IBIS and 100mp coming to an EOS R camera? [CR2]

keithcooper

EOS 7D MK II
I note it was mentioned as 100+MP, not 100MP in what we were told (which was mainly referring to Canon not pursuing medium format any more)

If this camera is real, it likely won't come until after something at, shall we say, 5D mk4/mk5 level gets launched as a 'pro' model. That should address many of the desires for video and a better EOS R

As to complaints about filling cards and image size - suggests that this is not the camera you were looking for ;-)
It reminds me of many of the 5Ds complaints coming from people who probably should have got a 5D4, the 5Ds seemed a niche product from the start.

My pet hope for 100+MP and IBIS combination is a multishot mode using the IBIS to help reduce the bayer filtration loss of data (and moire). Absolutely great for those of us using the 5Ds in relatively static scenarios on a hefty tripod, whilst the IBIS would help for when I'm shooting hand held, which is nowhere nearly as bad with the 5Ds as some would suggest (usually people not trying it BTW)
 

kaptainkatsu

1DX Mark II
Sep 29, 2015
166
62
The pro-R body will not likely be the really high MP body as high MP is somewhat of a niche product. Note that the pro-DSLR (1D line) has a comparatively low MP and the 5D line has a middle of the road MP total. That is the MP range (low to middle) that the majority of pros apparently prefer.
A Sports Pro (1D) body will most likely have 20-24mp. I wouldn't mind a 4mp bump from my 1DX2 but it certainly is not a deal breaker if Canon sticks with 20mp. I actually like the form factor of the 1DX2, not entirely sure how a mirrorless version would benefit me much
 

Mt Spokane Photography

I post too Much on Here!!
Mar 25, 2011
15,529
755
I am a bit puzzled here; I thought at first it was said it was likely 2019 sees a pro-R body; most likely the one with high m'pix?
Rumors are just that. This is a rumor, not some sort of promise. the rumored pro model may or may not happen, it would not be 100 MP though. A 100MP body is a specialist tool, at least for now. Sony has or is coming out with a 60-70 MP sensor, so Canon wants to top that. I expect Canon to put out 2 R bodies a year until there are models from low to high.
 

Don Haines

Beware of cats with laser eyes!
Jun 4, 2012
8,154
1,690
Canada
Rumors are just that. This is a rumor, not some sort of promise. the rumored pro model may or may not happen, it would not be 100 MP though. A 100MP body is a specialist tool, at least for now. Sony has or is coming out with a 60-70 MP sensor, so Canon wants to top that. I expect Canon to put out 2 R bodies a year until there are models from low to high.
My thoughts too!

There will be many more bodies in the pipeline, a low price intro model, a 5D equivalent, a 1D equivalent, and a high megapixel body. It will take a couple of years for them all to show up at your local camera store, but in the meantime rumours will fly and some people will get very upset because whatever comes next is not their perfect camera
 

docsmith

EOS 6D MK II
Sep 17, 2010
867
244
For me, the first thing I will look at if this is ever released will be the file size of mRAW and sRAW. If they are something like 25 MB and 50 MB, I could be tempted by this camera and typically shoot in one of those modes with occasionally breaking out the full RAW resolution of 100 MP.
 

Graphic.Artifacts

EOS 7D MK II
Aug 1, 2017
453
257
Canon seems to be the only team left in the Megapixel wars. If 100MP sensors significantly outperform 45MP sensors why doesn't Sony use them in it's cameras or manufacture and sell them to it's sensor customers. It certainly isn't because they can't. Dividing up the Pizza into smaller and smaller pieces doesn't create more pizza.
 

addola

Sold my soul for a flippy screen
Nov 16, 2015
65
29
I would much rather have better higher ISO performance, and dynamic range. Canon cameras usually have better DR than Nikon at higher ISO. The 5D Mk IV beats Nikon D810 from ISO > 200 and is very close to D850 from ISO800 up (according to DXO data). So it looks like Nikon cameras typically have "optimized" dynamic range at lower ISO64 & ISO100. A high megapixel Canon camera should be optimized for better dynamic range at lower ISO, which is where you would want to shoot that camera for landscape, and studio shots.

I hope Canon's implementation of IBIS is as good as on MFT cameras from Panasonic & Olympus. Personally I am more interested in stills resolution from 24MP to less than or equal 50MP so that the file sizes would be manageable. But IBIS would definitely help with video work.
 

Normalnorm

EOS 7D MK II
Dec 25, 2012
527
134
When people think about 100mpx being too much, they forget about the bayer filter that essentially means the accurate colour resolution of an image is 1/4 of the total resolution, because each of the 100 million pixels on the sensor is only receiving either red, green or blue light so the colour information from four pixels (at least, more in more complex algorithms) is required to generate the colour for a single pixel. Generally this isn't a big problem, but if you have images with large areas of predominantly one shade, such as a green plant or a red dress, the real perceptive resolution of what that sensor will provide will be significantly less than the 100 megapixels.

So, downsampling a 100 megapixel image to a 25 megapixel image would give you a 25 megapixel image with, assuming an ideal lens, the optimum sharpness and colour accuracy.

Is this important for most people? Of course not. But there are certain tasks, such as high resolution reproduction of artworks or natural objects, where capturing the finest detail accurately is important, and for that a 100 megapixel EOS R can't come soon enough!

Of course at 100megapixels diffraction is going to be a real bitch, but that's another thing altogether!
The best camera for high res imaging of art and natural objects is a scanning back. Accurate color, mad resolution, and minimal diffraction issues.
Of course no flash and minimal portability but then for that niche it is less important.
 
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bokehmon22

EOS RP
Oct 31, 2016
356
186
I would much rather have better higher ISO performance, and dynamic range. Canon cameras usually have better DR than Nikon at higher ISO. The 5D Mk IV beats Nikon D810 from ISO > 200 and is very close to D850 from ISO800 up (according to DXO data). So it looks like Nikon cameras typically have "optimized" dynamic range at lower ISO64 & ISO100. A high megapixel Canon camera should be optimized for better dynamic range at lower ISO, which is where you would want to shoot that camera for landscape, and studio shots.

I hope Canon's implementation of IBIS is as good as on MFT cameras from Panasonic & Olympus. Personally I am more interested in stills resolution from 24MP to less than or equal 50MP so that the file sizes would be manageable. But IBIS would definitely help with video work.
Precisely. I have no need for 50+ mpx camera. I print 24 x 36 on 30 mpx Canon 5D IV and it's plenty. I'd rather have Canon concentrate on ISO, dynamic range, eyeAF, dual IS

I hope the EOS R pro delivered. I have already contemplate on Panasonic S1 and possibly Sony next FF mirroless A9II/A7RIV.
 

Normalnorm

EOS 7D MK II
Dec 25, 2012
527
134
100MP is a niche that few will inhabit.
I rarely use my 5DsR because at the sizes I need (even large repro) a well done 30MP R image does the job superbly.
Wrestling the files of the DsR is a pain, 100MP would be enraging.
 

BeenThere

EOS 6D MK II
Sep 4, 2012
852
184
I suspect that Canon will fill its pipeline with more mainstream bodies first, but niche bodies are possible later for the bragging rights. I’m not getting upset by rumors of this body which would likely be at least two or three years away.
 

Normalnorm

EOS 7D MK II
Dec 25, 2012
527
134
I would much rather have better higher ISO performance, and dynamic range. Canon cameras usually have better DR than Nikon at higher ISO. The 5D Mk IV beats Nikon D810 from ISO > 200 and is very close to D850 from ISO800 up (according to DXO data). So it looks like Nikon cameras typically have "optimized" dynamic range at lower ISO64 & ISO100. A high megapixel Canon camera should be optimized for better dynamic range at lower ISO, which is where you would want to shoot that camera for landscape, and studio shots.

I hope Canon's implementation of IBIS is as good as on MFT cameras from Panasonic & Olympus. Personally I am more interested in stills resolution from 24MP to less than or equal 50MP so that the file sizes would be manageable. But IBIS would definitely help with video work.
I think we are very close to minimal additional improvements.The conversations about noise and DR are somewhat overblown as the differences seem to have small impact. It is hard to believe that everyone needs to stretch their files into such unrecognizable shape that magical DR (that actually doesn't exist) will save their lives.
 

Talys

Canon 6DII
Feb 16, 2017
2,058
329
Vancouver, BC
The real use for me with a 100 megapixel camera would be to get more reach out of existing lenses, or to be able to use smaller lenses, for birding and other wildlife photography. So, what it comes down to is, are two things: first, how good are heavily cropped photos? Secondly, when a 100 megapixel image is taken under ideal lighting and reduced down to 5 megapixels or so, how much better or worse is it compared to a 30-ish megapixel camera reduced down to 5-10 megapixels?

In reality, every single time, a 1DX with the ideal focal length lens (ie no cropping required) reduced down to print or screen resolutions produces better results than a camera with a lot more megapixels and a lens with a lot less focal length.

So, will the 100 megapixel camera change this dynamic at all?

If so, a 100 megapixel mirrorless could be a wonderful tool. For example, I can imagine that it could have a crop mode that would turn it into a 25 megapixel camera, using only the center 1/4 of the image circle at very high pixel density, yet filling up the EVF.

Only time will tell if what I'm wishing for is simply a pipe dream, or a possibility. But, these are exciting times!

Regarding IBIS: I still don't really care, but it would be wonderful just to shut up the people who go on and on about how the R doesn't have IBIS. :)
 
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unfocused

EOS 1D MK II
Jul 20, 2010
5,008
1,366
66
Springfield, IL
www.mgordoncommunications.com
...For example, I can imagine that it could have a crop mode that would turn it into a 25 megapixel camera, using only the center 1/4 of the image circle at very high pixel density, yet filling up the EVF...
That's an interesting thought, because one of the biggest problems I find when choosing between a crop sensor and a full frame sensor is getting accurate focus on the larger sensor. The maginification of the crop sensor can make it easier to nail the focus when distance limited (I'm talking about situations where even with a crop sensor you need to crop the image by 50% or more.) I hadn't thought about the advantage of an EVF that would allow you to magnify the image in the viewfinder.
 
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unfocused

EOS 1D MK II
Jul 20, 2010
5,008
1,366
66
Springfield, IL
www.mgordoncommunications.com
One of the interesting things about technological revolutions is that a product can come to market without the manufacturer really knowing whether or not it will be an attractive feature and then consumers invent new/innovative uses for the feature. Cameras in cell phones, for example, were something of an afterthought I believe. But once they were added, people found them so useful and desirable that now they are chief feature of most cellphones. Same with DSLR video. From what I have read, Canon had no idea when they added it to the 5DII that it would revolutionize the video world.

I can see Canon putting a 100 mp camera out in the market without necessarily knowing exactly what the demand is and then watching as buyers invent new uses for the high megapixel images.
 
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keithcooper

EOS 7D MK II
Canon seems to be the only team left in the Megapixel wars. If 100MP sensors significantly outperform 45MP sensors why doesn't Sony use them in it's cameras or manufacture and sell them to it's sensor customers. It certainly isn't because they can't. Dividing up the Pizza into smaller and smaller pieces doesn't create more pizza.
I'll remember that next time I stitch several 5Ds images to get the resolution I need for a shot.
I just try and remember that just because a feature is of no use to me, it may well be to others - I personally put video, wifi and GPS in this category... YMMV :)
 

saveyourmoment

EOS M50
Apr 1, 2013
47
6
actually you need ibis to take quite sharp photos with a 100mp sensor. even fujifilm 100s has that, because you will not be able to take sharp photos handheld with 100mp sensor(or at least you need really steady hands and good breathcontrol).

but 2020? So I will stop renting the gfx 50s and go all in for fujifilm. sorry canon. too late.
 
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Graphic.Artifacts

EOS 7D MK II
Aug 1, 2017
453
257
I'll remember that next time I stitch several 5Ds images to get the resolution I need for a shot.
I just try and remember that just because a feature is of no use to me, it may well be to others - I personally put video, wifi and GPS in this category... YMMV :)
Stitching counts as adding another pizza. :)

Not discounting your need and I'm sure you're more experienced at building high res images than I am. However, I think there's an open question regarding how much addition benefit you get by going to smaller and smaller photocells on 135 format sensors. I'm not convinced that solution won't create more problems than it solves but I freely admit that I don't know where the tipping point is. I'm guessing it's less than 100 MP but I suppose we won't know until somebody puts an ultra high res sensor out there.