Announcing The Canon EOS-1D X Mark II

Jul 21, 2010
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biggiep said:
OdysseasP said:
I believe that the Nikon D5 has a superior AF system for tracking moving subjects as far as still photography is concerned

You believe this, why? You know this, how?

What's wrong with you? Can't you read a spec sheet? 153 AF points. What more do you need to know?!?

::)

</sarcasm>
 
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Jun 12, 2015
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biggiep said:
OdysseasP said:
I believe that the Nikon D5 has a superior AF system for tracking moving subjects as far as still photography is concerned

You believe this, why? You know this, how?

Since OdysseasP is obviously just guessing, with absolutely no way of knowing, since either the D5 or the 1DXII has been reviewed yet, I would prefer it if people gave him/her the silent treatment, and rather discuss something interesting. Sorry if I sound harsh here, but I think such meaningless discussions polute the thread and the issue at hand.
 
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Larsskv said:
biggiep said:
OdysseasP said:
I believe that the Nikon D5 has a superior AF system for tracking moving subjects as far as still photography is concerned

You believe this, why? You know this, how?

Since OdysseasP is obviously just guessing, with absolutely no way of knowing, since either the D5 or the 1DXII has been reviewed yet, I would prefer it if people gave him/her the silent treatment, and rather discuss something interesting. Sorry if I sound harsh here, but I think such meaningless discussions polute the thread and the issue at hand.
Canon has Intelligent Tracking and Recognition AF with 360,000-pixel metering sensor. It should also help in subject tracking for stills and video. Wondering considering this intelligent tracking specific PDAF, how does it help video AF.
 
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frankchn said:
OdysseasP said:
Thus, since both the Nikon D5 and the Canon EOS 1D X Mark II are specifically targeted towards sports photographers, I believe that the Nikon D5 has a superior AF system for tracking moving subjects as far as still photography is concerned, unless the use of teleconverters brings the maximum lens aperture up to f/8 and/or when even 12 fps aren't enough in order to capture the perfect moment and one is willing to drop resolution to 9MP in order to have 60 fps while has the luxury of spending plenty of time post capture in front of a computer in order to select the perfect moment, in which case the Canon EOS 1D X Mark II with the addition of a much better 4K video recording implementation (duration, AF) becomes the better buy. Finally, I would like to say, that both cameras embody the best technology their manufacturers have commercially available at the moment, with each camera strengthening even further the strong points of its manufacturer, either that is the AF algorithm for calculating the future position of a moving subject, low light AF performance, high ISO image quality and battery life in the case of Nikon or AF responsiveness both in lens and in camera body and 4K video implementation in the case of Canon.

How would you know unless you have tested both cameras' AF system? The number of AF points are not the be-all and end-all of the AF system's abilities, or else we will all be using the Sony a7R II with its 399 point on-sensor DPAF system (every point selectable, unlike Nikon's system and no AFMA to worry about to boot!).

Especially with Canon's iTR AF and Nikon's 3D Focus Tracking where the metering sensor plays a huge part in letting the AF system know where to focus. Both the D5 and the 1DX2 should be very good at AF (barring another 1D3 fiasco) but you cannot definitely say that one camera is better than the other in AF just by looking at the spec sheets.

I have already said in my post that the ''Nikon D5 with its 99 cross type AF sensors is much better at tracking fast erratically moving subjects, at least in theory since neither of these two AF systems have been tested in practise''. Please read carefully my original post. In addition, in my original post I mention that the AF system of the Canon EOS 1D X is much more responsive than the one in the equivalent Nikon model. I agree with you that the number of AF points are not the be-all and end-all of the AF system's abilities, that is why in my original post I said that while Nikon D series historically have an advantage as far as the AF algorithm which predicts the position of a moving subject for at least 18 years as far as I can remember (which continues to the present day), since the days of the Nikon F100 & the Canon EOS 3 (real world photo test with moving car - PhotoNet Greece, Summer 1999), the Canon EOS 1 series historically had a much more responsive AF system. Sony a7R Mark II can't be compared to DSLR cameras such as the Nikon D5 & the Canon EOS 1D X Mark II, since it uses an on sensor PDAF system which at the moment at least while being by far the best implementation as far as mirrorless cameras are concerned, it doesn't have the same speed or tracking capabilities as the AF systems in professional DSLR cameras which feature a separate AF module (on which the light is being split and partially driven by the optical pentaprism and thus there are AF inconsistencies in comparison to on sensor PDAF systems). The reason I make a distinction and special mention to the fact that selectable AF sensors into cameras designed specifically for sport photography aren't that important is because when you are shooting sport events in which athletes move fast and erratically then you don't have enough time to select the right AF sensor and you have to trust the AF system of your camera to pick up the right sensor. Furthermore, since you mention Canon's iTR AF and Nikon's 3D Focus Tracking, where the metering sensor plays a huge part in letting the AF system know where to focus, most camera reviewers agree that Nikon's implementation is far better than he one from Canon (with the Canon EOS 1D X being the only Canon which offers comparable performance at best with Nikon's most DSLR cameras). I also agree with you that both the D5 and the 1DX2 should be very good at AF (barring another 1D3 fiasco) but the thing is which one is better. Finally, I am saying one more time, that the comparison in my original post was purely a theoretical one based on the spec comparison on paper and on the long history of both Nikon D series (and of the F series prior to it) and the Canon EOS 1D series (and of the 1 series prior to it).
 
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Larsskv said:
biggiep said:
OdysseasP said:
I believe that the Nikon D5 has a superior AF system for tracking moving subjects as far as still photography is concerned

You believe this, why? You know this, how?

Since OdysseasP is obviously just guessing, with absolutely no way of knowing, since either the D5 or the 1DXII has been reviewed yet, I would prefer it if people gave him/her the silent treatment, and rather discuss something interesting. Sorry if I sound harsh here, but I think such meaningless discussions polute the thread and the issue at hand.

60398491.jpg
 
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Jul 21, 2010
31,099
12,863
ritholtz said:
Canon has Intelligent Tracking and Recognition AF with 360,000-pixel metering sensor. It should also help in subject tracking for stills and video. Wondering considering this intelligent tracking specific PDAF, how does it help video AF.

It doesn't, at all. The iTR system uses data from the metering sensor, which is located in the pentaprism housing and is illuminated by light reflected up to the pentaprism by the reflex mirror. During video shooting (and live view), the mirror is locked up and the dedicated metering sensor sees no light. Focus and metering are done using the CMOS image sensor.
 
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frankchn said:
How would you know unless you have tested both cameras' AF system? The number of AF points are not the be-all and end-all of the AF system's abilities, or else we will all be using the Sony a7R II with its 399 point on-sensor DPAF system

Agree... except Sony doesn't have DPAF. That's Canon.
 
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OdysseasP said:
frankchn said:
OdysseasP said:
Thus, since both the Nikon D5 and the Canon EOS 1D X Mark II are specifically targeted towards sports photographers, I believe that the Nikon D5 has a superior AF system for tracking moving subjects as far as still photography is concerned, unless the use of teleconverters brings the maximum lens aperture up to f/8 and/or when even 12 fps aren't enough in order to capture the perfect moment and one is willing to drop resolution to 9MP in order to have 60 fps while has the luxury of spending plenty of time post capture in front of a computer in order to select the perfect moment, in which case the Canon EOS 1D X Mark II with the addition of a much better 4K video recording implementation (duration, AF) becomes the better buy. Finally, I would like to say, that both cameras embody the best technology their manufacturers have commercially available at the moment, with each camera strengthening even further the strong points of its manufacturer, either that is the AF algorithm for calculating the future position of a moving subject, low light AF performance, high ISO image quality and battery life in the case of Nikon or AF responsiveness both in lens and in camera body and 4K video implementation in the case of Canon.

How would you know unless you have tested both cameras' AF system? The number of AF points are not the be-all and end-all of the AF system's abilities, or else we will all be using the Sony a7R II with its 399 point on-sensor DPAF system (every point selectable, unlike Nikon's system and no AFMA to worry about to boot!).

Especially with Canon's iTR AF and Nikon's 3D Focus Tracking where the metering sensor plays a huge part in letting the AF system know where to focus. Both the D5 and the 1DX2 should be very good at AF (barring another 1D3 fiasco) but you cannot definitely say that one camera is better than the other in AF just by looking at the spec sheets.

I have already said in my post that the ''Nikon D5 with its 99 cross type AF sensors is much better at tracking fast erratically moving subjects, at least in theory since neither of these two AF systems have been tested in practise''. Please read carefully my original post. In addition, in my original post I mention that the AF system of the Canon EOS 1D X is much more responsive than the one in the equivalent Nikon model. I agree with you that the number of AF points are not the be-all and end-all of the AF system's abilities, that is why in my original post I said that while Nikon D series historically have an advantage as far as the AF algorithm which predicts the position of a moving subject for at least 18 years as far as I can remember (which continues to the present day), since the days of the Nikon F100 & the Canon EOS 3 (real world photo test with moving car - PhotoNet Greece, Summer 1999), the Canon EOS 1 series historically had a much more responsive AF system. Sony a7R Mark II can't be compared to DSLR cameras such as the Nikon D5 & the Canon EOS 1D X Mark II, since it uses an on sensor PDAF system which at the moment at least while being by far the best implementation as far as mirrorless cameras are concerned, it doesn't have the same speed or tracking capabilities as the AF systems in professional DSLR cameras which feature a separate AF module (on which the light is being split and partially driven by the optical pentaprism and thus there are AF inconsistencies in comparison to on sensor PDAF systems). The reason I make a distinction and special mention to the fact that selectable AF sensors into cameras designed specifically for sport photography aren't that important is because when you are shooting sport events in which athletes move fast and erratically then you don't have enough time to select the right AF sensor and you have to trust the AF system of your camera to pick up the right sensor. Furthermore, since you mention Canon's iTR AF and Nikon's 3D Focus Tracking, where the metering sensor plays a huge part in letting the AF system know where to focus, most camera reviewers agree that Nikon's implementation is far better than he one from Canon (with the Canon EOS 1D X being the only Canon which offers comparable performance at best with Nikon's most DSLR cameras). I also agree with you that both the D5 and the 1DX2 should be very good at AF (barring another 1D3 fiasco) but the thing is which one is better. Finally, I am saying one more time, that the comparison in my original post was purely a theoretical one based on the spec comparison on paper and on the long history of both Nikon D series (and of the F series prior to it) and the Canon EOS 1D series (and of the 1 series prior to it).
But Canon has 360,000-pixel metering sensor and Nikon has 180,000 pixel metering sensor only.
 
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Looks like a great "tool camera for sport pros, warzones and pro wildlife shooters" maybe even the best that ever was as it just does everything the 1dx 1dc did a bit better ... For ppl coming from the 5d3/5DsR direction I guess it is not what they wanted or expected as it is just not sth like a new 1ds3. For that the MP would have to be around 26-30. I hope the 5d4 will than be that camera ... with 8-9fps and updated high ISO performance and some more DR (13,5 to 14 stops ?)
 
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captainkanji said:
I'll be in Japan in May for 2 weeks. Wonder if I'll be able to play with one at Yodobashi Camera? Unfortunately, the cash I would spend to get one is going towards the trip. It's gong to be fun.

Usually they are quite good at getting this stuff early at least to show it around even if getting it will take a lot more time. Don't know where you are going but the one at Osaka Umeda was especially nice.
 
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Light_Pilgrim said:
Just wondering, how does it stand against the D5? There is nothing extraordinary that I ser from specs, but I am not the target audience as I am into labdscapes and portraits. What are the thoughts of those who can thorougly compare to D5?

Well nobody can, neither has been released yet :p
 
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Don Haines

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Jun 4, 2012
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tr573 said:
ritholtz said:
But Canon has 360,000-pixel metering sensor and Nikon has 180,000 pixel metering sensor only.

That's only TWICE the number of pixels, the D5 has almost THREE times the number of AF points! Numbers!!!!

And the D5 has a 16.7 second buffer (200 shots at 12FPS) while the 1DX2 only has a 10.6 second buffer (1709 shots at 16FPS). Oh the tragedy! Why doesn't Canon properly address the buffer gap!

The simple solution is to forget about RAW and just shoot JPG..... At roughly 8MB per picture, on the 1DX2 you can hold the shutter down for 17 minutes and 4 seconds at 16FPS to fill that 128Gb memory card..... (does the battery last for 16,400 pictures?)
 
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