The State of the Canon Full Frame Mirrorless Development

Canon Rumors Guy

Canon EOS 40D
CR Pro
Jul 20, 2010
10,827
3,184
Canada
www.canonrumors.com
HTML:
We’ve all seen over the last few weeks that there has been a lot of chatter about Canon’s inevitable first full frame mirrorless camera. I just wanted to clarify some points on the development of the camera(s).</p>
<p>Anyone claiming that they know the final specification of the production product are simply not telling the truth. We have confirmed at least two prototypes are in existence and we wouldn’t be surprised if there is more of them out there. We’ve reported what a couple of people have told us about the prototype cameras and at no point do we claim or think these prototype cameras will be what we see once something is announced.</p>
<p><!--more--></p>
<p>We also think there’s a good chance that two cameras could be under development, even if they aren’t announced at the same time. more on that later.</p>
<p>There is no announcement date within Canon as of yet for a full frame mirrorless camera. That will obviously change at some point, but as of today, no one knows when it’s coming. Retailers may have been told that it’s coming, but when and what the specifications will be, has not been told to them.</p>
<p>We’ve probably posted less than 5% of the “information” sent to us about the camera(s).</p>
<p>We’ve also been told by multiple people that development of this product has been unlike any other camera Canon has developed over the last decade, including the Cinema EOS line. Photographers are actually more involved in the development than any time in the past.</p>
<p>I don’t want to report on the lens mount yet, as everything I’ve been told is confusing and I’d like to understand what’s happening before reporting on this area of  the camera.</p>
<span id="pty_trigger"></span>
 
Canon Rumors said:
We’ve also been told by multiple people that development of this product has been unlike any other camera Canon has developed over the last decade, including the Cinema EOS line. Photographers are actually more involved in the development than any time in the past.
Developed by the people for the people!

homer_15.jpg


I kid, I kid ;)
 
Upvote 0
Canon Rumors said:
We’ve all seen over the last few weeks that there has been a lot of chatter about Canon’s inevitable first full frame mirrorless camera. I just wanted to clarify some points on the development of the camera(s).

Good to see you back on your feet at the computer!

My job is done ;)
 
Upvote 0

ahsanford

Particular Member
Aug 16, 2012
8,620
1,651
canonnews said:
Canon Rumors said:
We’ve all seen over the last few weeks that there has been a lot of chatter about Canon’s inevitable first full frame mirrorless camera. I just wanted to clarify some points on the development of the camera(s).

Good to see you back on your feet at the computer!

My job is done ;)

Thanks for subbing in. Speedy recovery to our fearless leader indeed!

- A
 
Upvote 0
Mar 25, 2014
588
14
bereninga said:
I think there are a few models out there.

A pro APS-C with EF-M to EF adapter.
A pro APS-C with EF mount.
A pro full-frame with EF-M to EF adapter.
A pro full-frame with EF mount.
I am hoping for Canon to give us Rebel sized FF similar to SL series. Cheap and small FF offering for less than $1000 with EF mount.
 
Upvote 0
Jun 29, 2017
197
395
I was involved in the development of Aperture by Apple before it was released as a Beta to the public. There was a time when Apple worked closer with the professional community for input. This never meant that we told them what we wanted and they gave us the requests, it meant that they developed a strategy and then asked us on a professional level if it would improve our workflow.

I hope Canon has taken this approach, because from a professional point of view, Sony is dead. They make some incredible ENG capable professional video cameras, and they're slowly moving their mirrorless line into the professional realm. I've had so many positive experiences with Canon when it comes to replacing or repairing equipment. Their center in Burbank has taken huge strides in catering towards us, and it's really helping people make the decision to use Canon on their projects. Honestly, if anyone wants to create a long term relationship with professionals, they must use Canon as their model. It has become easy for us to switch platforms, especially as expensive equipment is being used on a rental basis.

There are several major features that I would love to see in the next EOS series. Things like synchronizing multiple cameras through an app (time-lapse or multicam shooting), an improved file system on the camera (similar to smart folders that organize by location or date), bringing back Eye Control AF (like on the EOS 3), a basic ability to copy camera settings to a card, and applying them to a B or C camera, even if they are a lower model, and the ability to override the EXIF data for lenses that are attached but have no readout. Most of these aren't big changes, but they're a handful of things that would save me a tremendous amount of time with the style of travel shooting that I do for work.
 
Upvote 0

jolyonralph

Game Boy Camera
CR Pro
Aug 25, 2015
1,423
944
London, UK
www.everyothershot.com
All I want is:

As lightweight as possible. I can live with some ergonomic trade-offis if it's going to save weight and most importantly size.

Because of that, EF-M or similar new mount. But ideally, EF-M compatibility to allow use of EF-M lenses in crop mode.

High resolution sensor >= 40mpx. 60mpx would be great as it'd give us a very respectable 24mpx in crop mode.

No AA filter. And ideally with some new improvement on the bayer filter such as non-regular R/G/B sensor positions (penrose tiling etc) or some other method of avoiding moire. Or stacked R/G/B sensors, or whatever. Yes, I'm aware these specific ideas hit on patents from other companies, but there are no doubt other techniques.

Global shutter. On-chip ADC so we can get a much faster crop mode.

USB3 Type C connector for data and, most importantly, for internal charging & power. So a camera on tether could be powered entirely from a suitable USB connector whilst also returning data.

Full support for tethered USB protocols as per existing EOS DSLRS, even the 1200D does this fine, yet the M5/M6 are broken and don't support USB tethering properly.

A new set of lightweight high quality prime lenses, all with IS. eg 24mm f/2, 35mm f/1.8, 50mm f/1.4, 85mm f/1.4

An inexpensive but high quality 24-70 f/3.5-f/5.6 zoom as a kit lens option.
 
Upvote 0

ahsanford

Particular Member
Aug 16, 2012
8,620
1,651
ritholtz said:
bereninga said:
I think there are a few models out there.

A pro APS-C with EF-M to EF adapter.
A pro APS-C with EF mount.
A pro full-frame with EF-M to EF adapter.
A pro full-frame with EF mount.
I am hoping for Canon to give us Rebel sized FF similar to SL series. Cheap and small FF offering for less than $1000 with EF mount.

With high confidence verging on certainty, Canon won't start their FF mirrorless experience with such a product (unless it's an unexpected fixed lens setup a la RX1R II or Leica Q, but I don't think that's what you were asking for).

We could totally see that kind of product someday -- an FF mirrorless + SL1/2-ish form factor -- but the importance of this first Canon FF mirrorless (ILC) offering cannot be overstated. IMHO, it needs to be/have:

  • Appealing to a broad swath of FF shooters
  • A clear ergonomic lineage to Canon bodies currently sold today (to draw in existing Canon users)
  • Work really well with Canon EF lenses, speedlites, etc.
  • Be a plausibly familiar/consistent user experience for folks with a Canon SLR on one shoulder and this new rig on the other
  • Specs at least on par with a 6D2 -- it doesn't need to match Sony or line up favorably to an A7 III, but it can't be behind the lowest price point FF SLR or folks will indict Canon for not taking FF mirrorless seriously

And I just don't see a rig built around simplicity and a really small size ticking all those boxes.

- A
 
Upvote 0
I'm going to go out on a limb and forecast two body types- one with a form factor of the M5, the second one will be a whole different and new body style with a rotating grip and viewfinder. A viewfinder that could be adjusted for those awkward low shots would be a godsend. A new body design would solve the problem of trying to pack more features into the current body designs and increase cooling. This would benefit the video side.
 
Upvote 0

ahsanford

Particular Member
Aug 16, 2012
8,620
1,651
KeithBreazeal said:
I'm going to go out on a limb and forecast two body types- one with a form factor of the M5, the second one will be a whole different and new body style with a rotating grip and viewfinder. A viewfinder that could be adjusted for those awkward low shots would be a godsend. A new body design would solve the problem of trying to pack more features into the current body designs and increase cooling. This would benefit the video side.

So an XC10 with an FF ILC mount... that will take really heavy lenses. Will that work?

I'm all for some ergonomic bravery where needs aren't being well met, but that seems a wild leap best left for a dedicated video rig -- which this first offering most certainly will not be.

- A
 
Upvote 0
Mar 2, 2012
3,188
543
Punio said:
I just want to know if it's the EF mount or not. Because as soon as they announce EF is dead, it'll be the Canopolypse. Can you imagine the value of everyone's gear dropping overnight?

I can imagine resale prices dropping, but not intrinsic value. If canon unveils a new mount, all my lenses still work for me.
 
Upvote 0
Jul 21, 2010
31,196
13,067
Punio said:
I just want to know if it's the EF mount or not. Because as soon as they announce EF is dead, it'll be the Canopolypse. Can you imagine the value of everyone's gear dropping overnight?

So you're saying that announcing a new mount for a FF MILC camera is synonymous with announcing the end of EF lens production? There are some effective antipsychotic pharmaceutical agents available, perhaps you should consult a physician.
 
Upvote 0