Canon EOS R usability issues

Larsskv

EOS 7D MK II
Jun 12, 2015
759
178
WB change, Spot Metering, Drive, AF MODE (Single/SERVO), ISO (yes you will most likely put that on that ring on lens) .... i cant be bothered ... list is tooo long and putting few option on M.FN button then scroll then press Set then scroll again then press set again ... not quick. And way to change mode ... OMG ... that thing is ridiculous. Also what you want to say is ... "I can customize bla bla bla" where problem is ... i have to make my brain relearn that my options on top of 5D are now on button that is on complitely different place, also, i can do so for only few options because ... well have soo less buttons to do that with. There is a reason ADOBE never changed shortcuts for options in all versions of programs ... speed and muscle memory of users.

And i stand by my 80D versatility comparison. I would do much better with 80D speed wise then EOS R with all customizations combined at some fast paced event with lights that change every few seconds.
You can set the functions you mention to separate buttons. Customizability is not a problem with the R. And please tell me, how you change and move the focus point faster on the 80D, than on the R.

You know the 80D and how it operates. The R operates differently. It will take some time and experience to get used to. Yes, you must relearn the buttons in order to match your 80D speed wise. But it can be done.

All this said, I agree that the EOS R needs refinement. The DSLRs are more mature and better thought out from a usability standpoint, and I (still) prefer how the DSLRs operate. I am curious if Canon is all in on touch and drag focus, or if they will put a joystick in a future mirrorless camera. I think the touch and drag focus is more effective, but a bit more cumbersome/less intuitive in use.
 

Act444

EOS 6D MK II
May 4, 2011
956
68
I still wonder why the R ergonomically wasn’t laid out to be more or less a FF version of the M5...
 

mihazero

EOS M50
Jul 22, 2011
37
2
Absolutely, its not marketed or intended to be a 5D or 1D replacement, yet I see people complaining about lack of features only found on those cameras.

Yet, wedding photographers seem mostly happy with it, the one main drawback being the lack of AF assist on the flash unit. I see it as a alternative for someone who wants 6D II features with a few upgrades and does not want to pay the $4,000 that the 5D replacement model will cost. I bought mine to replace my SL2, and, for now, at least, am keeping my 5D MK IV, they can share batteries, lenses (I have no RF lenses), and since the sensors are basically the same, post processing is similar as well.

Although pro sports photographers somehow managed to capture some pretty good photos with those huge press cameras and 4 X 5 sheet film, it took lots of experience to gain the skill needed to use the tool. Its nice to not have to be able to just gun 100 photos of a event and sort thru them, but, as you say, sports can be done.
Oh i agree ... it is not 5D or 1Dx intented replacement. That is what im waiting. And as i said in previous message ... You can capture amazing photos even with old rebels, but thats not the point.
 

LSXPhotog

EOS RP
Apr 2, 2015
330
145
www.diossiphotography.com
It's really difficult to read anything about this camera online. This topic in particular really annoys me because it's honestly something that can easily be solved with seat time with the camera and learning it's layout. Yes, it's unlike previous Canon bodies. But you know what? I learned to use it pretty quickly because I'm not inept.

The mode dial...

Let's be real. This isn't an issue at all in any way shape or form. Want to change your mode? You don't even have to leave the viewfinder! Press the mode button and then select the mode you want! Canon let's you use the front scroll wheel, the rear mode wheel, the directional pad and the touchscreen to choose. So just quit whining about it. It's incredibly easy and I would argue it's easier than previous Canon cameras have been. I really don't get the issue here.

As for the joystick...

I am a professional motorsports photographer. My main camera is a 1DX Mark II. Practically every camera I've owned in the past 8 years has used a joystick. I don't miss it at all on this camera. Why? Because touch and drag - after you've gotten used to using it - is a much faster and more effective way to move to the area you want to autofocus. Yet, I see complaints about this. I challenge anyone to prove the joystick would be better at moving to one of the 5655 possible positions...I'll buy them a coffee.
 

BillB

EOS 6D MK II
May 11, 2017
993
209
It's really difficult to read anything about this camera online. This topic in particular really annoys me because it's honestly something that can easily be solved with seat time with the camera and learning it's layout. Yes, it's unlike previous Canon bodies. But you know what? I learned to use it pretty quickly because I'm not inept.

The mode dial...

Let's be real. This isn't an issue at all in any way shape or form. Want to change your mode? You don't even have to leave the viewfinder! Press the mode button and then select the mode you want! Canon let's you use the front scroll wheel, the rear mode wheel, the directional pad and the touchscreen to choose. So just quit whining about it. It's incredibly easy and I would argue it's easier than previous Canon cameras have been. I really don't get the issue here.

As for the joystick...

I am a professional motorsports photographer. My main camera is a 1DX Mark II. Practically every camera I've owned in the past 8 years has used a joystick. I don't miss it at all on this camera. Why? Because touch and drag - after you've gotten used to using it - is a much faster and more effective way to move to the area you want to autofocus. Yet, I see complaints about this. I challenge anyone to prove the joystick would be better at moving to one of the 5655 possible positions...I'll buy them a coffee.
Internet camera reviews often make mountains out of molehills with little or no consideration of the practical significance of a particular feature for actual photography. That would spoil the internet fun.
 

wockawocka

EOS 7D MK II
Sep 13, 2011
716
61
I got mine today and love it. If I would change two things it would be:

- Optional amplification of the rear screen af selection. I want to move my AF point from one side to the other in one movement, not three.
- An option to select my own burst rate, (3/4/5 fps)

Great camera though, focus in low light smokes my 5D4 even in live view.
 

Talys

Canon 6DII
Feb 16, 2017
2,052
317
Vancouver, BC
Yet, wedding photographers seem mostly happy with it, the one main drawback being the lack of AF assist on the flash unit.
Not being a wedding photographer, I absolutely hate this about mirrorless cameras. AF assist just works exactly the way one would imagine a autofocus assist should on a DSLR. Although EOS R is much better than A7R3, it is much worse than a T2i in situations where you'd use an AF assist light.

As someone who really, really likes flashes and strobes, I wish camera manufacturers could get this part working "right" on mirrorless. I guess, this is another reason why EVFs don't make me super excited -- they add little value in the WYSIWYG aspect if you're going to be creating a lot of your own light anyhow.

Absolutely, its not marketed or intended to be a 5D or 1D replacement, yet I see people complaining about lack of features only found on those cameras.
Part of it is just because in some respects, EOS R is so close, yet so far :) I'm pretty sure that there will be a Canon pro 5D/1D type mirrorless, that will get us there. It just won't be $2,000. For the price that EOS R is, I think it's an excellent general purpose mirrorless camera, excellent value, and no-brainer for someone with EF lenses that wants to play with mirrorless.
 
  • Like
Reactions: dak723 and Jethro

dcm

Good or bad - it's not the gear.
Apr 18, 2013
712
32
Got my hands on the R/24-105 combo in the local Best Buy today (no Nikon Z in stock yet to compare with it). Liked the fit in my hand - I was able to pick it up and use it without much thought. Just running through the basic setup and options I found it a nice blend of features from my M5 and 1DX2. Other than size it didn't remind me of my 6D all that much, but maybe that's because I haven't been using it as much lately.

Price seems a bit high, but I didn't explore all of it's capabilities yet. I'm tempted, but in no rush. I'd like to see the next body and a few more RF lenses before I pull the trigger. Over the years I've found most usability issues are more about me learning how to use a new body rather than something inherent in the design. And I've see lots of changes since the film days with my A-1.
 

Jethro

EOS R
Jul 14, 2018
183
79
Bought mine yesterday (15% off in the black Friday sales!). Great first impressions. Fv seems very natural to me, and I suspect it's going to be the go-to mode. I'm not fussed by the mode button approach. At the moment I haven't got a problem with the multi-fn bar, except it sometimes seems a little laggy in responding. It's all seems a little smaller than the 6D I'm used to, but not so that I'm really noticing it. The trick seems to be to get used to doing pretty much everything through the EVF, which is exceptional. Not having had a mirrorless ILC before, I'm still getting used to the WYSIWYG approach, but again it seems fine to me. I'm still coming to terms with the cabling to attach to my computer - that's not obvious at the moment. I gather there is an optional HDMI cable.
 

killswitch

EOS RP
Aug 26, 2012
269
9
It's really difficult to read anything about this camera online. This topic in particular really annoys me because it's honestly something that can easily be solved with seat time with the camera and learning it's layout. Yes, it's unlike previous Canon bodies. But you know what? I learned to use it pretty quickly because I'm not inept.

The mode dial...

Let's be real. This isn't an issue at all in any way shape or form. Want to change your mode? You don't even have to leave the viewfinder! Press the mode button and then select the mode you want! Canon let's you use the front scroll wheel, the rear mode wheel, the directional pad and the touchscreen to choose. So just quit whining about it. It's incredibly easy and I would argue it's easier than previous Canon cameras have been. I really don't get the issue here.

As for the joystick...

I am a professional motorsports photographer. My main camera is a 1DX Mark II. Practically every camera I've owned in the past 8 years has used a joystick. I don't miss it at all on this camera. Why? Because touch and drag - after you've gotten used to using it - is a much faster and more effective way to move to the area you want to autofocus. Yet, I see complaints about this. I challenge anyone to prove the joystick would be better at moving to one of the 5655 possible positions...I'll buy them a coffee.
I agree with you regarding the mode dial issue. it's really ok the way it is in EOS R. However, I am curious what you think about the touch screen functionality in the following scenarios 1) touch screen af usability under extreme weather conditions where you are wearing thick gloves. 2) M-fn touch bar under the same extreme conditions and wearing thick gloves 3) taking a shot through the EVF, are you able to select/reach the AF points on the left edge of the AF region in one go in absolute mode? I tried setting up the AF region to be on the top right corner of the actual touch-screen even then my thumb could not reach the left edge of the AF points without loosening my grip. Alternate way for me was to set it to relative mode and swipe twice/thrice to reach those AF points on the left edge. Is there are AF-drag speed setting (like PC mouse, track-ball) on EOS-R? I may have missed?
 
  • Like
Reactions: LSXPhotog

killswitch

EOS RP
Aug 26, 2012
269
9
Also, anybody seen any video examples of what happens if you turn off the "image review" after each shot? Is it a quick black-out before we see again through the EVF? I have seen video examples of what happens with image review on only, need to go back to my local Best-Buy and test it out with the setting off.
 

wockawocka

EOS 7D MK II
Sep 13, 2011
716
61
Also, anybody seen any video examples of what happens if you turn off the "image review" after each shot? Is it a quick black-out before we see again through the EVF? I have seen video examples of what happens with image review on only, need to go back to my local Best-Buy and test it out with the setting off.
If you turn it off you get zero blackout.

Which is nice. If you set it to 2 secs you can still cancel it by holding the shutter down again.
 
  • Like
Reactions: killswitch

Act444

EOS 6D MK II
May 4, 2011
956
68
Also, anybody seen any video examples of what happens if you turn off the "image review" after each shot? Is it a quick black-out before we see again through the EVF? I have seen video examples of what happens with image review on only, need to go back to my local Best-Buy and test it out with the setting off.
If you're talking about stills, in my experience, even with IR off there is still a split second delay between shot taken and continuation of EVF feed - basically, what this translates to is a "jerky" movement if you're shooting in burst mode through the viewfinder (or screen for that matter). Can make it real difficult to track subjects/contribute to a "disconnected" feeling with the photographer. This is another drawback of the R (in my eyes) vs. a DSLR...

With IR on I found the camera essentially unusable. I don't want my view interrupted/blocked by the last shot I just took. I had to turn it off on the M cameras as well, but at least those had no EVF.
 
Last edited:

killswitch

EOS RP
Aug 26, 2012
269
9
If you're talking about stills, in my experience, even with IR off there is still a split second delay between shot taken and continuation of EVF feed - basically, what this translates to is a "jerky" movement if you're shooting in burst mode through the viewfinder (or screen for that matter). Can make it real difficult to track subjects/contribute to a "disconnected" feeling with the photographer. This is another drawback of the R (in my eyes) vs. a DSLR...

With IR on I found the camera essentially unusable. I don't want my view interrupted/blocked by the last shot I just took. I had to turn it off on the M cameras as well, but at least those had no EVF.
If you turn it off you get zero blackout.

Which is nice. If you set it to 2 secs you can still cancel it by holding the shutter down again.
Thanks folks, hmm very interesting. I use my 5D3 to track my one year old son, and since the little one move so fast, I use fast shutter speed to freeze the action and in doing so the shutter black-out is pretty fast or minimal in those situations. I wonder even with fast shutter speed the black-out is noticeable delay/lag through EOS R EVF.

Is Sony's A9 the only one that has no blackout? Or do the A7III, A7R III have no blackout as well? Can anyone here confirm this? Thanks.
 

jd7

EOS 7D MK II
Feb 3, 2013
713
87
If you're talking about stills, in my experience, even with IR off there is still a split second delay between shot taken and continuation of EVF feed - basically, what this translates to is a "jerky" movement if you're shooting in burst mode through the viewfinder (or screen for that matter). Can make it real difficult to track subjects/contribute to a "disconnected" feeling with the photographer. This is another drawback of the R (in my eyes) vs. a DSLR...
How does the effect of the stutter in the EVF compare with the blackout in an OVF when the mirror flips up when you take a shot though? I assume the EVF stutter makes for a worse experience, given the various comments I've seen about the EVF making it harder to track a moving subject compared to an OVF, but I'd be interested to hear a bit more detail about it. Anyway, i will have to see if I can get hold of an EOS R at some point and see how much it bothers me.
 

jd7

EOS 7D MK II
Feb 3, 2013
713
87
How does the effect of the stutter in the EVF compare with the blackout in an OVF when the mirror flips up when you take a shot though? I assume the EVF stutter makes for a worse experience, given the various comments I've seen about the EVF making it harder to track a moving subject compared to an OVF, but I'd be interested to hear a bit more detail about it. Anyway, i will have to see if I can get hold of an EOS R at some point and see how much it bothers me.
Got a few minutes with an EOS R in a store today.

Really didn't like the touch and drag AF at first but after only a couple of minutes I was already starting to feel a lot happier with it. I wonder how precise you can make it even with practice. Still, overall my guess is I'd find it a pretty good system once I had a bit more time to get used to it.

As for the EVF stutter in continuous shooting mode, I definitely found it more off-putting than OVF blackout on a DSLR. I would need to try it out more though (and the EVF more generally) before I decided if it is a deal breaker for me.
 

Viggo

EOS 5D SR
Dec 13, 2010
3,957
470
Remember when it comes to evf lag or stutter there is a big difference between using adapted EF lenses and RF lenses and enabling “High speed Display”.
 
  • Like
Reactions: killswitch

YuengLinger

EOR R
Dec 20, 2012
2,325
354
Southeastern USA
Remember when it comes to evf lag or stutter there is a big difference between using adapted EF lenses and RF lenses and enabling “High speed Display”.
Can you explain this more? Or link to a deeper discussion? You've thrown two new factors at me here. Can EF lenses use this "High speed Display" option you mention?
 
  • Like
Reactions: killswitch

Viggo

EOS 5D SR
Dec 13, 2010
3,957
470
Can you explain this more? Or link to a deeper discussion? You've thrown two new factors at me here. Can EF lenses use this "High speed Display" option you mention?
No, the EF lenses I’ve tried has this option grayed out in the menu.

It’s red menu number 6, at the bottom. Page 149 in the manual.
 

YuengLinger

EOR R
Dec 20, 2012
2,325
354
Southeastern USA
No, the EF lenses I’ve tried has this option grayed out in the menu.

It’s red menu number 6, at the bottom. Page 149 in the manual.
And how effectively does this eliminate lag in the EVF when used with RF lenses? We've had comments that the EVF display lags behind real life in bird-in-flight and other action scenarios.

Is High Speed Display enabled by default? Looks, from the manual, like it should be. Who wouldn't want the EVF to be "more responsive, making it easier to follow fast-moving subjects"? :)
 
Last edited: