Odd storage on 7D2

Jaysheldon

EOS T7i
Dec 23, 2015
71
4
Hi
After looking at the images I shot today at an airshow I found the camera had created two folders of images: One called 100EOS7D (with 10GB of images, and the other 101 EOS 7D (with 12 GB). Card is a SanDisk 32GB Ultra Plus.
....ah, I see. Counter on the first bunch went up to OF9A99999, then the second starts at OF9A0001.
(Doesn;t matter, It was a miserable day -- almost everything OOF. I can't shoot handheld with the EF400 f5.6 -- certainly not shots of prop planes with a SS speed of 1/25- sec. Thought putting on the stabilizer of my eF70-200 f4 IS would help. Nope. Must be the AF. Couldn't be my poor technique.....)

Jay in Toronto
 

Valvebounce

EOS 5D SR
Apr 3, 2013
4,252
189
52
Isle of Wight
Hi Jay.
Shame about the crappy focus system on the Canon, how were the shots from the Sony cameras? :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
Do you really need to go to 1/25th, I managed full prop discs above that, 1/60th from memory :unsure::unsure: not that my memory is that good.
I had that same OMG moment the first time a camera image count rolled over and created a new folder despite having rtfm I’d forgotten it was supposed to happen!

Cheers, Graham.
 
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Kit.

EOS 6D MK II
Apr 25, 2011
1,360
747
You can create your own folders from camera menu. You also have an option to erase "all pictures in folder".
 

AaronT

EOS 80D
Jan 5, 2013
161
235
I doubt you could get many sharp shots with a 400 mm, handheld, of a stationary prop plane at 1/25 SS without IS. Your arms are not a tripod. Even with a gimbal head on a tripod it would be difficult at 1/25 on a moving plane.
 

LDS

EOR R
Sep 14, 2012
1,578
152
certainly not shots of prop planes with a SS speed of 1/25- sec. Thought putting on the stabilizer of my eF70-200 f4 IS would help.
Why a so low shutter speed? It won't help with higher FPS too. Don't be too afraid of higher ISO, especially in well lit situations.

IS won't help with moving subjects as well (even for static ones with a 4 stop IS you would be very close to the limit for a 200mm lens, and below for a 400 on a full frame, even more so with an APS-C) , unless you pan properly - if the subjects move across the frame quickly enough, it will be blurred, even if IS keeps the system "steady". Bigger heavier lenses are more difficult to handle, especially if you're not well trained, and after a while fatigue kicks in anyway.

Motion blurring is anyway different from an OOF image, it has distinctive patterns, especially if it happens in one direction only.

I was able to take images of flying flamingos handheld with a 400/5.6 (on a FF, though), but shutter speed was at 1/1250 or faster, and the flamingos are usually slower than a plane.
 

Jaysheldon

EOS T7i
Dec 23, 2015
71
4
Forgive the type. I was shooting at 1/250 of a sec. But even stuff I was shooting at 1/3200 sec. with my 70-200 f4 IS were out of focus. This was my first air show with the 7D2.
Motion blur is probably more accurate description than OOF
 
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Valvebounce

EOS 5D SR
Apr 3, 2013
4,252
189
52
Isle of Wight
Hi Jay.
So were these planes in flight?
Have you done AFMA on your lens, I can only imagine that the AFMA must need doing or is off for the distance you are shooting at for shots at 1/3200s to be oof, 1/3200 should be fast enough to freeze virtually all movement and camera shake.
AFMA can seem like unnecessary time spent, but it is well worth it in the end. I feel it is best done with some kind of proprietary software and target, different people prefer different brands, covered in depth else where on the forum.

Cheers, Graham.
 

Jaysheldon

EOS T7i
Dec 23, 2015
71
4
Hi Graham
Yes, these were in flight. Really disappointed I fouled up because there was a Canadian-based Lancaster, and this particular show is the only one it flies for. (It's based in nearby Hamilton, but this the only show it participates in. There was also a Mtichell B-25.)
I haven't AFMA'd my lenses.
On this particular shoot there were a number of issues of my making. The first shots of the prop planes were at 1/200, later I upped to 1/250; I didn't use my monopod, which might have helped on the low overpasses, even the ones with jets that I shot at 1,3200). This was my first airshow with the 7D2, and I altered between 8 and 15 expansion points (I found that 15 points flickered around, which bothered me -- perhaps no focus lock?. At any rate I mostly used 8 points. Didn't seem to make a difference) Some shots were on High Speed Drive 10 fps (perhaps firing too fast? Mirror flap?). I used a slower fps later (made no difference).
In case you're wondering, AI Servo,. Case 1.
....Just looked up some advice on another site and there are suggestions that if there's only one plane in the viewfinder use all 65 AF points.

As for the 70-200, I either should have turned IS off, or used Mode 2 for panning, I think.
Bottom line is my panning isn't smooth enough, and I do need some support.

Attached is a screen shot of a jet, 1,4000 sec, f7.1, ISO 400. This is the fourth of a set, focus point on all four is the cockpit. You'd think the fourth one would be sharp.
 

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LDS

EOR R
Sep 14, 2012
1,578
152
From a screenshot is hard to tell what kind of blurring happens. With a 400mm on an APS-C 1/250 is too low for hand shooting. The monopod would have helped. IS off is usually OK only when you're on a tripod and the camera is steady. Mode 2 is OK if you're really panning.

With AI Servo you can enable automatic tracking so the camera switches AF points as the subject move inside the frame, using all the 65 points. Otherwise you need to keep the manually selected AF points on the subject.

Using 1/4000 at f/7.1 the image shouldn't suffer much motion blur unless the lens was shaken enough. You could try to shoot the same subject, even a steady one, at different distances, using a tripod and handheld (with the 400), and look at the differences, so you can tell if your camera/lens combo needs AFMA or not.
 

Valvebounce

EOS 5D SR
Apr 3, 2013
4,252
189
52
Isle of Wight
Hi Jay.
With all due respect to LDS, 1/250th is not too slow for hand holding, or maybe it is not slow enough? If you are not panning at 1/250th it will be a problem, I think panning hand held might offer more stability than static hand holding?
One of the shots below was at 1/60th hand held, yes the lens has IS, but I think it would be pushing the 4 stops it supposedly gives (not mathematically I know, but in practical terms.) and I am by no means great at panning compared to some here!
AFMA has been done, both with and without the extender!
My understanding is that the bare lenses compare optically quite well at 400mm?

7DII
EF100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS II USM +1.4x III @ 476.0 mm
1/1000 ƒ/8.0 ISO 200
SE0A4448_DxO by Graham Stretch, on Flickr

7DII
EF100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS II USM +1.4x III @ 560.0 mm
1/60 ƒ/22.0 ISO 100
SE0A4578_DxO by Graham Stretch, on Flickr

I think I get somewhere between 5 and 10% keepers from slow shutter speed panning shots. When I first started panning I was probably getting <0.5% which is far from rewarding, don’t give up. Panning also needs regular practice, I go to the local beach and just practice following the gulls taking the occasional shot to check accuracy.
I think I was using single point for multiple planes and either Zone AF, (15 points) Large Zone AF (Left, Centre or Right Zone) or Full (all 65 points) for single planes.
The flicking around is the points following the object or perhaps picking different areas of high contrast as the lighting changes.
Always in AI Servo, custom mode, not sure it helps!
I use Back Button Focus, (it is easier on the muscles to keep the button mashed in than to hover on a half press of the shutter button) AF On is set for normal shooting in whatever mode, the * button set for registered settings, it generally has 1/1000s set in Tv mode, (it also has spot metering set) this enables a quick change for jets or that first sharp shot of prop planes (or racing cars) to make darn sure there is a keeper! :)

I’m no expert, and while all this advice might only be worth what you paid for it I hope something helps! :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:

Cheers, Graham.
 

Jaysheldon

EOS T7i
Dec 23, 2015
71
4
Hi Graham
Thanks for your advice. There;s an airshow in London, Ont. where a B-17 is flying in two weeks, so I've got 13 days to polish my technique. I have no trouble panning and shooting Boeing 7X7s/Airbuses taking off and landing (usually with the aid of a monopod), but obviously they're going at slower speeds. Still mad I had zero keepers of the Lancaster and B-25......
Shot below was with the 7D2, EF400 f5.6, 1/600 sec f6.3 ISO 320, with monopod.(not at the cursed airshow). Admittedly, its easier to shoot something coming towards/going away from you.
Jay
 

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LDS

EOR R
Sep 14, 2012
1,578
152
With all due respect to LDS, 1/250th is not too slow for hand holding, or maybe it is not slow enough?
That depends if you're really panning or not. Panning requires a smooth, continuous movement in one direction. In this case slower shutter speeds will deliver the required effect. The position of the arms is not irrelevant, it could be easier to pan when the subject is at eye level or below, than when it's high, and the elbows are not close to the body.

If you're just 'chasing' the subject, especially when the subject movement is not regular enough, the shutter speed needs to be faster.
 
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Graphic.Artifacts

EOS 7D MK II
Aug 1, 2017
453
257
In my experience it's more difficult to get a sharp photo with a non-is lens when you are trying to hold it "still' than it is when doing a slow controlled pan. Maybe the momentum of the pan? I'm not sure why but I've seen it in my own work quite a bit. I can't take a sharp "still" picture with a 7D2/4005.6 combo at a speed much below 1000th/sec
 
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Valvebounce

EOS 5D SR
Apr 3, 2013
4,252
189
52
Isle of Wight
Hi LDS.
I couldn’t agree more, tracking birds in flight, especially the small erratic type definitely requires much higher shutter speeds, however we were looking at planes in flight, very predictable path.

Hi Graphic.Artefacts.
I have been lucky enough that my only non IS lenses are a nifty fifty and ef-s 10-22mm so it is interesting to get the perspective of another user of the lens in question, interesting that you reinforce my comment that panning hand held might offer more stability than static hand holding.

Hi jprusa.
Very interesting to have a direct comparison of the lenses thrown in to the equation, it seems from what you and Graphics.Artefacts have said it appears that what LDS said about 1/250th shutter speed being too slow in respect to the 400 f5.6 was correct.

Cheers, Graham.

That depends if you're really panning or not. Panning requires a smooth, continuous movement in one direction. In this case slower shutter speeds will deliver the required effect. The position of the arms is not irrelevant, it could be easier to pan when the subject is at eye level or below, than when it's high, and the elbows are not close to the body.

If you're just 'chasing' the subject, especially when the subject movement is not regular enough, the shutter speed needs to be faster.
In my experience it's more difficult to get a sharp photo with a non-is lens when you are trying to hold it "still' than it is when doing a slow controlled pan. Maybe the momentum of the pan? I'm not sure why but I've seen it in my own work quite a bit. I can't take a sharp "still" picture with a 7D2/4005.6 combo at a speed much below 1000th/sec
I have 400 5.6 and 100 - 400 , the IS gives you way more flexibility than the prime.
 
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Graphic.Artifacts

EOS 7D MK II
Aug 1, 2017
453
257
Hi Graphic.Artefacts.
I have been lucky enough that my only non IS lenses are a nifty fifty and ef-s 10-22mm so it is interesting to get the perspective of another user of the lens in question, interesting that you reinforce my comment that panning hand held might offer more stability than static hand holding.

Cheers, Graham.
Hey Graham,
I think it does but I can't say I've ever really tried to prove it. I know the camera feels more stable when panning. I guess it's possible that the panning just blurs out some of the shake. The 7D2/4005.6 combo can deliver great results but only if you get everything exactly right. Who does that all the time? Certainly not me. :confused: My general minimum shutter speed rule for the 7D2 was 1/2x effective focal length and then go up from there depending on how fast the subject is moving. I like the 400 5.6 though. Mine is a bit sharper than the zoom and I think it has a nicer bokeh wide open. An IS version would have been nice though. Maybe that would have helped support the 7D2.
 
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LDS

EOR R
Sep 14, 2012
1,578
152
however we were looking at planes in flight, very predictable path.
As long as they're not performing aerobatics maneuvers (and you don't know very well the program). Anyway, there's also another factor to take into account. With propeller planes you may not want too fast speeds as they can make the propeller look bad. With jet planes, that's not usually an issue.