5DIV price confirmed

[neuroanatomist]

The problem with Canon is that they are using massive price differences around the globe, which I do not accept. But all I can do is to be loud and clear about my discontent and not buy. If enough people did that, especially the "not buy" thing, Canon may listen and do something about it. I am not very optimistic though.

You certainly don't have to accept it, but it's Canon's prerogative to charge what they want, where they want. But because they can, it doesn't follow that they should. Since I've previously designated BS as a term applied to DxO's Scores, perhaps we can label Canon's global differential pricing extortion policy a pile of dung.

I do sort of wonder, though, if Canon Global/HQ is at the root of it. How much autonomy do country-level subsidiaries have? Canon USA decided not to sell or service the M2, and initially did not sell or service some of the EF-M lenses, for example. So is the problem in your case Canon, or specifically Canon Norway? Not that it matters in the end, I suppose – but voting with your wallet is the best way to send a message.

 

[Eldar]

The problem with Canon is that they are using massive price differences around the globe, which I do not accept. But all I can do is to be loud and clear about my discontent and not buy. If enough people did that, especially the "not buy" thing, Canon may listen and do something about it. I am not very optimistic though.

You certainly don't have to accept it, but it's Canon's prerogative to charge what they want, where they want. But because they can, it doesn't follow that they should. Since I've previously designated BS as a term applied to DxO's Scores, perhaps we can label Canon's global differential pricing extortion policy a pile of dung.

I do sort of wonder, though, if Canon Global/HQ is at the root of it. How much autonomy do country-level subsidiaries have? Canon USA decided not to sell or service the M2, and initially did not sell or service some of the EF-M lenses, for example. So is the problem in your case Canon, or specifically Canon Norway? Not that it matters in the end, I suppose – but voting with your wallet is the best way to send a message.

I am confident that these decisions are made in HQ or maybe at the nest regional level, in our case Europe (even the CFast-card deal for the 1DX-II was controlled and (hopelessly) administered from the European HQ). If you subtract the various VATs around, you´ll see that the European prices are pretty conform. In Norway we have longer warranties and a stronger customer protection, which adds a little to our price and there are a few others with the same. But I have seen the prices for Poland, Finland, UK, Germany, Switzerland, Norway, Sweden and Denmark (at least) and they are pretty much same same.

But to be fair, having made a couple of comparisons to Nikon and Sony, they are no better. A D810 is $2.796,95 at B&H and is priced at $3.840 here. A Sony A7R-II is $3.198 at B&H and $4.207 here. So from that perspective, Canon is just doing what the others are doing. However, when launching the 5DIII, 1DX, 7DII, 5DS/R and 1DX-II, we saw a multiplication factor of about 10x from the USD price to the NOK price, which is reasonable. For the 5DIV, that has turned to 12x.

 

[Diko]

The problem with Canon is that they are using massive price differences around the globe, which I do not accept. But all I can do is to be loud and clear about my discontent and not buy. If enough people did that, especially the "not buy" thing, Canon may listen and do something about it. I am not very optimistic though.

You certainly don't have to accept it, but it's Canon's prerogative to charge what they want, where they want. But because they can, it doesn't follow that they should. Since I've previously designated BS as a term applied to DxO's Scores, perhaps we can label Canon's global differential pricing extortion policy a pile of dung.

I do sort of wonder, though, if Canon Global/HQ is at the root of it. How much autonomy do country-level subsidiaries have? Canon USA decided not to sell or service the M2, and initially did not sell or service some of the EF-M lenses, for example. So is the problem in your case Canon, or specifically Canon Norway? Not that it matters in the end, I suppose – but voting with your wallet is the best way to send a message.

I am confident that these decisions are made in HQ or maybe at the nest regional level, in our case Europe (even the CFast-card deal for the 1DX-II was controlled and (hopelessly) administered from the European HQ). If you subtract the various VATs around, you´ll see that the European prices are pretty conform. In Norway we have longer warranties and a stronger customer protection, which adds a little to our price and there are a few others with the same. But I have seen the prices for Poland, Finland, UK, Germany, Switzerland, Norway, Sweden and Denmark (at least) and they are pretty much same same.

But to be fair, having made a couple of comparisons to Nikon and Sony, they are no better. A D810 is $2.796,95 at B&H and is priced at $3.840 here. A Sony A7R-II is $3.198 at B&H and $4.207 here. So from that perspective, Canon is just doing what the others are doing. However, when launching the 5DIII, 1DX, 7DII, 5DS/R and 1DX-II, we saw a multiplication factor of about 10x from the USD price to the NOK price, which is reasonable. For the 5DIV, that has turned to 12x.

What is hidden under ghe abbreviation of NOK?


Canon is the bigest "of them all". That means it's normal for them to have grey market issues. I wonder how are the things in the NIKON camp.

However I will vote with my vote NOT by not buying, but instead by byuing from the grey market.

As for the autonomy thing I will take the liberty to speculate that generally speaking the the biggest possible autonomy is on continental level. However the world advertising (please note I refrain from using "Marketing") is mainly coming from the US.

 

[Eldar]

What is hidden under ghe abbreviation of NOK?

NOrwegian Kroner = 8,2NOK/1USD (at closing on Friday)

 

[Bennymiata]

In Australia, the 5d4 is being offered for A$4988.00 (US $3807.80) at a chain brick and mortar retailer which includes a 10% tax, so it's not so bad compared to the US.
High taxes and high labour rates in Europe do make their cost base higher than it is in other places, but then again, Europeans get free medical whereas Americans pay dearly for the sort of health cover that Europeans and Australians take for granted.

Which shop is that?

Sorry for the late reply.
It's Digi Direct.

 

[neuroanatomist]

As for the autonomy thing I will take the liberty to speculate that generally speaking the the biggest possible autonomy is on continental level.

When I could not buy an EF-M 11-22mm in the US, I ordered it from a Canadian retailer. Interestingly, the warranty card was the standard one, applicable in the US and Canada. I wonder what would have happened if I had needed the lens serviced while Canon USA wasn't selling it?

 

[kaihp]

What is hidden under ghe abbreviation of NOK?

NOrwegian Kroner = 8,2NOK/1USD (at closing on Friday)

For those that wonder: There are Norwegian Kroner, Danish Kroner and Swedish Kronor. Appreviated NOK, DKK, and SEK.
There used to be Czech Kroner as well, but they gave it up for the Euro.

 

[Laktibrada]

czech crowns are still a thing it's the slovaks who gave up theirs for the evil EUR

 

[Flamingtree]

In Australia, the 5d4 is being offered for A$4988.00 (US $3807.80) at a chain brick and mortar retailer which includes a 10% tax, so it's not so bad compared to the US.
High taxes and high labour rates in Europe do make their cost base higher than it is in other places, but then again, Europeans get free medical whereas Americans pay dearly for the sort of health cover that Europeans and Australians take for granted.

Which shop is that?

Sorry for the late reply.
It's Digi Direct.

That's ok, thanks for that. They have just opened a shop here in Perth, I will have to check it out.

 

[yeahright]

What is hidden under ghe abbreviation of NOK?

NOrwegian Kroner = 8,2NOK/1USD (at closing on Friday)

For those that wonder: There are Norwegian Kroner, Danish Kroner and Swedish Kronor. Appreviated NOK, DKK, and SEK.
There used to be Czech Kroner as well, but they gave it up for the Euro.

The Czech have not introduced the Euro yet. It is the Slovak Crown that was replaced by the Euro in 2009.

 

[StudentOfLight]

I wonder if there is insufficient supply to cater to both Europe and US markets and so Canon want to prioritize US sales. Perhaps the US market is more risky to lose.

 

[Mikehit]

The problem with Canon is that they are using massive price differences around the globe, which I do not accept. But all I can do is to be loud and clear about my discontent and not buy. If enough people did that, especially the "not buy" thing, Canon may listen and do something about it. I am not very optimistic though.

You certainly don't have to accept it, but it's Canon's prerogative to charge what they want, where they want. But because they can, it doesn't follow that they should. Since I've previously designated BS as a term applied to DxO's Scores, perhaps we can label Canon's global differential pricing extortion policy a pile of dung.

I do sort of wonder, though, if Canon Global/HQ is at the root of it. How much autonomy do country-level subsidiaries have? Canon USA decided not to sell or service the M2, and initially did not sell or service some of the EF-M lenses, for example. So is the problem in your case Canon, or specifically Canon Norway? Not that it matters in the end, I suppose – but voting with your wallet is the best way to send a message.

I am confident that these decisions are made in HQ or maybe at the nest regional level, in our case Europe (even the CFast-card deal for the 1DX-II was controlled and (hopelessly) administered from the European HQ). If you subtract the various VATs around, you´ll see that the European prices are pretty conform. In Norway we have longer warranties and a stronger customer protection, which adds a little to our price and there are a few others with the same. But I have seen the prices for Poland, Finland, UK, Germany, Switzerland, Norway, Sweden and Denmark (at least) and they are pretty much same same.

But to be fair, having made a couple of comparisons to Nikon and Sony, they are no better. A D810 is $2.796,95 at B&H and is priced at $3.840 here. A Sony A7R-II is $3.198 at B&H and $4.207 here. So from that perspective, Canon is just doing what the others are doing. However, when launching the 5DIII, 1DX, 7DII, 5DS/R and 1DX-II, we saw a multiplication factor of about 10x from the USD price to the NOK price, which is reasonable. For the 5DIV, that has turned to 12x.

My guess is that Canon USA (like any subsidiary) is given a target profitability for the financial year. The subsidiary then looks at the sales of all the different products along with patterns of profitability and looks at the prices of the competition, makes a judgement on what the local market can afford and prices each product such that they can hit their overall profitability target. They also have to try and predict broad currency fluctuations so they are covered without continually changing their prices.
Canon Japan is happy because they have got their money from the sale to the wholesalers and the subsidiary then has to make HQ happy.

So in that respect, I see HQ has having a say but a lot of the finer detail is local.

 

[GuyF]

I wonder if there is insufficient supply to cater to both Europe and US markets and so Canon want to prioritize US sales. Perhaps the US market is more risky to lose.

Maybe, but you'd think with Europe having a larger population that sales would be higher here. Anyone got sales figures comparing EU & US markets?

 

[Maiaibing]

I wonder if there is insufficient supply to cater to both Europe and US markets and so Canon want to prioritize US sales. Perhaps the US market is more risky to lose.

Maybe, but you'd think with Europe having a larger population that sales would be higher here. Anyone got sales figures comparing EU & US markets?

Europe is Canon's largest market. Check out their investor's relations reports.

 

[smorgo]

It's my belief that in part, the price reflects Canon's expectations or fears over further currency fluctuations in Europe through the further impact of Brexit.

The movements to date have easily accounted for a 10% increase in cost. If they're expecting more of the same, I can see why they may have taken a cautious view when setting the retail price.

There's a general issue that gets little attention while we're debating the issues we're facing. Working for a large Japanese company, I've seen time and time again that you can't apply Western expectations to the way Japanese companies operate. Whatever we may see as common sense or good business, when it comes to product development, markets or prices, Japanese companies have a completely different way of doing things. Culturally, they're so different to the way that Western companies operate that the same values just don't apply. We'll always be struggling to fathom why particular decisions are made in companies like Canon or Nikon (though I get the impression that Sony are more Westernised in their outlook).

 

[eml58]

I know this is a mistake, I know, but...

To you and others in this thread, I suggest finding a bowling ball and explaining economic concepts to it, there's a higher likelihood it will understand. Sarcasm is lost on those who lack the wit to comprehend it.

Your right of course.

reminds of the Tom Hanks movie Castaway and him talking to "Wilson", I'm pretty sure "Wilson" didn't get it either.

 

[kaihp]

The Czech have not introduced the Euro yet. It is the Slovak Crown that was replaced by the Euro in 2009.

Oops, sorry about mixing that up.

 

[Donkey_Kong]

Bicker about the pricing all you want. Whenever I buy camera gear, I just take a wad of cash into JB HIFI, tell them I'm paying gray market price, and they almost always accept. In Australia, the 5DIV is meant to be $5,200 body only. I will report how much I actually pay for it, whilst retaining my full local warranty. Since it's a brand new item, JB may not be so flexible on the price, but I guarantee you I will be walking out of there with more than just the body if this is the case. "You're damn right you'll through in the vertical grip and those top range cf cards". This is what I love about JB Hifi. One time it worked when I literally didn't even have any money whatsoever...they gave me a bargain (24-702.8L II & 70-2002.8IS II for CHEAPER than gray market prices), on a 15 month interest free payment plan.

 

[Diko]

Bicker about the pricing all you want. Whenever I buy camera gear, I just take a wad of cash into JB HIFI, tell them I'm paying gray market price, and they almost always accept.

That would explain why I couldn't get onto the website (I've forgot the US proxy on. Now let's hope I'll not forget to turn off the Australian one)


Good luck

 

[GuyF]

...I will report how much I actually pay for it...

Yup, like we'll believe you : - http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=30603.msg617812#msg617812

Just remind us how that thread ended for you.