Do you think the 90D is superior to the 7DII?

SteveC

M50 & T6i
Sep 3, 2019
348
197
I don’t think the M series aims to ever be used as a 7D line replacement. Canon doesn't seem to market them as weather sealed at all, meaning they probably aren't. And if they stick with the 63mm lens diameter for all Ef-m lenses, we'll never see a super zoom or anything remotely fast and long in the native mount. We've also not seen a dual card slot M camera yet.

The 7D people seem to be looking for something withstanding harsh environmental conditions that can be used reliably and comfortably with long lenses, mainly for wildlife. The premise of keeping size and weight to an absolute minimum while keeping the price reasonable does not seem compatible with that.
This makes a great deal of sense. The M series lenses have a width restriction (at least, so far). It's a design decision, not a physical constraint (Tamron, at least, makes a fatter 18-200 zoom), Canon would either have to get over this, or convince people to use an adapter. As for the weather sealing, nothing would preclude them from coming out with a weather-sealed model in the future.

And to--for the moment--broaden my scope a bit, the R is almost weather sealed...apparently the viewfinder is the main flaw here.
 

koenkooi

EOS 7D MK II
Feb 25, 2015
483
283
This makes a great deal of sense. The M series lenses have a width restriction (at least, so far). It's a design decision, not a physical constraint (Tamron, at least, makes a fatter 18-200 zoom), Canon would either have to get over this, or convince people to use an adapter. As for the weather sealing, nothing would preclude them from coming out with a weather-sealed model in the future.

And to--for the moment--broaden my scope a bit, the R is almost weather sealed...apparently the viewfinder is the main flaw here.
The M6II announcement combined with the 7D1 on my desk got me dreaming of an Olympus E-M1X like EF-M camera: Smaller than the 1D series, a builtin grip for more batteries and weather sealing. And it will be announced together with an EF-M 300mm f/5.6 DO IS (weather sealed) and a new EF-EF-M adapter with a few more rubber seals. And a unicorn to put your kids on for action pictures.
 
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Don Haines

Beware of cats with laser eyes!
Jun 4, 2012
8,142
1,673
Canada
The M6II announcement combined with the 7D1 on my desk got me dreaming of an Olympus E-M1X like EF-M camera: Smaller than the 1D series, a builtin grip for more batteries and weather sealing. And it will be announced together with an EF-M 300mm f/5.6 DO IS (weather sealed) and a new EF-EF-M adapter with a few more rubber seals. And a unicorn to put your kids on for action pictures.
I want it to also have an AF system that is so good that you can even get an in-focus short of Bigfoot!
 

Otara

EOS RP
Jul 16, 2012
284
65
I got to play with the 90d and M6 II yesterday. The increased M6 II framerate simply because it only has to move the shutter rather than a mirror as well is noticeable at 14fps, and the 30 raw burst is very interesting. Didnt notice any issues with the VF being an addon and the increased gap made it easier to put to the eye. The 90D just felt slow to me, but its probably a subjective feeling, I should have tried the 7D II there to compare (I have it but its been a week since I used it last). If anyone can get to an Canon Experience store, it really is pretty neat to be able to try it all out side by side.

The lack of sealing works both ways in that it becomes less relevant between the 90D and M6II, depending on the priorities of the other features. As Ive said in other threads I dont particularly worry much about sealing differences anyhow, unless its actually rated for depth or the like, I tend to be a bit binary in that area.

I felt kind of cheated in that the potential for a mirrorless APS-C for wildlife is really starting to be apparent, and both bodies were a bit frustrating as a result. A very strong goldilocks experience where bed number 3 doesnt exist yet.
 

SteveC

M50 & T6i
Sep 3, 2019
348
197
I felt kind of cheated in that the potential for a mirrorless APS-C for wildlife is really starting to be apparent, and both bodies were a bit frustrating as a result. A very strong goldilocks experience where bed number 3 doesnt exist yet.
I suspect the answer will be to come out with a full frame RF for wildlife--at 83 MP. It would offer an APS-C crop mode (like they offer different aspect ratios today), and you'd have 32 MP pictures as if they came out of an APS-C.

The other alternative would be a hugely jumped-up M series, but that would be quite a leap--weather sealing, faster lenses, etc.
 

Otara

EOS RP
Jul 16, 2012
284
65
I suspect the answer will be to come out with a full frame RF for wildlife--at 83 MP. It would offer an APS-C crop mode (like they offer different aspect ratios today), and you'd have 32 MP pictures as if they came out of an APS-C.

The other alternative would be a hugely jumped-up M series, but that would be quite a leap--weather sealing, faster lenses, etc.
I was thinking jumped up M, but that would be awesome, although of course another pricepoint. The M vs RF separation is going to be interesting.
 

Rejay14

I'm New Here
Sep 11, 2014
22
0
I had been waiting for the 7d3 to come out for ages and I am very disappointed to hear that it suppose to be shelved, and the 90d to take its place.to Which I don't think is a great improvement for the amount of years I have had my 7d2 to date and feel we are getting behind with our competitors ? Canon has not confirmed that this is true to my knowledge. unsure were to go now with things as weather to change all my gear
What about used 1DX Mark 1's? They should be tumbling in price nicely
 

Sharlin

EOS 6D MK II
Dec 26, 2015
1,057
556
Turku, Finland
I got to play with the 90d and M6 II yesterday. The increased M6 II framerate simply because it only has to move the shutter rather than a mirror as well is noticeable at 14fps, and the 30 raw burst is very interesting. Didnt notice any issues with the VF being an addon and the increased gap made it easier to put to the eye. The 90D just felt slow to me, but its probably a subjective feeling, I should have tried the 7D II there to compare (I have it but its been a week since I used it last). If anyone can get to an Canon Experience store, it really is pretty neat to be able to try it all out side by side.
Should be noted that the 14fps H+ drive is basically "speed priority" mode, it does have continuous AF but prioritizes frame rate over focus accuracy. The 7fps H mode on the other hand is "focus priority".
 
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Grant Atkinson

EOS 80D
Jan 6, 2014
185
23
Just got my 90D a few minutes ago. It feels good in the hand so far. I have a 7D Mark 2, an 80D, and a set of Canon full frame bodies around, so am looking really forward to using the new 90D and also getting an idea of its strengths and weaknesses for my kind of uses :)
 

AlanF

Canon 5DSR II
Aug 16, 2012
5,744
3,071
Just got my 90D a few minutes ago. It feels good in the hand so far. I have a 7D Mark 2, an 80D, and a set of Canon full frame bodies around, so am looking really forward to using the new 90D and also getting an idea of its strengths and weaknesses for my kind of uses :)
Grant, I have been doing a hands-on commentary here https://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?threads/eos-90d-hands-on-review.37589/
The sensor is definitely an improvement over that of my now long sold 7DII and does outperform a crop from my 5DSR. I'd be very interested in how you find the AF performs compared with the 7DII. The centre point is definitely very fast and accurate but I haven't been able to test the zones properly yet because of a lack of compliant wild life.
 
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privatebydesign

Would you take advice from a cartoons stuffed toy?
Jan 29, 2011
7,901
1,033
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Just got my 90D a few minutes ago. It feels good in the hand so far. I have a 7D Mark 2, an 80D, and a set of Canon full frame bodies around, so am looking really forward to using the new 90D and also getting an idea of its strengths and weaknesses for my kind of uses :)
Welcome back Grant! Your input has been missed and I have commented on it, I also link to your AF videos on YouTube whenever relevant, which seems quite a lot!
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
990
484
I want it to also have an AF system that is so good that you can even get an in-focus short of Bigfoot!
You don't really want an in-focus shot of Bigfoot. He has a telekinetic ability to sense when that happens, and then you'll never be seen or heard from again.
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
990
484
Weather sealing "...well-sealed buttons and dials, not much else. That means, I think, that it will be fine in a misty rain for a while, but don’t get it saturated and don’t set it somewhere wet." Roger Cicala, https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2018/10/teardown-of-the-canon-eos-r-mirrorless-camera/
Roger goes into even more detail in this blog entry:

About Getting Your Camera Wet… Teardown of a Salty Sony A7sII

(The below is quoted from the linked blog entry)

Here’s a list of bad things that we’ll discuss.

  1. Camera manufacturers market their equipment as weather resistant. But if you get water inside the camera the warranty is void. So that’s pretty much “we guarantee it will work unless it breaks.”
  2. People think weather resistant means waterproof because they want to believe that.
  3. Service Centers play the impact/moisture damage card so much that everyone assumes they are full of …shirt… when they say so.
  4. There are two kinds of photographers: Those who have ruined a camera from water damage and are careful about water and see #2.
  5. Most service centers won’t work on a water damaged camera, even if you pay them. Some won’t even open it up to look inside if they see evidence on the outside.
 
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Don Haines

Beware of cats with laser eyes!
Jun 4, 2012
8,142
1,673
Canada
“Camera manufacturers market their equipment as weather resistant. But if you get water inside the camera the warranty is void. So that’s pretty much “we guarantee it will work unless it breaks.”
I figure that if it does not have underwater shooting modes, then it is not waterproof :)
 
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stevelee

FT-QL
Jul 6, 2017
1,250
281
Davidson, NC
I’m reminded of watches I have had that were good down to 10 meters, but you shouldn’t wear them scuba diving. I wondered what you’d be doing 10 meters under water otherwise.