Canon announces development of the EOS R5 full-frame mirrorless camera

[vjlex]

Two separate thoughts on 20 FPS:

• could the caveat be that that number is only for continuous shooting in one of the compressed file formats such as JPEG or HEIF?
• when comparing R5's maximum FPS to the 1DX3, is it being overlooked that the real feat is that the 1DX3 has a virtually unlimited buffer? couldn't the R5 also be capable of 20 FPS RAW, but just have a much more limited buffer, and simply have to take a longer break between shutter presses while writing to disk?

 

[Quackator]

why sell at $3,299.00 when this puppy will be flying of the shelves at $3,750.00. this is an industry leading product.

Canon will want to undercut the A7R4, just to make sure the beast is really dead.

So it all depends on how deep the price of the A7R4 falls until
Canon determines the final price of the R5.

Which is sardonic, to some extent.

Sony will want to pull as many people over before losing them to
the R5, so they will be aggressive on pricing in the near future.

Just yesterday I came past a billboard claiming up to 750 Euro
rebates on select Sony cameras. This is a killing field now.
Canon makes Sony cut in their own flesh - and then beats them
with their price anyway.

 

[Quackator]

couldn't the R5 also be capable of 20 FPS RAW, but just have a much
more limited buffer, and simply have to take a longer break between
shutter presses while writing to disk?

Then it wouldn't be able to write away 8k video.

 

[Del Paso]

My friend, you must keep up. Terms evolve. The new nomenclature is now "cripple hammer" a la James Caan and Kathy Bates in the movie "Misery".

Do you mean that Canon is no longer doomed, but crippled?
This would open a new perspective !
PS: t'was a good movie...

 

[Del Paso]

The EF 135mm f/2 L is a harder lens the find on the used market than many others. Not too many who have them are willing to let them go unless they are a "below average" copy.

MPB sell them quite often, and at "acceptable" prices.
But, as you wrote, the risk is getting a poor copy, no risk with serious dealers offering an exchange guaranty.

 

[SecureGSM]

Canon will want to undercut the A7R4, just to make sure the beast is really dead.

So it all depends on how deep the price of the A7R4 falls until
Canon determines the final price of the R5.

Which is sardonic, to some extent.

Sony will want to pull as many people over before losing them to
the R5, so they will be aggressive on pricing in the near future.

Just yesterday I came past a billboard claiming up to 750 Euro
rebates on select Sony cameras. This is a killing field now.
Canon makes Sony cut in their own flesh - and then beats them
with their price anyway.

Sorry, This is not how Canon operate. To make a long story short and to avoid a deep dive into price to market conversation :

Canon R5 at $3,750 is a better value than A7R_whatever at $, 3,200. There is no reason for Canon to set RRP for R5 as aggressive as you suggest.
$750 discount that Sony is offering is an act of desperation. As simple as that.

Now, remind me of of another mirrorless system that offers an amazing 28-70/2.0 zoom on IBIS stabilised 45Mb body that shoots 12 FPS with mechanical shutter, with apparently great video features, pro level handling, resilient and weatherproof, backed up by world class service and support globally.
I am sorry, at this stage I see no reason for Canon even consider discounting.
I Envisage a very long preorder queues leading well into Christmas time with some R glass becoming a short supply.

 

[Jack Douglas]

On the long line, I sure hope you're wrong because I'd need mine before September.

Jack

 

[Del Paso]

People who buy lenses because they need "one of each focal length" (as opposed to those who buy a lens for a specific photographic need and understand how to match a lens to a use case instead of getting what every reviewer say is "the best" at that focal length/aperture) base their buying decision on flat test chart performance, even if shooting flat test charts or doing other 2D document reproduction is not what they think they want to do with the lens some day. Designing a lens to be best at rendering flat test charts from edge to edge and corner to corner comes at the expense of the smooth out of focus areas that give the EF 135mm f/2 L its "magic."

In an age of the Gods of the Flat Test Chart such a 135mm lens would be dismissed as "hopelessly soft" and "outdated" compared to the current crop of fast 135mm lenses that render OOF backgrounds like garbage - but do very well at reproducing flat test charts.

And that's why I never base my buying decision on Lens Rentals full aperture tests.
They simply don't do a lens justice. (coma, color rendition, bokeh, etc...)
What really matters, is how a lens performs in a situation it was designed for, and that's never flat-brick-wall -photography (exception :TSE lenses).

 

[Quackator]

Agressive pricing is not discounting.
Canon wants to win back the samplers, who still use
their EF glass via MC-11 or metabones on a Sony.

The lower the price when the R5 finally hits market,
the more Sony bodies will be orphaned.
This is a massive blow, and Canon is well aware of that.

Already the R was very close to 5D4 specs, but came in
well below the 5D4 launch price. Winning market share
back is much more important than margin on this body.

The R5 is the proverbial oil lamp, that Rockefeller gave
away for free. It is a vehicle for lens sales.

So yes, there are reasons for aggressive pricing.
Very good reasons.

 

[Quackator]

On the long line, I sure hope you're wrong because I'd need mine before September.

Canon is already producing the camera full throttle.
Maybe they are still working on the firmware, but the
hardware is certainly finalized and in production.
Expect samples to be hands on for Photokina in May,
and shipping start in June, July the latest.

Canon always strives to quench as much intial demand as
possible because of initial adopter cream skimming pricing.

So if you have preordered now (I sure have), you should
have it by July the latest.

 

[SecureGSM]

On the long line, I sure hope you're wrong because I'd need mine before September.

Jack

Oh, I rarely say “trust me”, but in this case. Get in the queue as early as possible. Talk to a Canon reseller of your choice tomorrow.
Consider that camera will be likely offered in bundle with 24-105, in bundle with 24-70/2.8 and body only.
Canon will prioritise kits. Naturally. This will lead to body only being in short supply initially and for some time.

 

[Jack Douglas]

One thing for sure we'll know in due course and of course I'd cheer for lower but not while I was holding my breath.

I'd be body only and it does make sense to get in line since it costs nothing. I own a filter adapter ring so I am fully intending to buy the right R, probably R5. I was impressed with the ND filter for use with the 11-24.

Jack

 

[SecureGSM]

Agressive pricing is not discounting.
Canon wants to win back the samplers, who still use
their EF glass via MC-11 or metabones on a Sony.

The lower the price when the R5 finally hits market,
the more Sony bodies will be orphaned.
This is a massive blow, and Canon is well aware of that.

Already the R was very close to 5D4 specs, but came in
well below the 5D4 launch price. Winning market share
back is much more important than margin on this body.

The R5 is the proverbial oil lamp, that Rockefeller gave
away for free. It is a vehicle for lens sales.

So yes, there are reasons for aggressive pricing.
Very good reasons.

Enterprise sales is not your day job obviously.
But let’s agree to disagree as I see no point to argue here. Let revisit when pricing was released
I suggest pricing to be around $3750 in North American markets.

 

[SecureGSM]

One thing for sure we'll know in due course and of course I'd cheer for lower but not while I was holding my breath.

I'd be body only and it does make sense to get in line since it costs nothing. I own a filter adapter ring so I am fully intending to buy the right R, probably R5. I was impressed with the ND filter for use with the 11-24.

Jack

++++ I was impressed with the ND filter for use with the 11-24.

That feature alone coupled with 45Mb sensor is quite appealing to photographers who value 11-24 on a High MP body.
I dare to say that Canon created a most universal camera known to date:

High MP, 12 FPS, fast AF and accurate AF, a host of unique video features, IBIS which is big for video, ergonomics, colour magic, unique glass, CPS, ruggedness, and so on and so forth.
There is no question that pros would be tempted with all this goodness. Now OVF apart... what else may be a concern?

 

[Jack Douglas]

++++ I was impressed with the ND filter for use with the 11-24.

That feature alone coupled with 45Mb sensor is quite appealing to photographers who value 11-24 on a High MP body.
I dare to say that Canon created a most universal camera known to date:

High MP, 12 FPS, fast AF and accurate AF, a host of unique video features, IBIS which is big for video, ergonomics, colour magic, unique glass, CPS, ruggedness, and so on and so forth.
There is no question that pros would be tempted with all this goodness. Now OVF apart... what else may be a concern?

Now, now let's not get too carried away.

Jack

 

[StoicalEtcher]

A result of a barrage of marketing, hardwiring the equation
that mirrorless=small into people's brains.

There is no reason why a DLSM *must* be small.
In my eyes there would be good reason for it to
be bigger, namely the size of my fingers.

The R5 seems a step in the right direction, but I'd love
it to be the size and layout of the 5D MkIV.

Agreed! Well said!
And that is what it would take (in the near-term at least) to get me to switch - I'm more concerned with the form factor than the actual technology (mpx, frame rates, etc) for what I do (personal view, of course).

 

[LensFungus]

People shouldn't getting blinded by the low prices compared to the competition of cameras like the Canon EOS RP, EOS R, M50 or M200. They are the gateway drugs. When it comes to professional gear, Canon always makes you pay a lot of money. I don't work for Canon, so I don't know how much the R5 will cost and I don't know about their future pricing strategy but if everything stays the same it will be in the same league as the Canon EOS 5D IV or Sony A7R IV when they were new.

 

[vjlex]

Then it wouldn't be able to write away 8k video.

Sorry, I don't really understand the technical side of it, but I don't understand how those two things would be mutually exclusive.

 

[BillB]

Agressive pricing is not discounting.
Canon wants to win back the samplers, who still use
their EF glass via MC-11 or metabones on a Sony.

The lower the price when the R5 finally hits market,
the more Sony bodies will be orphaned.
This is a massive blow, and Canon is well aware of that.

Already the R was very close to 5D4 specs, but came in
well below the 5D4 launch price. Winning market share
back is much more important than margin on this body.

The R5 is the proverbial oil lamp, that Rockefeller gave
away for free. It is a vehicle for lens sales.

So yes, there are reasons for aggressive pricing.
Very good reasons.

There is also the R6 to think about. If the R6 is a lower price level, Canon may aggressively price the R6 rather than the R5. There are still a lot of pieces missing for this puzzle.

 

[tron]

where would you put them?

View attachment 188736

as it was, they got rid of the bar, and added in joystick there. added one more button (rate) to the left side.
Moved AF-ON to be near joystick (sounds reasonable).
added two more buttons above the wheel.

it's going to be pretty cramped as it is.
View attachment 188737

a fully articulating screen comes at a price - the price is buttons. you simply can't put as many buttons on the camera with a fully articulating screen because you are missing now to the left of the screen, and to the bottom for where buttons could go.

IMO, the power switch is still weird.

Where EOS 5DMkIV, 5DMkII, 5DII, 5D,7D,7DII etc have them: On the top! They could make the camera half centimeter thicker (tops) and put the buttons at similar positions. That way they would be the same (more or less) with DSLRs and the switching would be much easier as far as handling is concerned.