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Author Topic: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all  (Read 37884 times)

Marsu42

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #75 on: October 10, 2012, 02:59:07 PM »
Argh, that's not what I wanted to hear since I don't care about video. Canon, please release a 5d3s w/o video for $2500, will you?
I guess they could release a DSLR without live-view for cheaper...is that what you'd want?

That would be a little annoying since focus peaking in LV is extremely nice for still shots - but since I've already got a 60d+ml for that, I'd even be ok w/o lv on a 5d3. I really want/need a higher iso capable camera than the current 18mp aps-c with good af for event shots, that's why I wasn't thrilled about the 6d specs.

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #75 on: October 10, 2012, 02:59:07 PM »

7enderbender

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #76 on: October 10, 2012, 04:04:47 PM »
Argh, that's not what I wanted to hear since I don't care about video. Canon, please release a 5d3s w/o video for $2500, will you?
While that would be lovely, the reality is it'd cost $4500, not $2500...seeing as Magic Lantern can unlock all their features, video is largely firmware...and without more people to buy it, they have to charge more to recoup costs. I guess they could release a DSLR without live-view for cheaper...is that what you'd want?

That would certainly fine by me. I have no use for live-view or video.
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Aglet

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #77 on: October 10, 2012, 11:53:37 PM »
Could you share the information what ps trick or 3rd party software is supposed to remove banding noise? I'd really like to have it in LR, but I've got some pictures that needed shadows raised a lot (high dr shots with moving objects) and that I'd really like to postprocess to a usable state?


TopazLabs DeNoise

it works OK on weaker banding like the 5d2 but on my 7d it had to smear too much detail to remove the strong 8-pixel wide vertical striping.
might be workable on the slightly better performing 60D,
..which reminds me... I need to try it on a 60D shot I took as a quick candid with a friend in deep shadow without flash or wrecking the main subject exposure. When I pushed it hard the 60d banded nearly as bad as my 7D but I don't think the subject would mind being smoothed out a little.  ;)

www.topazlabs.com/blog/denoise-5s-debanding-technology/

nicku

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #78 on: October 11, 2012, 01:19:41 AM »
Could you share the information what ps trick or 3rd party software is supposed to remove banding noise? I'd really like to have it in LR, but I've got some pictures that needed shadows raised a lot (high dr shots with moving objects) and that I'd really like to postprocess to a usable state?


TopazLabs DeNoise

it works OK on weaker banding like the 5d2 but on my 7d it had to smear too much detail to remove the strong 8-pixel wide vertical striping.
might be workable on the slightly better performing 60D,
..which reminds me... I need to try it on a 60D shot I took as a quick candid with a friend in deep shadow without flash or wrecking the main subject exposure. When I pushed it hard the 60d banded nearly as bad as my 7D but I don't think the subject would mind being smoothed out a little.  ;)

www.topazlabs.com/blog/denoise-5s-debanding-technology/


TopazLabs DeNoise works very good for my 7D pictures.... i recommend this soft.

Aputure

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #79 on: October 11, 2012, 04:00:46 AM »
The 6D will certainly be "not so bad", in fact I think it will be pretty awesome. However they could shave a few hundred dollars off the price, just as the 60D was a bit cheaper than the D7000. It's like that all over again, except with full frame. As a long-time Canon user, and fan of their ergonomics, I'll be going with the 6D. Here's my comparison of the two from Photokina! http://www.aputure.com/blog/?p=4016

WSMyles

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #80 on: October 11, 2012, 05:50:25 AM »
Anyone else think that maybe the propeller-heads at Canon designed the 6D down to the *rumoured* price of the D600 ($1599) instead of the actual price ($2100)?  I can just 'see' the party in the weekly Product Development meeting when Nikon released their price...  and if "They" are selling at over 2k, why not do the same?  After all, it's too late to add an autofocus system back into it, this close to market.

All I wanted was a FF DSLR with a decent AF system and reasonable IQ in variable light for dog sports.   I don't even care about >4fps.  The rest of the time, I could even do MF!  Don't care about video.   I'm not 'committed' to anyone's system yet, as I've been waiting to see what was coming out this year.  Nikon might have an edge on the bodies right now, but for the focal lengths I'm looking at, Canon has the better glass.

Yes, I could probably get away with a 7D for the sporting stuff, and a 6D for everything else... but that would mean lugging two compromise bodies around for the same price as a 5D3.  Put the 7D AF system in the 6D and I'd probably perorder it.  Hell, you could even take the "OK, but not perfect" sensors from the 1DX production line and stick them in a lower-end FF camera for all I care.  18MP is plenty.  I'd rather have another stop or two of clean ISO than 4-6MP.

It looks like noone wants my money unless I give them ALL of it.   Looks like my 30d might have a couple of years left on it... perhaps with a 70-300.   Maybe even a 70-300 L.  Case in point of elasticity of demand.  Stretch the customer too far, and they walk away.  You get 100% of nothing.  If the prices here in Oz were on parity with the US or HK, it'd be harder to walk away... but with 20-30% margin?  These shoes are walkin'.

(And yes, I'm aware that Canon have decided [or justified, retrospectively?] that the target market for the 6D is travellers/tourists, who don't need more than one AF point.)

Marsu42

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #81 on: October 11, 2012, 06:20:39 AM »
Anyone else think that maybe the propeller-heads at Canon designed the 6D down to the *rumoured* price of the D600 ($1599) instead of the actual price ($2100)?

You might find that Canon thinks that $2100 is a very reasonable price for a ff camera, they seem to have lost the grip on reality a bit - or maybe not, because they know users won't switch. If they designed the 6d for the $1600 price tag they'd left out autofocus completely :-o

It looks like noone wants my money unless I give them ALL of it.

Indeed - I've got €5000 lying around waiting to be spent on Canon equipment, but the current €3000 5d3 + €2500 24-70 (excluding equipment like cf cards yadayada) simply don't seem like a very sweet offer to me.

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #81 on: October 11, 2012, 06:20:39 AM »

WSMyles

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #82 on: October 11, 2012, 06:52:28 AM »
You might find that Canon thinks that $2100 is a very reasonable price for a ff camera, they seem to have lost the grip on reality a bit - or maybe not, because they know users won't switch. If they designed the 6d for the $1600 price tag they'd left out autofocus completely :-o

Arguably, they did leave it out :)    Actually, I would be reasonably happy paying $2100 for a FF version of a 7D, as long as I can have it tomorrow.  Just upscale the AF/metering units and the sensor/mirrorbox and it has everything I want... and they even have a sensor they could use - the one from the 1DX.  Just use the ones that are 'marginal' for the big-brother camera.  I'm frankly amazed they aren't doing that already.  Perhaps they are stockpiling them for future use in this very way?

Of course, the "$2100" 6D won't sell for anything like that here, either.  The "preorder" prices are well above that, and I'm not talking about 10% either...  There is a mysterious $400 gap between the average price for a fully imported 5d3 body (including shipping, GST and customs duty) and the very best retail prices.  That's rather more than 13%.  Add the 24-105 and it becomes $600....

It looks like noone wants my money unless I give them ALL of it.

Indeed - I've got €5000 lying around waiting to be spent on Canon equipment, but the current €3000 5d3 + €2500 24-70 (excluding equipment like cf cards yadayada) simply don't seem like a very sweet offer to me.

At least that here, but it won't be 'reserved' for long.  I'm focal-length limited right now, and the AF on the 30d is probably comparable to the 6d (what, five years later?) - so cropping half the frame or more AND struggling for focus is doing my head in.  There's practically nothing left except the 'lucky shots.'

I remember reading the 6D leaked specs here a few days before it was announced, thinking to myself, "they CAN'T be that out of touch.  Who would buy this?"  Then the boot fell.. the leak was right!

kalmiya

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #83 on: October 11, 2012, 08:30:35 AM »
Anyone else think that maybe the propeller-heads at Canon designed the 6D down to the *rumoured* price of the D600 ($1599) instead of the actual price ($2100)?  I can just 'see' the party in the weekly Product Development meeting when Nikon released their price...  and if "They" are selling at over 2k, why not do the same?  After all, it's too late to add an autofocus system back into it, this close to market.

All I wanted was a FF DSLR with a decent AF system and reasonable IQ in variable light for dog sports.   I don't even care about >4fps.  The rest of the time, I could even do MF!  Don't care about video.   I'm not 'committed' to anyone's system yet, as I've been waiting to see what was coming out this year.  Nikon might have an edge on the bodies right now, but for the focal lengths I'm looking at, Canon has the better glass.

Yes, I could probably get away with a 7D for the sporting stuff, and a 6D for everything else... but that would mean lugging two compromise bodies around for the same price as a 5D3.  Put the 7D AF system in the 6D and I'd probably perorder it.  Hell, you could even take the "OK, but not perfect" sensors from the 1DX production line and stick them in a lower-end FF camera for all I care.  18MP is plenty.  I'd rather have another stop or two of clean ISO than 4-6MP.

It looks like noone wants my money unless I give them ALL of it.   Looks like my 30d might have a couple of years left on it... perhaps with a 70-300.   Maybe even a 70-300 L.  Case in point of elasticity of demand.  Stretch the customer too far, and they walk away.  You get 100% of nothing.  If the prices here in Oz were on parity with the US or HK, it'd be harder to walk away... but with 20-30% margin?  These shoes are walkin'.

(And yes, I'm aware that Canon have decided [or justified, retrospectively?] that the target market for the 6D is travellers/tourists, who don't need more than one AF point.)

Funny, I was also looking into full-frame, and came to the same conclusion...
For the moment, my 550D is "good enough" to be used for some more time..
And I'm not in a rush anymore, for the moment, I'll wait and observe.

symmar22

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #84 on: October 11, 2012, 08:36:15 AM »


Indeed - I've got €5000 lying around waiting to be spent on Canon equipment, but the current €3000 5d3 + €2500 24-70 (excluding equipment like cf cards yadayada) simply don't seem like a very sweet offer to me.

I have exactly the same problem ;)

dswatson83

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #85 on: October 11, 2012, 09:28:11 AM »
2 Dead pixels in a brand new D600! Man, i'm really pissed that Canon had to cripple the 6D because the D600 has ALOT of issues like no aperture control in video live view, dead pixels, and some screen issues and Canon could have capitalized. Guess the 5D mark III will have to be my pro body as well as my spare/travel body :)

Source:
Nikon D600 Full Hands On Review & Test Small | Large

crasher8

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #86 on: October 11, 2012, 10:55:03 AM »
Could you share the information what ps trick or 3rd party software is supposed to remove banding noise? I'd really like to have it in LR, but I've got some pictures that needed shadows raised a lot (high dr shots with moving objects) and that I'd really like to postprocess to a usable state?


TopazLabs DeNoise

it works OK on weaker banding like the 5d2 but on my 7d it had to smear too much detail to remove the strong 8-pixel wide vertical striping.
might be workable on the slightly better performing 60D,
..which reminds me... I need to try it on a 60D shot I took as a quick candid with a friend in deep shadow without flash or wrecking the main subject exposure. When I pushed it hard the 60d banded nearly as bad as my 7D but I don't think the subject would mind being smoothed out a little.  ;)

www.topazlabs.com/blog/denoise-5s-debanding-technology/


TopazLabs DeNoise works very good for my 7D pictures.... i recommend this soft.


Does anyone have any experience with DeNoise on a 5D3?

xps

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #87 on: October 11, 2012, 11:14:20 AM »
4000€ in my wallet want to be spent...

Does anybody know. if the AF of the 6D is FAST too, or just accurate at low light?

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #87 on: October 11, 2012, 11:14:20 AM »

ajschot

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #88 on: October 11, 2012, 11:46:18 AM »
4000€ in my wallet want to be spent...

Does anybody know. if the AF of the 6D is FAST too, or just accurate at low light?

i tried at the Photokina last month with an 24-70 f/2.8 L II lens and it is really fast in normal light and in worse light as at the booth of Canon at the Photokina. i switched between de cam in front (close like 60cm or so and the to a dark truss somewhere up (10 meters) and it was fast, al servo also tried on the canon guys but well they were not running so could not test that but at f/2.8 it was fast and for what i could see in the LCD it was at most zoomed sharp too.


tron

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #89 on: October 11, 2012, 11:52:20 AM »
4000€ in my wallet want to be spent...

Does anybody know. if the AF of the 6D is FAST too, or just accurate at low light?
How can someone know? 6D is an imaginary camera for now. Although I guess Canon cannot tolerate postponing it for many months (D600 being the reason. Ins't competition nice?)
Are you starting from scratch?
In that case you could go for the kit 5DIII and 24-105 f/4L IS.

It is possible to get it in Europe for 4000 euros

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Re: Looks like the 6D may not be so bad after all
« Reply #89 on: October 11, 2012, 11:52:20 AM »