The follow-up to the Canon EOS-1D X Mark II may come in 2019 [CR2]

[rbielefeld]

Frankly, the Sony A9 is a pretty amazing sports/wildlife camera.

The AF of the Nikon D5 simply out performs the 1DX2. So many wildlife photographers are dumping Canon gear and switch to Nikon. And Canon does not have a camera body even comparable to the D850. Hopefully, Canon will at least close the gap if they lack the technology to take the lead.

I like my 1DX2 but the keeper rate for BIF is far below a D5.

I disagree with this assessment. I have shot both systems a lot and shoot almost exclusively BIF and when the AF is set up correctly for the BIF scenario being shot, the Canon holds its own if not does better than the D5 in my experience. Moreover, the Canon system performs extremely well with BIF at 1200mm (600mm f/4 + 2xTC), something Nikon cannot achieve. Overall, I try to avoid making sweeping statements about any particular system without a lot of data from a lot of photographers. Basically, everyone shoots differently. Some people will find the Canon does better for them and visa versa. Both are very good systems and can consistently capture action I never thought would be possible to photograph with any regularity.

 

[Quarkcharmed]

Weight is also important for me. A camera has to be heavy. As a rule of thumb I should be able to knock someone unconscious with my camera and the camera should still work after that.

Just curious, have you had real life practical tests with the cameras you buy?

 

[Del Paso]

I disagree with this assessment. I have shot both systems a lot and shoot almost exclusively BIF and when the AF is set up correctly for the BIF scenario being shot, the Canon holds its own if not does better than the D5 in my experience. Moreover, the Canon system performs extremely well with BIF at 1200mm (600mm f/4 + 2xTC), something Nikon cannot achieve. Overall, I try to avoid making sweeping statements about any particular system without a lot of data from a lot of photographers. Basically, everyone shoots differently. Some people will find the Canon does better for them and visa versa. Both are very good systems and can consistently capture action I never thought would be possible to photograph with any regularity.View attachment 182150

Wonderful picture, really superb!

 

[rbielefeld]

Wonderful picture, really superb!

Thanks for the compliment.

 

[unfocused]

I disagree with this assessment. I have shot both systems a lot and shoot almost exclusively BIF and when the AF is set up correctly for the BIF scenario being shot, the Canon holds its own if not does better than the D5 in my experience...

I'm always interested in learning more about other people's techniques. Can you expand on the settings you use for BIF scenarios.

 

[ethanz]

Reading many comments here i am asking myself, how I can be so happy with my 5DIV and 1DXII.

You must be crazy and delusional to be happy with them. Sorry to break it to you.

 

[ethanz]

Just curious, have you had real life practical tests with the cameras you buy?

Takes Canon bashing to a whole new level

 

[privatebydesign]

Frankly, the Sony A9 is a pretty amazing sports/wildlife camera.

The AF of the Nikon D5 simply out performs the 1DX2. So many wildlife photographers are dumping Canon gear and switch to Nikon. And Canon does not have a camera body even comparable to the D850. Hopefully, Canon will at least close the gap if they lack the technology to take the lead.

I like my 1DX2 but the keeper rate for BIF is far below a D5.

That is user error, plain and simple.

If there was a genuine keeper rate difference between the two then there is no way the two biggest sports shooting agencies in the world would be using Canon. Neither would world renowned wildlife shooters like Andy Rouse who switched back to Canon after shooting Nikon for years, he changed to Nikon when he was affected by the 1D MkIII AF issues. He tried out the 1DX MkII and the 200-400 and said the AF returned him many more keepers than his D5 for wildlife.

As for the D5 hype, that all happened around the time Arthur Morris said he couldn't get a good shot of a nearly static pelican with a 1DX MkII but could with a Nikon, utter bullish!t.

 

[imagery99]

I disagree with this assessment. I have shot both systems a lot and shoot almost exclusively BIF and when the AF is set up correctly for the BIF scenario being shot, the Canon holds its own if not does better than the D5 in my experience. Moreover, the Canon system performs extremely well with BIF at 1200mm (600mm f/4 + 2xTC), something Nikon cannot achieve. Overall, I try to avoid making sweeping statements about any particular system without a lot of data from a lot of photographers. Basically, everyone shoots differently. Some people will find the Canon does better for them and visa versa. Both are very good systems and can consistently capture action I never thought would be possible to photograph with any regularity.View attachment 182150

Nice image! I have been reading on fredmiranda and dpreview for 2-3 years now and yes, lots of Canon wildlife shooters seem to have switched to Nikon for the better af/ tracking. Some of the top BIF shooters like Arash Hazeghi, Art Morris, arbitrage (forgot his name) to name a few switched last year (not sure if you consider Art Morris as one of top maybe just popular). Of course it was very hard form them to accept the reality at first and sell their Canon gear but they eventually did. I don't think they would sell their Canon gears if the AF of Nikon bodies is 'marginally better'. The keeper rate is probably 10% more than with Canon as what I've been reading. Also, the moderator of BPN recently switched after staunchly defending Canon's AF according to Art Morris on his blog. I know people who are emotionally attached to Canon will say Canon has the best of everything but that's not true at all.

 

[unfocused]

I spent a couple decades in publishing and I could count on one hand the number of times I published an uncropped image. That's an internet myth. In fact, the better photographers I published intentionally shot "loose" so that art directors and layout artists wouldn't have problems with composition. I've seen far more artwork discarded for being shot too tight than for having to be excessively cropped. We may have different definitions of who are and are not "professionals"...

Another complicating factor is the reality of shooting for the internet (which is where most pictures live today.) Most websites are optimized for horizontal shots, which means that even subjects that would be better framed as verticals, must be shot as horizontals to accommodate publishing on the web.

 

[imagery99]

That is user error, plain and simple.

If there was a genuine keeper rate difference between the two then there is no way the two biggest sports shooting agencies in the world would be using Canon. Neither would world renowned wildlife shooters like Andy Rouse who switched back to Canon after shooting Nikon for years, he changed to Nikon when he was affected by the 1D MkIII AF issues. He tried out the 1DX MkII and the 200-400 and said the AF returned him many more keepers than his D5 for wildlife.

As for the D5 hype, that all happened around the time Arthur Morris said he couldn't get a good shot of a nearly static pelican with a 1DX MkII but could with a Nikon, utter bullish!t.

Some popular wildlife shooters switched before Art Morris though. In fact, he switched after hearing some Canon shooters switched and was surprised about how the Nikon D500/ D850 / D5 have much higher keeper rate.

 

[AlanF]

.....Some of the top BIF shooters like Arash Hazeghi, Art Morris, .....

Really?
“I Suck at Flight Photography.”
Art Morris

http://www.birdsasart-blog.com/2012/10/27/i-suck-at-flight-photography-but/
His forte is set-piece portraits, which he does rather well.

 

[imagery99]

@ AlanF ---which is why I said I wasn't sure if you people consider him as 'one of the top' BIF shooters.

 

[Graphic.Artifacts]

I wouldn't pay too much attention to what some "popular" internet photographers are doing. Switching brands causes controversy, controversey attracts page views and page views are monetized. Nikon AF is a bit more intelligent while Canon AF uses a bit more brute force but competent photographers seem to get similar results with both systems. For unskilled users. the Nikon system is easier to get good results so it does better with reviewers who haven't spent much time photographing action. At least that's the way I see it.

 

[rbielefeld]

I am not emotionally attached to Canon. I will shoot whatever system I believe is the best for what I do. My Canon system works for my BIF photography. I am not a casual BIF shooter, I make a living do it, so I try other equipment all the time. Canon is still the overall best tool for me. People switch systems all the time based on how they shoot.

Nice image! I have been reading on fredmiranda and dpreview for 2-3 years now and yes, lots of Canon wildlife shooters seem to have switched to Nikon for the better af/ tracking. Some of the top BIF shooters like Arash Hazeghi, Art Morris, arbitrage (forgot his name) to name a few switched last year (not sure if you consider Art Morris as one of top maybe just popular). Of course it was very hard form them to accept the reality at first and sell their Canon gear but they eventually did. I don't think they would sell their Canon gears if the AF of Nikon bodies is 'marginally better'. The keeper rate is probably 10% more than with Canon as what I've been reading. Also, the moderator of BPN recently switched after staunchly defending Canon's AF according to Art Morris on his blog. I know people who are emotionally attached to Canon will say Canon has the best of everything but that's not true at all.

That is user error, plain and simple.

If there was a genuine keeper rate difference between the two then there is no way the two biggest sports shooting agencies in the world would be using Canon. Neither would world renowned wildlife shooters like Andy Rouse who switched back to Canon after shooting Nikon for years, he changed to Nikon when he was affected by the 1D MkIII AF issues. He tried out the 1DX MkII and the 200-400 and said the AF returned him many more keepers than his D5 for wildlife.

As for the D5 hype, that all happened around the time Arthur Morris said he couldn't get a good shot of a nearly static pelican with a 1DX MkII but could with a Nikon, utter bullish!t.

Shoot the system that works best for you. Plain and simple. Canon works better for me, especially when taking the 600 f/4 and putting 1.4x and 2x TCs on it. It just works when set up correctly.

 

[Graphic.Artifacts]

BIF shooting is 90 percent technique and opportunity. I can tell the difference between shots I take with a 7D2/400 f5.6 combo and a 1DX2/600 f4 combo but I doubt if very many of the folks who see the finished work are able to.

 

[imagery99]

I wouldn't pay too much attention to what some "popular" internet photographers are doing. Switching brands causes controversy, controversey attracts page views and page views are monetized. Nikon AF is a bit more intelligent while Canon AF uses a bit more brute force but competent photographers seem to get similar results with both systems. For unskilled users. the Nikon system is easier to get good results so it does better with reviewers who haven't spent much time photographing action. At least that's the way I see it.

I think this is the great summary of how they differ. But if you can get it easier, why not? The same with Sony's eye-AF, if you can shoot portraits faster with eye-AF instead of moving your focus point, why not? Technology improves and people want to shoot their favorite subjects easier and easier. If you want the upcoming 1DXiii to have some improvements, I'm pretty sure you want it to shoot sports/BIF easier. What I don't like hearing is hardcore fanboys who refuse to believe that some systems have a better/ efficient way of capturing an image. You want those features too to be present to an upcoming Canon camera.

 

[AlanF]

I wouldn't pay too much attention to what some "popular" internet photographers are doing. Switching brands causes controversy, controversey attracts page views and page views are monetized. Nikon AF is a bit more intelligent while Canon AF uses a bit more brute force but competent photographers seem to get similar results with both systems. For unskilled users. the Nikon system is easier to get good results so it does better with reviewers who haven't spent much time photographing action. At least that's the way I see it.

That's a very good argument for most of us to move to Nikon.

 

[privatebydesign]

Some popular wildlife shooters switched before Art Morris though. In fact, he switched after hearing some Canon shooters switched and was surprised about how the Nikon D500/ D850 / D5 have much higher keeper rate.

Yes and some switched the other way, like Andy Rouse who had a very dim view of Canon but the reality of the resultant images persuaded him to change back, the initial 'divorce' from Canon was very public and acrimonious and changing back wasn't a simple thing.

Some will get better results with one, some the other, neither is measurably 'better' than the other. One thing I have noticed with the 1DX MkII AF is that it is way more responsive the I am, my settings from day to day might change depending on my level of alertness, tiredness, fatigue, etc Sometimes I can outrun an AF change sensitivity, sometimes I can't, I don't find one set of settings works for a specific situation rather I adjust as I am going through a shoot. I watched a video by Grant Atkinson on AF setup where he creates a custom menu panel with just the three AF adjustments in it and uses those rather than case modes, it works very well for me.

 

[Graphic.Artifacts]

I think this is the great summary of how they differ. But if you can get it easier, why not? The same with Sony's eye-AF, if you can shoot portraits faster with eye-AF instead of moving your focus point, why not? Technology improves and people want to shoot their favorite subjects easier and easier. If you want the upcoming 1DXiii to have some improvements, I'm pretty sure you want it to shoot sports/BIF easier. What I don't like hearing is hardcore fanboys who refuse to believe that some systems have a better/ efficient way of capturing an image. You want those features too to be present to an upcoming Canon camera.

For me it's a question of how much control you want to cede to the AF system. When making a solo portrait obviously you want to focus on the closest eye most of the time so eye AF is fine. But there are many situations where the AF is not going to be intelligent enough to make that decision which is why I prefer to control that myself. AI and computational photography are progressing rapidly but I don't think we are at a place yet where I'm going to turn control of something as important as autofocus selection entirely over to the camera. YMMV.