EOS M5 - first impressions

[Khufu]

Re: M5: 2-3 seconds shutter delay in dark scenes (with manual flash and focus)

This is what you are missing. The volume of the 80D, according to the dimensions listed, is 1.84x greater than that of the M5, which is what is usually described as 84% larger. So, when someone says that x is 84% larger than y, it means that x is 1.84 times greater than y, or 1.84 ys will fit into the volume of 1 x.

Unfortunately, percentages are very frequently used in a misleading way to overstate differences.

Trying not to be an arse here but this is kinda' one of my pet hates (along with Americans not realising "could care less" means the absolute opposite of what they're trying to communicate) ...and you do seem quite into technicalities yourself sooo:

84% greater = 1.84x "the size of"
1.84x "greater than" = 184% greater = 2.84x "the size of"

2 x "greater" = 3 x "the size of"


Sorry

I've seen similar things on educational websites, miscommunicating the size of astrological bodies and units... Bad internets! Bad physicists!

Technically, you are correct. But, overwhelmingly, as much as it grates, "times greater" is used to mean the same as "times as great". Scanlon http://www.jpscanlan.com/vignettes/timeshigherissues.html has analysed the frequency of the "incorrect" usage of "times greater" relative to the "correct" "times as great". Even in scientific journals, the "incorrect" usage predominates. For example, pointedly, in that esteemed journal The Lancet, the "incorrect" usage is 35 times more frequent. So, I am afraid, arsedom is thrust under you in the popular parlance stakes and the illiterates are in the ascendancy.

That was an interesting read (what I've read of it), but it's not the same argument, as became disappointingly apparent as I read on up to and beyond the table of statistics; these figures are based solely on usage of the terms and not correct or incorrect usage of each term! *sigh*

The author has chosen, based on the advice of various guidance articles, to refer to those instances using "as great as" et al as "correct" and branding "greater than" et al as "incorrect", regardless of whether the terms are used correctly or incorrectly in context... I can honestly say that I would personally use the latter terms at literal face value, correctly, which would then render it as a statistic in the "incorrect" camp. Yes, I would say travelling 300 miles is 2 x further than 100 miles, because it is, but because I didn't say "three times as far" it's "incorrect" terminology, which is what has been considered here, NOT incorrect usage

THERE IS HOPE!!

It's a shame though, this article started so well, then produced really stupid, confusing data set using specific terminology (ie. "incorrect") itself which clearly shows it's an agenda-driven piece where the irony is so sticky and disgusting and, eugh...

I'm reeeally interested in the data that this article almost suggested it was going to present though

 

[Ed V]

Just returned my EOS M5 w/ the 15-45 kit lens for exchange. The camera seemed fine but the lens was the softest lens I have ever encountered. I know it is a kit lens and I don't expect it to be as sharp as my L glass but this glass was way too soft for me. Hopefully the new kit will be better and the 22 2.0 whenever it arrives will be even sharper.

Ironically I purchased two M5 kits with one for my wife and one for me. I let her pick her camera first. She got the good one and me... well I lost.

Anyway it is on it's way back to B&H. First thing I ever returned to them.

Ed

 

[bholliman]

After 2 months of regular use, I'm still very impressed with this little camera. Over the weekend, I tried it for birds with my 300 f/2.8 II lens, both in flight and perched birds from a blind. I didn't have a much success with BIF (I didn't really expect to), but it did great for perched birds.

Male Downy Woodpecker

2017_02_05_124141-1501 by Bryan Holliman
on Flickr

 

[dslrdummy]

Re: EOS M5

After 2 months of regular use, I'm still very impressed with this little camera. Over the weekend, I tried it for birds with my 300 f/2.8 II lens, both in flight and perched birds from a blind. I didn't have a much success with BIF (I didn't really expect to), but it did great for perched birds.

Male Downy Woodpecker

2017_02_05_124141-1501 by Bryan Holliman
on Flickr

Great to hear. I have the 300 and was thinking of the M5 as a relatively inexpensive and light weight back up on my next trip (Zambia and Madagascar). The 24MP with crop is attractive given my main body is the 1DXii.

 

[digigal]

"Great to hear. I have the 300 and was thinking of the M5 as a relatively inexpensive and light weight back up on my next trip (Zambia and Madagascar). The 24MP with crop is attractive given my main body is the 1DXii."

I've only got the M3, not the M5, but I'd sure hate to rely on that focus system to capture the dancing Sifakas--no problem with the 1DXII, of course.

Catherine

 

[slclick]

For me the decision to not buy came down to one feature, the screen. I swear if it had a true flippy, I'd snatch it up. Esp with a great deal from our friend Gordon. So, I wait.

 

[bainsybike]

Re: M5: 2-3 seconds shutter delay in dark scenes (with manual flash and focus)

This is what you are missing. The volume of the 80D, according to the dimensions listed, is 1.84x greater than that of the M5, which is what is usually described as 84% larger. So, when someone says that x is 84% larger than y, it means that x is 1.84 times greater than y, or 1.84 ys will fit into the volume of 1 x.

Unfortunately, percentages are very frequently used in a misleading way to overstate differences.

Trying not to be an arse here but this is kinda' one of my pet hates (along with Americans not realising "could care less" means the absolute opposite of what they're trying to communicate) ...and you do seem quite into technicalities yourself sooo:

84% greater = 1.84x "the size of"
1.84x "greater than" = 184% greater = 2.84x "the size of"

2 x "greater" = 3 x "the size of"


Sorry

I've seen similar things on educational websites, miscommunicating the size of astrological bodies and units... Bad internets! Bad physicists!

In the same spirit as your contribution, Khufu, I think you mean "astronomical". "Astrological" is to do with the interpretation of the supposed influence of heavenly bodies on human affairs.

 

[Crosswind]

M5 info screen to avoid heating up the sensor?

Might be a dumb question... but look at the picture below... is the sensor still recording light in the background, while being in that particular INFO-display, or does the sensor stop collecting information (and therefore stop heating up) as long as I am inside this INFO screen??

I'm not sure, because y'know mirrorless cameras are always in LiveView, but when shooting some photos of the night sky, I want to a.) save some energy when possible by shutting down the image sensor (while still being able to see the display and all the settings about f-stop, exp. time and ISO) and b.) stop the sensor from constantly heating up, generating more noise.

 

[AvTvM]

Re: M5 info screen to avoid heating up the sensor?

Might be a dumb question... but look at the picture below... is the sensor still recording light in the background, while being in that particular INFO-display, or does the sensor stop collecting information (and therefore stop heating up) as long as I am inside this INFO screen??

i don't know for sure, but would guess the sensor is ON whenever the camera is ON.

 

[Crosswind]

Re: M5 info screen to avoid heating up the sensor?

i don't know for sure, but would guess the sensor is ON whenever the camera is ON.

It would be so easy to fix this with a firmware upgrade, if you are right. It is completely unnecessary to have the sensor working and always heating up, while being in the menu or in that INFO screen.

That's also true for the image stabilizer of some lenses... they won't stop working... even when I am in the menu or reviewing some images ??? If you do not have a manual IS OFF/ON switch (like with the 24IS), you'd have to go into the menu everytime you don't need it to shut it down.

 

[jolyonralph]

Just got my M5 and first impressions:

a) Ergonomics are slightly better than M3 (ok, significantly better) with a real on/off switch, but the menu button is still dangerously easy to trigger accidentally (although perhaps it's not quite as sensitive as on the M3)

b) start up time seems slow. In fact, just testing it side by side with the M3, the M5 is slightly *slower* than the M3 in startup, and the M5 is about twice as slow as the Sony A6000 in startup time. With mirrorless cameras when you have to keep the camera off most of the time to conserve battery slow startup = missed shots.

c) focus seems to be pretty good, and I've only misadjusted the focus point a few times with my nose hitting the touch screen so far But in general touch/drag focus is a very good thing.

d) I actually got the Canon App for the iPhone and the M5 to successfully pair on my iPhone 6S Plus, a feat that I never managed to get working right with the M3 (nor, for that matter did I ever get the Sony software to pair properly with my A7RII) This is a big win.

e) Flash is identical to the weedy pop-up unit in the M3 except oriented in a more traditional way. I actually liked the off-center flash on the M3 in those rare times I had to use it.

Hopefully a future firmware update can address b)

 

[jolyonralph]

Also, to add to the ergonomic woes of the M5, the record video button is in a horrible place. It's impossible to hodl the camera single-handed and turn video recording on.

With the Sonly A6000, it's actually possible to hand-hold it and still access ALL of the buttons - partly because it's much lighter than the M5, and partly because it's just that little bit wider, giving a better hand grip which leads to much better control in a single hand.

I think that Canon have sacrificed too much in ergonomics to try to reduce the width of the camera.

I do hope someone at Canon actually reads these threads.

 

[dak723]

Also, to add to the ergonomic woes of the M5, the record video button is in a horrible place. It's impossible to hodl the camera single-handed and turn video recording on.

If I'm not mistaken, there are about 7 different buttons you can customize to choose to record video. The ability to customize these buttons will hopefully improve the ergonomics for you.

 

[Khufu]

Just got my M5 and first impressions:

a) Ergonomics are slightly better than M3 (ok, significantly better) with a real on/off switch, but the menu button is still dangerously easy to trigger accidentally (although perhaps it's not quite as sensitive as on the M3)

b) start up time seems slow. In fact, just testing it side by side with the M3, the M5 is slightly *slower* than the M3 in startup, and the M5 is about twice as slow as the Sony A6000 in startup time. With mirrorless cameras when you have to keep the camera off most of the time to conserve battery slow startup = missed shots.

c) focus seems to be pretty good, and I've only misadjusted the focus point a few times with my nose hitting the touch screen so far But in general touch/drag focus is a very good thing.

d) I actually got the Canon App for the iPhone and the M5 to successfully pair on my iPhone 6S Plus, a feat that I never managed to get working right with the M3 (nor, for that matter did I ever get the Sony software to pair properly with my A7RII) This is a big win.

e) Flash is identical to the weedy pop-up unit in the M3 except oriented in a more traditional way. I actually liked the off-center flash on the M3 in those rare times I had to use it.

Hopefully a future firmware update can address b)

This has only just occurred to me:
Has the M3 to M5 transition lost you the bounce flash?

Removal of bounce flash AND 3x video crop seems like a horrific downgrade to me :O !!!

I'm still on the M2, which is the tiniest M (win!) but I may grab an M3 before long for the better sensor, video crop with EVF aaand bounce flash; is horrific that the M5 does away with aaall the useful features for me :/

 

[1kind]

Also, to add to the ergonomic woes of the M5, the record video button is in a horrible place. It's impossible to hodl the camera single-handed and turn video recording on.

If I'm not mistaken, there are about 7 different buttons you can customize to choose to record video. The ability to customize these buttons will hopefully improve the ergonomics for you.

I changed the record button to the top M-FN button. This way, it is easier to reach