Unfixable reds...

[Dick]

I have really struggled with reds (and magenta) lately and I'm starting to think that a 5D3 cannot be used to take pictures of red things.

Here is one example - this is what the raw looks like when opened up in Aperture:

Played with the sliders and was not able to fix the photo (the color is off and all kinds of weird details have emerged):

Sorry for the different framings. Used print screen.

In many cases I have failed to fix the reds and BW has been the only option left. Sometimes it is possible to get something decent out, but the same settings do not fix the next photo. Having kids running around with red clothes on is something that really makes me angry now, because I know already before I pick up the piece of trash Canon, that the photos will suck.

What's the cure?
Has anyone found a solution to this? If it starts with N, then I guess I will have to look into that stuff next.
Is there something specific that could be done in PP? I have tried pretty much everything I have been able to think of even with the help of Google.

 

[StudentOfLight]

Do you have a colorchecker passport?
What light light source were you shooting under, i.e. is it a full spectrum light?
What does the red channel's histogram look like on your computer when you open the file?
Does your screen have the gamut to display the range of saturation that was captured?
Is your monitor calibrated?

 

[Dick]

Do you have a colorchecker passport?
What light light source were you shooting under, i.e. is it a full spectrum light?
What does the red channel's histogram look like on your computer when you open the file?
Does your screen have the gamut to display the range of saturation that was captured?
Is your monitor calibrated?

Screen is calibrated and fine. Natural light. Will have to dig out a histogram tomorrow.

This is just one example. The worst case would be one where two (or more) persons have red clothes that are supposed to look slightly different.

 

[rs]

Do you have a colorchecker passport?
What light light source were you shooting under, i.e. is it a full spectrum light?
What does the red channel's histogram look like on your computer when you open the file?
Does your screen have the gamut to display the range of saturation that was captured?
Is your monitor calibrated?

+1

It looks like the red channel has clipped. Also, if the same subject is shot darker, do you get better results using DPP?

 

[Dick]

Do you have a colorchecker passport?
What light light source were you shooting under, i.e. is it a full spectrum light?
What does the red channel's histogram look like on your computer when you open the file?
Does your screen have the gamut to display the range of saturation that was captured?
Is your monitor calibrated?

+1

It looks like the red channel has clipped. Also, if the same subject is shot darker, do you get better results using DPP?

If the red channel gets clipped with somewhat correct exposure of a photo, I don't know what to do anymore. I have tons of photos with this kind of issues. The photos look fine except for the red bits.

Haven't tried DPP. Maybe I should, but then again I don't really want additional work flow steps i.e. using multiple apps for each photo.

 

[rado98]

Not sure if it is the same in Aperture, but I had an issue with purples in Lightroom, they were just never right. I solved the problem by using the Faithful camera calibration profile instead of the default Adobe standard, man that made a massive difference.

 

[tpatana]

Red is often tough for Canons. Someone told me it's "feature" on the Canon sensors.

 

[Mt Spokane Photography]

I've found my 5D MK III to be excellent for reds, better than previous models with the exception of the original 5D.

There is little we can do to advise you from a screen shot of a monitor that might be part of the issue.

Can you post a link to a raw file?

Reds can be over exposed, if you use the rgb histogram in your camera to set the exposure manually, you will be able to set exposure to avoid overexposure of any single color.

Its also possible that the camera is faulty, there are internal adjustments for the color amplifiers that only Canon can adjust. I have seen posts from those who were able to get the issues repaired.

Sometimes, users set their camera to Adobe RGB and end up with out of gamut colors because their monitor cannot display them, or their printer print them. Blues and purples are normally the issues for that situation.

I have never had a reds issue with either of my 5D MK III's, so something is going on that does not sound normal.

 

[Dick]

Don't feel like posting the raw since there are people in the photo. I could maybe do some test shots later on when I find the time and then I could post the raw(s).

This is from the image originally posted:

 

[rs]

Do you have a colorchecker passport?
What light light source were you shooting under, i.e. is it a full spectrum light?
What does the red channel's histogram look like on your computer when you open the file?
Does your screen have the gamut to display the range of saturation that was captured?
Is your monitor calibrated?

+1

It looks like the red channel has clipped. Also, if the same subject is shot darker, do you get better results using DPP?

If the red channel gets clipped with somewhat correct exposure of a photo, I don't know what to do anymore. I have tons of photos with this kind of issues. The photos look fine except for the red bits.

Haven't tried DPP. Maybe I should, but then again I don't really want additional work flow steps i.e. using multiple apps for each photo.

The reason for suggesting DPP is being Canon software, it's more likely to be fine tuned for the CFA in the camera than any third party raw converter. Plus you gain all the camera profiles such as faithful. It's worth a shot (it is free after all), and if it doesn't improve the situation, don't include it in your workflow.

 

[MrFotoFool]

I have been using 5d3 for a year and a half (and 5d2 before that) and never had any problems. Sounds really strange that it would not record them properly in camera or on screen.

Now if you have trouble printing reds, that is understandable. I work at a photo lab (over 20 years) and photo paper has always had trouble reproducing detail in reds. For example a red rose will be a solid blob with no petal separation whereas a yellow or white or blue flower the petals will be finely detailed.

Is it only with fabrics like your sample photo, or is it other objects like red cars? If it is fabrics that is a well known problem especially with synthetic materials.

 

[Mt Spokane Photography]

Here is a bright red dress taken earlier this year at a high school play. ISO 1000 1/160 sec f/3.2 with my 5D MK III and 24-70mm L II.

There were lots of reds of every hue, but never a issue.

 

[Dick]

Here is a bright red dress taken earlier this year at a high school play. ISO 1000 1/160 sec f/3.2 with my 5D MK III and 24-70mm L II.

There were lots of reds of every hue, but never a issue.

Those reds are blown at my end (traveling with a calibrated MacBook Air). Maybe it is the great Apple screen then that is not good enough. On iPhone 6 they also look blown.

Then I come to my next question: People look at photos on screens these days, so should the reds be desaturated so that they don't look blown on most displays?

 

[distant.star]

.
If you plow through this, it will give you what you need...

"Tips and Strategies for Mastering Color in Photoshop with John Paul Caponigro"

https://youtu.be/as78a4oIhFc

 

[Bungle]

I too have problems with reds with 5diii. Using lightroom on Spyder calibrated monitor.
Question for you, do you get terrible vertical banding noise if you adjust the exposure?

 

[privatebydesign]

I too have problems with reds with 5diii. Using lightroom on Spyder calibrated monitor.
Question for you, do you get terrible vertical banding noise if you adjust the exposure?

You need to calibrate your camera with a custom profile.

The image below is seven versions of the same file all with the same white balance, just different camera profiles. These are the equivalent of Picture Styles for jpegs but are actual profiles applied to the same RAW file.

Only one is 'correct', and you can only get that by using a custom camera profile. Making a custom camera profile takes a minute or two.

Look at it like this, what is the point of only calibrating one part of your workflow?

 

[rfdesigner]

Look at it like this, what is the point of only calibrating one part of your workflow?

Because you can choose what colours you want in post processing, then your prints must match, other than some portraits how many images we see are a true and accurate representation of what is there?.. very few. Most will have a different colour balance & more saturated colours as a minimum.

I'm not saying correcting for the colour variation of your camera vs the average isn't a good move, just that adjusting for white balance in post pretty covers a large part (but not all) of what you gain from calibration.

Also remember the big gain in printer and screen calibration is getting the individual colours linear, if all screens wer linear then adjusting contrast, saturation and brightness would be enough. Camera sensors are inherantly linear.

PS I have tried calibrating my camera.. it can be worth doing.. just it doesn't give the huge benefit you get from calibrating screens and printers.

 

[chauncey]

Unfixable reds...why do you need to fix them? It seems to me that your difficulty is improper exposure.
You have a shown histogram capabilities while in live view...use it...no more blown colors...ever.

I starting shooting in live view-manual mode using the displayed histogram to expose to the right.
One must remember that the LV image is a jpeg representation of the image and you must neutralize your
in-camera picture styles for that histogram to be more accurate representation of the RAW image.

Trying to achieve accurate colors without using that passbook is an exercise in futility.

 

[AUGS]

I have really struggled with reds (and magenta) lately and I'm starting to think that a 5D3 cannot be used to take pictures of red things.

One thing you may want to check is the colorspace you have set on the camera now.
Just wondering if you previously used sRGB and now the camera is set to AdobeRGB. They will display differently depending on your monitor settings. Typically the AdobeRGB will look washed out.

 

[Khristo]

Can someone explain why it should be necessary to create a custom colour profile in Lightroom?

As I understand it, when i import a raw from my 5D3 into Lightroom, the software recognises it as a 5D3 file and applies Adobe's standard profile for the 5D3 (unless I have set something else). If that is correct, I'd hope that Adobe's profile has a little more work behind it than I'm likely to get out of my own effort, and even then, a profile created with a Colorchecker is going to be influenced ("coloured") by x-rite as well to some extent(?).

I get that if I am trying to achieve maximum colour accuracy in a specific shot and am concerned about the colour balance of the incident light lighting the scene, then a custom profile for that scene/incident light should theoretically help. But generally speaking, is my 5D3 so different to other 5D3s that a general custom profile for my 5D3 is going to be 'better' that the standard Adobe 5D3 profile?

(I do have a Colorchecker, so I'm not trying to construct an argument not to invest in one!)