Canon officially announces the PowerShot G5 X Mark II and PowerShot G7 X Mark III

PVCC

Arts & Engineering
Jul 5, 2019
65
15
Does anyone know if you can output to external HDMI monitor WHILE recording video at FullHD and 4K and have the LCD Touchscreen enabled at same time?

So you could tap the LCD screen to focus then frame and check everything in external larger monitor

That would be VERY useful...

Thanks!
 

Stereodude

EOS 80D
Jul 8, 2019
149
130
Thank you very much for your comments!! Much appreciated!

I couldn't understand very well what Amy said. You're clarifications help me a lot :)

About the "Auto focus problem", I think there are two factors playing here:

1- in the last review, he said he set AF to "Face detection" (something that lot of people like, and will use, but not me)
2- He, and Amy, were holding the camera very close when walking (I don't know at what focal length) That may be a cause for AF hunting or out of focus if it was reaching the minimum focus distance.

- Gordon's video didn't have that problem at all when he was walking handholding it, he probably held the camera with his arms fully extended.
Although on his specific Face AF test the Sony is a mile away ahead, no doubt Sony is leader in this point (I still remember the spot of A7r IV).

Sony is improving some features much faster than Canon indeed. In fact it's the king of mirrorless cameras, sensors and auto focus processing technology.

Cheers!
You can see it hunting in Gordon's VLOG test video too, just not to the same extent as the problems are demonstrated in the others. What AF mode are you planning to use?

From watching other videos on YouTube they are definitely not too close (closer than the minimum focus distance).

Here's a close focus comparison of the G7X III, G5X II, & RX100 VII (at 7:55) where you can see how close they can focus:
 

PVCC

Arts & Engineering
Jul 5, 2019
65
15
You can see it hunting in Gordon's VLOG test video too, just not to the same extent as the problems are demonstrated in the others. What AF mode are you planning to use?

From watching other videos on YouTube they are definitely not too close (closer than the minimum focus distance).

Here's a close focus comparison of the G7X III, G5X II, & RX100 VII (at 7:55) where you can see how close they can focus:
Hey,

Thanks!

I always use Small square area AF mode (contrast detection in this case, since it doesn't have DualPixelAF technology), to touch the subject and focus (or even hal-release the shutter to focus). I almost never use Face Detection (maybe I'd do if I had a Sony).

When using to pull focus, from one subject to another, I touch over them alternatively.

It seems the G7X III's AF is not good enough for face detection, according to these previews.

But I really don't think it'll be so bad in contrast area mode, even less if you can disable AF Servo (which I usually do to avoid "hunting")

Thanks once again, comments are always welcome and helpful!
 

powershot2012

EOS RP
Aug 3, 2012
236
5
And the comes the RX100 VII and soon to be announced VIIA...

AF is one of the most important things in a camera and looks like both of the Canon’s are yesterday’s technology.

For as long as both of these cameras were developed, there is no excuse why they are not more advanced with DPAF.
 

Stereodude

EOS 80D
Jul 8, 2019
149
130
And the comes the RX100 VII and soon to be announced VIIA...
VIIA? Why would there be an A version of the VII that's going to be announced soon when the VII isn't shipping yet? Do you mean another update to the V? Like a VB?

For as long as both of these cameras were developed, there is no excuse why they are not more advanced with DPAF.
Sure there is. Some possibilities:

1) Sony wouldn't sell them a 1" sensor with DPAF
2) Sony wanted too much money for a 1" sensor with DPAF
3) Canon didn't want to develop their own 20MP 1" sensor with DPAF
4) Canon didn't want to give the new Powershot G series cameras that good of AF to protect other models in their camera lineup from cannibalization.

I'm not saying they're necessarily good excuses, but there are definitely excuses.
 

PVCC

Arts & Engineering
Jul 5, 2019
65
15
The RX100 VA was really an exceptional unusual upgrade made by Sony to the RX 100 V, but not likely to happen often. Furthermore, it wasn't officially announced as a new model, it was very quietly.

The AF on the G7X III is "old", completely agree. No excuses to Canon.

The "problem" is probably Canon used a Sony sensor which doesn't have DualPixelAF technology, so Canon could only offer contrast detection + some kind of image processing in real time to offer face detection and servo.

Canon is running behind Sony in many areas, sensors and AF technology, no doubt.

Fortunately to me, I barely use Servo and almost never Face detection (at least so far).

EXTERNAL Monitor: I think G7X III will not display on external monitor WHILE recording video.. that's something I'll really miss due to the advantages it would mean (AF Touchscreen, and better/larger image framing).
Hope I'm wrong!! But I didn't find anybody testing that, nor the User Manual...
 

Stereodude

EOS 80D
Jul 8, 2019
149
130
Canon has 1" 4K sensors with DPAF in their video cameras. I think they're making them in house. Ironically the Sony 1" sensor video cameras lack DPAF.
 

stevelee

FT-QL
Jul 6, 2017
1,182
229
Davidson, NC
I don’t recall ever having a focus problem with my G7X II so I have trouble understanding the obsession with advanced focusing techniques in a camera with a lens that zooms between 8mm and 37ish. The worst case depth of field is at 37mm and f/2.8. Agonizing over focusing on left eye vs. right eye strains the laws of optics.

I will admit that I have managed to make some out-of-focus shots with the camera. A few weeks ago in Stockholm I rode in a glass ride on a rainy day to the top of the Skyview globe. I wasn’t paying attention to shooting pictures, but just enjoying the ride and the view. So I left the autofocus on. The camera focused beautifully on the raindrops on the glass rather than on the buildings below. Paying attention, I would have set manual focus on infinity, or at least anything beyond hyperfocal distance. I fail to see how I can blame the little camera for that.
 
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stevelee

FT-QL
Jul 6, 2017
1,182
229
Davidson, NC
Also I should have put the camera nearer the glass. The little lenses formed by the drops would have degraded the image, but I would likely have got something usable.

And I probably shouldn’t have confused the issue by bringing this up, even in a moment of full disclosure. It distracts from my point about the optics of the focal lengths and apertures involved with this camera and its successor.
 

PVCC

Arts & Engineering
Jul 5, 2019
65
15
QUESTION:

Does anyone know if you can manually focus WHILE recording video using the ring around the lens?

Because that would be very important to me and I never had a GxX before.

I'm planning to make my own detachable "EVF" attaching an optical element to the LCD screen. I already made s for DSLRs and it's great to see larger frame, and in sunlight when otherwise you can barely see the screen.

Cheers
 
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neuroanatomist

I post too Much on Here!!
Jul 21, 2010
24,565
2,002
I'm planning to make my own detachable "EVF" attaching an optical element to the LCD screen. I already made s for DSLRs and it's great to see larger frame, and in sunlight when otherwise you can barely see the screen.
Or you could buy a Hoodman Loupe...
 

stevelee

FT-QL
Jul 6, 2017
1,182
229
Davidson, NC
QUESTION:

Does anyone know if you can manually focus WHILE recording video using the ring around the lens?

Because that would be very important to me and I never had a GxX before.
I have no idea, and I can't tell from the manual. It just tells how to lock the focus to what you have set manually rather than letting autofocus take over automatically during the video.

Because of the depth of field, manual focus is tricky using just the screen. You need to magnify the image or use focus peaking. Unless you use a tripod, twisting the ring is likely to jiggle the camera too much for video, since the camera has so little mass. Maybe with practice one could master the technique. Normally you would focus using the little wheel on the back, so that would jiggle the camera less. The front ring can control zooming. Smooth zooms during videos take some practice, too.

I've used manual focus just as a set-and-forget video setting when shooting things more than 20 feet away. I focus on something near the middle of the range I want in focus, knowing that everything else will be covered by the DOF. If things are 50 feet away or more, I know the hyperlocal distance will take care of it, so I focus somewhere about there. For closeups, the autofocus is more than adequate. You are never going to get the effect you can get with an 85mm f/1.2 on FF.

I'm trying to imagine what effect I might would want to get by refocusing during shooting video with this camera. No real-life-for-me scenario comes to mind, since if I wanted selective focus in video, I'd use my DSLR, and in traveling with just the little camera, I can't think of anything I'd want to do like that.

But say that I did. If I can't refocus during shooting, I know that the camera can. So, say, I wanted to have the shot begin with the background in focus and then go to focus upon a nearby subject, I'd manually focus on the background and then let autofocus take over and focus on the subject.

For other situations, face detection, servo autofocus, and one-touch autofocus should suffice. It may be a matter of thinking through what you want to do and accomplishing it the way the camera wants to do it rather than trying to make the camera do it your way.

Sorry I can't give you a real answer. I did try looking in the manual. The nature of the camera is such that even if it works, it could be tricky to pull off in a useful fashion. It probably says something that in using the camera for almost three years, it has never occurred to me to try to do something like that. Given the nature of the beasties, I would think this would not change from the II to the III.
 

PVCC

Arts & Engineering
Jul 5, 2019
65
15
I have no idea, and I can't tell from the manual. It just tells how to lock the focus to what you have set manually rather than letting autofocus take over automatically during the video.

Because of the depth of field, manual focus is tricky using just the screen. You need to magnify the image or use focus peaking. Unless you use a tripod, twisting the ring is likely to jiggle the camera too much for video, since the camera has so little mass. Maybe with practice one could master the technique. Normally you would focus using the little wheel on the back, so that would jiggle the camera less. The front ring can control zooming. Smooth zooms during videos take some practice, too.

I've used manual focus just as a set-and-forget video setting when shooting things more than 20 feet away. I focus on something near the middle of the range I want in focus, knowing that everything else will be covered by the DOF. If things are 50 feet away or more, I know the hyperlocal distance will take care of it, so I focus somewhere about there. For closeups, the autofocus is more than adequate. You are never going to get the effect you can get with an 85mm f/1.2 on FF.

I'm trying to imagine what effect I might would want to get by refocusing during shooting video with this camera. No real-life-for-me scenario comes to mind, since if I wanted selective focus in video, I'd use my DSLR, and in traveling with just the little camera, I can't think of anything I'd want to do like that.

But say that I did. If I can't refocus during shooting, I know that the camera can. So, say, I wanted to have the shot begin with the background in focus and then go to focus upon a nearby subject, I'd manually focus on the background and then let autofocus take over and focus on the subject.

For other situations, face detection, servo autofocus, and one-touch autofocus should suffice. It may be a matter of thinking through what you want to do and accomplishing it the way the camera wants to do it rather than trying to make the camera do it your way.

Sorry I can't give you a real answer. I did try looking in the manual. The nature of the camera is such that even if it works, it could be tricky to pull off in a useful fashion. It probably says something that in using the camera for almost three years, it has never occurred to me to try to do something like that. Given the nature of the beasties, I would think this would not change from the II to the III.
Hey,

Thanks for the time to reply. Much appreciated.

I got a bit confused.

Yes, the one-touch AF is what I usually do to refocus, but if I cover the screen with a "loupe" device I'll have to manage with rings and buttons.

Besides the shacking problem, which I understand, you can manually focus with the rear wheel, right?

- I did understand you can zoom in/out with the ring around the lens, but I didn't clearly understand if you can use ttat ring to manual focus?

Also, on the G7X III Canon removed the switch, so the lens ring is always "clicky", right? (Why Canon removes things that are good... seems "expert" to make people upset)

Thanks!
 

stevelee

FT-QL
Jul 6, 2017
1,182
229
Davidson, NC
Yes, the one-touch AF is what I usually do to refocus, but if I cover the screen with a "loupe" device I'll have to manage with rings and buttons.

Besides the shacking problem, which I understand, you can manually focus with the rear wheel, right?

- I did understand you can zoom in/out with the ring around the lens, but I didn't clearly understand if you can use ttat ring to manual focus?

Also, on the G7X III Canon removed the switch, so the lens ring is always "clicky", right? (Why Canon removes things that are good... seems "expert" to make people upset)
The small wheel is the default way to focus manually. You can set the front ring to control most things, including focus. If it is always clicky, I can't see the utility in using it to focus. Clicking makes sense for zooming, since it normally zooms in discrete steps. The zoom lever on top is quick and clumsy, so handy for stills and virtually useless while shooting video. In some modes, the ring defaults to controlling ISO. In M mode, the ring sets the aperture, and the dial sets the shutter speed. The camera allows a lot of customization for buttons and wheels. The camera is capable of doing all sorts of things that I would never use it for, unless I were stranded on a desert island with it and without a computer or another camera. And, of course, I had a way to charge the battery and an unlimited supply of memory cards.
 

PVCC

Arts & Engineering
Jul 5, 2019
65
15
The small wheel is the default way to focus manually. You can set the front ring to control most things, including focus. If it is always clicky, I can't see the utility in using it to focus. Clicking makes sense for zooming, since it normally zooms in discrete steps. The zoom lever on top is quick and clumsy, so handy for stills and virtually useless while shooting video. In some modes, the ring defaults to controlling ISO. In M mode, the ring sets the aperture, and the dial sets the shutter speed. The camera allows a lot of customization for buttons and wheels. The camera is capable of doing all sorts of things that I would never use it for, unless I were stranded on a desert island with it and without a computer or another camera. And, of course, I had a way to charge the battery and an unlimited supply of memory cards.
Haha, thanks a lot. Now I got it.

Makes me more upset that Canon removed the unclick switch for the ring... :$#!&

With the lonely island you made me remember a foldable solar panel I purchased to charge smartphones (very good under summer sunlight indeed, works like a wall outlet), so that would be not a problem since the G7X III can be charged by USB (good one for that)
Problem remains on enough stock of memory cards lol ;)

Thanks a lot once again! :)
 
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Stereodude

EOS 80D
Jul 8, 2019
149
130
This one made me laugh.


It's noticeably worse than every other camera he compared it to, but "it's not that bad"??? Exactly how much worse does it need to be to qualify as "that bad"?
 

stevelee

FT-QL
Jul 6, 2017
1,182
229
Davidson, NC
None of these demos tell me anything useful, other than bringing back nostalgia for SCTV.

My recent ratio suggests that I shoot one video for every 900 stills with the II. I did use autofocus for that 28-second video of a fountain at a modern art museum. I reduced it to 540p for embedding on a web page. http://www.stevelee.name/scandinavia2019/sweden/stockholm2/MVI_6362.mp4

Normally I use manual focus for video, especially with that camera, given its significant depth of field in decent light. The exception would be the kind of quick travel clip like the above linked one. Any camera that can't focus on that, I would consider to be defective.

What I need are tests for autofocus in still shots that demonstrate some deficiency or difficulty that might exceed what I experience with the II.
 

PVCC

Arts & Engineering
Jul 5, 2019
65
15
EDIT: The last minute telling that tapping the screen AF almost instantly, and the conclusion of the above review exactly tells what I wrote before this edit.
Good one for this guy, even comparing so different cameras, but concrete on the point to clear the silly AF buzz.
___

I honestly think most of these "reviews" (I can't consider all of them as that) are not really serious or well made. They're making lot of silly buzz about the AF...

I am very demanding with Canon and very critic on many of their decisions, but I know they're not stupid (at least on basic things like that)

The G7X III will focus without problem for stills and video in one-touch AF mode. Older cameras already do.

On continuous or servo or face detection mode, well, it will depend on subject, light, etc.

It will NOT compare to Sony RX 100 VA and above.

But for this camera I don't expect the AF performance if a DSLR or A7r IV in any way.

For those who really need AF performance, then Sony RX 100 VA and above will probably be a better choice (remember that not all of them have Touchscreen)

For me, Manual focus on video + one-touch AF (tapping the zone on the screen) for Stills and Video is perfectly enough for this pocketable camera.

And the IQ of full res images seems to be quite good, something that I do care a lot.
 
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PVCC

Arts & Engineering
Jul 5, 2019
65
15
What I need are tests for autofocus in still shots that demonstrate some deficiency or difficulty that might exceed what I experience with the II.
What EXACT AF problem (and the corresponding settings and modes) are you experiencing with the G7X II?
I didn't understand
Thanks!