The Canon EOS M50 leads mirrorless camera sales in Japan for March 2019

QuisUtDeus

EOS 80D
Feb 20, 2019
115
80
I'm not complaining about anything. I'm pointing out that there are a lot of assumptions in that statement. Without them, there is not much of a statement at all. We don't know the margin of profit on any of these cameras. They could be selling them at a loss to make it up on lenses. There could be a huge profit on one of them and a very small one on the others. There could be any number of factors involved. If you have actual data for that, great.
There's less assumption in that than in the raw addition of the price of the cameras with no weighting for sales volume, but you aren't arguing with that post. I wonder why.
 

Uneternal

EOS T7i
Jan 25, 2016
57
32
Sales aren't made by the best cameras but actually the best you can get for cheap.
I've got my M50 yesterday and must say I'm not really impressed. Its plastic fantastic, even my G7X feels a lot more expensive and precious holding it.
It does take good pictures tho.
 

Kharan

EOS M50
Nov 9, 2018
36
24
I Got bored so i decided to go back and do some REAL MATH on this.

let's assume every % point is 1 unit for the sake of this illustration. Going by amazon japan current yen prices and we will assume that both units get 10% margins (which was your supposition)

M50 - 64,050 Yen x 18.2 units = 1,165,710 and profit: 116,571
A7 III - 221,000 Yen x 3.5 units = 773,500 and profit 77,350

So going by some basic math seems like Canon's making more profit on the M50's than Sony is on the A7 III's at least in Japan.

Both the M50 and the A7 III's are sold with different kit options,etc as well, for the sake of this I just cancelled all that out as equal.
Absolutely. It'd be frankly appalling if Canon weren't making more money off a camera that costs almost a fourth of a competitor's high-end offering. But this will change, sooner rather than later, and Sony (and Nikon, and Fujifilm, and now Olympus and Panasonic and Pentax) are banking on keeping their slice of the sweet high-end camera pie.

Basically, what Canon are doing is good business today, and maybe tomorrow, but not necessarily next week (figuratively).
 

jeffa4444

EOS 6D MK II
Feb 28, 2013
1,426
84
65
Absolutely. It'd be frankly appalling if Canon weren't making more money off a camera that costs almost a fourth of a competitor's high-end offering. But this will change, sooner rather than later, and Sony (and Nikon, and Fujifilm, and now Olympus and Panasonic and Pentax) are banking on keeping their slice of the sweet high-end camera pie.

Basically, what Canon are doing is good business today, and maybe tomorrow, but not necessarily next week (figuratively).
Canon are the Houdini of camera world. They may not be the first to market with some technologies but they know how to catch-up fast. The EOS R has its faults but for its first full-frame mirrorless camera is pretty good, the RF 24-105mm F4L IS USM lens is way better than its EF cousins so we know Canon has the technology to make great lenses. Don't write them off too quickly.
 

neuroanatomist

I post too Much on Here!!
Jul 21, 2010
24,542
1,974
Basically, what Canon are doing is good business today, and maybe tomorrow, but not necessarily next week (figuratively).
Yes, no doubt it’s that sane short-sightedness that has led Canon to dominate the ILC market for 16 years and counting.
 

Kharan

EOS M50
Nov 9, 2018
36
24
Isn't that what every mature business should be doing?
Nope, that’s how Kodak went under. They need to be at the top of new developments, and aggressively push to open new markets. But Canon got late to medical imaging, third-party sensor sales, mirrorless cameras... They seem to entering new fields at a glacial pace these last few years.
 

Kharan

EOS M50
Nov 9, 2018
36
24
Yes, no doubt it’s that sane short-sightedness that has led Canon to dominate the ILC market for 16 years and counting.
Sure, because the transition to EF from FD was “shortsighted”. The creation of their own sensor fabs was “shortsighted”. The strong focus on unified controls and design language was “shortsighted”. Their huge investment into optronics and robot-assisted manufacture was “shortsighted”. Their relentless push to move features downstream into cheaper cameras was “shortsighted”.

No, what really IS shortsighted is the crap they’re putting out today. The glorious Canon from ten years ago is no more - it has been replaced by a committee-driven Titanic that will sink at this rate.
 

neuroanatomist

I post too Much on Here!!
Jul 21, 2010
24,542
1,974
No, what really IS shortsighted is the crap they’re putting out today. The glorious Canon from ten years ago is no more - it has been replaced by a committee-driven Titanic that will sink at this rate.
You mean the last ten years where they maintained close to 50% of the ILC market share? Come back and say you told us so after they hit the iceberg. Until then, your claims are empty.
 
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Kit.

EOS 6D MK II
Apr 25, 2011
1,138
552
Nope, that’s how Kodak went under. They need to be at the top of new developments, and aggressively push to open new markets.
Nope, that's how Kodak went under. They were at the top of new developments and aggressively pushed to open the digital camera market when it wasn't yet ready, and got burned.

Canon wasn't in hurry, and went there right in time to become the leader.

Sure, because the transition to EF from FD was “shortsighted”.
It wasn't shortsighted, but it was not in hurry either. Minolta (now Sony) pushed its A-mount to the market a couple of years earlier.
 

xeppelin

I'm New Here
Apr 22, 2019
20
9
Seven years ago the EOS M launched, was blasted by critics and forum members as ‘unable to compete’.
true. And correctly so. Not only blasted by forum members and critics, but "by the market" and potnetial buyers. That's why Canon had to firesell it. Had they launched the darn thing at 499 MSRP, they would probably have sold a load of them and never had to go down to 299. But, SMART Canon and their INFALLIBLE market research. :)

Today, the line is a smashing success.
Yes. But only since they launched almost competitive M5/M6 and even more so, the "more than fully competitive" M50. Had Canon been SMART enough to spare us and themselves a marginally iterated EOS M2 and a disappointing M3 and launched the M5/M6 pair plus M50 and M100 about 2 years earlier, they'd have made a LOT MORE MONEY. And had they spared us some of the wekaer EF-S lenses and instead launched EF-M 32/1.4, 50/1.8 IS and 85/2.4 IS earlier or at all, they'd have made EVEN MORE MONEY.

But, SMART Canon.

Last year, the EOS R launched, was blasted by critics and forum members as ‘unable to compete’.
It was and still is not fully competitive. Price too high and/or sensor+performance too weak. Had Canon launched a stronger R last year [=fully 5D V equivalent, slightly better than Z7 and A7 III] at a sensible price, it would have been A SMASHING SUCCESS already last year.

But, SMART Canon.

Had Canon on June 29, 2017 announced and launched their EOS RP [specs as is] instead of the 6D II, they would still have missed been 5 years late to the FF MILC party and missed lots of sales, but the RP would still have been a SMASHING SUCCESS and had HIT Sony nicely and squarely smack in the face already 2 years ago.

Instead, Canon marginal-iterated DSLRs and let Sony build their mirrorfree FF system and market share totally unfettered and unbothered by them. For more than 5 years (A7: 2013/10).

Really SMART, Canon!

Always good fun to see such SMART companies deploying extremely SMART product and business strategies. ;)
 
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xeppelin

I'm New Here
Apr 22, 2019
20
9
Yeah, but just wait until Sony launches cameraless lenses. :p
they'd better launch "lens-less" cameras! :)

Looking forward to computational cameras along those lines:

That may well be the DOOM of Canon's imaging business [consumer products, not cine & broadcast]. Unless they soon launch a computational camera with 99 optical "L-modules". :)
 

xeppelin

I'm New Here
Apr 22, 2019
20
9
The EOS R has its faults but for its first full-frame mirrorless camera is pretty good, the RF 24-105mm F4L IS USM lens is way better than its EF cousins so we know Canon has the technology to make great lenses. Don't write them off too quickly.
One of the things Canon gets REALLY RIGHT every time are lens mount parameters. FD was "gold" in 1971, EF was gold in 1987 and RF is gold again now. Simply the best possible parameter combo for mirrorfree 36x24mm imagine area plus the smartest/most versatile lens communications design (hardware, contacts, protocol, ]. It gives Canon the largest possible set of options / most degrees of freedom for lens designs across the entire range of focal lengths and from low-cost/low-end lenses all the way to ultra-high-end "L+". Plus potential for best-in-class AF, IS, flash operation and all other lens-related functionalities beyond "raw IQ".

Nikon Z is a bit "wider" and a bit shorter "than necessary" [ that's also why they are stuck bewteen a rocjk and a hard place for a mirrorfree APS-C system:) ] and although hotly denied by most of their fans, Sony E-mount is "a good deal narrower than desirable" for FF image circle [but perfectly fine for APS-C, just like Canon EF-M is]. Canon was very SMART not to use EF-M mount for their FF system. It would have limited them to the same narrow design space as Sony.

Those decisions will come to full fruition only over the years, as lens lineups are expanded, but they will have major impact. Unless existing or new players enter the market with stunning computational cameras sooner than expected. :)
 

neuroanatomist

I post too Much on Here!!
Jul 21, 2010
24,542
1,974
true. And correctly so. Not only blasted by forum members and critics, but "by the market" and potnetial buyers. That's why Canon had to firesell it. Had they launched the darn thing at 499 MSRP, they would probably have sold a load of them and never had to go down to 299. But, SMART Canon and their INFALLIBLE market research. :)
The original EOS M was the #2 best-selling MILC in Japan, behind only a two generation old, deeply discounted Sony NEX model...and the M was not discounted in Japan (at least until the M2 was launched), and Japan was a far larger MILC market than North America where the M didn’t sell well because no MILCs sold well (Japan is still a larger MILC market, but the differential is less now than it was at that time).

So yes, SMART Canon leveraging accurate market research to design and launch a very popular camera selling at full price and high profit in the largest global market for the segment.

I won’t bother responding to the rest of your post, as it is equally replete with a poor grasp of the facts and the global market.
 

Rocky

EOS 6D MK II
Jul 30, 2010
911
26
I cannot understand why people spend so much time "discussing" who is sell the most DSLR, ILC etc. If you like that particular camera, just go ahead and buy it. Sales leader does not guarantee the best performance, reliability or ease of use.