Will dSLR's be sustained only by nostalgia?

cayenne

EOR R
Mar 28, 2012
2,076
200
I meant my left arm is not against my torso, not my hand. I went back and edited for clarification. Thanks!

You don't mean you have both elbows out and away from your body, do you?

Are you using the same combo?

Yep, most of the time, both arms/elbows away from my body, especially when I'm shooting concerts....

That I mostly have a 70-200 f/2.8 on my 5D3....or sometimes the huge 11-24L lens that is quite heavy....for those fun guitarist shows with their long foot forward on a pedal with the distortion.....fun shots.

But yes, I believe that's how I shoot most of the time, I rarely if ever that I can think of have my left hand, holding the lens AND against my body for a point of contact....I really need to grab the camera and some lenses and run out this weekend and see what I really do and if it matches my memory at this time...

But brr...supposed to be windy and cold tomorrow...will have to see.
:)

C
 
  • Like
Reactions: YuengLinger

Macoose

EOS T7i
Jun 4, 2015
71
3
No we haven't.
I find it interesting that two people can read the same quote and come away with two different conclusions.

"To date we’ve launched ten critically acclaimed lenses, and as it’s a new system we plan to continue this, launching more RF lenses while still fully supporting the EF lens system."

“And of course, should the market demand it, we are ready to create new EF lenses. But for now, our focus is on RF.”
 

YuengLinger

EOS 5D MK IV
Dec 20, 2012
2,786
966
Southeastern USA
Eventually the "discontinued" notices will come, first fitfully, then steadily, and then in a rush, and the constellation that was EF shall leave a void in the firmament. (But not tonight!)

No, this is not glee, or satisfaction...This is just how I think about things and express myself. It is not intended to offend, but I'm not going to sit on my hands and shut up because a few sensitive, angry people cannot tolerate my style.

In fact, I've had an emotional attachment to some of my favorite gear. I've felt strongly, tenderly about a certain car, a few surfboards, and several cameras and lenses. In each case there has been a time to move on--for me.

Now it's time to start using the gear and stop rattling on and on about it. But we should always be willing to help others and teach. That's where lies the great potential of CR and other forums.
 

unfocused

EOS 1D MK II
Jul 20, 2010
5,259
1,877
66
Springfield, IL
www.mgordoncommunications.com
I find it interesting that two people can read the same quote and come away with two different conclusions.

"To date we’ve launched ten critically acclaimed lenses, and as it’s a new system we plan to continue this, launching more RF lenses while still fully supporting the EF lens system."

“And of course, should the market demand it, we are ready to create new EF lenses. But for now, our focus is on RF.”
That's because some people don't read the actual quote, but only read the misleading headlines. Others confuse the opinions of the writer with the actual statement of the person in the know.
 

unfocused

EOS 1D MK II
Jul 20, 2010
5,259
1,877
66
Springfield, IL
www.mgordoncommunications.com
Eventually the "discontinued" notices will come, first fitfully, then steadily, and then in a rush, and the constellation that was EF shall leave a void in the firmament. (But not tonight!)

No, this is not glee, or satisfaction...This is just how I think about things and express myself. It is not intended to offend, but I'm not going to sit on my hands and shut up because a few sensitive, angry people cannot tolerate my style.

In fact, I've had an emotional attachment to some of my favorite gear. I've felt strongly, tenderly about a certain car, a few surfboards, and several cameras and lenses. In each case there has been a time to move on--for me.

Now it's time to start using the gear and stop rattling on and on about it. But we should always be willing to help others and teach. That's where lies the great potential of CR and other forums.
Wow! You really swing back and forth like a pendulum. One post you are contritely acknowledging that you're overreacting. The next time you are accusing everyone who disagrees with you of being overly sensitive and angry.

The only thing that makes me angry is when people distort and misrepresent the truth. There is entirely too much of that today and I'm a little sick of it. It's unfortunate that we have become so accustomed to distortion that we tolerate and expect it even in online conversations about insignificant things like cameras and lenses.

Yes. In the long run EF mount lenses will be discontinued. But then, in the long run we are all dead. I am not in the tiniest bit worried, angry or sensitive about the life of EF lenses or DSLRs.

But, I will continue to tear into people who post misinformation.
 
Last edited:

cayenne

EOR R
Mar 28, 2012
2,076
200
What I read into this and other reports of the Canon statement was simple.

We're going to keep putting out what EF lens we have now,.

We will not plan to develop or research any more new EF lenses going forward, unless we see a pronounced call for them by our consumers.

From that I read, Canon thinks they road toward is RF lenses which means for the most part, mirrorless is what Canon sees as the future.

It won't be sudden, but the writing is on the wall.

Again, just my opinion from what I read. Seems simple enough to me....what am I missing?

I don't really care either way, but it seems that from what I see, Canon is seeing for now, EF and DSLR as a relatively soon to be dead end and that mirrorless is the future they are developing for.

C
 

Aussie shooter

@brett.guy.photography
Dec 6, 2016
599
691
What I read into this and other reports of the Canon statement was simple.

We're going to keep putting out what EF lens we have now,.

We will not plan to develop or research any more new EF lenses going forward, unless we see a pronounced call for them by our consumers.

From that I read, Canon thinks they road toward is RF lenses which means for the most part, mirrorless is what Canon sees as the future.

It won't be sudden, but the writing is on the wall.

Again, just my opinion from what I read. Seems simple enough to me....what am I missing?

I don't really care either way, but it seems that from what I see, Canon is seeing for now, EF and DSLR as a relatively soon to be dead end and that mirrorless is the future they are developing for.

C
The thing is that is such a logical path that it didnt really need to be stated anyway. The EF lineup is so comprehensive as to basically mean there is no room for improvement. If you cant find what you want in the EF line then you really are just hard to please. There is no reason for canon to develop ef lenses. But they wont desert users of ef lenses. They will support them. Of course they will. But RF is where the development MUST happen. There is no choice in the matter. Eventually 90 percent (give or take) of canon shooters will switch and they will need a comprehensive line up of glass.
 

unfocused

EOS 1D MK II
Jul 20, 2010
5,259
1,877
66
Springfield, IL
www.mgordoncommunications.com
...Eventually 90 percent (give or take) of canon shooters will switch and they will need a comprehensive line up of glass.
While I generally agree with your post, I am not sure we can state this last bit with such confidence. I use the R. I like the R. Aside from sports, I probably use it 90% of the time. But, after months of doing so, I'm just not that confident that we are on the verge of a major breakthrough that will give mirrorless cameras the exclusive domination of the market. There are still many challenges with using mirrorless cameras, and some of the those challenges do not seem all that easy to overcome.

It's tempting to imagine some theoretical mirrorless R that resolves all the current challenges and then stack that up against existing DSLRs and assume that mirrorless will completely replace DSLRs. That may happen, but it requires a couple leaps of faith. First, that mirrorless can and will overcome its current limitations and the DSLRs will not improve in the future. I'm more cautious about such bold predictions.

In addition, I think these predictions ignore the significant disadvantage that faces the RF system of lenses. Currently, the RF system is usable only on full frame mirrorless bodies -- which constitutes a profitable, but very small part of the overall market. In contrast, EF lenses can be used on every body Canon makes. We sometimes forget or ignore the fact that APS-C dominates the market. Some people predict that APS-C will eventually die out. I'm not so sure about that either. Having let the APS-C genie out of the bottle, it may be hard for Canon to put it back. Too many people have grown accustomed to having the extra reach and lower cost of the crop sensor.

I see great potential in the R system, but I think it requires ignoring some inconvenient truths to confidently predict the virtual death of DSLRs and the EF lens system in the foreseeable future.
 
  • Love
Reactions: Michael Clark

koenkooi

EOS 7D MK II
Feb 25, 2015
665
439
[..] We sometimes forget or ignore the fact that APS-C dominates the market. Some people predict that APS-C will eventually die out. I'm not so sure about that either. Having let the APS-C genie out of the bottle, it may be hard for Canon to put it back. Too many people have grown accustomed to having the extra reach and lower cost of the crop sensor.
[..]
I would be fine with having an RF being FF only and M becoming the APS-C line. If such a thing happens, I hope Canon will release something in the spirit of the Olympus E-M1X, a relative large, rugged body with a tiny mount. Imagine what the M6II could with a Digic X, CFexpress, bigger battery and a large grip!

But I don' think that will happen, so an APS-C RF mount camera is likely to get produced.
 

AlanF

Canon 5DSR II
Aug 16, 2012
6,199
4,061
I would be fine with having an RF being FF only and M becoming the APS-C line. If such a thing happens, I hope Canon will release something in the spirit of the Olympus E-M1X, a relative large, rugged body with a tiny mount. Imagine what the M6II could with a Digic X, CFexpress, bigger battery and a large grip!

But I don' think that will happen, so an APS-C RF mount camera is likely to get produced.
A 90D has the grip and battery, and most of the functionality of the M6 II! It would just need and EVF.
 

Aussie shooter

@brett.guy.photography
Dec 6, 2016
599
691
While I generally agree with your post, I am not sure we can state this last bit with such confidence. I use the R. I like the R. Aside from sports, I probably use it 90% of the time. But, after months of doing so, I'm just not that confident that we are on the verge of a major breakthrough that will give mirrorless cameras the exclusive domination of the market. There are still many challenges with using mirrorless cameras, and some of the those challenges do not seem all that easy to overcome.

It's tempting to imagine some theoretical mirrorless R that resolves all the current challenges and then stack that up against existing DSLRs and assume that mirrorless will completely replace DSLRs. That may happen, but it requires a couple leaps of faith. First, that mirrorless can and will overcome its current limitations and the DSLRs will not improve in the future. I'm more cautious about such bold predictions.

In addition, I think these predictions ignore the significant disadvantage that faces the RF system of lenses. Currently, the RF system is usable only on full frame mirrorless bodies -- which constitutes a profitable, but very small part of the overall market. In contrast, EF lenses can be used on every body Canon makes. We sometimes forget or ignore the fact that APS-C dominates the market. Some people predict that APS-C will eventually die out. I'm not so sure about that either. Having let the APS-C genie out of the bottle, it may be hard for Canon to put it back. Too many people have grown accustomed to having the extra reach and lower cost of the crop sensor.

I see great potential in the R system, but I think it requires ignoring some inconvenient truths to confidently predict the virtual death of DSLRs and the EF lens system in the foreseeable future.
I agree that there are still big issues to overcome but there are a couple of reasons i think almost all users will make the switch. Firstly. The technology will go close to overcoming the issues like eye strain and shutter lag. Secondly. I think they will eventually release apsc cameras with RF mounts in order to have the same upgrade paths as they do with current dslrs. And lastly i think that from a business perspective, in a slowing market, companies must choose one or the other. It will not be financially viable to continue to research and develop two systems. It will be a case of wildlife photographers like me having to accept the drawback of mirrorless because we wont have a choice. It wont happen immediately though. It will be ten or fifteen years i think
 
  • Like
Reactions: cayenne

StoicalEtcher

EOS RP
Jan 3, 2018
232
135
Yorkshire
And lastly i think that from a business perspective, in a slowing market, companies must choose one or the other. It will not be financially viable to continue to research and develop two systems
I don't necessarily disagree with the trust of your views Aussie, but I do wonder to what extent Canon need to continue to research and develop the EF/mirror system, as opposed to just leaving it where it is, keep it in production (assuming sufficient demand remains) and then 'simply' slotting in the relevant latest updates from their research on the R system - such as sensors.

I'm not saying it is literally as simply as swapping in/out parts, but if the R really does become the dominant market for them, perhaps it is still possible to keep the EF system turning over with modest input rather than running the full blown R&D capacity that they have for the last 30 years?

Stoical.
 

Aussie shooter

@brett.guy.photography
Dec 6, 2016
599
691
I don't necessarily disagree with the trust of your views Aussie, but I do wonder to what extent Canon need to continue to research and develop the EF/mirror system, as opposed to just leaving it where it is, keep it in production (assuming sufficient demand remains) and then 'simply' slotting in the relevant latest updates from their research on the R system - such as sensors.

I'm not saying it is literally as simply as swapping in/out parts, but if the R really does become the dominant market for them, perhaps it is still possible to keep the EF system turning over with modest input rather than running the full blown R&D capacity that they have for the last 30 years?

Stoical.
You are possibly correct. What i can see is that they may just keep a 'wildlife' camera available in dslrs and basically just swap the rest over to mirrorless
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
1,716
939
Consolidation for financial reasons. Easier for new photographers and even seasoned ones to consistently nail exposure. Precison AF like none I've seen from any dSLR...
For those of us who learned to expose with film and single segment center weighted average monochrome light meters, we think anyone who can't nail exposure with an RGB+IR 200+ segment light meter supported by a library of thousands upon thousands of color/shape based scenarios just needs to go out and practice some more.

Yeah, in rapidly changing light it would be nice to be able to see a histogram in the OVF, but not at the expense of the immediacy and the ability to see what is actually in front of the camera one gets with an OVF. We've already learned how the camera sees it without needing the camera to show it to us. We've also learned what it can look like after raw post processing that the camera, even one with an EVF, still can't show us.

Most of the so-called "revolutionary" advantages of EVFs are only useful to those who haven't already learned how to visualize what a scene, seen with the naked eye, will look like to the camera (and in the final product). This is just as true, though, when comparing the in camera produced JPEG preview/EVF preview to what the result of a properly processed raw file will look like. The EVF is not a true WYSIWYG unless you're shooting straight to JPEG and doing no post processing.

If you're a raw shooter, you've still got to be able to visualize how it can look after processing to get the best results in challenging light.
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
1,716
939
Same as with the transition from film to digital. Exactly the same. This is what it looks like when one technology replaces another. They don't "walk away" and they do "continue to make" and even "improve."
How many years did you shoot film before transitioning to digital?
 
  • Like
Reactions: AlanF

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
1,716
939
Can you envision a workaround for prolonged observation? Some kind of hybrid viewfinder? But then a mirror would be needed right?

I think the rear panel display would be good in certain light, but definitely not bright sunlight...
"Viewfinder? What's a viewfinder?" - Weegee

1580130040197.png


1580134968580.png
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: AlanF