Canon EOS R body with more than 75mp on the horizon [CR2]

Jack Douglas

CR for the Humour
Apr 10, 2013
6,137
1,075
Alberta, Canada
Not to mention the equation that relates lens resolution to price but we gladly pay for the modest improvements because they are discernible and make a difference to people who know and care. If you have GAS and cash, why not. You may not be a better photographer but you likely won't be worse.:)

Jack
 
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AlanF

Canon 5DSR II
Aug 16, 2012
5,738
3,033
Yes you are right about diffraction limit f stops coming down, an upside of the R system though seems to be the ability to make larger aperture lenses. So maybe you lose two stops of smaller apertures but gain one stop of larger aperature’s. Granted fewer MP would boost the diffraction limit and that is the trade off. The 5D4 is already at 8.6 aperature to begin losing quality to diffraction.
Diffraction is determined by the size of the entrance pupil of the lens, usually the front element, and is a function of just the f-number and the wavelength of light. How does having a larger mount make it practically possible to have a larger front element? It certainly doesn’t help telephotos and you have f/0.95 50mm lenses already.
 
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Mbell75

I'm New Here
Oct 21, 2018
23
8
umm how bout 35-45MP Pro EOS R ALL AROUND MODEL with DUAL DIGICS something for us DO-ALL Shooters of fashion,portraits and sports 7-9fps with continuous AF and better full frame 4K video and AF and DUAL CARD SLOTS nobody cares about 75MP
Said it before and I'll say it again. Anyone thinking Canon can compete with the Sony a9 is dreaming. They dont have anywhere near the sensor capabilities to produce a camera like that.
 

Jack Douglas

CR for the Humour
Apr 10, 2013
6,137
1,075
Alberta, Canada
Funny, I thought Canon was already competing with the A9. Or are you saying "Canon is doomed"?:) I guess I'm saying I don't swallow that line, which we've heard endlessly for quite some time. I think various people are buying and will continue to buy various cameras according to their needs. So far no one is doomed. Or, maybe you're saying a camera is just a sensor?:confused:

Jack
 
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justaCanonuser

Grab your camera, go out and shoot!
Feb 12, 2014
456
266
Frankfurt, Germany
Yes you are right about diffraction limit f stops coming down, an upside of the R system though seems to be the ability to make larger aperture lenses. So maybe you lose two stops of smaller apertures but gain one stop of larger aperature’s. Granted fewer MP would boost the diffraction limit and that is the trade off. The 5D4 is already at 8.6 aperature to begin losing quality to diffraction.
With my old 5D3 I can see diffraction slightly kicking in at f>=10 (pixel peeping). So I don't lose too much information on the pixel level with this camera when I move to classic landscape settings.

I'd really love if Canon could provide at least some moderate MP bodies with prosumer features for people like me. In fact, there seems to be a market for such cameras, as Sony's A7S series proves. Currently a A7S III is rumored (of course, with videographers as core target). But many people buying higher end cameras are trained like Pavlov's dogs: ring the Monsterpixel bell and they automatically start to drool.

As second best solution, Canon could provide a M- and SRAW technology based on true pixel binning (combining pixels to create a bigger virtual pixel on the sensor level), like Sigma does in some cameras. This would serve both the needs of high MP fans and moderate MP preferring ignorants like me without too many different sensor lines.
 
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4fun

picture? perfect!
Nov 19, 2018
181
53
So the 6D is also crippled?
6D was roughly "OK-ish" at launch. 6D Mk. II was crippled at launch already. Compared to market standard at launch, Canon put a shamefully poor sensor into it. And also updated AF system only to the level the original 6D should already have come with.
 

Uneternal

EOS T7i
Jan 25, 2016
58
32
I'm actually a little bit worried about Canons future. So if we look at former rumors, they said Canon is only releasing 2 more models in 2019 and one of them is going to be an entry-level EOS R. So the other one seems to be this 75MP model which is a successor of the 5DSR and probably optimated for studio work, rather than sports or night photography.
That means we will probably not see a successor of the 5D4 in the R-series soon!
I don't know what are Canon's plans here but IMO they got a good chance of trailing behind Sony next year. Especially if they aren't gonna dump their prices soon. Here in Europe, the R went up on place 2 of the sales rankings, but only for a few weeks of its introduction, now tumbling down to no 12.
 
Nov 24, 2018
8
5
I think if my desire for a better camera were unique, mine alone, we'd all still be using Canon 20D's. Or maybe film? And if customers don't want more and better, why are we even discussing 75 MP?

Yes, George Hurrell created great portraits back in the 1930's using 8x10 plates and huge, hot, and heavy lights. I suppose that's what I should be satisfied with, as they created great art.

Never "wish" for better tech? Does this apply to cars, TV's, and computers?

I prefer Canon's service and lenses, and it is in fact the lenses which tie us, to an extent, to a camera brand. So, I'd like to see best in the industry bodies too, even if they are only a little better than what Canon currently offers. I have friends with Nikon D8xx bodies, and the Nikons have numerous extra niceties for photographers in the menus, the ergonomics, and other aspects. Usability, not just image quality, is a factor in deciding whether one body or the other is more attractive to an individual.

Not sure what triggered you here, in your very "first" post (unless this is just a new screen name for you), to claim that I'm "whinging" for hoping the next release of a Canon body is even better than the current very good ones.

Happy holidays!
I'm so sorry! I didn't realise I needed your permission to respond to your post. Yes we all start somewhere.
I admit I was bored. However, as a caveat, I have been following CR for many years but decided to make an entrance on your post.
Again you compare the Nikon for having niceties in the menu.
I have been shooting with Canon EOS - Film and Digital - for over thirty (30) years and have never had a problem taking pictures with every model that I have owned.
Why would somebody be compelled to think they are missing out on "extra niceties" in the current Canon line up.
Move to Nikon and Sony!
I have never ever had a problem taking a photo on a Canon - even without the bells and whistles of the Nikon / Sony niceties - whatever they are?
So it sounds (to me) like you "want what you need" but don't know what that actually is.
 
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Nov 24, 2018
8
5
I'm actually a little bit worried about Canons future. So if we look at former rumors, they said Canon is only releasing 2 more models in 2019 and one of them is going to be an entry-level EOS R. So the other one seems to be this 75MP model which is a successor of the 5DSR and probably optimated for studio work, rather than sports or night photography.
That means we will probably not see a successor of the 5D4 in the R-series soon!
I don't know what are Canon's plans here but IMO they got a good chance of trailing behind Sony next year. Especially if they aren't gonna dump their prices soon. Here in Europe, the R went up on place 2 of the sales rankings, but only for a few weeks of its introduction, now tumbling down to no 12.
Why are worried...Canon know what they are doing.
Sit back and relax
 

YuengLinger

EOS 5D MK IV
Dec 20, 2012
2,575
677
Southeastern USA
I'm so sorry! I didn't realise I needed your permission to respond to your post. Yes we all start somewhere.
I admit I was bored. However, as a caveat, I have been following CR for many years but decided to make an entrance on your post.
Again you compare the Nikon for having niceties in the menu.
I have been shooting with Canon EOS - Film and Digital - for over thirty (30) years and have never had a problem taking pictures with every model that I have owned.
Why would somebody be compelled to think they are missing out on "extra niceties" in the current Canon line up.
Move to Nikon and Sony!
I have never ever had a problem taking a photo on a Canon - even without the bells and whistles of the Nikon / Sony niceties - whatever they are?
So it sounds (to me) like you "want what you need" but don't know what that actually is.
Whatever your name, thank you for bringing the 30 years of wisdom to the forum to tell other members to jump ship if they discuss Canon gear in the context of other brands. What a refreshing perspective! "Love it or leave it!" Never heard that before! Glad you are so satisfied with your kit.
 
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Treyarnon

EOS T7i
Jan 11, 2018
62
36
Cornwall, UK
Visit site
I'm actually a little bit worried about Canons future. So if we look at former rumors, they said Canon is only releasing 2 more models in 2019 and one of them is going to be an entry-level EOS R. So the other one seems to be this 75MP model which is a successor of the 5DSR and probably optimated for studio work, rather than sports or night photography.
That means we will probably not see a successor of the 5D4 in the R-series soon!
I don't know what are Canon's plans here but IMO they got a good chance of trailing behind Sony next year. Especially if they aren't gonna dump their prices soon. Here in Europe, the R went up on place 2 of the sales rankings, but only for a few weeks of its introduction, now tumbling down to no 12.
Quit worrying and go out and take some pictures.
The 5DS has been around for 4 years - so due a replacement, which is why the rumors of a replacement are circulating at present.

The 5d4 was only released 2 years ago, so is mid life right now, so a little early for a replacement. If you have a 5D4, then plenty of life left in it surly? It was a shame that Canon didn't simply pack the dual card slots and joystick onto the R and be done with it, but hey ho.

The 'entry level R' is an interesting concept - Canon moving for the mass market rather than niche markets could be a good move for the company though? One assumes that Nikon and Sony are working on their own entry level mirrorless options. Do we know for absoutly certain that this 75MP senor is not destined for the entry level camera?? Call me crazy - but if the high res model is aimed and landscapers and studio work specifically, the camera does not need a lot of bells and whistles. Cut out the high frame rate, IBIS, 4k video modes etc, and put out a camera with '5Ds style' image quality, straightforward interface and lightweight build, and there could be a good market for that.
 
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Nov 24, 2018
8
5
Whatever your name, thank you for bringing the 30 years of wisdom to the forum to tell other members to jump ship if they discuss Canon gear in the context of other brands. What a refreshing perspective! "Love it or leave it!" Never heard that before! Glad you are so satisfied with your kit.
Someone is angry!
I suggest you stick to taking you cat photos with your flawed 6D mkii and leave the adults to taking real photographs with their equally flawed 'other Canon' cameras that subtract all the 'niceties' of the Nikon you aspire to. Oh by the way it's 42 years of wisdom shooting with a camera - with film and digital.
Canon should employ you as the head of their R'n'D department.
I can see it now....Your / Their, next camera the EOS D850 ....as it has "niceties".

Have a lovely day.
It's been great looking into your creative realm.
 

YuengLinger

EOS 5D MK IV
Dec 20, 2012
2,575
677
Southeastern USA
Someone is angry!
I suggest you stick to taking you cat photos with your flawed 6D mkii and leave the adults to taking real photographs with their equally flawed 'other Canon' cameras that subtract all the 'niceties' of the Nikon you aspire to. Oh by the way it's 42 years of wisdom shooting with a camera - with film and digital.
Canon should employ you as the head of their R'n'D department.
I can see it now....Your / Their, next camera the EOS D850 ....as it has "niceties".

Have a lovely day.
It's been great looking into your creative realm.
Sorry, never took a pic of a cat, and only a few of dogs. Not my bag.

Since this is a thread discussing another jump in camera tech, perhaps you could share your thoughts about how 75 MP will help your work, or not?

No, I've never been a fan boy of any brand I buy, whether surfboards, cars, TV's, or even Canon. As stated many times, as a whole, Canon is the right fit for me, but other brands make advances that would be nice too.

Cheers, old friend!
 

padam

EOS 7D MK II
Aug 26, 2015
597
217
I'm actually a little bit worried about Canons future. So if we look at former rumors, they said Canon is only releasing 2 more models in 2019 and one of them is going to be an entry-level EOS R. So the other one seems to be this 75MP model which is a successor of the 5DSR and probably optimated for studio work, rather than sports or night photography.
That means we will probably not see a successor of the 5D4 in the R-series soon!
I don't know what are Canon's plans here but IMO they got a good chance of trailing behind Sony next year. Especially if they aren't gonna dump their prices soon. Here in Europe, the R went up on place 2 of the sales rankings, but only for a few weeks of its introduction, now tumbling down to no 12.
I think the Pro version is more important for them than a high-megapixel Pro one and they know it, but it will be positioned above of the 5D IV, I don't see them going for anything other than the 1DX II sensor, it is still very competitive for both photo and video(especially with C-Log...), and I think it will have dual processors and a CFast slot as well for 4k60p. If they delay it that means going for a newer generation sensor, but I doubt that.

I don't think they are too worried, their initial pricing is only a bluff and they have the leeway to drop it if needed(they can make a decent profit on those accessories as well), and after that the even cheaper entry-level mirrorless will be competing against Sony models that are much older, therefore lacking in some features and it is harder to equip them with cheap lenses.
 

jolyonralph

Kodak Brownie
Aug 25, 2015
1,097
310
50
London, UK
www.everyothershot.com
Canon NO LONGER HAS ANY CHOICE in the matter!

These are specs from PetaPixel and SonyRumors websites about Sony introducing
a NEW 60 megapixel sensor so if Canon wants to stay in business, they had better
match and even EXCEED the specs noted below:
Oh Harry, and for a short brief while I thought you had an understanding of business.

Canon haven't been able to match or exceed the specs of Sony sensors for quite a while now, except in autofocus ability with DPAF which still beats out PDAF on Sony.

They don't have to beat it. All they have to do is produce a camera that people want to buy.
 
Nov 24, 2018
8
5
Sorry, never took a pic of a cat, and only a few of dogs. Not my bag.

Since this is a thread discussing another jump in camera tech, perhaps you could share your thoughts about how 75 MP will help your work, or not?

No, I've never been a fan boy of any brand I buy, whether surfboards, cars, TV's, or even Canon. As stated many times, as a whole, Canon is the right fit for me, but other brands make advances that would be nice too.

Cheers, old friend!
Oh...75 MP would be great to work with.
The resolution (I should imagine) would be out of this world ( mixed with the right glass)
Any camera manufacturer using 35mm format for sensor size would be aware of the inherent vibration caused by mirror or shutter mechanisms.
Mirrorless is clearly the way to go with such "large" sensors as the vibration can be kept to a minimum.
I doubt if the megapixel race will stop at 70 or 75 (whatever) and in 8 - 10 years time these sensor sizes will seem minuscule.
I am so happy you not a fanboy of any brand. How's that working out for you ?
 
Nov 24, 2018
8
5
---

Canon NO LONGER HAS ANY CHOICE in the matter!

These are specs from PetaPixel and SonyRumors websites about Sony introducing
a NEW 60 megapixel sensor so if Canon wants to stay in business, they had better
match and even EXCEED the specs noted below:

  • 60 megapixels
  • 16 channels (this is probably used to increase data rate transfer from sensor to system memory to reduce rolling shutter!)
  • 4.6FPS @ 16-bit (Can you say OMG-level beautiful landscapes, astro-phototgraphy and low-light imagery?)
  • 12FPS @ 14-bit ( Good for time lapses!)
  • 8K30P @ 12-bit (Not a bad spec -- I'll take it for high end security video!)
  • 8K60p @ 10-bit (THIS spec is what I was EXPECTING BIG-TIME for new smooth motion 8K video cameras!!!)
  • 4K60p @ 12-bit (Video and still Images will LOOK UTTERLY STUNNING at oversampled DCI 4k at 4:4:4 RAW 12 bit colour!)
  • FHD300P @ 10-bit (with a bit of software tweaking this can be increased to 8-bit 4:2:0/4:2:2 at 600 frames per second at HD 1080p!)
which speak of a NEW PARADIGM in high-pixel count image sensors which can be deployed to MULTIPLE platforms.

---

...AND...

Sony, being the world's largest producer of Smartphone Image Sensors, has in it's waiting wings, some NEW VERSIONS of current 1/2 inch, 2/3rd inch and even APS-C sensors which are being readied for deployment on SMARTPHONES !!!!! Yes! You HEARD IT HERE FIRST !!!! Not for Mirrorless or DSLR cameras....but rather SMARTPHONE deployments!

After that long ago image leak of a POSSIBLE series of Canon prototype smartphones with a very large sensor (looked like APS-C and 1 Inch sensors), it looks like SONY may hit the market FIRST with a 2/3rds Inch Sensor on a 4K screen Sony xPeria flagship smartphone! And at 50 Megapixels, that smartphone would be technically a Medium Format imaging system in a consumer-level form factor....AND once that happens, you JUST KNOW that Canon, Fuji, Nikon, Olympus won't be far behind with 50+ Megapixel mirrorless cameras AND smartphone-systems!

In fact, .....I AM GOING TO CALL THIS NEAR-FUTURE AS ALMOST A DONE DEAL .... I see BOTH Canon AND Fuji building High-End, Image Connoisseur-specific SMARTPHONES that will have DCI 4k (4096 by 2160 pixels) OLED displays with 50 Megapixel still images AND 8k video (8192 by 4320 pixel) once Sony introduces that new 50 megapixel 2/3rds inch sensor xPeria super-smartphone! On a technical level because of battery issues, I do see 8K video on these smartphones being only 30 fps recording and the full-sensor downsampled 4K video at 60 fps with 120 fps 1080p HD resolutions!

For stills, I am 99.99% SURE it will be 50 Megapixel STILL PHOTOS rather than 75 megapixels or 36 megapixels on these NEW large image sensor smartphones! With modern computational photography algorithms SIMILAR what the Google Pixel-3 is doing which it's Stacked Images software, I EXPECT that image quality will start EATING AWAY at cameras like the Sony A6500 and Canon Rebel and M5/M6 Series and Nikon D500 series cameras!
Oh dear. Canon don't just make cameras and the cameras they make do sell...
Why? Its because they are the Toyota of the camera world. Their products might not be the best compared with other manufacturers (depending on what you define as "best") but they make and sell (thousands of) the most popular cameras on the market because they are reliable and do what they are meant to do.
 

AlanF

Canon 5DSR II
Aug 16, 2012
5,738
3,033
There are different 'resolutions'. The conventional sensor resolution measured in pixels. So 3.5x increase in mpx will lead to 3.5x increase in resolution in pixels (very trivial).
Define resolution any way you want, but you are absolutely and categorically wrong about the standard convention about defining resolution. Look at tabulated resolution measurements: they are in line pairs per mm or lines per picture height. Or they are in MTF values scaled to unity. Doubling the number of pixels in a sensor just increases the possible lines per picture height or line pairs per mm by the square root of 2. The resolution of a sensor depends on the linear dimension of each of its pixels, which scales with the square root of the total number.
 

Aaron D

EOS 80D
Jul 21, 2016
143
109
Kansas City
www.aarondougherty.com
Sounds like overkill, but why not? It'll be 100 next update.

And again for 100th time: how about some fresh new TS-E lenses to go with? I'd like a 17mm with filter threads and A TRIPOD FOOT! And a 24mm...

And a 28mm f2.0—small, sharp, w/IS. That would be a perfect walking-around lens…...
 
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