Canon engineers talk EOS R and the future of the system

Canon Rumors Guy

EOS-1D X Mark II
Jul 20, 2010
7,055
57
Canada
www.canonrumors.com
#1
DPReview had a chance to talk to the folks from the Canon EOS R development team. They spoke with someone from each of the main parts of development, someone from physical design, optical design, UI design and the product design team. Apparently, the design team was given more freedom for the EOS R system, than any previous Canon camera project.

There were obviously design decisions that are new to a Canon EOS camera, and one of them is the lack of a mode dial.
Trying to accommodate the needs of video shooters ended up leading the removal of the camera’s mode dial, says Koji Yoshida: “if you have a mode dial then the [exposure] settings will be the same for both stills and movies.”
“We consulted with a lot of different people and talked about this a lot, and decided to have different settings this time,” he says. But it’s clear this isn’t a decision made...
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Aug 9, 2012
315
5
52
Milano, Italy
#3
Now I'm happy enough with my 6D + lenses (from 17-40 L to 100-400 II L) plus M6 + lenses, but I don't know how to invest (spend) my money in the near future.

If the RF 24-105 L proves to be better than the EF 24-105 L, then what Canon's engineers said about the new mount is true, and there's no reason to keep investing in EF lenses and bodies.

I could replace my 6D, EF 24-105L and EF 35mm F/2 IS with a R, RF 24-105 and RF 35mm F/1.8 IS, but then I would not be able to use my M as a backup body (just in case I travel to Australia, Canada or other exotic places).

A good idea could be to replace both the 6D and the M6 with two R bodies, but there's just one option.

So… I'll wait until summer 2019 at least.

[I don't have particular needs: I'm just one of the many amateur photographers with more money to spend for gear than talent - and time - to make the best of it].
 

Act444

EOS Rebel T7i
May 4, 2011
924
55
#4
IMHO, they're experimenting a bit, and it will take a couple of iterations to nail down the right Canon mirrorless.
Agreed. Same thing happened with the M series, which evolved quite nicely from the simplistic M to the dial-intensive M6. I expected the R to be more like the M5/M6 though in terms of design, but perhaps Canon feel they need to make an attempt to reinvent the wheel. Which is fine and all. The risk of course in doing so is alienation.

I have already compared my thoughts on the R vs. 5D series but personally, I don’t think the R can replace an M6 either, and that’s purely due to size. The R may as well be a DSLR, at least a mid-size one. If I can take in an R, I should also be able to take in a 5D. But I have been able to get the M6 into places I couldn’t take a 5D. Now, for general travel use, I like the R/24-105 combo as a simple, single HQ camera/lens solution. But based on first impressions and reviews, unless I commit myself to a trip in the near future, I see no rush to grab one.
 
Likes: JohanCruyff
#5
When the beginning said they got rid of the mode dial to accommodate video shooters, I immediately lost interest (not that I was going to buy an R anyway). I do not shoot video and never have and almost every photographer I know personally is the same. Why do companies think everyone wants video? IMO a still only camera would be a huge seller. And yes I know video is huge now as well, I am not implying no one needs it, I am just saying based on my personal observations it is a minority of photographers.
 

zim

EOS 7D Mark II
Oct 18, 2011
1,863
53
#6
I use the mode dial a LOT especially the 3Cs I really don't know how I'd get on without that mode dial.

Is the Rs implementation the same as the 1Dx?
Is there an equivalent of the hard stop at 3C on the R or 1Dx?
 
Jan 17, 2013
145
0
#7
Isn’t the M series effectively the aps-c version of the R? THe flange distance is shorter on the M, making adapting R lenses to ef-m mount doable. This would parallel the ef and ef-s dynamic.
 
Jul 14, 2018
80
32
#8
When the beginning said they got rid of the mode dial to accommodate video shooters, I immediately lost interest (not that I was going to buy an R anyway). I do not shoot video and never have and almost every photographer I know personally is the same. Why do companies think everyone wants video? IMO a still only camera would be a huge seller. And yes I know video is huge now as well, I am not implying no one needs it, I am just saying based on my personal observations it is a minority of photographers.
Maybe the EOS R was meant to be the all-rounder (still and video) version, and the rumoured 6D-level body coming next year avoids some of the supposedly video-centric features of the EOS R?

I mean, there is some irony in the engineers saying that the novel control features of the EOS R were aimed at videographers, when a lot of the general criticism of the camera has come from that quarter.
 
Likes: bokehmon22
Oct 26, 2013
1,014
168
#9
I use the mode dial a LOT especially the 3Cs I really don't know how I'd get on without that mode dial.

Is the Rs implementation the same as the 1Dx?
Is there an equivalent of the hard stop at 3C on the R or 1Dx?
Instead of turning the mode dial, you press the button and dial in your mode in the viewfinder. I rented the R today and already find the new mode dial extremely easy to use. Easy to change the mode while you shoot.
 

Kit.

EOS Rebel SL2
Apr 25, 2011
507
138
#10
What do they actually mean by “if you have a mode dial then the [exposure] settings will be the same for both stills and movies”?
 

Talys

Canon 6DII
Feb 16, 2017
1,929
175
Vancouver, BC
#11
What do they actually mean by “if you have a mode dial then the [exposure] settings will be the same for both stills and movies”?
It means, if you physically print P Av Tv M C1 onto a mode dial, those are all the modes you can have, and you must have exactly those modes, whether you're shooting video or stills. It's kind of a stupid rationalization, at least for now, because the two are almost the same anyways. In video mode, there's no Bulb (duh), and no Fv mode. They both have auto, program, Av, Tv, M, and C1-C3, I believe. And obviously, it's possible to tell the user to turn the mode dial to something else if they're trying to shoot a video in Bulb >.<

I guess, if there were vastly different exposure modes in the future for stills vs video, it would make more sense O.O
 
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jd7

EOS Rebel SL2
Feb 3, 2013
622
44
#12
It means, if you physically print P Av Tv M C1 onto a mode dial, those are all the modes you can have, and you must have exactly those modes, whether you're shooting video or stills. It's kind of a stupid rationalization, at least for now, because the two are almost the same anyways. In video mode, there's no Bulb (duh), and no Fv mode. They both have auto, program, Av, Tv, M, and C1-C3, I believe. And obviously, it's possible to tell the user to turn the mode dial to something else if they're trying to shoot a video in Bulb >.<

I guess, if there were vastly different exposure modes in the future for stills vs video, it would make more sense O.O
I have to say I thought they meant that if you have a mode dial, you stay in the selected mode when you switch between stills and video. By not having a mode dial, you can set it up so when you switch to stills you instantly get one mode but when you switch to video you instantly get a different mode. Maybe I have misunderstood though?
 
Likes: MrFotoFool
Jul 31, 2018
297
109
#13
Like every interview before with Canon people: absolutely zero content. Total waste of time reading the stuff. Every time. Contrast it with interviws with the Sigma CEO - there is always worthwhile content. Canon? Never ever. Just blather, blather, blather, non-answers. :mad:(n)

And their attempt at explaining no mode dial is totally absurd. Wasting precious real estate on top of camera for a dial-shaped idiotic ON/OFF switch is beyond "asinine".

If they want to make UI cleaner, then just leave off "n00b scene modes" and reduce to green square Auto, P or Fv, Av, Tv, M, B, C1-C3 plus "Video" capture as one setting on the mode dial.
 
Likes: MrFotoFool
Nov 3, 2012
279
9
#14
Held an R today for the first time. Nice heft and feel. Then I looked through the EVF. Awful. Just as bad as the A9. These are among the best EVFs but are soooo far from the OVF on my DSLRs, that I would not buy the camera.
What I don't understand is that the rear screen was nice and sharp and high resolution and a pleasure to use. But the EVF....
The viewfinder is the interface between the artist and the scene. A step change is needed before I'd buy a mirrorless.
 

BillB

EOS Rebel T7i
May 11, 2017
825
77
#15
Maybe the EOS R was meant to be the all-rounder (still and video) version, and the rumoured 6D-level body coming next year avoids some of the supposedly video-centric features of the EOS R?

I mean, there is some irony in the engineers saying that the novel control features of the EOS R were aimed at videographers, when a lot of the general criticism of the camera has come from that quarter.
A lot of the criticism always comes from that quarter. No surprise there.
 

BillB

EOS Rebel T7i
May 11, 2017
825
77
#16
Like every interview before with Canon people: absolutely zero content. Total waste of time reading the stuff. Every time. Contrast it with interviws with the Sigma CEO - there is always worthwhile content. Canon? Never ever. Just blather, blather, blather, non-answers. :mad:(n)

And their attempt at explaining no mode dial is totally absurd. Wasting precious real estate on top of camera for a dial-shaped idiotic ON/OFF switch is beyond "asinine".

If they want to make UI cleaner, then just leave off "n00b scene modes" and reduce to green square Auto, P or Fv, Av, Tv, M, B, C1-C3 plus "Video" capture as one setting on the mode dial.
For some people, reading anything they don't agree with is a waste of time.
 
Likes: Del Paso
Nov 12, 2016
313
78
#17
Held an R today for the first time. Nice heft and feel. Then I looked through the EVF. Awful. Just as bad as the A9. These are among the best EVFs but are soooo far from the OVF on my DSLRs, that I would not buy the camera.
What I don't understand is that the rear screen was nice and sharp and high resolution and a pleasure to use. But the EVF....
The viewfinder is the interface between the artist and the scene. A step change is needed before I'd buy a mirrorless.
Erm... The EVF is almost twice the resolution of the rear screen, in a display that is physically much smaller than the rear screen. It has 3.6 million pixels packed into a 0.5 inch display. Exactly how much more resolution do you need? For all the criticism I've heard about the EVF, you are the only one I've heard complain about the resolution.
 

zim

EOS 7D Mark II
Oct 18, 2011
1,863
53
#18
Instead of turning the mode dial, you press the button and dial in your mode in the viewfinder. I rented the R today and already find the new mode dial extremely easy to use. Easy to change the mode while you shoot.
Ah ok, I (obviously) don't have one so I think I was misunderstanding the quote. Thought the mode dial had gone altogether and it was just a scroll through button! :eek:

Thanks for clearing that up
 
Jul 31, 2018
297
109
#19
For some people, reading anything they don't agree with is a waste of time.
there is nothing in those Canon interviews to agree or disagree with. Only fluffy, fuzzy blather. Zero information. Only generic, general bullsh*t any of us here knew long before already.
 
Jul 31, 2018
297
109
#20
Maybe the EOS R was meant to be the all-rounder (still and video) version, and the rumoured 6D-level body coming next year avoids some of the supposedly video-centric features of the EOS R?

I mean, there is some irony in the engineers saying that the novel control features of the EOS R were aimed at videographers, when a lot of the general criticism of the camera has come from that quarter.
well, had stupid Canon left the mode dial in place and instead implemented 4k video with no crop, they would have gotten praise from videots and stills photogs.

wasting real estate with a dial-shaped ON/OFF switch. GIVE ME A F*CKING BREAK.