A New Entry Level Full Frame Camera? [CR1]

[Canon Rumors Guy]

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<strong>The EOS 6D or similar

</strong>Received a vague bit of information that Canon could be readying a new entry level full frame camera. It would sit below any sort of 5D Mark III. It would not be the “mythical’ 3D.</p>
<p>The camera would be lower megapixel than the 5D Mark III. A Canon rep recently told the BBC that <a href="http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php/topic,1637.0.html">“fewer megapixels are better”</a>.</p>
<p><strong>When?

</strong>I’m still getting some hints of an October announcement of some kind of DSLR, nothing seems difinitive though.</p>
<p>There is a suggestion Canon themselves don’t even know what they’re going to announce, if anything at all. The problem is not prototypes that aren’t ready, the problem is production. If there is an October announcement for a DSLR, I wouldn’t expect immediate delivery based on this information.</p>
<p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;">c</span>r</strong></p>

 

[pedro]

That's great news, CRguy! Let it be real.
Here's my wishlist:
Digic V
clean ISO 6400
ISO 50- 51.200
18 MP
6 fps
better AF than 5Dii
US $ 2000
no video
or same as 5Dii
and I'll order it right away 8)
could be a real killer cam!

 

[Polansky]

A entry full frame DSLR would not be a logical move and bad timing.

The 5DMKII has enough pixelcount, but for all else it is actually nothing more than an entry DSLR.
Feature wise the 5D MKII is a very 'old' camera in today's camera landscape except for its pixelcount as said.

Therefore this rumour sounds more like rubish and from someone who can't afford the 5D MKII.

Meaby after the 5D MKIII is released there is room for a small pixelcount full frame camera (which would then be the old 5D rebranded as 6D?) Although even that is not very likely to happen.....

 

[Eagle Eye]

It's only a matter of time until Canon follows through on this. Like they did with the 7d sensor, they'll place a full frame sensor in multiple bodies, stretching their profits from the r&d and actually reducing costs for the consumer in the long run as well. I wouldn't be surprised, given that the 5d mark ii is fairly frequently backordered, if Canon simply placed the same sensor in a plastic body, stuck a digic 5 in there, and pulled a bunch of features out. The cost of producing it would not be staggering and i surmise it would sell well as a prosumer camera at around 1600?

 

[pedro]

The 5DMKII has enough pixelcount, but for all else it is actually nothing more than an entry DSLR.
Feature wise the 5D MKII is a very 'old' camera in today's camera landscape except for its pixelcount as said.
Meaby after the 5D MKIII is released there is room for a small pixelcount full frame camera (which would then be the old 5D rebranded as 6D?) Although even that is not very likely to happen.....

or see my wishlist specs above
equip it with a full frame 7D sensor (18 MP)
and Digic V
better AF than 5Dii, but lesser than 7D

and voilà, here's your 6D
would be mine at least 8)

@EagleEye: while I was editing my post, you just hit the same nail!!!congrats!

 

[Eagle Eye]

A entry full frame DSLR would not be a logical move and bad timing.

The 5DMKII has enough pixelcount, but for all else it is actually nothing more than an entry DSLR.
Feature wise the 5D MKII is a very 'old' camera in today's camera landscape except for its pixelcount as said.

Therefore this rumour sounds more like rubish and from someone who can't afford the 5D MKII.

Meaby after the 5D MKIII is released there is room for a small pixelcount full frame camera (which would then be the old 5D rebranded as 6D?) Although even that is not very likely to happen.....

Entry level? Really? Do you even use one? In what ways, apart from autofocus, is the 5d mark ii an entry level dslr? As for putting a 12mp sensor from the 5d into a new body, do you really think canon would market a camera with iso 3200? They'd use the sensor from the 5d mark ii and stretch the technology. Everyone who was going to buy a 5d ii has pretty much bought one. Some will upgrade to a new higher end body, others will buy a second body on the lower end. Still others would upgrade from the rebel, 60d, or 7d. It would be shrewd of canon to puruse this.

 

[Eagle Eye]

That's great news, CRguy! Let it be real.
Here's my wishlist:
Digic V
clean ISO 6400
ISO 50- 51.200
18 MP
6 fps
better AF than 5Dii
US $ 2000
no video
or same as 5Dii
and I'll order it right away 8)
could be a real killer cam!

Unfortunately, your wish list is a little excessive. For an entry level, why would they develop a whole new sensor, a whole new autofocus, and add more technology than the 5d ii has, then cut the cost? To keep cost down, they'll simpy build a new body around existing technology. I would expect to see a 5d mark ii with a highly limited feature set, including no top lcd. They'll bring full frame to the masses, but it aint going to be pretty and certainly not have iso of 51200. No video? You seem to miss the constant reminder on here that including video costs canon nothing and cuts your costs in the long run because they sell more bodies.

 

[pedro]

@EagleEye:
I am planning to go FF after 30 years again ;-) Former Contax 139 Quartz shooter back in 1982...
You are right with your comment. I thought about the 18MP sensor of the 7D extended to FF. but if that's impossible...ok. The 21 MP then ;-)
What I would like to have for my low light photography is a 5Dii (6D) with less pixel count and Digic V.
And yes, you are also right with your video based response.
Guess I could go on without a fetaure like taht, but entry levels surely would implement it...

Another possibility: A 5Dii N. Likely? and forget the entry level...

 

[Dave]

Actually I'm not sure if I like the idea. They could use this to rise the prize of an upcoming 5D3 or to take away features of other cams (e.g. 7D), like they did on the 50D => 60D upgrate.

But the question is: Will it be a new cam?
An interesting thought I heard on you tube a couple weeks, was the idea that the 7D2 will go full frame. I don't think so, but it would be REALLY cool (at least if they keep all the features).

FF - especially for video - is quite interesting and me be we will see the former discussed hybrid video-SLR. A 5D as the "entry level" FF is much to expensive for guys who just want a better video cam.

 

[Polansky]

Entry level? Really? Do you even use one? In what ways, apart from autofocus, is the 5d mark ii an entry level dslr? As for putting a 12mp sensor from the 5d into a new body, do you really think canon would market a camera with iso 3200? They'd use the sensor from the 5d mark ii and stretch the technology. Everyone who was going to buy a 5d ii has pretty much bought one. Some will upgrade to a new higher end body, others will buy a second body on the lower end. Still others would upgrade from the rebel, 60d, or 7d. It would be shrewd of canon to puruse this.

Yes Mister, I use 2 5D mark II's as I am a professional wedding photographer. Feature wise the 5D MKII is nothing more then the 5D MK I except for a higher pixelcount and the added video (which is not being used by many photographers - not said videographers who love the 5D MKII).

If the 5D MKII hadn't had the video it would have been a 6 year old camera with just a higher MP sensor.

Compare the 5D MK II ISO performance with a Nikon D3 or D3x and you know that your 5D2 is not that special anymore... 5D MKII for these days is just old technology. As for the autofocus of the 5D MKII that has always been a big laugh. Just one central AF point which easily causes OOF pictures when you need to recompose (at big apertures) or when you are in low contrast conditions.

 

[pedro]

good point, Dave
7D FF would be great too.
equipped with the 5Dii's 21 MP sensor
clean ISO 6400
ISO 50-25600
Digic V ?
same AF

 

[mrian]

hopefully true. i hope to upgrade my "old" 5d classic to the new one.

anyway, one reputable online seller i know is now selling 5dmk2 ~100-200usd lower than usual, not sure if it's a sign but let's just say she doesn't drop prices often. 8)

 

[akiskev]

If the 5D MKII hadn't had the video it would have been a 6 year old camera with just a higher MP sensor.

Yes.. no live view, no better high iso performance, no digic4 with all its goodies (vignetting correction, higher dynamic range, etc etc).
U MAD BRO?

Note to self: don't feed the troll

 

[Bokehmon]

A lot of people here don't think that R&D for new cameras cost money....

If they were to come out with a budget FF camera, it would be a lot like what they did with the XXXXD series... recycle old sensors and add/ cut out some new features.

If there is an entry level FF camera, then the most cost effective way to produce it would be to use the 5DII sensor, and some AF system they already have... ie the current 5D one or 7D one....

They can then sell this at a lower market price without have to spend money on R&D while protecting the sales of a newer tech 5DIII.

It makes much more sense from a market standpoint to use the same sensor (7D, 60D, 600D) and vary the features because that reduces costs.

Along this line, I expect that the new 5DIII will have the same sensor as a 1DsIV. Either the 1DsIV will drop to like 6999 price point or the 5DIII will rise to 3499.

 

[GMCPhotographics]

If this is a sub product to the 5DIII then it's pretty obvious that this new 6D camera is a 5DIII using the old 5D>5DII evolution formula. Eg, pretty much the same camera but with a newer Digic processor and more MP.
So that would indicate that the 5DIII will be a substantially better camera than the 6D/5DII. Looks like our 5D will eventually become the mythical 3D after all!

 

[Dave]

good point, Dave
7D FF would be great too.
equipped with the 5Dii's 21 MP sensor
clean ISO 6400
ISO 50-25600
Digic V ?
same AF

Yeah, but I don't think so... If take a 7D going FF you have a 5D (or even more). And I wouldn't call a 7D "entry level" at the current pricing.

I can't understand why canon is spreading the line so much. If I were Canon I would reduce the number of product lines instead of increasing it.

1DS
1D
5D
7D
XXD
XXXD
XXXXD

Indeed! There's definitly missing a cheaper FF camera, but imo there is not that much room for a new line.

 

[Bokehmon]

If this is a sub product to the 5DIII then it's pretty obvious that this new 6D camera is a 5DIII using the old 5D>5DII evolution formula. Eg, pretty much the same camera but with a newer Digic processor and more MP.
So that would indicate that the 5DIII will be a substantially better camera than the 6D/5DII. Looks like our 5D will eventually become the mythical 3D after all!

$6999 -- 1Ds: FF high res studio monster

$4999 -- 1D: FF low res speed demon

$3999 -- 3D: FF higher end

$2499 -- 5D: FF entry level

$1799 -- 7D: APS-C high end

$1199 -- 9D: future of XXD series? enthusiast camera

$899 -- XXXD: mid range APS-C

$599 -- XXXXD: entry level APS-C

 

[Eagle Eye]

A lot of people here don't think that R&D for new cameras cost money....

If they were to come out with a budget FF camera, it would be a lot like what they did with the XXXXD series... recycle old sensors and add/ cut out some new features.

If there is an entry level FF camera, then the most cost effective way to produce it would be to use the 5DII sensor, and some AF system they already have... ie the current 5D one or 7D one....

They can then sell this at a lower market price without have to spend money on R&D while protecting the sales of a newer tech 5DIII.

It makes much more sense from a market standpoint to use the same sensor (7D, 60D, 600D) and vary the features because that reduces costs.

Along this line, I expect that the new 5DIII will have the same sensor as a 1DsIV. Either the 1DsIV will drop to like 6999 price point or the 5DIII will rise to 3499.

+1

 

[shtfmeister]

If the 1D and 1Ds are to be merged then isn't the aps-h sensor going to be abandonded?
so maybe it'll be a
7DII aps-h with 18(or 21)MP
and the rest basically the same (maybe dual digic V)

 

[neuroanatomist]

so maybe it'll be a
7DII aps-h with 18(or 21)MP
and the rest basically the same (maybe dual digic V)

Unlikely. A 7D with APS-C and compatibility with EF-S lenses, and a 7DII that's neither? Nope.