EOS R exposure compensation and metering

Kit Lens Jockey

EOS R
CR Pro
Nov 12, 2016
872
594
I just noticed that the exposure compensation on the EOS R seems to be limited to +/- 3 stops. I know the situations where you would really want to go beyond either of those limits is rare, but I'm a little disappointed as you can push the exposure compensation right off the end of the scale that's shown and keep going if you really want to on the 5D4.

Also, is it just me, or is even the evaluative metering mode on the EOS R weighted to where the focus point is? I know we have wanted this feature for a long time, but it doesn't appear that there's any way to turn this on or off. It seems to always weight the exposure based on how bright it is where the focus point is.
 

Mt Spokane Photography

I post too Much on Here!!
CR Pro
Mar 25, 2011
16,264
1,302
Exposure is not linked to focus point, but my SL-2, 5D MK IV, and EOS R all adjust the lighting in live view once I select a focus point, so it appears that it exposes for the focus point. Actually, It is not adjusting the exposure until the camera is focused.

3 stops of EC is normally plenty, but I can see that there are cases where it is not enough.
 

Viggo

EOS R5
Dec 13, 2010
4,569
1,261
This has been annoying me also. I want a camera that meters the whole image and then focus where I want. The R has a great metering that’s somewhat ruined because it heavyly weights towards the AF point... I wish I had that as an option and also a complete average independent of the AF point... I do A LOT of EC I should t have to...
 

Viggo

EOS R5
Dec 13, 2010
4,569
1,261
Ok, so both of you just said completely conflicting things. Which is it? :unsure:
Spot metering is NOT linked to AF point, but the average metering IS weighted to the AF point. If I meter a scene with center point and it gives one exposure, without changing framing or anything but AF point placement, the metering shifts towards getting what I focus on, properly exposed.
 

dak723

EOS R
Oct 26, 2013
1,141
435
Evaluative metering changes the exposure depending on your AF point (It's evaluating, after all!). If you don't want the metering to change with your AF point, it seems as if you should use partial or center-weighted metering.

Having owned mirrrorless for a while now, it seems like your settings are far less important than with a DSLR since you can see your metering in the EVF.
 

Viggo

EOS R5
Dec 13, 2010
4,569
1,261
Evaluative metering changes the exposure depending on your AF point (It's evaluating, after all!). If you don't want the metering to change with your AF point, it seems as if you should use partial or center-weighted metering.

Having owned mirrrorless for a while now, it seems like your settings are far less important than with a DSLR since you can see your metering in the EVF.
Well, I don't know about less important, but thing for me is that I constantly have to adjust EC where I should be able to see through the EVF the exposure I want and then concentrate on AF, now, in a burst suddenly the metering has changed a lot when I don't want to.....
 

jd7

EOS R
CR Pro
Feb 3, 2013
822
185
Spot metering is NOT linked to AF point, but the average metering IS weighted to the AF point. If I meter a scene with center point and it gives one exposure, without changing framing or anything but AF point placement, the metering shifts towards getting what I focus on, properly exposed.
I think you mean evaluative, rather than average. Yes? Evaluative analyses the whole frame but weights for the area under the active AF point/s. Spot, partial and centre-weighted average are not linked to AF point. Those modes all start with whatever is in the centre of the frame, and the difference between them is basically how far from centre they take into account.

Personally I use centre-weighted average most of the time. You can get a pretty good feel for how it will meter if you look at the whole frame, so you have a pretty good idea about what EC you need for your subject. I find evaluative is “inconsistent” in that a small change in the scene can sometimes cause the camera to analyse a scene quite differently and select quite different exposure settings, so it’s hard to anticipate what EC you will need.
 
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Viggo

EOS R5
Dec 13, 2010
4,569
1,261
I think you mean evaluative, rather than average. Yes? Evaluative analyses the whole frame but weights for the area under the active AF point/s. Spot, partial and centre-weighted average are not linked to AF point. Those modes all start with whatever is in the centre of the frame, and the difference between them is basically how far from centre they take into account.

Personally I use centre-weighted average most of the time. You can get a pretty good feel for how it will meter if you look at the whole frame, so you have a pretty good idea about what EC you need for your subject. I find evaluative is “inconsistent” in that a small change in the scene can sometimes cause the camera to analyse a scene quite differently and select quite different exposure settings, so it’s hard to anticipate what EC you will need.
Correct, I mean evaluative, sorry ‘bout that (y)
 
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Kit Lens Jockey

EOS R
CR Pro
Nov 12, 2016
872
594
Ok, I simply cannot get this thing to meter properly in low light, indoor situations. Seems to be either way too bright or way too dark, depending on what metering mode I use. On the 5D4, evaluative metering always seemed to work pretty well. With the R, it's just erratic.

What is the metering mode on the R that is closest to evaluative on the 5D4? Center weighted average? Evaluative on the R just doesn't seem to act the same.
 

Mt Spokane Photography

I post too Much on Here!!
CR Pro
Mar 25, 2011
16,264
1,302
I think metering so far is the same or better than my 5D MK IV. Accuracy is very dependent on the scene, if the subject does not fill a lrge part of the screen, then center weighted or spot may work better if the subject is in the AF area. I have only taken about 500 shots so far, so I really have not used mine in a lot of different lighting situations.
 

SereneSpeed

EOS M6 Mark II
Feb 1, 2016
95
42
The histogram reads the whole scene. This is the first camera where I don't even use the in-camera meter. Every once in a while I check where it's at and it seems accurate enough, but I'm not using it.

I guess I'll have to try Av mode (or auto ISO in Manual) and play with EC a bit. But, I thill think I'll just monitor the histogram while changing EC.

I can't believe how much of the shooting experience is different with the mirrorless camera. So much more to learn and so many habits to unlearn.
 

highdesertmesa

EOS R6 | GFX 50R
CR Pro
Apr 17, 2017
302
356
Placitas, NM
www.instagram.com
The histogram reads the whole scene. This is the first camera where I don't even use the in-camera meter. Every once in a while I check where it's at and it seems accurate enough, but I'm not using it.

I guess I'll have to try Av mode (or auto ISO in Manual) and play with EC a bit. But, I thill think I'll just monitor the histogram while changing EC.

I can't believe how much of the shooting experience is different with the mirrorless camera. So much more to learn and so many habits to unlearn.
Thread resurrection to correct this. In evaluative mode the histogram is weighted toward and changes with the focus point. Center weighted metering will keep a stable histogram regardless of focus point.
 

SereneSpeed

EOS M6 Mark II
Feb 1, 2016
95
42
Thread resurrection to correct this. In evaluative mode the histogram is weighted toward and changes with the focus point. Center weighted metering will keep a stable histogram regardless of focus point.
No, in evaluative mode, the histogram is not weighted toward changes in the AF point...

Are you perhaps confusing the meter with the histogram?

Two different tools.

Perhaps you could tell me more clearly, what part of what I wrote needed to be 'corrected'?
 
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SereneSpeed

EOS M6 Mark II
Feb 1, 2016
95
42
I'll add that the histogram should never change based on ANY metering mode, and AF point position changes. It's an evaluation of all the pixels in your image. It's created from the .jpg preview (or the evf/sensor data in a MILC), so changes to image style settings will change the histogram, and RAW files will have more latitude than the histogram shows. But, that's not related to metering.

If you frame your image so the left half of your frame is shadow and the right half is highlight, no matter if you meter the light, or dark, the histogram will not change. If you meter the left, your meter will tell you that you need to allow more light to hit the sensor to bring the shadows up to 18% grey (-EVs on the meter). If you meter the right, it will tell you you need to cut the light to reach 18% grey +EVs on the meter).

But the histogram, it's not changing...
 
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Sporgon

5% of gear used 95% of the time
CR Pro
I'll add that the histogram should never change based on ANY metering mode. It's an evaluation of all the pixels in your image. It's created from the .jpg preview (or the evf/sensor data in a MILC), so changes to image style settings will change the histogram, and RAW files will have more latitude than the histogram shows. But, that's not related to metering.
If the different metering modes give different exposures the histogram will change.
 

SereneSpeed

EOS M6 Mark II
Feb 1, 2016
95
42
If the different metering modes give different exposures the histogram will change.
Semantics...

Metering modes don’t change exposure.

Some shooting modes change exposure based on the metering mode.

Change the metering mode all you want in manual shooting mode and moving the AF point will not change the Histogram.
 
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SereneSpeed

EOS M6 Mark II
Feb 1, 2016
95
42
[...] In evaluative mode the histogram is weighted toward and changes with the focus point.
In evaluative mode, the metering is weighted toward the changes with the focus point.

Depending on your shooting mode, changes in the metering may change the histogram.

But, if your metering is not set to control your exposure, moving the AF point will not change the Histogram.

A year ago I said "The histogram reads the whole scene" - And, that has not changed. It is still correct today.

Set your camera to manual and move your AF point (in evaluative metering) from light to dark. You will see the metering change, but not the histogram. They are different tools.
 
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SereneSpeed

EOS M6 Mark II
Feb 1, 2016
95
42
I get it...

highdesertmesa, Sporgan, and Viggo, you don't have the histogram on at all times in your EVF, right? You're just thinking about image review? The joy of MILC and one of the main reasons I switched over was the in EVF histogram. It's an incredibly powerful tool if you use it. The histogram and the metering being independent can most easily be observed with the histogram enabled in the EVF. Try it and see how it differs from metering.
 
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Kit.

EOS 5D Mark IV
Apr 25, 2011
1,994
1,350
I get it...

highdesertmesa, Sporgan, and Viggo, you don't have the histogram on at all times in your EVF, right? You're just thinking about image review? The joy of MILC and one of the main reasons I switched over was the in EVF histogram. It's an incredibly powerful tool if you use it.
Personally, I have the histogram on at all times in my EVF, but mostly because I cannot trust highlights rendering in my EVF. For my OVF shooting, the histogram is much less important. A histogram doesn't tell you how your subject is exposed.

Besides, so far I have never used my EVF camera with a flash as the main light source.

The histogram and the metering being independent can most easily be observed with the histogram enabled in the EVF. Try it and see how it differs from metering.
The histogram and the metering are only "independent" if you don't use the metering.