1DX II 1080p @120fps real resolution issue.

[Jack Douglas]

Thanks to all who offer help, I'm appreciating all the comments and of course have to trust what I'm being told since I can't judge yet for myself. Hours of reading and videos are helping and it's slowly making sense.

This may be a repeat of what I've said previously (I'm too tired to remember) but it would seem most of the condemnation of the 1DX II video capability comes from folk that want PP grading capabilities that it doesn't support. One video I watched suggested being careful to set things up right before shooting (custom 0 -1 +1 +1) and then there isn't need for much grading.

For me just getting super nice, usable video out of the camera would be great.

Jack

 

[East Wind Photography]

Is it "smoothness" that determines the speed you shoot at?

Jack

The system you use is what traditionally determined your frame rate. Cinema was 24, PAL tv systems (EU, UK, AUS) were 25 progressive or 50 interlaced frames and NTSC (US, Japan, S America) were 30p/60i (well 29.97 but lets not go there). HDTV still tend to be an interlaced signal so you're working at 50/60i

Playing footage back on a computer you don't have interlacing or frame rate as a constraint. 24/25 is considered to look more cinematic, because we are used to seeing cinema at 24fps. 50/60i looks like video - motion is smoother, but because the traditional associations are video=cheap cinema=expensive and expensive=good cheap=bad a lot of the videos you'll see online are shot at 24 or 25fps. Consequently, when Peter Jackson released the HFR version of the Hobbit at 48fps most reviewers went yuck, it looks like a cheap 1990s tv series.

Is it "smoothness" that determines the speed you shoot at?

Jack

There are a lot of factors but to get the smoothest action you should use a shutter speed of 1/fps. That is when shooting at 4k 30fps, you should use 1/30s shutter speed, and vary your aperture and/or ISO to adjust exposure. That should give you the best smoothness.

There are times when you should/can deviate depending on how much movement there is and wether you are shooting from a tripod. Some forms of special effects require deviation as well.

Its always best to fill up as much of the frames as possible with content and eliminate gaps between frames.

This is wrong. Sorry, but the usual rule of thumb for shutter speed in video is the 180 degree rule (http://www.red.com/learn/red-101/shutter-angle-tutorial) which states that your shutter should be 1/(2*frame rate) so for 30p use 1/60th and for 60p use 1/120th.

There are a few times when you'll deviate from that - if you're planning to use a slow motion plugin like twixtor, if you're shooting something like rain falling which is too fast to see at 1/50th, or to create a jarring motion effect for your zombie chase sequence, but 95% of the time for video stay at 2*frame rate.

And from a cinematography perspective you don't use aperture or ISO much for exposure, your aperture is used for DoF and your ISO is kept as close to base as possible (as you don't have tools that are anything like as good as still for NR, and movement of noise over time can be a lot more distracting than in a single frame). Your go to changes are ND and lighting the scene, then ISO (particularly with a 1DX2 which should allow some pretty clean highish ISO video) then aperture.

Maybe thats the case with the red system. Ive used both on the 1dx ii and can see little difference...the 1/fps tends to give a bit smoother image when panning or when something moves across the screen quickly. 1dx ii definately does something different as far as reading data off the sensor.

 

[Jack Douglas]

East Wind Photography, so it's not that critical, but what about when you use 1/1000, how bad is it. I'm waiting for my battery to charge but it'll be a while before I'll be trying video.

Jack

 

[East Wind Photography]

East Wind Photography, so it's not that critical, but what about when you use 1/1000, how bad is it. I'm waiting for my battery to charge but it'll be a while before I'll be trying video.

Jack

At 4k60 1/1000 is OK but at 4k30 you can see the difference with fast movement. If you goal is to.do frame grabs from it though you don't have much choice.

 

[Jack Douglas]

East Wind Photography, so it's not that critical, but what about when you use 1/1000, how bad is it. I'm waiting for my battery to charge but it'll be a while before I'll be trying video.

Jack

At 4k60 1/1000 is OK but at 4k30 you can see the difference with fast movement. If you goal is to.do frame grabs from it though you don't have much choice.

Well known bird photographer, Glenn Bartley, shoots 7DII for extra reach and did a 1DX II review where he mentioned that the frame grab was one reason he'd consider the camera. It sure sounds inviting but there wouldn't be any focus correction if it was a bird who was changing position, or would the camera track that. I guess I need to start answering my own questions now by trying it out. I'm overwhelmed by it all.

Jack

 

[Besisika]

East Wind Photography, so it's not that critical, but what about when you use 1/1000, how bad is it. I'm waiting for my battery to charge but it'll be a while before I'll be trying video.

Jack

At 4k60 1/1000 is OK but at 4k30 you can see the difference with fast movement. If you goal is to.do frame grabs from it though you don't have much choice.

Well known bird photographer, Glenn Bartley, shoots 7DII for extra reach and did a 1DX II review where he mentioned that the frame grab was one reason he'd consider the camera. It sure sounds inviting but there wouldn't be any focus correction if it was a bird who was changing position, or would the camera track that. I guess I need to start answering my own questions now by trying it out. I'm overwhelmed by it all.

Jack

I have tried it and I am very please with result.
I did not intend to shoot usable video footage and frame grab at the same time. I simply separate the two due to shutter speed.
When shooting for frame grab, I set my camera like I was about to shoot photo (high shutter speed to freeze motion) and when I want to shoot video I switch it back to video set up.
Frame grab doesn't have to be 10min long, actually they are (the way I used it) series of 3 to 10s snipek, but contain enough frames for you to choose. 64gb card was enough for 3 hours.
You set your focus mode to tracking + face recognition; and when shooting you rely on face recognition (if the subject is close enough and human) or just tap on it and let the camera track it.
Yes, it stays in focus (depending on your depth of field). You can pre-focus it as well.
Below is an example taken using it. I tried all 3 methods here, the face recognition failed due to the hat and the movement of the head, but tapping works fine. This one was manual with pre-focus.
To practice, you don't have to wait for birds, just try it on the street with cars and people.

Verdun Cricket-0002 by Besisika, on Flickr

 

[Jack Douglas]

Besisika, thank you for the helpful comments and encouragement. Of course I have to start using it and as you say small bursts will function much like high frame rate photos. I guess it goes without saying, that a tripod would be indispensable. For bursts a small CFast card is no problem. Is the AF fast enough to adjust with each frame or is there noticeable loss of frames?

I'll be fiddling around trying to get things setup for photos with my new 400 and trying to AFMA etc. It's a challenge but fun times are ahead.

Jack

 

[Besisika]

Besisika, thank you for the helpful comments and encouragement. Of course I have to start using it and as you say small bursts will function much like high frame rate photos. I guess it goes without saying, that a tripod would be indispensable. For bursts a small CFast card is no problem. Is the AF fast enough to adjust with each frame or is there noticeable loss of frames?

I'll be fiddling around trying to get things setup for photos with my new 400 and trying to AFMA etc. It's a challenge but fun times are ahead.

Jack

At high speed, I don't actually use tripod. That was shot around 1/1600 - 1/2000th sec so tripod was not required, but you can use it if you want. My opinion, monopod would be more suitable. I use tripod for actual video shooting as these are usually around 1/60th sec.
My AF was fast enough. It was bright sunny day and I had not trouble. Tap on the subject first and once you see it grabbed then press the record button. After 30min -ish of trying I got the hand of it. I had some missed focus but I guess these were mainly user error.

 

[East Wind Photography]

Yes, dual pixel AF works very well in live view and can track subjects very well. It does much better if a face is involved but it can track based on color and contrast as well. Af tracking and tracking speed can be adjusted. Usually for video you want slow and dramatic focus shifts, but for action and best tracking, particularly if you are frame grabbing, you just set it to its fastest settings.

 

[Jack Douglas]

Thanks guys. I actually pressed the shutter this morning. It scared me it's so loud compared to my 6D. The viewfinder is awesome and of course that red focus point!! AF at F8 with 400 DO II X2 III is super. I have it set for cross points only, which is that center vertical region with spot focus. This is going to be so great having the reach of 800 (I was worried when I was MF on 6D).

Jack

 

[East Wind Photography]

Thanks guys. I actually pressed the shutter this morning. It scared me it's so loud compared to my 6D. The viewfinder is awesome and of course that red focus point!! AF at F8 with 400 DO II X2 III is super. I have it set for cross points only, which is that center vertical region with spot focus. This is going to be so great having the reach of 800 (I was worried when I was MF on 6D).

Jack

Ive found the AF is so great with this one that i dont need to restrict it to cross points like i did on the 5diii and 7dii.

 

[Jack Douglas]

East Wind Photography, thanks for that. I'm going to change it to the whole region. With the 6D the non-cross points were noticeably poorer.

Jack