A Bit More About the New “Big White” Lenses Coming from Canon [CR3]

ethanz

1DX II
Apr 12, 2016
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Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

applecider said:
The guy next to me at the sushi bar was drinking sake and at the end of his meal got a fortune cookie ( Chinese Japanese Sushi) and inside the cookie was a piece of paper from canon japan in Japanese which the other guy next to me could read.....

It said that the updates to the big whites were going to have native Sony mounts. Turns out that the girl friend of the Japanese speaker has a third cousin who works in canon corporate and she thinks that canon has decided that Sony bodies are the best and canon will now move toward only making lenses for Sony.

BTW the fortune cookie fortune was “old ways die hard try something new”.
The question actually is, how much sake did you have? ;D

Good story though.
 

Talys

Canon 6DII
Feb 16, 2017
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Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

jolyonralph said:
Exactly. Some EF lenses really don't work so well with Live View/DPAF. Some are fine, but others hunt like crazy.
Nearly all of the modern EF L lenses work flawlessly with live view DPAF; certainly, all of the most popular primes and f/4 and f/2.8 L zooms. Some of the of the older EF's don't work so great, but some of they also don't work as well using the dedicated PDAF sensor.
 
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zim

EOR R
Oct 18, 2011
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Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

Don Haines said:
Mr Majestyk said:
Talys said:
There must be lots of sports photographers that see it your way, because, during the World Cup the sidelines were just full of A9's, right?
Clever, you know that has just to do with lack of glass and not the cameras AF, and yes that's Sony's own moronic oversight not have had the 400 f/2.8 ready when the A9 was announced, but at least they've rectified that now and also delivered another home run. When the A9II hits before the Olympics you'll see a seismic shift in the mix. Sony only hass to improve ergonomics and ruggedness and it will take a lot of the pro market. Inertia is very strong with working pros, they won't just change for the sake of it. Not a single Canon user I've known that originally said the A9 was a toy and has now used one for more than a few minutes has not come away amazed by the AF. No it's not perfect but it's still better than the 1DXII which can't even match the D5 in some cases.
Because pro photographers do not shoot with a sensor, they shoot with a system..... and at the World Cup, CPS was there to support Canon shooters..... and they had a whole room full of the best lenses for those pros to borrow, and any equipment problems could be swapped out on the spot! Plus, the system that they were using has great ergonomics and the easy controls on the cameras to allow the pros to change settings without taking their eyes off of the action.... To give all that up for a Sony would be madness!

And tethering.....

Don’t forget tethering......

It’s great to have an Ethernet jack on the camera.....

While the action is happening, those ”poor people who had to suffer through using a 1DX2” were tethered to the internet. As they took pictures, they were downloaded to “the office” where an editor would process them and post them.... their workflow was so good that they were published before the event finished!
whilst watching the photographers during the final presentation one word was going through my mind.... weatherproofing!
 
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neonlight

EOS 80D
Jul 10, 2015
124
15
Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

But mirrorless camera with native EF mount, and no pelicle mirror? I can't see that happening.
You may be right, but it seems to me that the quickest way forward for Canon would be to introduce a FF mirrorless with native EF mount. But maybe they could have done that already, though it seems Canon were slow to realise the impact of mirrorless?
Modern EVF's should be fast enough to keep track that no mirror (not even a pellicle) is needed.
 

neonlight

EOS 80D
Jul 10, 2015
124
15
Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

...and dont forget, upgrades may well include better processing power in the lenses. Perhaps there is something to the rumor that says Canon are getting all their EF lenses ready for FF mirrorless...(the old ones will work, of course, but slower?)
 
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tron

EOS 5D SR
Nov 8, 2011
4,089
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Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

neonlight said:
...and dont forget, upgrades may well include better processing power in the lenses. Perhaps there is something to the rumor that says Canon are getting all their EF lenses ready for FF mirrorless...(the old ones will work, of course, but slower?)
Yes because everyone wants to drive a 600mm f/4L IS I,II,III,whatever lens with a small mirrorless camera ;D
 

takesome1

EOS 6D MK II
Aug 23, 2013
1,490
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Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

applecider said:
The guy next to me at the sushi bar was drinking sake and at the end of his meal got a fortune cookie ( Chinese Japanese Sushi) and inside the cookie was a piece of paper from canon japan in Japanese which the other guy next to me could read.....

It said that the updates to the big whites were going to have native Sony mounts. Turns out that the girl friend of the Japanese speaker has a third cousin who works in canon corporate and she thinks that canon has decided that Sony bodies are the best and canon will now move toward only making lenses for Sony.

BTW the fortune cookie fortune was “old ways die hard try something new”.
So let me get this straight, you think a fortune cookie and knowing someone with a third cousin can predict the way this is going?

I am not buying any of this.

Any word on which lenses they are going to release though?
 

scyrene

EOS 5D MK IV
Dec 4, 2013
2,511
395
UK
www.flickr.com
Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

CanonFanBoy said:
unfocused said:
tron said:
Trigger said:
tron said:
I cannot see how the version II white super teles could be discontinued. I mean they can of course but it will not look very ethical on Canon.
From what I understand, it's standard procedure for Canon to discontinue parts & service for any lens seven years after a new version is released. Nothing to do with ethics, but rather the economics of making & stocking all those old parts. Having said that, I think ten years would be a bit more reasonable.
If the new versions are not really NEW design like the 70-200 ones then they make new versions as an excuse to stop supporting the current ones. This is HUGE Ethics issue. Now the 70-200 2.8L IS II is a new design of version I. Version III isn't. Hope you can see that!
It's not the case of an "excuse." Like most manufacturers, Canon stops servicing discontinued products once they run out of parts to perform that service. What no one here knows is whether or not the 70-200 III is simply a refresh with new lens coatings and body paint. If that's the case, it's likely that Canon would continue to provide service for the II version for many years if (and that is an important "if") the parts are interchangeable.

Since the new big whites haven't even been released yet, we don't know how different they will be from the existing versions. So speculating about how long they will service the current versions is way premature.
I don't see it as an ethical issue either. You bought the lens, Warranty is over. Eventually Canon decides it is time to move on. You didn't purchase a lifetime service guarantee for that lens and one wasn't offered.
Also, although it depends where you live and may not be good enough for everyone, discontinued lenses can be repaired by third parties, cannibalising broken lenses for parts, many years after Canon stops covering them.
 

scyrene

EOS 5D MK IV
Dec 4, 2013
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Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

Etienne said:
Sonys system with wide and normal lenses are smaller and lighter
Precisely what elevance does this have to a thread about two new supertelephoto lenses?
 

scyrene

EOS 5D MK IV
Dec 4, 2013
2,511
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Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

RGF said:
Will Canon put a drop in extender into their III super teles? This would allow them to raise their price point and give a real incentive for all current owners to upgrade.

Then a year from how introduce DO version of all the lenses w/o drop in extenders. Five years later, add the drop in extender to the DO versions (or perhaps make the drop in extender in 2 parts - 1.2, 1.4 so combined you get 1.7).

Lots of upgrades in our futures
I'm not sure there are any exact precedents, but my inclination is to think that if they call it a mark III, they won't be adding anything like a built-in extender, that would be more likely named as a new lens ('EF Xmm 1.4x Extender' or similar).

Trigger said:
Am I correct in the impression I have that a DO 500 or 600 will (inherently) be inferior in the IQ/bokeh department than the 500/600 II lenses we have now, and if so, am I correct in hoping that an upcoming 500/600 III is not a DO?
Again, similar to what I say above, if it's a DO then it's not a mark III. If it's a mark III, it won't be DO.
 
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jolyonralph

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Aug 25, 2015
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Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

Talys said:
Nearly all of the modern EF L lenses work flawlessly with live view DPAF; certainly, all of the most popular primes and f/4 and f/2.8 L zooms. Some of the of the older EF's don't work so great, but some of they also don't work as well using the dedicated PDAF sensor.
It's the *nearly all* that is the problem. Potentially Canon could get away with it by immediately withdrawing from sale/upgrading all of the older lenses that don't work so well with DPAF - and there's quite a few that would be affected.

Otherwise Canon have the nightmare of trying to sell a new camera which isn't totally compatible with all the lenses for that mount currently on sale.
 

neuroanatomist

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Jul 21, 2010
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Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

jolyonralph said:
Talys said:
Nearly all of the modern EF L lenses work flawlessly with live view DPAF; certainly, all of the most popular primes and f/4 and f/2.8 L zooms. Some of the of the older EF's don't work so great, but some of they also don't work as well using the dedicated PDAF sensor.
It's the *nearly all* that is the problem. Potentially Canon could get away with it by immediately withdrawing from sale/upgrading all of the older lenses that don't work so well with DPAF - and there's quite a few that would be affected.

Otherwise Canon have the nightmare of trying to sell a new camera which isn't totally compatible with all the lenses for that mount currently on sale.
Can someone indicate which specific EF L lenses don't 'work flawlessly with live view DPAF' and how their performance is lacking?
 

fullstop

EOS 6D MK II
Apr 23, 2018
1,088
153
Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

they work within the limitations in live view mode. AF is not as fast as in mirrorslapping mode. AF is not silent, as opposed to STM or Nano-USM lenses. Luckily only an issue for video capture, not for stills.

AF on new native EF-X lenses will perform better on mirrorless Canon cameras than legacy EF shards will. No matter whether L or not.
 

zim

EOR R
Oct 18, 2011
1,863
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Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

fullstop said:
AF on new native EF-X lenses will perform better on mirrorless Canon cameras than legacy EF shards will. No matter whether L or not.
why?
 

neuroanatomist

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Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

If anyone would care to respond with factual information, please do.
 
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ethanz

1DX II
Apr 12, 2016
1,067
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Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

neuroanatomist said:
If anyone would care to respond with factual information, please do.
You mean you haven't been given access to all the details on EF-X lenses? I'll email you the files.
 

zim

EOR R
Oct 18, 2011
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Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

ethanz said:
neuroanatomist said:
If anyone would care to respond with factual information, please do.
You mean you haven't been given access to all the details on EF-X lenses? I'll email you the files.
that'll be the X-Files ;D
 

tron

EOS 5D SR
Nov 8, 2011
4,089
389
Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

@unfocused: I agree that speculation about servicing the current versions is way premature but then this rumors site mentioned the version III lenses which is itself speculation (although one with some sources). TDP site reviews the new 70-200 2.8L IS III and mentioned the very few differences. The only optical one is the coating. So it would be unethical to stop servicing the version II.

@Canonfanboy: Guarantee meens free repair. I never mentioned it/requested it. Serviceability is different than Guarantee. So if a really new lens appears then YES they can proceed with this scheme as they used to. And kudos to them for improving the products. However, if they keep the same optical formula and merely introduce cosmetic changes then sorry it is unethical. If they CANNOT/WILLNOT yet really improve the lenses and practically but a nice III instead of a II then sorry but it is unethical to discontinue the version II.

@scyrene: That's a good idea (cannibalising broken lenses for parts) but it should have to be done so for really old lenses. The version II are not that old. Just my opinion.

@all:

1. I too cannot see how a thread about 2 new teles gets turned to Sony.
2. Am I the only one who thinks that the following 2 teles would benefit Canon more?
a. 600mm f/4 DO IS (and/or maybe a smaller 500MM DO IS)
b. 150(or 200) - 600mm(or 500 but preferrably 600) L IS

OK not expert on market and Canon but I would try to get these two in the long run without getting rid of my existing whites. I think that they would somehow complete the series and not antagonize the current ones. YMMV.
 

danski0224

EOS 6D MK II
Apr 24, 2011
1,089
4
Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

As far as clickbait goes :), it would be a certainty that Canon would update the bread and butter 400 f/2.8 and 600 f/4 lenses to function properly with whatever mirrorless camera is coming out.

I would assume that there are updates to the lens AF motors, possibly the aperture motor to allow more FPS, internal electronics and communications protocols.

And of course, it is an easy excuse to obsolete upper 4 figure and 5 figure lenses so you have to buy new ones...
 

neuroanatomist

I post too Much on Here!!
Jul 21, 2010
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Re: A Bit More About the New Big White Lenses That Are Coming

danski0224 said:
As far as clickbait goes :), it would be a certainty that Canon would update the bread and butter 400 f/2.8 and 600 f/4 lenses to function properly with whatever mirrorless camera is coming out.

I would assume that there are updates to the lens AF motors, possibly the aperture motor to allow more FPS, internal electronics and communications protocols.

And of course, it is an easy excuse to obsolete upper 4 figure and 5 figure lenses so you have to buy new ones...
Why do you think the current versions won't function properly with whatever mirrorless camera is coming out? My 600/4 II functions properly with my M6...