Is the EOS 7D Mark II the last in the 7D series? We’re told that it is [CR1]

AlanF

5DSR
Aug 16, 2012
5,039
1,862
I logged in to reply to this.

I agree. The R does nail focus and can tear through a lot of shots without buffering. I couldn't nail focus no matter the settings in the 7d mk ii. Looked sharp when the mirror flapped on a 70-200 f4 but was out of focus constantly. Sigma 50 f1.4 art - no sharp focus ever. The 200d/100d could nail focus more consistently... All be it slow
I am anal compulsive when it comes to AF, and constantly comparing shots to find which ones give the best resolution of detail of bird plumage. I find the 5DIV and 5DSR to be very consistent. My previous 7DII, although not quite as good as the more modern bodies, was still pretty good. (I also do use mirrorless and don 't find them substantially better with my lenses.) Did you AFMA your 70-200 f/4? A constant out of focus seems likely to be an AFMA problem. But, you could have had a rogue 7DII.
 
Dec 23, 2014
4
1
See the 70-200 is tack sharp.. sometimes. No amount of afma would sort the 50mm (the canon 1.4 is horrible but the 1.8 stepper and STM variationsare good). Perfect on 200d and 5d (the original) no adjustments. The consistency was not there. But again I did get sharp photos just not all the time
 

AlanF

5DSR
Aug 16, 2012
5,039
1,862
See the 70-200 is tack sharp.. sometimes. No amount of afma would sort the 50mm (the canon 1.4 is horrible but the 1.8 stepper and STM variationsare good). Perfect on 200d and 5d (the original) no adjustments. The consistency was not there. But again I did get sharp photos just not all the time
I am confused as your phrasing "Looked sharp when the mirror flapped on a 70-200 f4 but was out of focus constantly." meant to me that the image looked sharp through the viewfinder but was out of focus when you processed it. Also you are not clear which lens you are referring to. Is it the 70-200mm on the 200D and 5D or the 50mm that is perfect?
 
Dec 23, 2014
4
1
I am confused as your phrasing "Looked sharp when the mirror flapped on a 70-200 f4 but was out of focus constantly." meant to me that the image looked sharp through the viewfinder but was out of focus when you processed it. Also you are not clear which lens you are referring to. Is it the 70-200mm on the 200D and 5D or the 50mm that is perfect?
If the subject is standing still (not moving back or forward) the 7d mk ii is fine on the 70-200 f4.

Standing still on the sigma 50 f1.4 on 7d mk ii never sharp.

200d / 100d never had focus issues.
 

AlanF

5DSR
Aug 16, 2012
5,039
1,862
If the subject is standing still (not moving back or forward) the 7d mk ii is fine on the 70-200 f4.

Standing still on the sigma 50 f1.4 on 7d mk ii never sharp.

200d / 100d never had focus issues.
Thanks for the clarification. Do you use AI Servo?
 

Andreasb

I'm New Here
Mar 24, 2017
11
8
Maybe I can explain this to you:

After I have paid over $20 k for a 600mm IS II, 400mm DO II and a 100-400, I cant afford to buy 2 x 1DX MKII. I need to have two bodies, because one of them is a backup if one failed. So there went another $4k on bodies plus of course grips and batteries so say 5k in all.

Maybe in the best of scenarios I would have wanted one of them to be a 1DX MKII but, I definitely wanted one of them to be a crop body. When you are shooting 1000-3000+ images a day and you crop most of them anyway a FF is quite pointless, you can seemingly never have to much reach.


its bit odd peoples who can afford 500 or 600mm big white wants consumer price body :p
 

haggie

EOS 80D
May 11, 2016
136
37
its bit odd peoples who can afford 500 or 600mm big white wants consumer price body :p
That is a bit of a silly (perhaps ignorant) remark.
Together with a friend we too are at the verge of buying the EF 500 II together. We both use 7D Mk II's - once the best cropped camera for action photography (and that is something else than your words of 'consumer price body' implies).
He is mainly a birder, hiking for days with long lens and doing that many days a year: that is 'required' to shoot birds at the oppourtunities that THEY give.
I mainly shoot aircraft at airshows and around military airfields. This is a limited number of days a year but each of these offer many photo opportunities, so these few days a year are quite enough for me. This all means that we can share the same lens easily without being a nuisance to the other.

When you think of it, the fact that the 7D Mk II is an action camera means that you will see relatively many long lenses among its owners. Far more than among owners of the 80D, which are more 'generalist' users - i.e. without the need for such specialist (and therefore expensive) lenses.

That being said, it still is remarkable that Canon wants to end the 7D-series. It destroys a name that has earned its reputation among acion photographers.
Canon has invested heavily to know its clients and their behaviour. This CR1 rumor could well fit in the Canon's efforts to bring the news about the end of the 7D-series gradually. The first hint was the rumor of over a year ago that the development of a(n unnamed higher-end) DSLR was scrapped. The second hint came with the rumor that the successor to the 80D and the 7D MK II might be combined. And now the rumor gets even more specific: outed by itself, specifically expressing the result of earlier decisions. The fact that it is ranked CR1 then would not mean much.

The actual reason may be as already suggested in the rumor. Canon wants the higher profit-per-unit Full Frame Cameras pushed and sees an opportunitiy to convince at least part of its 7D-user base to convert from Canon APS-C to Canon FF (mirrorless or DSLR). The 7D is a big and advanced camera with relatively low number of units sold per year. A "big and advanced" Full Frame camera will also sell relatively low numbers a year, but with higher yield. If so, they will have good reason to do so.
They might simply need all design/engineering and production resources for their new way ahead: with the R-series in the center.
 
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Don Haines

Beware of cats with laser eyes!
Jun 4, 2012
7,914
1,271
Canada
Ah ok seeing problem now ,its all about frame rate and 1dx serie is too expensive.
Canon must think they can offer something better than 7 serie on mirrorless i hope.
doesnt full frames focus better when more focus points ? at least fast moving target is easier keep on viewfinder.
Actually, the 7D2 has a better spread of AF points than the 1DX2!
 
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Don Haines

Beware of cats with laser eyes!
Jun 4, 2012
7,914
1,271
Canada
With the 7D2, the 80D, and the 77D, there is also the possibility that the 77D will stay and that the replacement for the 7D2 and 80D will be what the 7D3 would have been....
 

BillB

EOS 6D MK II
May 11, 2017
960
192
That is a bit of a silly (perhaps ignorant) remark.
Together with a friend we too are at the verge of buying the EF 500 II together. We both use 7D Mk II's - once the best cropped camera for action photography (and that is something else than your words of 'consumer price body' implies).
He is mainly a birder, hiking for days with long lens and doing that many days a year: that is 'required' to shoot birds at the oppourtunities that THEY give.
I mainly shoot aircraft at airshows and around military airfields. This is a limited number of days a year but each of these offer many photo opportunities, so these few days a year are quite enough for me. This all means that we can share the same lens easily without being a nuisance to the other.

When you think of it, the fact that the 7D Mk II is an action camera means that you will see relatively many long lenses among its owners. Far more than among owners of the 80D, which are more 'generalist' users - i.e. without the need for such specialist (and therefore expensive) lenses.

That being said, it still is remarkable that Canon wants to end the 7D-series. It destroys a name that has earned its reputation among acion photographers.
Canon has invested heavily to know its clients and their behaviour. This CR1 rumor could well fit in the Canon's efforts to bring the news about the end of the 7D-series gradually. The first hint was the rumor of over a year ago that the development of a(n unnamed higher-end) DSLR was scrapped. The second hint came with the rumor that the successor to the 80D and the 7D MK II might be combined. And now the rumor gets even more specific: outed by itself, specifically expressing the result of earlier decisions. The fact that it is ranked CR1 then would not mean much.

The actual reason may be as already suggested in the rumor. Canon wants the higher profit-per-unit Full Frame Cameras pushed and sees an opportunitiy to convince at least part of its 7D-user base to convert from Canon APS-C to Canon FF (mirrorless or DSLR). The 7D is a big and advanced camera with relatively low number of units sold per year. A "big and advanced" Full Frame camera will also sell relatively low numbers a year, but with higher yield. If so, they will have good reason to do so.
They might simply need all design/engineering and production resources for their new way ahead: with the R-series in the center.
The 7DII replacement might be an aps-c mirrorless with a new sensor (32.5mp?), beefed up weather resistance, and the first iteration of the systems that will be used in the 5D and 1D level mirrorless cameras.
 

digigal

Traveling the world one step at a time.
Aug 26, 2014
128
101
Ah ok seeing problem now ,its all about frame rate and 1dx serie is too expensive.
Canon must think they can offer something better than 7 serie on mirrorless i hope.
doesnt full frames focus better when more focus points ? at least fast moving target is easier keep on viewfinder.
Nope--wrong again. I'm just a an ancient tiny LOL and although I can go around the world photographing I'm limited by what I can lift and hold to shoot and what I can carry up a mountain in the snow or over the rocks etc. I'll pay almost any amount of money for lighter, better, greater reach and performance than 7DMII + 100-400 II which is the best compromise I've found so far. I was out practicing shooting birds with the R + 100-400 yesterday so I'm always hoping there'll be something lighter coming (and, no, I don't think the R is a substitute for the 7DMII !)
 

canonnews

EOS RP
Dec 27, 2017
228
111
Canada
www.canonnews.com
That is a bit of a silly (perhaps ignorant) remark.
Together with a friend we too are at the verge of buying the EF 500 II together. We both use 7D Mk II's - once the best cropped camera for action photography (and that is something else than your words of 'consumer price body' implies).
He is mainly a birder, hiking for days with long lens and doing that many days a year: that is 'required' to shoot birds at the oppourtunities that THEY give.
I mainly shoot aircraft at airshows and around military airfields. This is a limited number of days a year but each of these offer many photo opportunities, so these few days a year are quite enough for me. This all means that we can share the same lens easily without being a nuisance to the other.

When you think of it, the fact that the 7D Mk II is an action camera means that you will see relatively many long lenses among its owners. Far more than among owners of the 80D, which are more 'generalist' users - i.e. without the need for such specialist (and therefore expensive) lenses.

That being said, it still is remarkable that Canon wants to end the 7D-series. It destroys a name that has earned its reputation among acion photographers.
Canon has invested heavily to know its clients and their behaviour. This CR1 rumor could well fit in the Canon's efforts to bring the news about the end of the 7D-series gradually. The first hint was the rumor of over a year ago that the development of a(n unnamed higher-end) DSLR was scrapped. The second hint came with the rumor that the successor to the 80D and the 7D MK II might be combined. And now the rumor gets even more specific: outed by itself, specifically expressing the result of earlier decisions. The fact that it is ranked CR1 then would not mean much.

The actual reason may be as already suggested in the rumor. Canon wants the higher profit-per-unit Full Frame Cameras pushed and sees an opportunitiy to convince at least part of its 7D-user base to convert from Canon APS-C to Canon FF (mirrorless or DSLR). The 7D is a big and advanced camera with relatively low number of units sold per year. A "big and advanced" Full Frame camera will also sell relatively low numbers a year, but with higher yield. If so, they will have good reason to do so.
They might simply need all design/engineering and production resources for their new way ahead: with the R-series in the center.
I wouldn't draw conclusions quite yet.

While Canon always wants more profit % per unit, they also make cameras to fit into just about every single market position slot possible, not all of them are as highly profitable as full frame.

A 7D Mark III does command a lot of engineering talent, but that engineering talent is still working on 1 series cameras as well. Nothing is done in a vacuum.

For alot of reasons merging the xxD and 7D series cameras back together again, is hard work, and will leave some group of customers unhappy, there is no easy answer to this.

As I suggested in our article, I'm not sure I see Canon doing this without first trying the 77D and T7i approach which is to create the same camera guts in the 90D and 7D Mark III and vary the cameras by ergonomics and viewfinder experience. So basically the 90D becomes a lighter, cheaper version of the 7D Mark III and essentially they both coexist together.

That to me seems to be the more logical solution.
 

anden

I'm New Here
Aug 31, 2012
24
0
I am into amateur sports and would not accept less than 10 fps. Using mostly Sigma 50-100 and 50-150, and the 10-22 and 17-55. 1D plus a few matching lenses is way too expensive for my purposes.

I am hoping that whatever supersedes the 7DII, won't mean that I have to buy a completely new camera system to use it. Well, unless there are some new and fantastic benefits with it.
 

degos

EOS 80D
Mar 20, 2015
177
103
E.g. there's talk of a 70 MP FF sensor: if they make it so it could also be used in crop mode (only using the pixels on the inside, letting the other sit by idle: you would instantly regain the added reach of an crop sensor without losing the ability to also go wide on the same body and lens)
No, that wouldn't give any more 'reach' than just taking the photo in FF mode and cropping to the centre section out in Photoshop etc.

Reach on APS-C was a function of pixel density, not sensor size. The manufacturers were willing to push the density higher with the small sensors since there was less proportional wastage on a single wafer if one array was defective than with FF ( what was the number, six FF arrays on one wafer versus 14 crop? )

You can't change pixel density on the fly.
 

takesome1

EOS 5Ds R II
Aug 23, 2013
1,476
103
No, that wouldn't give any more 'reach' than just taking the photo in FF mode and cropping to the centre section out in Photoshop etc.

Reach on APS-C was a function of pixel density, not sensor size. The manufacturers were willing to push the density higher with the small sensors since there was less proportional wastage on a single wafer if one array was defective than with FF ( what was the number, six FF arrays on one wafer versus 14 crop? )

You can't change pixel density on the fly.
The crop factor and reach, the most miss represented thing about camera bodies in the last decade. Sold as trick photography using the narrower FOV on the smaller sensor. Magically it could turn your 100mm lens to a 140mm.

The lengthy heated debates over the higher pixel density of the crop cameras have all but disappeared.

You are incorrect on one thing you said. You can change pixel density on the fly. Just carry a second body.
 

s66

-
Jan 9, 2018
20
9
No, that wouldn't give any more 'reach' than just taking the photo in FF mode and cropping to the centre section out in Photoshop etc.

Reach on APS-C was a function of pixel density, not sensor size. The manufacturers were willing to push the density higher with the small sensors since there was less proportional wastage on a single wafer if one array was defective than with FF ( what was the number, six FF arrays on one wafer versus 14 crop? )

You can't change pixel density on the fly.
It's the same pixel density.
70/1.6^2~=27,34... I rounded it to 28 for convenience, but probably should have rounded to 27 instead.

If you try do do 70MP at the same framerate than 28MP you end up with almost 3 times the datarate. There's no mobile storage system for that, 3 (or more) times the CPU power (and battery and cooling) ... you now have a number of significant engineering problems that are beyond what's already solved in the camera/sensor world. And any buffer would need to be much bigger etc. Not something those looking for a high framerate body would accept.

Doing it all in post is an option if you have the shot! And in some circumstances getting that shot means a high framerate.
So, cropping on the sensor is needed if you want high high pixel density and high framerates at the same time.

The 7D has it's fans, giving them something where they'd need to carry even more glass, getting less usable pixels or a lower framerate will not make them happy at all.
 
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Pape

EOS RP
Dec 31, 2018
252
106
i hope you can use full frame on viewfinder with future crop mode ,crop could be drawed to view with red line.
 
Dec 6, 2016
260
167
The other problem with having a fast action, tough as nails FF camera that can have a crop applied in camera to enable high frame reate shooting is that it will be a tough as nails FF camera and will therefore cost what any other tough as nails FF would cost. Ie. A crap load more than a 7 series. Some of us cannot afford to drop 10k on a camera body but we could see our way clear to spend 3-3.5k. I absolutely think that a mirrorless 1 series should have the ability to generate a crop in camera but it will never be a substitute for a 7d
 
Last edited:
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canonmike

EOS T7i
Jan 5, 2013
93
39
There seems to be a segment in the Canon community that will be much disappointed with no 7D III offering. Personally, I'll be surprised to see any new 7D offerings. I make this observation, given the current push by Canon and other mfgs., to give us more mirrorless offerings, whether it be crop or full frame bodies. It's obvious that Canon has invested a lot of R&D in the new RF lenses and the only way to recoup this tremendous investment is to give us bodies these lenses will work on. I own a gen one 7D body and, even with L glass, have found the photos from same, somewhat soft and lacking, even when using a tripod. Photos from my M50 using an inexpensive EF-M 22mm lens, or even the 15-45mm kit lens are sharper than photos taken with my 7D, using any lens + the compact size of the M series cameras makes them much easier to carry. Instead of upgrading my 7D to a 7DII, I opted for a new 6DII during last fall's Black Fri sales, for a very reasonable cost of only $1100.00, including a free grip. To date, my only real disappointment with my 6DII is the slow frame rate, making it somewhat lacking when doing action or wildlife photography. But, at least the photos are sharp. As to the future, I am waiting for the Pro R body with a faster frame rate, so I can then take full advantage of the great RF lens offerings., lenses that even the likes of Nikon fanboys like Jared Polin, sing their praises. We're waiting, patiently. Bring on that body, Canon.