1D4 & 60D
I received an email that suggested select 1D4 and 60D’s are being tested with 3″ OLED screens. Most of the test cameras are equipped with LCD screens.
USB 3.0
1D4 to be USB 3.0 ready. The initial camera shipments may come with it locked out, and be later turned on with a firmware upgrade as the spec reaches the masses sometime in 2010.
note: I don’t have the technical knowledge to know if you can turn on usb 3.0 at a later date. If anyone has some insight, i’d appreciate it.
GPS & Wifi
The source says GPS will be built into the 1D4 and not the 60D. Wifi will be an addon product for both cameras.
Announcement
The same email states August 25, 2009 for the official announcement.
cr
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Come on Canon… don’t skip the GPS from the 60d. GPS is relatively inexpensive – especially if all it is doing is getting lat/long coords and not actually worying about the screen or the map license. This would be a great addition now that Apple has released iLife ’09 with iPhoto’09’s geotagging support
OLED would likely free up some battery drain for a super quick shutter. 8-10 fps full frame. Come on.
Canon has been developing OLED for a long time.
GPS is a battery hog.
Not necessary to push for USB 3.0 if it’s not yet available on anyone’s PC/Mac. Won’t be widely adopted for another 3-5 years. Besides, the easy way to accomodate someone who desires USB 3.0 connectivity simply for the data transfers would be to get a USB 3.0 card reader (once they become readily available and assuming your PC/Mac can read it), which will likely be the alternative most pros used anyway.
Easier to buy the accessory and update your PC at home that buy an entirely new system.
Everything else is up in the air.
I’m more interested in seeing what type of focus system they incorporate in the 60D, Lord knows they gotta get something together that can compete with Nikon D300’s 51 point professional AF tracking system.
I’d also like to see solid video features, perhaps even an updated kit lens that is designed for video like the Panny GH1’s kit lens is.
If you turn it on – I would expect it would be less of a hog than a flash. I’d be content with a GPS dedicated dongle that sat on the hotshoe or worked with the battery grip – if it didn’t require the ~$400 wifi/ethernet adapter and then a special gps (~>$200) after that.
I want GPS but I’m willing to pay about $50-75 extra for a well integrated solution.
Got this from a Swedish site (used google-translate: http://translate.google.com/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=it&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fpc.feber.se%2Fart%2F159074%2Flinux_blir_frst_med_drivrutin_%2F&sl=sv&tl=en&history_state0= )
.. so perhaps USB 3.0 isn’t so far away as we might think. And perhaps they stick to the ordinary connection-set, and then it might be even more useful, so in a way it might be really ok.
And the OLED-screen are steps in the right direction.
I would also like a better autofocus, but not the Nikon-style. I want the eye-controlled from the old EOS 3. Now that’s a good thing! :)
I can’t see why we would need USB 3.0 support just yet. None of the flash memory cards are fast enough to reach USB 2.0’s speed limit.
On a side not, I would much rather see built in wifi than GPS :)
> On a side note, I would much rather see built in wifi than GPS
+1
Compact flash cards have passed the practical USB 2.0 limit now for a couple of years. The 45mb / sec UDMA cards are slowed down by USB cards readers considerably. I have switched to Firewire 800 UDMA card readers, they are much faster at downloading 16GB of Raw files from my 5D MK II. (I bought a Lexar UDMA USB Reader and used it for a few months, but the firewire 800 version blows it away. I have a Lexar Firewire 800 and a Sandisk Firewire 800, both are about the same speed… Very fast)
I don’t expect OLED on the 60D, perhaps the next version. The 1D MK IV, … maybe.
The information sounds reasonable, and the timing is what would be expected. Nikon is said to be announcing the D300S as a minor upgrade to the D300 in the near future, so there will be a flurry of new products, maybe more than expected.
I agree that built-in wifi sounds good on the surface, but practically, the transfer speed is very slow for Raw files, only practical for jpeg files. Nothing wrong with that, except I shoot raw.
Would be USB3 needed? No, but someone has to start employing it. And a 1D is a product with a rather long life time that might make use of technology to come. A MK4 will probably used with memory cards that exceed USB2.0, maybe in a year or 18 month down the road.
Or think of tethered shooting. High rez sensor plus good frame rates without sacrificing quality, and bandwidth requirements needs go through the roof.
USB 2.0 has less than half the transfer speed of the better CF cards
Sounds good, Any more word on 1D IV sensor size?
Canon has been talking about OLED for ages. If they’ve finally found a working solution, I am not surprised if they’re quickly replacing many products with OLEDs.
But, for goodness sake, Canon better start working on their imaging sensors as well. They are falling behind Nikon too quickly in this critical department.
Of course, it’s imperative that they start working on an improved AF sensor technology as well.
Oh, their camera features also need some serious updating.
Looks like Canon has many areas to work on. ;) Will they deliver or will they disappoint once again? Honestly, I have almost given up on them. Too bad Nikon is still very lacking in some important lenses I want. Sigh…
GPS isn’t an instant-on thing. If you want accuracy (and I’ve heard some of the big names remind us all that compass heading may be a key additional data point to be captured), that GPS has to be on ALL the time. Say goodbye to battery life if there was an internal GPS, so I’d put this wishlist item way out of your top picks.
I’ve had dedicated GPS units flake out and forget to turn off their internal GPS chip, rendering the unit almost unusable. I’d never want an internal GPS chip be able to sink my camera like that.
Do you want to “have” to replace your camera in a few years to have USB 3.0, or would you rather it have the ability now? If it’s not too expensive or power-hungry, I hope it makes it in the new cameras.
I’ve got the 3 (sitting there, all alone on a shelf – poor thing) and I LOVED the eye control focus. Used it all the time. I think it would be great to bring it back!
1D IV needs big improvement on ISO and AF system, and then we will be able to persuade more budgets from management.
The number of units we will order will all depend on how big the improvement Canon will deliver
Where are they falling behind on image sensor? BTW Sony is the one that makes Nikon’s
The 1d3 is only marginally worse (and that’s not everyone’s point of view) than the D3. How much better do you expect it to be?
ISO I’m pretty sure it’ll be on par with some of the best.
UGH please DON’T have a kit lens that is just designed for video. Again people these cameras are made for stills. It’s like Canon puts video in their cameras and everyone think they are videographers already and that they can have to have everything.
I rather have it without so i wouldn’t have to pay more for something i’m not going to use as much.
I heard today the next 1Ds will be 7-8 fps and in the 24MP range and the 1D4 15-16 fps and about a 14MP sensor. I also heard Canon is working on a 52 MP sensor in development.
Take a look at DXOMark and Imaging Resource RAW comparisons. :)
It suddenly dawned on me that one of the original 5D units on display in some trade show several years ago was also fitted with an OLED screen.
Unfortunately, that went nowhere.
I am not holding my hopes high this time.
802.11n can achieve descents speeds fast enough for even raw file transfer. If USB 3.0 is to be installed because it’s the latest and greatest, then 802.11n should also :)
Enabling USB3 with a firmware update is (impossible) very unlikely.
USB3 is backwards compatible no need to lock anything.
Most of the posts in here are about the USB 3 thing, don’t see the big deal, you’ll have it when you have it, mean time lets just concentrate on what we will have soon the 1DMK4 and the 60D. I would like to have an estimate release date on these cameras
I’m more interested in the cameras. So we have to wait a few more seconds to minutes to see our results…Give someone $1 million and they will ask why it wasn’t a $1,000,001.00. Give him/her a perfect life and they will still ask for more. Nit picking and not paying attention to the important issues…What the camera DOES have, and being more than satisfied…It isn’t even out yet, quit your crying…JMO though…
I guess I am in the minority, but I don’t understand why anyone other than serious scientists need GPS to tag their images. Do the sports, PJ, wedding, nature photographer need to tag their image?
Canon should make this an add on and save my money for better pixels and AF.
Canon vs Apple.
At least with Apple, the end of the product strip tease is a great product.
huh. sounds interesting. not sure if I buy the 1D IV being lower MP than the 50D, but the rest of it seems reasonable, though I would personally guess at around 30 MP for the Ds mk IV. I think they have often had super sensors in design, largely for research purposes. Sounds cool though.
Go back to what is must and good to have. Nothing is free. Pay attention to the must first.
May be movie also become an add on with manual SP, Ap & ISO, but auto focus. Save cost for those not wish to pay for it.
Must: Good sensor, ISO, AF and fps. May be FF. (Also eye control AF)
It makes sense if they are going to sqeeze 15 fps out of the 1D4, makes it a different category than the 50D or any other DSLR so matching MP to other cameras may not be such a big deal – for PJ, sports and events 15 fps would be awesome. I’ve heard 27 MP on the 1Ds is a possiblity, hadn’t heard the 24 MP at 7-8 fps on the 1Ds until yesterday. Aparently they are looking at compression technology on the pixels themselves because at over 50 MP they are so small they can’t handle the full light spectrum.
Don´t give a flying monkey´s about the 60D and it´s spec.
OLED in the 1 series sounds great. GPS would be nice, but not at battery expense. But a release date sometime soon would be nice!
OLED would be cool…i doubt it happens
New Handle Grip Canon Wireless Transmitter + Integrated GPS for Canon EOS 60D.
I understand that OLED drains the battery less and takes up less internal camera space. However, I also thought the material degraded faster than acceptable. I would hate to have to replace the OLED as routine maintenance.
OLEDs have also a much clearer image.
I don’t have it, and won’t buy it for now, but I can certainly see that those taking thousands of photos would like to have the location embedded in the exif or however they do it.
More and more photographers are using software management of their files, and searching by location would be a good thing.
For PJ’s, it gives aome credibility to a claim that a photo was taken at a particular site/ event and not cooked up in the back yard. A person could go to the same exact place and compare to see if it was actually shot there. Fake photos is a big concern of photojournalism.
Oled life is improving by leaps and bounds, so its a good idea to try it out in a real world situation to see what happens with sun, water, high and low temperatures, sand and dust.
http://www.avrev.com/home-theater-news/industry-trade-news/dupont-creates-oled-with-100-year-life-span.html
Well if it really lasts even close to the 100 years claimed in the article I guess it will last the 4-5 year replacement cycle I seem to be on with my DSLR bodies! besides, I am 61 so it will apparently out live me – LOL
OLED? USB 3.0? WiFi? GPS?
Just make sure the darned thing focuses properly. It’s why I still shoot with a 1DMKII. I’ll upgrade when reports tell me the AF matches or exceeds my MKII AF, which is as good as it gets.
Don’t be so closed minded.
That’s exactly my point.
I don’t want features, I want a good picture.
Clean ISO 1000 would be a good start. Clean ISO 1600: impressive. DR increased to levels where the Nikons are or beyond: You just got a sale.
USB? WiFi? GPS? OLED?
Get lost and do your homework.
Thanks Reno !
Finally someone who remembers that camera are to… take pictures ! And that most of the current cameras already take beautiful pictures.
Could someone tell me how USB3 or GPS will help in taking pictures ?
My opinion is that in the current days, the camera is not the problem… but the photographer who does not know how to take pictures. Remember Doisneau, Cartier Bresson, Boubat… Look at their pictures and ask yourself how many pixels they had, if their camera had 25600 ISO, what kind of USB they had of if they had a GPS…
Photography is in the eyes of the photographer, not in the body of his camera.
So now, I will reading forums, will go out and will take pictures !
Agree
There is no such thing as noise free. “Clean” means vastly different things to different people. DXO has tried to set a standard by setting a signal to noise ratio that defines a usable ISO at the sensor level. I can see noise, and lots of it in a ISO 100 capture from any digital camera, even though the S/N ratio is high, noise is always there.
With my 5D MK II, I have ISO 6400 captures that have lots of noise, but print quite nicely at 8 X 10. Does that mean they are “Clean”
8×10 cm or inch?
“Aparently [sic] they are looking at compression technology on the pixels themselves because at over 50 MP they are so small they can’t handle the full light spectrum.”
WTF?
By the way, the Olympus E-620 would have the equivalent of about 50MP if it had a FF sensor at the same pixel density and the EOS 50D would have about 38MP. The average recent compact camera has about 300-400MP in that same area. While they may be missing out on the infrared or ultra-violet ends of the spectrum, I doubt that you’d notice.
What would become a problem is dynamic range: there are only so many electrons you can cram into a photo-site that small in a given length of time. That number is small enough that 12- or 14-bits can handle it all too easily. “Compression technology on the pixels themselves” is probably related to pixels (photo-sites, really) with a non-linear response; they have a tone curve built in.
It’s very easy to fake EXIF data, so your words about fake photos doesn’t stand, imho!
Yeah I don’t really care about the technical side of it, and I’m no scientist, so I’m not gonna even try to explain anything beyond I was told an over 50 MP DSLR sensor is being developed and some sort of compression technology is being used on the photo-sites and the problem is in red wavelength. Make what you want out ot it if that means anything to you. I only care as far as when it will be available and how I can use it if it is any good.
USB 3.0
if the usb controller is capable for the 3.0 standard, but it has usb 2.0 capable firmware, it can be updated to 3.0.
probably the firmware isn’t finished/stable.
Funny thing about all this speculation is that the 1D and 1Ds are already designed and out for testing. The only thing Canon is going to do from here on is tweaking the details and any firmware updates they need.
What about video in 1D? Iguess many Pro PJ:s get upset if its not there.
No rumors on that?
As the mark III was released and finally reached 10fps, I can remember a report that said that 10fps could be exceeded easily but the professionals would need a special video license if they shoot at e.g. a football matchs.
If this is true, i would not assume that they will add a movie mode to the 1D family
Over here:
http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/cameras/Canon_1D_MkIV.html
There’s a report that the 1D4 is likely to be APS-H because the smaller mirror will allow faster operation. That’s the first convincing technical argument for the format I’ve seen as it counters the argument that a FF sensor with a crop mode would be the best of both worlds. We’ll probably see a frame rate that is much faster than the Nikon D3 with a higher resolution sensor and similar-to-better better noise characteristics. For sports pros shooting with telephoto lenses, what’s not to like? How often are they going to need something wider than the 20-21mm that they can get from a 16-35mm f/2.8L? What would PJs say about APS-H if, at launch, Canon also offered them a new 12-24mm lens, or similar?
That is so untrue.
Its when and where you publish your stuff you can get in trouble. Not when you do the shooting.
There´s no thing like an “video licence”.
If no video in 1D, what stops me from bringing a 5D in my bag?
On every event they should have a very camera updated security guard to get thru your stuff to see if you can record video. It doesnt work that way.
Its the rights to publish a clip from a Premiere Leauge game, NHL game or whatever that maters, not the filming itself
ahh ok,
my mistake. thanks for your correction.
“APS-H will allow faster mirror operation”??? The D3 is FF and can do 9FPS, just 1 frame less than the 1D3, and it can do 11FPS w/o AF servo. So that’s marketing BS again from Canon. Why can’t they just imitate what Sony did with the A900? The full-frame sized mirror is not flipped like the traditional reflex mirror, it’s actually lifted & raised by two supports on both edges of the mirror frame, which makes the VF display more stable due to lesser vibration & allows a quieter operation. Granted the A900 does just 5FPS, but Canon should be more imaginative if it wants to do >10FPS with a FF sensor.
Oled, Wifi, USB3, Video, GPS ? Are you sure you’re still talking about a camera or what ?
Knock, knock, knock, Canon guys, is there somebody here still willing to make Dslrs or just food for geeks ??? I’m glad I went to Nikon (though nikkor lenses arent as good as EF ones).
Have they thought about improving AF, Iso and dynamic range, Viewfinder instead of wasting time and money with gps and wifi – who cares about a GPS – except to eat the batery and writting crappy numbers in the exifs such as 12*23’67” or something… And who really cares about wifi ?not 2% of the professionnal users…
We’re also not talking about BS from Canon’s marketing department. It might be a BS rumour, though.
The figures you’ve given only go to prove that Canon’s OLD APS-H camera is faster than the newer FF competition. As for, “Why can’t they just imitate what Sony did [and produce a 5fps camera]?” and, “Canon should be more imaginative,” which do you want?
The only reason Nikon and Sony seem to be making such dramatic advances is that they were so far behind. Lately, they have got their acts together and CAUGHT UP with Canon’s current range of cameras. Now, several big manufacturers have reached the point of diminishing returns and they will be playing leapfrog for the foreseeable future. All of their cameras will be bloody good ones, but no one camera is going to be all things to all people.
Canon still have the advantage, though: while everyone else was playing catch-up, they were working on the technologies of the future (though Sony were at it too). Perhaps we’ll see improvements like those that could be related to a Canon patent that was reported here:
http://www.photographybay.com/2009/02/11/faster-autofocus-for-canon-eos-dslr-live-view-mode/
You could have full servo AF at 100fps with something like that (maybe). With enough horsepower and bandwidth it could be at the full sensor resolution. You might lose a stop or two of sensitivity, but, in the short term, a lightweight APS-H mirror might let you do 15fps in non-live-view mode and the bigger FF mirror only 7fps (I’m simply making these number up, BTW), so advantage APS-H.
Maybe in a few generations, with backlit sensors providing “clean” ISO 6400 even with a pellical mirror-type assembly for phase-detect AF and an EVF, we’ll see Canon do a FF sports camera…and we’ll hear complaints that it is not waterproof to 100m like some new Samsunikon model!
From pro PJ:s point of View:
Wifi=Maybe 2% of the un-proffesional users. Most of us pros will use it, quite alot.
(Transfer pictures on the fly from an ongoing sports event for ex.)
USB3=no need. 99% uses card readers.
Oled=no biggie, but if it saves battery its good.
GPS=not so importent for PJ:s, we now where we’ve been. But it would be a cool feature to show our readers on ex. google maps where we’ve been under lets say a year.
And its a really good way to get your archive organized.
Video=extremley importent for many of us, not all but quite alot.
And i’m sure they thinking (alot!) about improving AF, DR and ISO.
Yes, A photographer in the NW USA had a 26MP FF Canon for testing a couple of months ago. There are definitely prototypes out there, the question is, how close are they to the final product. Camera makers test many different concept configurations to see what photographers like and how well they perform.
These same features are on their way from Nikon and sony, its just a matter of when. No matter how hard one tries, progress will continue. No camera maker (except may be Leica) wants to be seen as out of date with new technology. Certainly, lots of users have found GPS, for example, to be a desirable feature. I’m not sure that I would use it, but I thought the same about new features in the past, and now I use then every day.
I’ll waiting OLED or AMOLED display also. I don’t understand, what’s the problem about using these already? They are already in use in cellural phones, but corporations like Canon and Nikon are unable to use them? Mission impossible?
It’s time to canon show again, that canon can add new features to the cameras before Nikon, again!
I add location keywords when I import my images. That solves the image sorting thing. Not exactly difficult to type, “Toronto, Roy Thompson Hall.” For the news editors who don’t trust their photographers, I’m sure we’ll have hacks for the gps data so emmbeding it will not amount to a secure lock on the truth. The fact of the matter is that GPS is a kinda cool toy for 99.999999% of photographers (don’t lie to yourselves) and if it sucks battery life then why in the hell should we put it in our cameras? Maybe people should take a class on image management instead…
Are you referring to the 13″ MBP with glossy screen, SD slot and no expresscard slot?
I disagree. I use my cell phone for GPS and leave it on and running all day while shooting to tag the photos later. Never uses much of my battery life and still make calls while it’s running. GPS isn’t that big of a power consumption.
Not really, it’s BS because those who invented that rumor and those perpetuating it like you obviously only got into photography during this digital era. If you were shooting 35mm film before you got into digital you would have known that Canon has a 35mm FF film camera that does 10FPS more than a decade ago already: the EOS-1V (and EOS-1n RS back in 1995).
So this rumor: CR = -1, for gross technical ignorance.
Now, let us be charitable and say maybe Canon is aiming for more than 10FPS, after all, Nikon has already done 11FPS with an FF camera, but their AF is still not fast enough to keep up with the framerate, thus the limitation on the D3.
Let’s say Canon is aiming for ~15FPS, then they just might as well bring back the pellicle mirror from the EOS RT (real time) made in 1989. :P
In conclusion, I call BS to the rumored justification that they were sticking to APS-H 1.25x/1.3x crop because of FPS limits with flipping an FF-sized reflex mirror. They better come up with more credible technical explanations if they are indeed gonna stick with APS-H for the EOS-1D series.
+1
I’m happy to see I’m not the only one that whant better image quality, not gadgets. But I’m wandering if they offer those gagets maybe they reach the end for better sensors. Switching boat is not very far for me!
(60D)I still don’t exactly know what GPS on a camera does, 1080 movies would be nice. But i want the camera to focus properly,i am looking for a new camera and 60D sounds pretty good, just want nice AF system with more than just 9 AF points thats all. 8FPS would also help. OLED if it saves battery great if its just to make it fancy leave it out.
Thank you!
Not to mention the 15″. Apple has forced me into a 17″ as a pro.
The blue color of OLED is the one that degrades the quickest and it’s good for about 7000hours. You should be fine…
The OLED degradation becomes more relevant for tv/computer stands.
+1
I’m a gadget lover and I wouldn’t imagine that I’d use GPS because I just add the location in Lightroom when I bring in images and leave it as that.
There are those who upload images to Google Earth and want that type of control, but there are great point and shoots for that type of thing. Me knowing where Ansel was standing when he took his shots isn’t going to let me recreate it, that moment in history is long gone.
Probably because USB controllers are still being developed (the spec is final, but there’s a lot that has to happen between a spec and a robust end-product.)
Yes, I’m absolutely sure those photographers didn’t care one whit what the resolution or dynamic range of their film was, or the quality of the glass…
/sarcasm
Cameras are tools. There’s nothing wrong with wanting good tools. This is a site about speculating on future tools. If that’s not your thing, then there are other sites that cater to other aspects of photography.
Sure, but why is it so hard to see that it would be nice if images were tagged automatically? One less menial task to have to do manually. Power consumption and cost are concerns, but I would assume it can be turned off, and cost is steadily dropping to be negligible. Adding $50 to a $5000 camera is in my mind Not A Big Deal. I don’t really see what the backlash is all about.
A fair number of people wouldn’t consider AF and FPS to be “musts”. ISO may not be a “must” for some, either.
On the flip side, there are some who consider, say, manual control in video a “must”. You inclusion of eye-control AF is a good example here, I’m sure a lot of people would say “concentrate on the camera, leave the eye-control gadgetry out.”
It’s hard to argue that a smaller and lighter mirror won’t be able to be flipped faster than a larger/heavier one though. The only real question is how much faster. So FF can do 10 or 11 FPS. It’s quite likely Canon is aiming higher, say 15FPS. If Canon can hit that with an APS-H mirror, 50% faster, maybe there’s something to their claim?
Canon and Nikon are probably more worried about long term robustness and environmental tolerances than Nokia or Apple. Professional cameras are mission critical for many customers and put through far more abuse than your average consumer cellphone. Therefore the standards the screen has meet are higher before Canon or Nikon will use them.
I see your point, but they had the eye control thing licked over 10 yeras ago…
Gps lets you geotag photos like this one
http://www.flickr.com/photos/barrosinc/3583566247/meta/
check it down there where it says latitude and longitude… then you can go to map and see a map with your pictures.
But at the moment the rate limiting factor of FPS in DSLR cameras is not the mechanical ability of the mirror to survive that movement. It is the rate at which the AF system can still function, given mirror black out times. the 1D mkIII barely handles 10 fps. the Nikon D3 tops out at 9 fps, it can shoot faster in DX, only reading some of the sensor but moving all of the mirror and shutter, but it is incapable of AF faster than 9 fps. The Canon EOS 1V could shoot at 10fps, but only AF with 9 fps. So it seems to me that since the framerate is currently limited by the AF function of the camera, I realize that I’m making an arbitrary asumption that motordrive is only useful when it has AF, which is true chiefly for sports, that I would want the most viewfinder and sensor real estate available to me within those limitations. The resolution of the sensor is entirely dependent on how fast the processor is. Given current chips, notably digiv IV, this does not seem to a problem, since the cap for resolution from this is above where the sensor of a fast action/lowlight camera ought to be in order to maintain properly sized photosites. I therefore deduce that regardless of the obvious mechanical advantage of having a smaller mirror which can then be moved faster that there is no speed advantage to APS-H SLR cameras over FF given current technology.
We are not considering “current technology”. You cannot reasonably claim that APS-H is not justifiable in the next generation camera body because the limiting factor is the AF system in the current generation body.
It is entirely possible that there will be a next generation AF system in the next generation body that will make the mechanical issues the limiting factor. If that is the case (and maybe it won’t be), then APS-H could be totally justifiable.
Here’s a silly question but since I am fairly new to this…Don’t be too unkind!!! If you have a ef 50mm f1.2 and ef 50mm f1.4. If you set them both at f2.8 for instance would they both give the same exposure or would the 1.2 being a larger diameter lense allow more light through in the same amount of time? Secondly given the same aperture setting of f2.8 would you expect a noticable difference in the resulting image and has anyone actually tested this out?
I love the way that a number of people commenting on 60D wants are looking for pro level features at a bargain basement price. For me as a sports shooter id be happy with 10fps, 12MP, larger buffer for RAW bursts when i use it, high ISO improvements, dynamic range improvement, fast accurate AF and a screen that gives me a good idea of what im getting. Basically a twaeked MK3. As for the new stuff – USB3, why not and the extra speed would im sure be useful with tethered shooting. GPS – personally dont need it. OLED screen – if it works, great. Video – dont need it and as accreditation for events is usually MUCH stricter on video than stills so i can see why it might be a problem for Canon, i remember reading a report that said the F.A. approval was a possible sticking point aswell.
B->
Its a common missunderstanding on the web that video would be a problem.
My reply from further up:
That is so untrue.
Its when and where you publish your stuff you can get in trouble. Not when you do the shooting.
There´s no thing like an “video licenceâ€Â.
If no video in 1D, what stops me from bringing a 5D in my bag?
On every event they should have a very camera updated security guard to get thru your stuff to see if you can record video. It doesnt work that way.
Its the rights to publish a clip from a Premiere Leauge game, NHL game or whatever that maters, not the filming itself
I understand the semantics error in my statement which you ahve correctly identified. I am however confident that AF technology does not advance so rapidly as something like microchip technology, and I seriously doubt that AF has been improved to allow greater than 11 fps continuous, which we already know a FF mirror and shutter is capable of handling. I would be surprised if it couldnt do 12. so I still see no reason that APS-H can be justified as the correct choice simply on the basis of framerate.
The exposure would be the same, as would the depth of field. the background blur would be a little bit different between the two lenses, probably more attractive on the 50 f/1.2
f/stop is the ratio between aperture diameter and the focal length of the lens. so f/2.8 is 1:2.8, where the focal length is 2.8 times longer than the maximum aperture diameter. the brightness of a lens is controlled be two things. We can approximate a lens as a tube for this explanation. The brightness in the tube is controlled by how big the hole at the end is (aperture diameter) and how long it is (focal length) A quick experiment looking down some carboard tubes should confirm this for you. so you get the same brightness for equivalent ratios. meaning a 400/2.8 is only as bright as a 24/2.8, even though its aperture is much physically bigger. This is the reason why f/stop, which is an arbitrary convention was created, to establish standard amounts of light set through which would hold true across different lenses.
Hmmmm, seems to me the problem is the AF having time to lock focus between mirror flips, at a certain frame rate it’s just not possible. But I can see two possibilities around that for AF beyond 10-11 fps. One is as previvously mentioned the pellicle mirror, the other is a liveview mirror lockup. The pellicle is the better choice as you can still see through the lens, but they might also be able to put a liveview only mode for high speed shooting that may allow faster fps with camcorder type AF – which I must say has gotten pretty good with multiple face recognition and motion tracking. I suppose a third possibilty is they have managed to improve the AF lock on speed to handle faster fps, but I’m more skeptical of that possibility.
Maybe the smaller mirror of APS-H will give space for new AF system used for live view ?
agreed. and if A pellicle mirror is implemented the main mirror does not physically move by definition. Thus, no APS-H speed advantage over FF
That would rock! I wonder if that would help AF in video mode too, assuming it has one.
“On every event they should have a very camera updated security guard to get thru your stuff to see if you can record video. It doesnt work that way.”
Just that happend to me a few times the last year.
Bring in the D700 and any lens you want, but the D90 has to stay in a locker at the entrance.
So don’t try to tell me it won’t happen…
Price is part of progress. But yes, you are right, much of this has to do with getting more for less. However I do think that Canon has a whole between the 50D and the 5D in their lineup that people would be willing to pay $1700-$1900 retail for. Now if Canon gives us the model that we want for $1300 then it becomes a Nikon killer and leads the market for awhile.
60D
1.6x crop
50-3200 clean iso (6400 good, 12800 OK, 25600 barely)
7-9 fps
100% viewfinder
better autofocus with (yes) more points, 19 at least
better weather sealing
better DR
1080p Video at 24fps and 30 fps
wow really? where did this happen :|
[i’m truly curious]
Yea me to. I can only talk from my own experience.
NHL, NFL, Premiere Leauge, F1.
From Dec 2008 >now.
5DmkII with me all the time.
It’s all about rights. Otherwise we could hijack the stream and put it on our website directly.
It’s easy to do, but we haven’t got the rights to do it so our ass would sued.
Same thing if you put up a videoclip from an event when someone bought the rights for it.
I hope you can se the logic in it!
Thanks for clearing that up. I currently only have zooms and am contemplating stepping into primes. Unfortunately not living in a capital city our local camera shops only carry the cheaper 50mm f1.8 in stock. Anything else I would have to order. I am contemplating the 50mm f1.2 but its a lot of money to outlay over and above the 50mm f1.4 without knowing whether there is really that much difference. I currently shoot weddings and a little studio work part time with a old 30D but have been hanging out to see what the 60D and the 1D come out with as to what I upgrade to next. The 5D Mark II really interested me as well but the FPS is holding me back from getting one. Any other wedding photographers have any suggestions?
Whats the problem with USB 3.0? If you think about it…How often does Canon update its xD bodies? And since it’ll have the video capabilites and all that stuff…large files too. So they are anticipating for the future. Though its not use now, but when 3.0 is widely available, the owner can transfer the data faster in the future. Its an easy and cheap upgrade for them. Why not do it now, then wait for the mrk5 to come out then do it. By then we’ll have USB 4.0.
Carl: The results on my iPhone vary quite drastically from yours. No idea on how that plays out on something with a serious battery, though. –j
As I said, if you enter fake data, and a person checks the location, you will be found out. Thats the beauty of it, anyone can go to the coordinates, you can even check on Google Satellite view.
It’s not “closed minded” – it’s knowing what we want (and what we *don’t* want), and it’s not being suckered in by every shiny new gadget that appears on a camera.
if you don’t want it don’t buy it. there may be a market for it. if the sales of some proposed ‘video kit lens’ add so much as a penny to the R&D for the stuff I do care about that’s enough reason to have it as far as I’m concerned.
Personally I find the idea silly, I don’t even know what a ‘video kit lens’ is. The close-mindedness he is referring to is the immediate disapproval of an idea whith which one is not sufficiently familiar to see its advantage, or has no personal use for. I think we should all try to be less close-minded, we might even learn a better way to make our images as a result
my $.02
“DR increased to levels where the Nikons are or beyond: You just got a sale.”
You’ll find that – with the sole exception of the new “toy” Nikon – Canon’s bodies beat the Nikons for DR across the board: certainly my 40D chews up and spits out the D300…
The german canon site has the manual for the D60:
http://www3.canon.de/pro/bda/fot/eos/
http://www3.canon.de/images/pro/fot/slr/geh/file/D60_HW_DE.exe
D60 and 60D completely different