Rest well Canon EOS 7D series [CR2]

Dragon

EF 800L f/5.6, RF 800 f/11
May 29, 2019
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Wow, you really nailed that focus. Incredible how sharp that looks even at an insane crop. Look at the detail on the tree branches, the moss. My images start falling apart at more than a 100% crop on an 80d with the 50 1.8.
The 100-400L attached to a 5DSR is a wicked sharp combo. Great for BIF because you get a FF field of view with crop frame resolution.
 
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YuengLinger

Print the ones you love.
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We've been consistently underwhelmed by Canon's conservative, practical approach to new products.

But maybe this will be the time they astound all their enthusiastic customers, swinging to the fences with a surprise jump in EVF, AF, and sensor tech. Maybe the R version of the 5D V will incorporate the best of the 7D series and the 5D series in one amazing FF body that costs about the same as the 5D IV, and be so good it replaces the 1D series. An optional grip will satisfy 1D shooters in terms of ergonomics. Streamline the lineup while emphasizing the advantages of FF, more or less casting off crop-sensor customers who don't want to upgrade. (After all, they do have the RP for entry-level FF).

For those who just want a fun camera for family outings and moments that deserve more than a smartphone, the EOS M will be around for a while, until smartphones eat them too.

Make money off of lenses, become untouchable in FF sales. Give people a clear reason to shoot something other than a smartphone.

And smash that hobbling 4k crop-factor in the bargain.
 
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unfocused

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Jul 20, 2010
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Canon does a wonderful job keeping us all guessing. I have to admire their ability to keep secrets. People get frustrated and will claim they needed this or that yesterday, but really that isn't true.

What people need is a road map so they can plan. My biggest frustration hasn't been what they have and haven't released it has been knowing what I can safely buy. I searoiuly belive part of the reason they are loosing customers is no body knows what they can safly buy with out getting F'd out of a lot of money if Canon is planning on abandoning some thing. If I switch to Fuji APS-C I can sleep well knowing that it will be supported into the future. ...

When getting ready to release the next model of an existing body or even unveiling a new body, it makes sense to build some suspense. But we are not in that situation.

Canon has introduced a radical new lens mount and that is creating a lot of uncertainty among their customers. While I'm usually a staunch defender of Canon, I'm no apologist. They really need to provide some clarity because high value customers are confused and uncertain about the future.

For reasons that many have stated here, the situation is heightened with the 7D. It's their flagship APS-C camera and to just drop it is going to leave a lot of customers with a bad taste in their mouths.

And...while I agree that they need to provide a road map, there is no credibility in claiming Canon is losing customers. That's factually wrong.
 
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Jul 21, 2010
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Yes and no. I find that the smaller the subject in the viewfinder, the harder it is to nail the focus. For a moderate crop, it's usually not a problem. But, if you are distance limited and need a severe crop, it can be frustrating to find that even though the autofocus point was on the bird's head, it didn't really catch the focus.
That’s true with an OVF, but with an EVF the camera could simply magnify the image in the viewfinder to match the crop on the sensor. Or magnify it even further, with an appropriate setting. Problem solved.
 
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canonmike

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I hadn't thought about that, but you make a good point. Very little about this makes sense.

Traditionally, the 7D series has come in under the 5D in price but over the 5D in features. I don't know how Canon packs all of this into a mirrorless body that would come in under the price of the R. But, if it is more than the R, I don't see 7D users buying it. We will know more for sure when the 90D or whatever they call it, comes out, but it just seems like Canon has really painted themselves into a corner on this.

To me that the easy way out is to release a 7DIII with an new sensor, touchscreen, f8 points, upgraded autofocus, 12 fps and call it good. Then wait five years for the market to sort out. As I've said before, I think once full frame hits about 36 mp, the perceived reach advantage of APS-C is no longer that significant in real world use.
Understand your desire here but am afraid that, alas, Canon has spent too much R&D on the R series mirrorless line, with all the hype continuing to get us moving more in that direction. I think their logic is that once we see how good the RF lenses are, in spite of high costs, we'll eventually embrace the fact, that's where the future for Canon and its customers, herein lays. The only reason they gave us an EF adapter is to mitigate the revolt that surely would have developed in the Canon community, in the absence of said adapter that would allow for all those EF lenses out there. I well remember the advent of the EF lenses, which I was not too thrilled about, until I picked one up, used it and saw how fast and quiet it was. That was my first EF lens, a 300mm EF F4L USM. I'm afraid the handwriting is on the well, like it or not, DSLR's are on the way out. With all camera sales down the last several years, I'm just glad that all the mfgs are still willing to bring us new gear, whatever it might be.
 
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AlanF

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That’s true with an OVF, but with an EVF the camera could simply magnify the image in the viewfinder to match the crop on the sensor. Or magnify it even further, with an appropriate setting. Problem solved.
As far as I have seen so far, DSLRs are able to have a spot AF that is smaller than that available on the various makes of mirrorless and so nail focus on a narrower area. What's the size of the AF spot on your R compared with your 1DX?
 
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Jul 21, 2010
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As far as I have seen so far, DSLRs are able to have a spot AF that is smaller than that available on the various makes of mirrorless and so nail focus on a narrower area. What's the size of the AF spot on your R compared with your 1DX?
Good question, I haven’t checked. However, I suspect the problem lies less with the size of the point, and more with imprecision in the alignment of the AF sensor with the AF point display in the viewfinder, a problem that is exacerbated as the AF point itself becomes smaller.
 
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Ozarker

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What people need is a road map so they can plan. My biggest frustration hasn't been what they have and haven't released it has been knowing what I can safely buy. I searoiuly belive part of the reason they are loosing customers is no body knows what they can safly buy with out getting F'd out of a lot of money if Canon is planning on abandoning some thing. If I switch to Fuji APS-C I can sleep well knowing that it will be supported into the future. Will Canon APS-C other than M which is a complete non starter for me?
Canon has really never provided a road map, ever. I don't worry about the camera bodies too much at all. Lenses are more my focus. I used to shoot ASP-C. Were I still doing that, I don't think I would be worried now. Though I understand some will worry, I don't. There are too many things I can change without worrying about what I cannot.

With the sales of entry level DSLR and MILC cameras in such deep decline industry wide (and Fuji holding such a minuscule part of the overall market), I would bet my money on a company in better financial shape at times like this.

As far as being F'd out of money, I don't get it. Bodies are replaced every few years anyway. They don't stop working when a company decides to discontinue a particular line. There are no victims that get ripped off or screwed over. People get what they pay for. A purchase doesn't make Canon perpetually on the hook for whatever one wants in the future.

Canon might also decide (likely have already decided) to produce a capable camera to replace that line.
 
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7D moves a lot of big whites. That is the primary reason why I have been shocked at how poorly the 7D fans have been treated.

This smells like they are going to take the new sensor for the 90D stick it in an R body and say it is the mirrorless replacement for the 7D. I would be fine with that. There is no specific RF-S mount needed and they really wouldn't have to build any APS-C sized lenses as people could adapt the existing EF-S lenses. That is what I do to shoot video on the R. This would give the APS-C base which is way bigger than FF a path forward rather than just giving them the finger which has been the plan so far.

I do wish they would change their crop from 1.6 to 1.5 with this move..
This would also be in-line with multiple statements from multiple canon company reps about selling more full frame lenses. If you want small and light lenses, go to the M mount cameras. If you want the maximum performance, go use the RF mount. Both can use EF lenses just fine. I imagine the only cheaper lens we are going to see on the RF mount anytime soon is the super zoom. That would be a decent kit lens for the prosumer side of the 7d base or for the hypothetical 90d on RF. I also wouldn’t be surprised if Canon takes a page from Sony and Apple, continuing to sell and make the R and RP but for cheaper and cheaper MSRP. If they were able to get the RP+24-240 at a 1499 price point fox Xmas it would sell well in big box stores.
 
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I'm just waiting to click the buy button on two lenses for the 2x 7DmkIIs I have or, start moving to a new platform from another vendor. Other than just going cold turkey and switching to the Sony A9 or a Nikon D850 , there are not many options left. Waiting for the 1dxmk3 release for a better used market price on the 1dxmk2 isn't one of them as my trust in Canon is dwindling. The current R line is not ready and I'm hesitant to spend on the new mount before any reliable sports (and general all around) mirrorless cam is released. It's too soon to drop the 7D line. Let's see if the 90D specs are better than rumors project them to be.
 
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I'm just waiting to click the buy button on two lenses for the 2x 7DmkIIs I have or, start moving to a new platform from another vendor. Other than just going cold turkey and switching to the Sony A9 or a Nikon D850 , there are not many options left. Waiting for the 1dxmk3 release for a better used market price on the 1dxmk2 isn't one of them as my trust in Canon is dwindling. The current R line is not ready and I'm hesitant to spend on the new mount before any reliable sports (and general all around) mirrorless cam is released. It's too soon to drop the 7D line. Let's see if the 90D specs are better than rumors project them to be.

If you can afford to get into the A9 or D850, why not do it? The chances of any Canon model, especially a 7D replacement, beating them in the near future are miniscule. The D850 is the best DSLR ever made. And the A9 is incredibly capable, and will likely continue to receive AI AF updates for years. Sony glass is excellent, if you can afford it.
 
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The 2001 Canon 1D used an APS-H sensor (1.3 crop). Key features were shutter speeds of 1/16000 to 30 sec and strobe-sync of 1/500 sec.
These 2001 specs make a good argument for a R body with an APS-H sensor (28.7 x 19.1 mm) as a 7D2 replacement.
An APS-H sensor gives a 24-200mm zoom a 31-260mm FF-FOV. The rumored Canon RF 500mm f/4L IS 500mm becomes a 650mm FF-FOV.
 
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Jul 21, 2010
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The 2001 Canon 1D used an APS-H sensor (1.3 crop). Key features were shutter speeds of 1/16000 to 30 sec and strobe-sync of 1/500 sec.
These 2001 specs...
Important to note that the 1D used a CCD sensor, and after that Canon switched to and has remained with CMOS sensors. That CCD sensor is what made the faster shutter speed and Xsync possible, not the fact that it’s an APS-H sensor.

Sorry, but APS-H is in a coffin with plenty of nails.
 
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Most of those in the know got a Nikon D500 instead of the 7DII. The 7DII AF is too unreliable, at times superb at times missing easy shots. I won't miss the 7DII but am disappointed they won't offer a 7DIII, as I was hoping to see if they could ever take the lead again in AF. D500 is still amazing for its price and overall AF is better than my 1DX's.

An R replacement will require big changes. Firstly Cannon's sensor tech is just not suitable for mirrorless. The glacial sensor read speed is most of the reason for slow AF in the EOS R and then the use of a single digicis just not up to offering the processing power for so many AF points. Canon needs new sensor tech and it'll be released in FF long before we see any sports oriented APS-C camera. I wouldn't be surprised if we are in the same boat this time next year talking about when sporty FF let alone APS-C R camera is coming. It'll need to be damned good with Sony working on an APS-C version of the A9 effectively.
 
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Jethro

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An R replacement will require big changes. Firstly Cannon's sensor tech is just not suitable for mirrorless. The glacial sensor read speed is most of the reason for slow AF in the EOS R and then the use of a single digicis just not up to offering the processing power for so many AF points. Canon needs new sensor tech and it'll be released in FF long before we see any sports oriented APS-C camera. I wouldn't be surprised if we are in the same boat this time next year talking about when sporty FF let alone APS-C R camera is coming. It'll need to be damned good with Sony working on an APS-C version of the A9 effectively.
Speaking as someone who actually owns and uses an EOS R, the AF is not slow at all. Both the EOS R and the EOS RP reused existing DSLR sensors, hence the price-points of both the current R series cameras. If by 'new sensor tech' you actually mean 'new sensors', then undoubtedly we will see those when the next R series cameras are announced/released.
 
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