Weather Sealing Torture Test: Canon, Olympus, Nikon Pass.. Sony?

Chaitanya

EOS 6D MK II
Jun 27, 2013
1,128
210
33
Pune
Talys said:
Interesting article, thanks for sharing it :)

The takeaway is that if you own an A7RII/III, keep it out of the rain and definitely away from the shoreline (where there might be a mist of salt water). That was only two 15 minute tests -- if you were out there for hours, the Sony would probably be toast. It was particularly bad that the water got into the shutter blades, battery compartment and basically everything else inside.

If I owned an A7RIII and it got water in it to the degree shown in the article, I'd send it in to be serviced by Sony before using it again. In my opinion, the potential for fires with lithium batteries is just too high. Plus, there may be cavities where water can enter, but which not particularly exposed and are problematic for evaporation.
Not just A7R3 but any Sony camera doesnt go well with humid weather, even A9 falls in this category.
 

Woody

EOS 6D MK II
Jul 20, 2010
1,139
41
Larsskv said:
I wonder whether or not DPReview will refer to this test, and if they do, how they present it... My guess is. It at all, or downplay the importance of it.
They'll pretend they have never heard of it.
 

woodman411

EOS 80D
Aug 1, 2017
108
71
USA
Hflm said:
That is pretty much nonsense.

I shot 5div and Sony A9 in parallel last year, having had many rainy wedding days without any problem at all.
And if the rain is too heavy, I wouldn't want to shoot at all. Majority of couples wouldn't anyway, too. But for the situations I had to, it worked flawlessly.

Drawing such a general conclusion is usual fanboy gibberish.

Doesn't mean I wouldn't like to have EM1-II like weather resistance for every product.
Who's the fanboy? It can't be you - the one that takes his own personal experience as gospel by calling the other "nonsense", and then calling a camera in a wedding shoot "flawless". Use it like a pro, meaning, think of taking the "money" shot, shots that people look at and say "wow, I would pay for that". When you shoot like that, you'll find *every* camera has flaws/limitations/quirks. And you'll sound more like Sung Park or Jeff Titterington, you know, real pros who have used Sony for money shots: https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/59526785
 

Don Haines

Beware of cats with laser eyes!
Jun 4, 2012
8,190
1,770
Canada
Hflm said:
Don Haines said:
woodman411 said:
ethermine said:
No surprises there. They all produce fantastic images, but after watching one of my favorite adventure photographers Chris Burkard laugh about how he's destroyed yet another Sony camera while photographing near water, or rainy conditions, It's made me appreciate my Canon gear all the more for being able to survive all the torture I've subjected them to across the globe. Then again, I'd happily shoot, and I probably wouldn't worry much about my Sony gear getting destroyed if Sony gave me gear like candy.

It would bug me knowing I wouldn't be able to completely rely on my gear under those conditions, though.
You can't rely on Sony when it's hot (overheating). You can't rely on Sony when it's wet (weather sealing). You can't rely on Sony for shooting stars (star eating). You can't rely on Sony for studio work (stopped-down focusing). What's next?
You can't rely on Sony. PERIOD!
That is pretty much nonsense.

I shot 5div and Sony A9 in parallel last year, having had many rainy wedding days without any problem at all.
And if the rain is too heavy, I wouldn't want to shoot at all. Majority of couples wouldn't anyway, too. But for the situations I had to, it worked flawlessly.

Drawing such a general conclusion is usual fanboy gibberish.

Doesn't mean I wouldn't like to have EM1-II like weather resistance for every product.
Yes, I am a Fanboy!

I am a Fanboy of Olympus for their weather sealing and innovation. Best crop camera lineup PERIOD!

I am a Fanboy of Canon for their user interface, service department, and reliability.

I am a fanboy of Nikon for the feature set on their higher end cameras.

I am a Fanboy of both Nikon and Canon for their glass.

I am a fanboy of Sony for Betamax.... sorry, nothing newer than that catches my eye....


BTW, as a "pro", one should realize that cameras are a tool, and if you use them hard, they will break. Sony has a reputation as the worst camera maker for service.
 

jeffa4444

EOS 6D MK II
Feb 28, 2013
1,437
88
65
angrykarl said:
I wonder how lower tiered bodies like 80D or 6DII would handle the test. The 80D probably not.

This is really enlightening to me as I'm planning a trip to Vietnam this summer and I realized I need a WS body... I guess I can strike out the Sony. ;D
Ive had a Canon 6D out in some quite shocking weather on Dartmoor and its been just as good as my 5DS. Ive not had the 6D MKII out in anything other than misty mornings so far so its too hard to tell given its now got the flippy screen.

My Olympus OMD-EM10 has survived a sudden and quite torrential rain storm in the summer of 2017 and came through in flying colours. I remember at the last Photokina Olympus had one of the OMD-EM1 cameras in a case with running water, Ive never seen Sony do the same.
 

Don Haines

Beware of cats with laser eyes!
Jun 4, 2012
8,190
1,770
Canada
jeffa4444 said:
angrykarl said:
I wonder how lower tiered bodies like 80D or 6DII would handle the test. The 80D probably not.

This is really enlightening to me as I'm planning a trip to Vietnam this summer and I realized I need a WS body... I guess I can strike out the Sony. ;D
Ive had a Canon 6D out in some quite shocking weather on Dartmoor and its been just as good as my 5DS. Ive not had the 6D MKII out in anything other than misty mornings so far so its too hard to tell given its now got the flippy screen.

My Olympus OMD-EM10 has survived a sudden and quite torrential rain storm in the summer of 2017 and came through in flying colours. I remember at the last Photokina Olympus had one of the OMD-EM1 cameras in a case with running water, Ive never seen Sony do the same.
Oly has the best sealing, and it is across the entire line. I was at a show once where they had an aquarium set up and a couple of their P/S cameras sitting in the bottom. People would reach in and take underwater pictures of the fish....
 

neuroanatomist

I post too Much on Here!!
Jul 21, 2010
24,619
2,105
Woody said:
Larsskv said:
I wonder whether or not DPReview will refer to this test, and if they do, how they present it... My guess is. It at all, or downplay the importance of it.
They'll pretend they have never heard of it.
Probably, but we'll see. After all, DPR claims to be unbiased. A forum member started a thread on the IR results:

I found this video quite interesting:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7BG74w0gAw
The Sony fared reasonably well, but it is still behind the competition.
He sounds about as unbiased as Rishi. ::)
 

woodman411

EOS 80D
Aug 1, 2017
108
71
USA
neuroanatomist said:
Woody said:
Larsskv said:
I wonder whether or not DPReview will refer to this test, and if they do, how they present it... My guess is. It at all, or downplay the importance of it.
They'll pretend they have never heard of it.
Probably, but we'll see. After all, DPR claims to be unbiased. A forum member started a thread on the IR results:

I found this video quite interesting:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7BG74w0gAw
The Sony fared reasonably well, but it is still behind the competition.
He sounds about as unbiased as Rishi. ::)
Review sites are all about equalizing the competition, so that they themselves are more relevant. Consistency is their enemy, including consistent stalwarts, like Canon, since consistency negates the need for review sites. They will use Nikon to push the specs-for-value advantage, and they will use Sony to push the dynamic-range/sensor advantage, until they can convince you that all the pros and cons equalize, and that you have to read their reviews to see who comes out on top. It is not necessarily evil, but it is not honest either. Self-interest. What a shock :)

PS - there are a few exceptions, the most notable being Consumer Reports, who not surprisingly get hammered by other review sites for their consistency in placing a particular brand on top (and therefore minimizing the relevancy of other review sites).
 

Hflm

Gear: 5div, A7riii, A9 ...
Jan 10, 2017
88
0
woodman411 said:
Hflm said:
That is pretty much nonsense.

I shot 5div and Sony A9 in parallel last year, having had many rainy wedding days without any problem at all.
And if the rain is too heavy, I wouldn't want to shoot at all. Majority of couples wouldn't anyway, too. But for the situations I had to, it worked flawlessly.

Drawing such a general conclusion is usual fanboy gibberish.

Doesn't mean I wouldn't like to have EM1-II like weather resistance for every product.
Who's the fanboy? It can't be you - the one that takes his own personal experience as gospel by calling the other "nonsense", and then calling a camera in a wedding shoot "flawless". Use it like a pro, meaning, think of taking the "money" shot, shots that people look at and say "wow, I would pay for that". When you shoot like that, you'll find *every* camera has flaws/limitations/quirks. And you'll sound more like Sung Park or Jeff Titterington, you know, real pros who have used Sony for money shots: https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/59526785
LOL. Your posts show your bias and getting personal doesn't help.

I use Sony for quite some time now and shot several weddings where it strongly rained, as well as other jobs, too. I have the first hand experience, used other gear and still shoot a 5div as a second body. If one believed you and others, the camera shouldn't be reliable _at all_, considering your claims and others posts.

It is a difference stating that a camera is less weather sealed etc. compared to others (I have no problem admitting this) vs. making absolute statements, which you and Haines did.
That is the prototypical fanboy method.

It is clear, too, that I wouldn't purposedly drain my gear or leave it in heavy rain. Sounds pretty stupid to do so.
 

Hflm

Gear: 5div, A7riii, A9 ...
Jan 10, 2017
88
0
Don Haines said:
Hflm said:
Don Haines said:
woodman411 said:
ethermine said:
No surprises there. They all produce fantastic images, but after watching one of my favorite adventure photographers Chris Burkard laugh about how he's destroyed yet another Sony camera while photographing near water, or rainy conditions, It's made me appreciate my Canon gear all the more for being able to survive all the torture I've subjected them to across the globe. Then again, I'd happily shoot, and I probably wouldn't worry much about my Sony gear getting destroyed if Sony gave me gear like candy.

It would bug me knowing I wouldn't be able to completely rely on my gear under those conditions, though.
You can't rely on Sony when it's hot (overheating). You can't rely on Sony when it's wet (weather sealing). You can't rely on Sony for shooting stars (star eating). You can't rely on Sony for studio work (stopped-down focusing). What's next?
You can't rely on Sony. PERIOD!
That is pretty much nonsense.

I shot 5div and Sony A9 in parallel last year, having had many rainy wedding days without any problem at all.
And if the rain is too heavy, I wouldn't want to shoot at all. Majority of couples wouldn't anyway, too. But for the situations I had to, it worked flawlessly.

Drawing such a general conclusion is usual fanboy gibberish.

Doesn't mean I wouldn't like to have EM1-II like weather resistance for every product.
Yes, I am a Fanboy!

I am a Fanboy of Olympus for their weather sealing and innovation. Best crop camera lineup PERIOD!

I am a Fanboy of Canon for their user interface, service department, and reliability.

I am a fanboy of Nikon for the feature set on their higher end cameras.

I am a Fanboy of both Nikon and Canon for their glass.

I am a fanboy of Sony for Betamax.... sorry, nothing newer than that catches my eye....
As I thought and you mad the very clear.
I find the newer Sony lenses extremely good, superior in many aspects to Canons counterparts in the metrics important to me, with the exception of the 35/1.4ii, which I adore (only problem this lens has is flares occuring when shooting contre jour).

Don Haines said:
BTW, as a "pro", one should realize that cameras are a tool, and if you use them hard, they will break. Sony has a reputation as the worst camera maker for service.
Of course I can make them break. But usually I don't need to and try not to. My experience with Sony service is very good. Might be because I get serviced in Germany. But Sony introduced Pro-Service recently which I find pretty reliable and fast so far.

In fact, my personal experience with Nikon is much worse and if you read Thom Hogan's Nikon blog there seems to be accumulating evidence that Nikon is getting bad at servicing gear and trying to safe money here. Could be due to Nikon's financial problems, who knows.
 

Don Haines

Beware of cats with laser eyes!
Jun 4, 2012
8,190
1,770
Canada
Hflm said:
Of course I can make them break. But usually I don't need to and try not to. My experience with Sony service is very good. Might be because I get serviced in Germany. But Sony introduced Pro-Service recently which I find pretty reliable and fast so far.

In fact, my personal experience with Nikon is much worse and if you read Thom Hogan's Nikon blog there seems to be accumulating evidence that Nikon is getting bad at servicing gear and trying to safe money here. Could be due to Nikon's financial problems, who knows.
I have been required to shoot under some very nasty conditions... such as salt spray and -60C (Resolute NWT Canada is a fine place to work in February). This can be a very fast death for an unsealed camera. For home, the main reason I went for a 7D2 was the sealing... for some of us, it is the most important factor in deciding on a camera.

It will be interesting to see how the "Pro Service" works out..... Service was one of their greatest weaknesses, it is nice to see them working on it....

Ultimately, we make personal choices. There is no "one answer for all", our differing needs and preferences give us different answers. For me, when it comes down to a question of small and portable, yet with decent quality, I like Olympus..... but for normal shooting I find glass and ergonomics far more important, and that's why I went Canon. I find Sony to be somewhere in the middle.
 

dak723

EOS 6D MK II
Oct 26, 2013
1,141
434
Augh...the Sony fans are upset because their favorite camera doesn't match the competition in a very important aspect. Not surprising. Of course, this doesn't mean your camera will be damaged in less severe conditions. Of course, this means you may never have a problem. But for many folks this "weakness' is important and amply demonstrates what many here who have tried the Sony FF cameras have repeatedly stated. That innovation isn't everything. That DR isn't everything. That some things are more important, such as weather sealing, ergonomics, getting the basics right (color, exposure) that Sony hasn't done well yet. It's not surprising that if you put your priorities in one place (lots of specs) that you will probably lag in other areas - and that is what many of us have found with the Sony FF cameras. Everyone should get the camera that they feel works best for them - and stop all the usual nonsense (Canon is years behind, Canon needs to innovate more, Canon is doomed because they can't match Sony, etc.) Thank goodness Canon doesn't match Sony in many areas.
 

Larsskv

EOS 7D MK II
Jun 12, 2015
785
205
Sony has done some strange things in terms of weather sealing. Have a look at this tear down:

https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2015/12/sony-fe-35mm-f1-4-za-lens-teardown/

From the summary:

“This lens has the most rubber gaskets I’ve ever seen. The weather and dust resistance in the lens itself should be superb. I’m still concerned that there is not rubber gasket where the lens mounts to the camera or under the bayonet mount. I would suggest, therefore, if you’re taking this out in weather a little additional seal at the lens-to-camera mount would be a good idea. A thick, snug, rubber band would probably do the trick, or a plastic bag around the camera and lens mount. Other than the mount, I think the rest of the lens would be fine in a hurricane. I’m always cynical about weather sealing, but this lens is amazing in that regard.”
 

ahsanford

Particular Member
Aug 16, 2012
7,973
502
Nutty question, seeing that D850 hot shoe cover -- does my 5D3 need a hot shoe cover or my 600EX-RT attached for the body to remain sealed? Is a naked hot shoe a potential path of fluid ingress?

- A
 

Don Haines

Beware of cats with laser eyes!
Jun 4, 2012
8,190
1,770
Canada
ahsanford said:
Nutty question, seeing that D850 hot shoe cover -- does my 5D3 need a hot shoe cover or my 600EX-RT attached for the body to remain sealed? Is a naked hot shoe a potential path of fluid ingress?

- A
I believe that they are not needed with Canon.....
 

StoicalEtcher

EOS 80D
Jan 3, 2018
189
87
Yorkshire
ahsanford said:
Nutty question, seeing that D850 hot shoe cover -- does my 5D3 need a hot shoe cover or my 600EX-RT attached for the body to remain sealed? Is a naked hot shoe a potential path of fluid ingress?

- A
Not a source of fluid ingress into the camera body itself, but a potential option for electrical issues, I would say, if water gets into the contacts between camera and flash and you then operate the flash (and I don't think the 600EX-RT itself is particularly water resistant in heavy conditions.)
 

Don Haines

Beware of cats with laser eyes!
Jun 4, 2012
8,190
1,770
Canada
StoicalEtcher said:
ahsanford said:
Nutty question, seeing that D850 hot shoe cover -- does my 5D3 need a hot shoe cover or my 600EX-RT attached for the body to remain sealed? Is a naked hot shoe a potential path of fluid ingress?

- A
Not a source of fluid ingress into the camera body itself, but a potential option for electrical issues, I would say, if water gets into the contacts between camera and flash and you then operate the flash (and I don't think the 600EX-RT itself is particularly water resistant in heavy conditions.)
This would be a good time for a bounce umbrella
 

StoicalEtcher

EOS 80D
Jan 3, 2018
189
87
Yorkshire
Don Haines said:
StoicalEtcher said:
ahsanford said:
Nutty question, seeing that D850 hot shoe cover -- does my 5D3 need a hot shoe cover or my 600EX-RT attached for the body to remain sealed? Is a naked hot shoe a potential path of fluid ingress?

- A
Not a source of fluid ingress into the camera body itself, but a potential option for electrical issues, I would say, if water gets into the contacts between camera and flash and you then operate the flash (and I don't think the 600EX-RT itself is particularly water resistant in heavy conditions.)
This would be a good time for a bounce umbrella
Ha ha - I like it! :) :)
 

old-pr-pix

EOS RP
Dec 26, 2011
396
50
Don Haines said:
Ultimately, we make personal choices. There is no "one answer for all", our differing needs and preferences give us different answers. For me, when it comes down to a question of small and portable, yet with decent quality, I like Olympus..... but for normal shooting I find glass and ergonomics far more important, and that's why I went Canon. I find Sony to be somewhere in the middle.
Totally agree. I went with Olympus for its sealing. I've had my Oly E-M5 in terrible rain storms. Only issue I found was I couldn't use AF since it would try to focus on individual raindrops between me and intended subject! I kept my Canon gear for 'serious' work although the latest generation of Oly PRO lenses is fully the equal of Canon L glass for IQ (within abilities of smaller m43 sensor).

They all have weather sealing limits though. Just reference the forum favorite Tony Northrup's story about his two 5DIII's wiped out by a flash storm. It's all on video as they tried to protect the cameras. (Video taken by Panasonic GH4 that survived the storm.)