You can now download the manual for the brand new Canon EOS 90D

Aug 31, 2019
5
3
I was really excited when I saw the 10-bit 4:2:2 in the spec sheet but all i could find in the manual was that it has clean hdmi out in 4k and 1080p and that it also has an HDR out option that can be enabled in camera for any TV supporting HDR. But the manual didn’t really have any specs at all and I heard that’s in a Supplemental manual instead, so that might be why it wasn’t clearly stated in the regular manual?
 

Scenes

Filmmaker
Jun 12, 2014
56
41
UK
Seen somewere uncropped 4k is 2:2 line binning which makes it 2.8k to 4k. If it was 6k to 4k it would certainly have been advertised in big letters.
It may welll turn out to be true but bare in mind ‘read on the internet somewhere’ isn’t anything near a fact.
 

Sharlin

EOS 6D MK II
Dec 26, 2015
962
409
Turku, Finland
But the manual didn’t really have any specs at all and I heard that’s in a Supplemental manual instead, so that might be why it wasn’t clearly stated in the regular manual?
The supplemental booklet doesn’t mention it either :( It’s a bit frustrating that different spec lists have slightly different contents.
 

Scenes

Filmmaker
Jun 12, 2014
56
41
UK
Using the Eos 90D city footage posted to Youtube I made a 4K timeline and overlaid one on top of the other. Shooting in crop mode zooms in the image 18%. So added to the 1.6 crop of APSC that gives you a 1.78 crop shooting 'best quality' 4K.

For what its worth, even with youtube compression both crop and no crop look spectacular on my 55" Sony Master series OLED. Regardless of however Canon is getting to 4K, its a huge step up from 70D/ 80D footage.
 
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Sharlin

EOS 6D MK II
Dec 26, 2015
962
409
Turku, Finland
Is that right? Why is it not added together?
Because they are, by definition, factors, that is, multipliers. They are relative to something , not absolute quantities. Compare, for example, two 1.4x extenders used together. The resulting focal length multiplier is 1.4x1.4x=2x.
 
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dtaylor

Canon 5Ds
Jul 26, 2011
1,366
775
1.88, to be pedantic. Gotta multiply, not add :)
That sounds like the 6k center of the sensor.

Either way the two sample videos posted in this thread both look good displayed on my 4k monitor. We'll have to wait for reviews to see how the footage compares to, say, an A73 or X-T3. But it looked sharp and detailed to me.

If only Canon had included the framerate that shall not be named :LOL:
 
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Sharlin

EOS 6D MK II
Dec 26, 2015
962
409
Turku, Finland
"To be pedantic" 1.4 X 1.4 is 1.96
This is engineering, not math, so 1.4 basically means 1.4+-0.05 (what 1.4 really approximates here is the square root of two, but realistically nobody cares if the magnification is 1.4x, 1.44x, or 1.5x as long as two 1.4x extenders are roughly equivalent to one 2x extender). Rigorously, 1.96 has too much precision, pulling an extra significant figure out of thin air.
 

AlanF

Canon 5DSR II
Aug 16, 2012
5,423
2,565
This is engineering, not math, so 1.4 basically means 1.4+-0.05 (what 1.4 really approximates here is the square root of two, but realistically nobody cares if the magnification is 1.4x, 1.44x, or 1.5x as long as two 1.4x extenders are roughly equivalent to one 2x extender). Rigorously, 1.96 has too much precision, pulling an extra significant figure out of thin air.
Reminds me of the old proof that all odd numbers are prime by different professions (a variant of which I have just found in on line https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Fun:Proof_that_all_odd_numbers_are_prime )

  • Mathematician: 3 is prime, 5 is prime, and 7 is prime. By induction, all the odd integers are prime.
  • Physicist: 3 is prime, 5 is prime, 7 is prime, 9 is experimental error, 11 is prime, 13 is prime, 15 is experimental error, 17 is prime, 19 is prime. The empirical evidence is overwhelming.
  • Engineer: 3 is prime, 5 is prime, 7 is prime, 9 is a good approximation, 11 is prime.
 

ykn123

EOS T7i
Oct 1, 2013
80
28
52
Germany
www.fotoflucke.de
I'm normally not one complaining about Canon to leave away features in lower end cameras. I love my 2 1DX Mark I's. I had a 7DMII but never was really satisfied with the sharpness , so sold it and used my 1Dx. I hoped to get a smaller body, 10fps sports companion for the 1DX, a 7DMIII or a 90D so to speak. Something competetive with a D500 / D7500, ok even with an AA filter if Canon really think it has to have one. The 90D has enough AF points, 10fps - even a joystick (yes!) - that must be it, right ? I shall preorder one but then : no AF cases in the menu (why on earth ?) and even more an issue for me: no AF mode that uses a single point and 4 (or 9) surrounding helper AF points ? This is really the mode i use (and i'm sure many more) 99% for my sport photography. Why Canon ? Why ? You present a great wildlife/sports camera and cripple features that are really really useful for sports photography ? WHY ? It's just software. no expensive parts or license fees to pay. Really. Why ?
 

Sharlin

EOS 6D MK II
Dec 26, 2015
962
409
Turku, Finland
I'm normally not one complaining about Canon to leave away features in lower end cameras. I love my 2 1DX Mark I's. I had a 7DMII but never was really satisfied with the sharpness , so sold it and used my 1Dx. I hoped to get a smaller body, 10fps sports companion for the 1DX, a 7DMIII or a 90D so to speak. Something competetive with a D500 / D7500, ok even with an AA filter if Canon really think it has to have one.
The 90D appears to be extremely competitive with the D7500. Indeed, doesn’t look like the D7500 is competitive with the 90D at all! The D500 is, of course, a completely different beast aimed at an entirely different target audience. Nikon has also gone on record that it is the last of its kind, and Canon, with their sales and marketing data and smart business analysts may have determined that it’s not worth it to compete with it at this time. The resources that could go toward a 7D3 are most likely being 100% directed towards the R project.

The 90D has enough AF points, 10fps - even a joystick (yes!) - that must be it, right ? I shall preorder one but then : no AF cases in the menu (why on earth ?) and even more an issue for me: no AF mode that uses a single point and 4 (or 9) surrounding helper AF points ? This is really the mode i use (and i'm sure many more) 99% for my sport photography. Why Canon ? Why ? You present a great wildlife/sports camera and cripple features that are really really useful for sports photography ? WHY ? It's just software. no expensive parts or license fees to pay. Really. Why ?
Meh, the lack of the AF extension modes seems to be perfectly reasonable product differentiation. The fact that software has zero marginal cost does not mean that it is economically sound to put all the software in all your products.

The AF cases, I guess, could have been included. After all, they could be construed as a ”novice” feature of sorts.
 

Scenes

Filmmaker
Jun 12, 2014
56
41
UK
The resources that could go toward a 7D3 are most likely being 100% directed towards the R project.
A few youtubers have mentioned that when asked about a new 7D model Canon specifically said the 90D was not a replacement for the 7D line. Which suggests there may be a new model in the pipeline.
 

Sharlin

EOS 6D MK II
Dec 26, 2015
962
409
Turku, Finland
A few youtubers have mentioned that when asked about a new 7D model Canon specifically said the 90D was not a replacement for the 7D line. Which suggests there may be a new model in the pipeline.
It’s only very weak evidence for that, and as I’ve said before, it’s completely obvious from all Canon communication and marketing that the 90D is not a 7D2 replacement. The speculation was always just that, speculation. Just as likely the 7D line may be simply dead, or eventually to be succeeded by an equivalent-tier R body (maybe the former 7D people are developing one as we speak…)
 
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ykn123

EOS T7i
Oct 1, 2013
80
28
52
Germany
www.fotoflucke.de
The 90D appears to be extremely competitive with the D7500. Indeed, doesn’t look like the D7500 is competitive with the 90D at all! The D500 is, of course, a completely different beast aimed at an entirely different target audience. Nikon has also gone on record that it is the last of its kind, and Canon, with their sales and marketing data and smart business analysts may have determined that it’s not worth it to compete with it at this time. The resources that could go toward a 7D3 are most likely being 100% directed towards the R project.



Meh, the lack of the AF extension modes seems to be perfectly reasonable product differentiation. The fact that software has zero marginal cost does not mean that it is economically sound to put all the software in all your products.

The AF cases, I guess, could have been included. After all, they could be construed as a ”novice” feature of sorts.
Well regarding the cases, it's not a feature for novices - it's included in my 5DM4 as well as in the 1DX from 2012 - so it's more like a comfort feature and Canon decided not to provide this comfort to their latest DSLR - so it's the opposite of what you say and it does not make sense at all.
As for the competetive situation - the D7500 is almost identical in terms of IQQ to the D500, in fact i liked the results a bit better during my tests. Anyway their 3D tracking works very well and their models both left away the AA filter, which helped in terms of sharpness and as the 90D is not a studio camera , i would have preferred no AA filter. Anyway. However, as they pimped the D)= with a joystick and 10 fps, and as they have the Single AF with helper points since at least 7 years in cameras, i still think it is a silly and not very customer friendly decision to not include that AF mode as well - especially as there is no word from Canon whether we REALLY can count on a 7D MIII. For me it's a pure marketing decision (you said product differentiation - but which fast and small DSLR - suitable for sports - i should buy then to get that feature ? ) - and it's a wrong decision. It would be a benefit for their customers at no or almost no additional cost.
 

Sharlin

EOS 6D MK II
Dec 26, 2015
962
409
Turku, Finland
Well regarding the cases, it's not a feature for novices - it's included in my 5DM4 as well as in the 1DX from 2012 - so it's more like a comfort feature and Canon decided not to provide this comfort to their latest DSLR - so it's the opposite of what you say and it does not make sense at all.
Yes, I know that it's an ergonomics/customizability feature on the higher-end bodies. Improved ergonomics and customizability are things you tend to gain when you go up the product hierarchy. Canon does not believe that the target audience of the 90D needs six configurable preset slots for different AF situations, and they are probably right. Adding the AF parameters to My Menu and tweaking them as needed works fine for people who do not shoot a variety of sports on a daily basis. But what I meant that a feature like the AF cases could also be reinvented as a friendly ease-of-use feature: no need to worry about the AF parameters, just pick the case that best matches what you're shooting.
 

Jethro

EOS R
Jul 14, 2018
206
92
It’s only very weak evidence for that, and as I’ve said before, it’s completely obvious from all Canon communication and marketing that the 90D is not a 7D2 replacement. The speculation was always just that, speculation. Just as likely the 7D line may be simply dead, or eventually to be succeeded by an equivalent-tier R body (maybe the former 7D people are developing one as we speak…)
I think this is more likely. The Canon strategy around R series cameras seems to have been around providing options for existing DSLR users to upgrade into FF mirrorless.

So, existing 80D users can upgrade into an improved 90D (or mirrorless version with the same sensor), or go a bit upmarket into an existing R series model. Existing 7Dii users can somewhat downgrade to a 90D (which will likely cover most but not all of their needs), move to an existing R series camera (which would be a partial upgrade, but not cover needs such as frame rates and weather sealing), or wait for the upcoming pro-oriented R models. It seems to be about rationalising (read 'reducing') the number of bodies. Lots of options, but complicated decision making!
 

Joules

EOS RP
Jul 16, 2017
226
144
Hamburg, Germany
Which suggests there may be a new model in the pipeline.
Is there any reason not to assume that the high res R will fill the void left by the 7D II?

We just saw that a) Canon has the ability to increase Framerate on a mirrorless body by reading only a center portion of the frame (See M6 II which can go from 14 FPS 32.5 MP to 30 FPS 18 MP) and b) Canon seems to find it easier to offer higher frame rates in mirrorless form (14 FPS on the M6 II vs 11 on the 90D).

It leaves a pretty big gap in terms of price between a 90D and high res R, sure. But from a business standpoint it might make more sense to offer a cheaper model that sells high volumes and a more expensive one with big margins, instead of also having one in between that doesn't do either one as well as the others.