The Canon EOS R5 will begin shipping before the Summer Olympics

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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I don't disagree with you and others. I spelled out what "prosumer" is, and when Canon does that, it allows the marketing folks to call it either way, pro or consumer.
"Prosumer" is also a regional marketing label.
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
2,269
1,285
the concept of the modern day mirrorless, e.g. EOS R, was started when DPAF was utilized in 7Dii or the Cinema camera of that era.

The concept; the concept; the concept
The 70D introduced Dual Pixel CMOS AF over a year before the 7D Mark II was introduced.
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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The architecture, button configuration (e.g. dial and joystick), of 7D and 7Dii is the same. I shot on 7D (along w/ 5Dii) for nearly 10yrs, and just last month bought 7Dii, and there are significant changes but the physial layout is nearly identical (e.g. 7Dii has the additional programmable button next to grip).

You can make other argument like "examining the output" that the crop sensor is horrible in many lower lighting scenario above 800iso. I'm not a pixel peeper, I'm arguing about the ergonomics or the physical layout. And there's a reason why the R5 looks like a 5D (e.g. wheel and joystick) than the Rebel line.

I've said this before the R5 even rumored w/ specs, and it was unpopular, that EOS R and RP are more like Rebel line than 1D predigree. That wheel and joystick is an strong physical attribute that what makes a Canon camera a pro camera.

Again, I'm not arguing about the software, just primarily about the hardware.
The biggest difference was the AF system. The difference between AF performance of the 7D and 7D Mark II is night and day.

The 7D had a less than pro level AF system that, while highly configurable, was wildly inconsistent from shot-to-shot.
The 7D Mark II has a pro level AF system almost identical to the 1D X/5D Mark III AF system.
 
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Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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Hey what if R5 is really best sport R camera what never comes?
What if 1 serie goes to M . Canon makes olympus sport camera crusher with EF-M 200mm f1,4 L :p
why would sport peoples be keen drag around heavy equipents ,when small equipemnt could do same job? just asking :p
Because smaller equipment can't do the same job. Those pesky laws of physics.
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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The original EOS M actually launched even before the 70D. So yeah, the concept had been there :ROFLMAO:
I had a mirrorless Canon camera in 2004, and it was far from Canon's first. It was a PowerShot A540.
 

jam05

EOS 80D
Mar 12, 2019
111
55
Thinking about it, the one place this camera makes no sense is the Olympics. Unless there is somehow no lag in the EVF, it will not work well for sports. Unless it can somehow focus while recording 8k video, it will not work well for sports. For ceremonies, or other more static situations it should be great, but for most of the action, not so much.

Does anyone know of pro sports shooters who use MILC bodies for action?
When people think of the Summer Olympics they tend to think of nothing but fast moving sports. There are more events at the Summer Olympics than fast moving sports. Even outside the venues, Olympic village, Opening Ceremonies etc. There are more things going on during a Summer Olympics than mere fast moving sporting events. Heck, go over to sportshooter.com and take a look at what cameras professional sports photogs are uploading images from. You would be surprised. Not all are from 1dx cameras.
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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5Ghz band is quite resilient in that respect, Michael. I do not suggest shooting with 5DIV Olympics. I am a reasonable person one would thought but premise that 5DIV cannot be used for a quick editorial photos due to lack of connectivity is false. See the OP.
In a smaller event though, where you do not have hundreds of other photogs in the event : festivals, concerts, public announcement and similar. With typically only a few photogs attending, this setup may be adequate.
Please let me remind you of the original statement I made to which you responded (emphasis added):

At the real high pressure events the top shooters are not using WiFi, they're tethering via the gigabit ethernet port.
 
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slclick

Cyclist, photog, drummer & sardonic haiku writer
Dec 17, 2013
4,016
1,885
When people think of the Summer Olympics they tend to think of nothing but fast moving sports. There are more events at the Summer Olympics than fast moving sports. Even outside the venues, Olympic village, Opening Ceremonies etc. There are more things going on during a Summer Olympics than mere fast moving sporting events. Heck, go over to sportshooter.com and take a look at what cameras professional sports photogs are uploading images from. You would be surprised. Not all are from 1dx cameras.
Exactly. Look at an NFL game, you have a mix of 1D and 5D bodies for the most part. Not all the shots are downfield.
 
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jam05

EOS 80D
Mar 12, 2019
111
55
However I regret mentioning "sportsshooter.com" that site has pretty much been dormant for quite some time. I just thought about that after I typed it. LOL
 

Rule556

I see no reason for recording the obvious. -Weston
Dec 19, 2019
76
75
Seattle
www.flickr.com
There has to be some kind of firmware loaded to map the pixels before it leaves the factory. There also must be a basic firmware already loaded that allows the firmware to be updated via a memory card, since the camera must boot and initialize the bus connected to the memory card in order to load the updated firmware.
Yes, those components are likely pre-flashed before assembly. Can’t imagine why they‘d do it differently. Especially since it’s user-updateable, and it lets dealers update them if they want or need to. They would have finalized the release version of the firmware during prototype production
Assembling is largely automated today.
Imagine fully assembled cameras to be stacked in racks,
usb plugs connected by robots and firmware updated
automatically. That can also be part of the final packing
procedure. They simply don't start boxing all those cameras
before the firmware is decided to freeze.
Typically the electronic components are already flashed before assembly, at least that's how it's done in the industry I work for.
 

FramerMCB

Canon 40D & 7D
Sep 9, 2014
444
117
53
Not sure how a lot of people would feel about lifting the camera higher to bring the LCD up to the correct height. It could work for a little bit, but in the long run of some shoots it might be tiring. That's def a band-aid.
I just watched a video where an "explorer of light" for Canon was shooting this along with a fellow from DP Review (video found there) with the 1DX Mk iii at a ranch in south Texas from blinds - he had his on a tripod with a gimbal head and a 600mm f4.0L IS II and tried out the liveview shooting mode for the 20 frames/second and was very impressed with what the camera was capturing and the overall hit-rate for frames in focus. He felt the hit-rate much better than his 1DX Mk ii, adding that he was not complaining about his Mk ii, just impressed with the in-focus hit-rate of his new Mk III.
Reviewers complaining about the 20 frames/second but only in live-view apparently were not considering/thinking about shooting from a tripod and/or monopod set up where you only have to have one hand to hold/control the camera...
 
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StoicalEtcher

EOS RP
Jan 3, 2018
280
191
Yorkshire
$2.4B in unsold inventory of a brand new product is not a cash flow problem for such a company.
It may not be impossible, but it's a heck of a lot, even for Canon, for one particular model in one particular division. I'm not saying its not true, but I'd join with those expressing interest in seeing the source of that 'statistic' (which I appreciate wasn't one you posted).
Cheers
 

StoicalEtcher

EOS RP
Jan 3, 2018
280
191
Yorkshire
I don't think Canon is anywhere near a professional body that will show a marked improvement in IQ with an OVF. Canon pushing the MKIII for the Olympics is almost laughable. It's a very modest "still" improvement...
But you do see it as an improvement then, albeit not a significant one for you?
On that basis, it surely makes it Canon's "best" camera for those purposes, and given there continue to be a huge number of wildlife, journalist, sports, etc. awards won by those wielding Canon's products, I'm not convinced it can be that terrible.

I don't think there is that much scope left for dramatic DR improvement in reality, but I'm a photographer rather than an electronics engineer, so I may be wrong....

Having said that, as a potential purchaser for a specific project, I would genuinely be interested in your posting some examples of the issues you're seeing, since you're the one with it, not me.

Thanks
 

StoicalEtcher

EOS RP
Jan 3, 2018
280
191
Yorkshire
Assembling is largely automated today.
Imagine fully assembled cameras to be stacked in racks,
usb plugs connected by robots and firmware updated
automatically. That can also be part of the final packing
procedure. They simply don't start boxing all those cameras
before the firmware is decided to freeze.
You may have watched The Matrix too many times ;) I've been in a large number of electronics factories and warehouses over recent years, and never seen product plugged into the mainframe in massive volumes.
 

FramerMCB

Canon 40D & 7D
Sep 9, 2014
444
117
53
Yeah, it's such an unmitigated disaster for wildlife and birding... :rolleyes:

Hey, hey! This is the video I referenced in a reply to an earlier comment in this thread. I thought this was a great video to show how effective and realistic shooting with the 1DX Mk iii in LiveView could be.

When I watched listened to Northrup and Polin both 'decrying' the LiveView shooting mode (frames/sec & autofocusing) they were both, I felt, scoffing at anyone actually trying to shoot this way - by holding the heavy camera/lens out at "arms length". I thought at the time they were both disingenuous with their comments. I thought, this would be a fantastic feature for someone shooting the type of sports/wildlife etc. where you know where the action is and where to set up your tripod/monopod to be capture the action...

I think they both have some 'serious skin in the game' now with Sony so I took their early looks with a grain of salt...
 

FramerMCB

Canon 40D & 7D
Sep 9, 2014
444
117
53
I saw your post on dpreview. you sure you didn't get a body that you're just not happy with? you have historically gotten the worst 1DX Mark II cameras in existance, sounds like it's continuing. Everyone is loving it elsewhere, ie: Fredmiranda.
I'm pretty sure this is either a troll, or someone buying graymarket bodies that have been run-over after they fell off the back of the delivery truck...
 
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Rule556

I see no reason for recording the obvious. -Weston
Dec 19, 2019
76
75
Seattle
www.flickr.com
The DR discussion and art discussion is sure to follow. BTW: 1/3 of a stop is always a deal breaker for me. I got a ticket for that once. 6.3 vs 7.1 is yuuuuuuge!
Maybe I should link images from my new art exhibition of test target photos and DR graphs suspended in vats of Ilford developer. They were all shot at f/22.
 
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Rule556

I see no reason for recording the obvious. -Weston
Dec 19, 2019
76
75
Seattle
www.flickr.com
Is there a high level rumor about the RF pancake? Don't recall in what state of ambiguity this one lies....I'd be adapting all glass but will pickup an RF lens if there's a peewee available.
I really want an f/2.8 20mm. With a lens like that my travel kit will be complete.