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Author Topic: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]  (Read 40387 times)

FTb-n

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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #30 on: October 08, 2012, 07:51:38 PM »
I'm holding out hope for better IQ. 

There's no point in introducing a 7DII unless Canon expects it to continue to be the entry-level pro  sports/wildlife body of choice for a few years to come.  It makes no sense to up the MP and frame rate without first improving IQ and high ISO performance.

Higher MP and FPS sound great as a marketing tool.  Sure, a frame rate of 10 fps has some benefits.  But for most sporting events, shotgun shooting in bursts is no substitute for timing that first shot.

The 7D is marketed as a sports body for those not ready for the 1D-X and the necessarily longer glass required to achieve the same field of view.  Both bodies share the same 18 megapixels.  I don't think the target audience for the 7DII will be wowed by higher MP and FPS alone – as exemplified in this thread.

Further, the 7D is one way to get serious amateurs and would-be pros hooked on Canon and invested in more L-glass.  Their next path upward is the 5DIII or 1D-X.  I would think Canon wants to continue this progression path.

In short, Canon must top the Nikon D7000 in every aspect – especially IQ and ISO performance.  Why let Nikon continue to own the best high ISO performance APS-C body?  As budding low-light sports photographers  look to the D7000, Canon loses out on their progression strategy to sell more 5D's and 1D's.

For me, I'd be happy if the 7DII only had two improvements:

1. Best in class high ISO noise reduction
2. Locking mode dial (I hate it when I bump out of M to Bulb)

(As an owner of the 60D and a 7D, I would enjoy the addition of an articulated screen on a 7DII.  I have been hooked on one ever since my G3.  A don't think the articulated screen is a fad as suggested, but I do doubt that a body aimed at pros or semi-pros will have one simply do to the risk of breaking the thing when shooting under pressure.)
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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #30 on: October 08, 2012, 07:51:38 PM »

al2

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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #31 on: October 08, 2012, 07:52:45 PM »
If Canon do that and price it at $2k then I'll sell my 7D and buy a 7D2, in other words; I'd pay another 500 for those upgrades.

Agreed.  But if the camera is over the $2,000 mark, there had better be some REALLY nice features to justify the price to upgrade.  And I'm not talking about GPS, articulating screen, or touch screen.  In fact, I'd pay money NOT to have the last two "features" on a prosumer SLR.

Why do you hate an articulating screen?  That's one thing I can't understand.  The articulating screen increases your creativity if you know how to use it.  As long as canon can maintain the durability and weather proofing of the camera, articulating screen is great.  At least it's there when you need it.

For me the articulated screen presents two major problems.  First, a Canon style articulated screen means that many of the buttons on the left side of the screen will have to disappear.  The articulated screen uses a lot of area on the back of the camera.  The second is the compromised weatherproofing.  Currently, the the pop-up flash is the main weatherproofing weakness.  I can work around that by sealing the flash with electricans tape when I'm going out
in the weather.  Yes, Canon can try to seal moving parts, but how long will they stay sealed?

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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #32 on: October 08, 2012, 08:15:33 PM »
I've been waiting to upgrade from my T1i, and was hoping to wait for a 60D successor. I found the T1i simply too small, especially after acquiring my telephoto lens.

This should be interesting, because if they merge the two in the upwards direction there will be a sizeable gap between the T4i-series models.

Hopefully the new sensor beings some improvements.

Hah. Exactly like me. I am seriously wanting to upgrade my T1i and a 70D would definitely hit the spot. 6fps,
better iso performance, better dynamic range, and better video features (1080p 60p, higher bit rate, All-I, etc??) would go a long way.

Also, to the guy saying a tilt screen was a fad. Well, for video users that is a must. I would not buy a DSLR without it. Please be aware of uses other than your own before posting next time.

I shoot a lot of video - typically 2 x dslr multicam with zoom h4n + lavalier mics etc. and you have either a micro-USB slot (for laptop tethering) or a mini-hdmi out to ext AV screen -> clearly you don't know what those flaps on the side of your camera are for.

Proof of the pudding is in the eating -> last canon DSLR to have a tilt screen was the 650D, the 5D3/1DX/6D did not get them, nor will a 7D2 as swivel screen are for hobbyists with Rebel bodies, and are less useful than an external wireless monitor (thanks to the intro of WiFi).

Canon have both segments covered - serious videographer will have HDMI-out, the amateur will have their smartphone, iPad or MP4 player which is way more flexible than an articulated screen.

Tech has moved on (WiFi is the new anywhere screen), so should you. Time will tell, and I'm betting that I'll be proved right and you will be proved wrong....and I will remind you that day that the 7D2 is eventually announced

Wrathwilde

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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #33 on: October 08, 2012, 08:16:46 PM »
Ok, I'll play. Here are the features/specs I'd be willing to bet on.

Single Processor, Digic 5+ (dual chip is just an added expense, a single 5+ is more than capable)
Single CF card slot (2nd slot = added expense, and pros that use the 7D as a 2nd camera will want compatible cards)

That's it, the two specs I'm willing to bet on.

What I'd like in a 7D Mark II...

New sensor tech, still @ 18mp, better ISO performance (low and high)
The same AF sensor and metering as the 5D3
No pop up flash, but a built in lowlight autofocus assist, and built in radio trigger and control for new Canon Flashes.
Locking Dial.

That's it, that's what would get me to upgrade from a 7D to a 7D2. An AF sensor that covers almost the entire frame when used with Canon EF lenses would be huge, when the camera senses an EF-S lens it could disable the outer points.

I don't want GPS. WiFi, I can take or leave. I really don't care about video, I absolutely don't want a swivel or touch screen.




« Last Edit: October 08, 2012, 08:20:23 PM by Wrathwilde »

Drizzt321

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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #34 on: October 08, 2012, 08:17:19 PM »
I've been waiting to upgrade from my T1i, and was hoping to wait for a 60D successor. I found the T1i simply too small, especially after acquiring my telephoto lens.

This should be interesting, because if they merge the two in the upwards direction there will be a sizeable gap between the T4i-series models.

Hopefully the new sensor beings some improvements.

Hah. Exactly like me. I am seriously wanting to upgrade my T1i and a 70D would definitely hit the spot. 6fps,
better iso performance, better dynamic range, and better video features (1080p 60p, higher bit rate, All-I, etc??) would go a long way.

Also, to the guy saying a tilt screen was a fad. Well, for video users that is a must. I would not buy a DSLR without it. Please be aware of uses other than your own before posting next time.

Agreed, even if it's still $1700 there's something of a gap in the $1000-1200 range for an XXD body.

As for the articulated screen...this is going to sound a bit snarky, but many (most?) of us use DSLR's as STILLS cameras. Not video cameras. I understand how a articulated screen would be great for video use, but I'd think you'd really want to get one of those external LCD's you which offer a bigger view of what you're shooting.
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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #35 on: October 08, 2012, 08:19:21 PM »
If Canon do that and price it at $2k then I'll sell my 7D and buy a 7D2, in other words; I'd pay another 500 for those upgrades.

Agreed.  But if the camera is over the $2,000 mark, there had better be some REALLY nice features to justify the price to upgrade.  And I'm not talking about GPS, articulating screen, or touch screen.  In fact, I'd pay money NOT to have the last two "features" on a prosumer SLR.

Why do you hate an articulating screen?  That's one thing I can't understand.  The articulating screen increases your creativity if you know how to use it.  As long as canon can maintain the durability and weather proofing of the camera, articulating screen is great.  At least it's there when you need it.

For me the articulated screen presents two major problems.  First, a Canon style articulated screen means that many of the buttons on the left side of the screen will have to disappear.  The articulated screen uses a lot of area on the back of the camera.  The second is the compromised weatherproofing.  Currently, the the pop-up flash is the main weatherproofing weakness.  I can work around that by sealing the flash with electricans tape when I'm going out
in the weather.  Yes, Canon can try to seal moving parts, but how long will they stay sealed?

+1 Canon will not degrade the 7D model with a tilt screen that compromises quality (weather-sealing) and results in loss of external buttons, especially when you can have any screen you like in your hand that is no longer physically attached to the camera body thanks to WiFi.

pierceography

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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #36 on: October 08, 2012, 08:25:01 PM »
If Canon do that and price it at $2k then I'll sell my 7D and buy a 7D2, in other words; I'd pay another 500 for those upgrades.

Agreed.  But if the camera is over the $2,000 mark, there had better be some REALLY nice features to justify the price to upgrade.  And I'm not talking about GPS, articulating screen, or touch screen.  In fact, I'd pay money NOT to have the last two "features" on a prosumer SLR.

Why do you hate an articulating screen?  That's one thing I can't understand.  The articulating screen increases your creativity if you know how to use it.  As long as canon can maintain the durability and weather proofing of the camera, articulating screen is great.  At least it's there when you need it.

For me the articulated screen presents two major problems.  First, a Canon style articulated screen means that many of the buttons on the left side of the screen will have to disappear.  The articulated screen uses a lot of area on the back of the camera.  The second is the compromised weatherproofing.  Currently, the the pop-up flash is the main weatherproofing weakness.  I can work around that by sealing the flash with electricans tape when I'm going out
in the weather.  Yes, Canon can try to seal moving parts, but how long will they stay sealed?

Definitely agree with those two points.  And there's a third: build quality.  Right now, the 7D is on par with the build quality of a pro level camera.  If you add an articulating screen, you're basically running the life span of the camera into the ground.  Even if you're incredibly careful with your equipment, your chances of damaging the camera increase exponentially when you start messing with retractable elements.  The popup flash on my 7D already fails to pop up 3/4 of the time.  So no thanks to moveable LCD.

And as for the screen increasing your creativity, well... I guess you'll just have to get dirty.  I've come back from plenty of shoots where my clothes were completely filthy from being on my stomach getting a shot.  If you're not willing to get dirty to get a shot, then it must not have been that good to begin with.
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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #36 on: October 08, 2012, 08:25:01 PM »

rotaholic

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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #37 on: October 08, 2012, 08:29:23 PM »
So does this mean no 70D? I have the money here burning a hole in my pocket, guess I will just go and get the 650d then. I had my heart set on a 70D  :'(

FTb-n

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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #38 on: October 08, 2012, 09:46:01 PM »
Gotta keep the two processors.  It's the secret to the focusing performance and may be the key to increased high ISO performance.

As for the articulating screen, I don't understand the "it's for hobbyist" attack.  Even the old Canon F-1 offered additional viewfinders for alternative viewing angles.  It has function and value.

However, the articulating screen does decrease the durability of the body.  Fast action shooting, maybe with multiple bodies, increases the risk of damage to the screen when it's out.  I doubt that any "pro-level" Canon body will have the articulating screen for fear that they will see more of them returned for service and deflate the durability reputation.  Still, I'd welcome the articulating screen on the 7DII.
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SDPhotopro

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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #39 on: October 08, 2012, 10:06:25 PM »
I have a 5DMkIII but can't beat my 7D for night sports and action.  Many friends I know like me would jump at a 7D MkII  with better noise control at high ISO. The 1.6 factor makes our 70-200 a f2.8 112-320 super zoom and Sigma 120-300 a powerful and fast f2.8 192-480 . Dark high school stadiums, gyms, theaters, and other outdoor action benefit from crop for fast zoom, high iso. Quiet mode from 5DmkIII is great, hope that they include it in the 7DMkII and keep the CF card.

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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #40 on: October 08, 2012, 10:16:24 PM »
The performance of the new sensor:  that is the key to whether or not I'll be  interested.   

+1000

The only thing that would make the 7DII interesting for me would be a low-noise sensor.
+1000
That is the reason I got the 5D3 and not the 7D...

neuroanatomist

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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #41 on: October 08, 2012, 10:58:18 PM »
Gotta keep the two processors.  It's the secret to the focusing performance...
Really?  How do the dual Digic 4 processors in the 7D contribute to focusing performance?  Or is the secret that Canon is lying when they state, "The EOS 7D has a 19-point autofocus system, all of which are cross-type points, that includes a separate AF processor to help to provide fast, reliable and accurate autofocus for photographers in all shooting situations."
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RC

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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #42 on: October 08, 2012, 11:13:24 PM »
...The camera would take the place of the  7D and 60D....

Hmmm, blending the 7D with the 60D, I might just be glad I kept my 7D.  We'll see.

Canon, can I upgrade the sensor in my 7D please?   :P

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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #42 on: October 08, 2012, 11:13:24 PM »

Richard8971

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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #43 on: October 08, 2012, 11:16:33 PM »
The camera would take the place of the  7D and 60D

Hmmm, isn't that what I have been saying all along? Hard to believe that so many would think that the two lines would NOT have been joined. Just about everything that Canon has been doing over the past couple of years, (I.E. The downgrade of the 60D and the upgrade of the Rebel T4i...) has been leading up to this.

I see the mirrorless EOS taking the place of the XXXXD line.

...the Rebel will take the place of the XXD line (in a way)

...and the 7D2 will replace both the XXD line and XD line...

I bet Canon will push more FF sensor bodies over the crop sensors, it's a logical step forward, but what do I know?

Oh well, this IS just a rumor, right? :)

D
« Last Edit: October 08, 2012, 11:51:30 PM by Richard8971 »
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Chosenbydestiny

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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #44 on: October 09, 2012, 12:10:03 AM »
"taking the place of" I can believe, as they have obviously bumped the rebel line up a bit with better AF (although someday I'd like to see custom white balance through K) but "blending", is not even suggested in the rumor. The 7D has its target audience like all the cameras in the lineup, but not by any means limited to what anyone can actually afford. Some people need crop bodies to decrease the distance between them and their subject without physically having to. Even if they can afford better. As for people who gripe about the flippy screens, grow up. It's nit picking, seriously. The sensor should be our biggest concern now, especially with the old 7D sensor digging it's own grave next to fossils at the mercy of Nikon's shovel. This is a Canon forum, we should be rooting for Canon to win with a new sensor in the next generation of bodies, not this petty flippy screen crap.
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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Rumors Surface [CR1]
« Reply #44 on: October 09, 2012, 12:10:03 AM »