Forum Decorum....Deshmorum?

[JohnDizzo15]

Just wanted to state a few things (from my POV) that one should bear in mind when participating in forum chatter.

- Know that starting/participating in potentially controversial threads is like playing a game

- Know the rules to the game and how to best play it

- If you don't like those games, don't play them (e.g. starting the threads and then participating in them)

- Don't get mad at what happens during that game, then take your ball and go home simply because you are no longer enjoying that game (e.g. starting threads and then locking them after you've had the last word)

- In the real world, you'd get shunned, punked, and treated like the turd burglar that you are for pulling the "I'm taking my ball home" card on everyone

- Freedom to express your view/opinion/two cents whether it be nonsense or valuable is something which every person is entitled to

- You are entitled to not like what others have to say

- You should try not to apply double standards. Dish it and be okay with having it dished back

- Much of how you SHOULD conduct yourself in life is probably the best way to conduct yourself on forums such as this one (unless you're a d-bag in every facet of life). Still, you are entitled to act as you so choose (within the confines of the admin set rules)

- Don't post or start threads that you know may be inflammatory if you don't want to deal with the resulting flames (very similar to not putting your hand in the fire if you don't like hot)

- If you insist on posting them, deal with the results (which you know full well are inevitably coming). Don't be the guy on the school yard that pushes someone and then gets mad because you subsequently got punched in the face because you weren't really looking to fight

- Stop crying

Yes, I am aware there are some slight redundancies. But they are good for reiteration of things that appear to be unclear to many around these parts.

The end.

 

[privatebydesign]

"- Don't get mad at what happens during that game, then take your ball and go home simply because you are no longer enjoying that game (e.g. starting threads and then locking them after you've had the last word)"

I don't believe that is up to the OP, only the mods have that power.

And on the subject of mods, who let me state quite clearly, i believe do a very good job, I do however wish that if they delete a comment they delete all the comments that either include that censured one, or are a direct reply to it. It gets really weird reading through a thread and see people replying to something that isn't there anymore.

 

[meywd]

"- Don't get mad at what happens during that game, then take your ball and go home simply because you are no longer enjoying that game (e.g. starting threads and then locking them after you've had the last word)"

I don't believe that is up to the OP, only the mods have that power.

And on the subject of mods, who let me state quite clearly, i believe do a very good job, I do however wish that if they delete a comment they delete all the comments that either include that censured one, or are a direct reply to it. It gets really weird reading through a thread and see people replying to something that isn't there anymore.

+1 or hide them so only people who really want to read them do read them, though not sure its implemented here.

 

[JohnDizzo15]

"- Don't get mad at what happens during that game, then take your ball and go home simply because you are no longer enjoying that game (e.g. starting threads and then locking them after you've had the last word)"

I don't believe that is up to the OP, only the mods have that power.

And on the subject of mods, who let me state quite clearly, i believe do a very good job, I do however wish that if they delete a comment they delete all the comments that either include that censured one, or are a direct reply to it. It gets really weird reading through a thread and see people replying to something that isn't there anymore.

I was of the same belief until someone (who I will leave unspecified) stated very recently that they no longer liked what was going on in the thread they started and that they were going to subsequently lock it. I didn't believe this person was an admin/mod so I decided to take a look at some of the threads that I have started myself. And apparently, there is an option to lock topic on the ones you started. For instance, there are two additional buttons on the bottom left of this thread when I view it which are "Remove" and "Lock."

Agreed re the mods on the forum. They absolutely do a very good job. Which is why I believe that if a thread is going to be locked, it should be their exclusive ability to do so.

 

[AcutancePhotography]

Interesting how you entitled your thread about decorum, but it turned out to just be a complaint about another member of this forum.

No one wins an argument on the Internets Tubes. It does not matter who gets the "last word" ;D

I think it is a good idea for the originators of a thread to be able to lock it. With all the derailments that happen here, it is a good tool to keep the conversation focused on the topic. I wished some of the other forums I haunt had that capability.

After all, if someone wants to talk about a different topic, they can start up their own thread and not derail someone elses

 

[JohnDizzo15]

Interesting how you entitled your thread about decorum, but it turned out to just be a complaint about another member of this forum.

No one wins an argument on the Internets Tubes. It does not matter who gets the "last word" ;D

I think it is a good idea for the originators of a thread to be able to lock it. With all the derailments that happen here, it is a good tool to keep the conversation focused on the topic. I wished some of the other forums I haunt had that capability.

After all, if someone wants to talk about a different topic, they can start up their own thread and not derail someone elses

The references made were to the most recent exhibition of lame duck-ness that I witnessed. The last straw if you will.

Agreed, no one wins an argument on the interwebs.

My wife would have a lot to say to you about whether it matters that one gets the last word. lol.

As far as derailment goes, the same people that have complained about derailment of their threads have derailed plenty of others that were based on other topics i.e. anything that has to do with dynamic range, image quality, a new canon body, etc.

 

[Mt Spokane Photography]

Agreed, no one wins an argument on the interwebs.

My wife would have a lot to say to you about whether it matters that one gets the last word. lol.

As far as derailment goes, the same people that have complained about derailment of their threads have derailed plenty of others that were based on other topics i.e. anything that has to do with dynamic range, image quality, a new canon body, etc.

I came across this cartoon in a post my son made recently. It seems to apply.

 

[AcutancePhotography]

I came across this cartoon in a post my son made recently. It seems to apply.

Reminds me of a very politically incorrect and inapproprate comparision between arguing on the Internets Tubes and the Special Olympics.

 

[Larry]

No one wins an argument on the Internets Tubes. It does not matter who gets the "last word" ;D

Agreed, no one wins an argument on the interwebs.

I'll argue with that!

IMO the statement is a "politically correct" cliche which attempts to establish the fact that contention is always pointless, with nothing gained by strenuous, even heated, disagreement or differences of opinion. (Heaven forbid there should be any waves! )

It may be a given that "the last word" is a phantom, so long as a thread stays open, but objective minds can be changed by strongly stated positions of merit, and meritless ones can be clearly shown to be such, ...so that a bit of "truth" (at least in the minds of some beholders) can be more widely disseminated.

 

[JohnDizzo15]

I'll argue with that!

IMO the statement is a "politically correct" cliche which attempts to establish the fact that contention is always pointless, with nothing gained by strenuous, even heated, disagreement or differences of opinion. (Heaven forbid there should be any waves! )

It may be a given that "the last word" is a phantom, so long as a thread stays open, but objective minds can be changed by strongly stated positions of merit, and meritless ones can be clearly shown to be such, ...so that a bit of "truth" (at least in the minds of some beholders) can be more widely disseminated.

LOL. Valid point. I will agree that there can in theory be a winner. However, how often do you witness acceptance and acknowledgement of defeat from the defeated party on the interwebs? That is where the endless defense and offense from each respective position continues to perpetuate a seemingly endless debate. I suppose that should be my revised statement. ;D

 

[Larry]

LOL. Valid point. I will agree that there can in theory be a winner. However, how often do you witness acceptance and acknowledgement of defeat from the defeated party on the interwebs? That is where the endless defense and offense from each respective position continues to perpetuate a seemingly endless debate. I suppose that should be my revised statement. ;D

How often? 100% of the time in the single case, at least, of the exchange between the two of us. I made a point which was gracefully acknowledged by yourself.

I concede of course, that there are personalities more inclined to be argumentative than others, and when two such find themselves at loggerheads, the party may last longer than many of us wish to stay.

Fortunately, the exit door is always open, and we are free to spend our time elsewhere, ...but those who hang-in-there for the spectacle may still notice a previously undiscovered gem or two flung along with the other substance.

I prefer that point/counterpoint be calmly engaged in (and accepted) as "discussion", rather than cringingly avoided as "argument".

I am pleased to have exchanged (peacefully) these few thoughts with you.

Thanks! 8)

 

[Jane]

I'd suggest adding another rule to your list:

Remember there are women reading/contributing to Canon Rumors

We are few in number, I believe. I have been reading CR for a couple of years but was put off contributing until recently by what I viewed as some rough posts in the past.

 

[JohnDizzo15]

...
- Freedom to express your view/opinion/two cents whether it be nonsense or valuable is something which every person is entitled to
...

Something that many people seem to forget is that freedom of speech doesn't exist on the Internet like many think it does. This website is privately owned and operated. Hence why moderators exercise censorship of swearing, try to curb trolling, etc. Freedom of speech means that the government is curtailed in what it can do to censor or control the speech of citizens - it doesn't bestow upon people the right to write whatever they wish wherever they wish on the 'net.

No reference was being made to the Constitution.

 

[JohnDizzo15]

...
<various analogies removed>
...

In the real world I see many parents send their kids to their room if they behave badly or take their toys away from them, etc, so that they cool down and stop behaving badly and understand that what they're doing or have done isn't acceptable.

Read into that what you will.

In this particular instance a poster to these forums was invited multiple times to contribute meaningfully to a thread and deliberately chose not to and thus behaved in an anti-social fashion. Possibly the correct way to respond to that is to ignore it (as it is often correct to just ignore children behaving badly.)

This website is a forum to discuss Canon rumors and as often happens, related discussion of other digital camera equipment. Nowhere in its charter do I see anything about it being a forum for making personal attacks on others nor is there any way to justify being rude here.

Let me know if you disagree and that this forum/website should be a place for attacking and insulting other people.

There are a multitude of things I don't agree with or condone. I agree that it should not be a place for personal attacks or insults.

That being said, I also believe that we all have the god given ability to ignore things hence the reason I have chosen to never be the kid that took his ball home. So in the same way you have asked that people simply ignore your posts when they don't want to read them, you can also choose to ignore their responses. No harm, no foul.

I agree, this forum and others like it are a place to discuss Canon rumors and other photography related topics. That being said, I also believe that the point has been made abundantly clear regarding the feelings of forum members who are discontent with Canon's offerings relative to other companies i.e. Sony, Nikon, Sony, Sony, and Sony.

In my personal life, when carrying on through the world, I believe I have developed the ability to recognize that certain behaviors or actions may lead to a very probable reaction. Therefore, I try to act in such a way so as to avoid reactions I don't want, and promote the possibility of the ones that I desire. The nexus between that statement and what you and other forum members have done is that I believe most of you have also developed an understanding for what types of reactions you're going to get to certain things based on the things you have already experienced previously. Hence the reason why the said posts are believed to be provocative by many on this forum.

And human nature most of the time leads us to respond to provocation in a negative fashion. Not saying that those are necessarily my feelings about your posts or threads. Just saying that they have gotten to the point where I would understand how many would view them as provocative.

 

[distant.star]

.
What possesses someone to hand down a slate of commandments for how other people should behave?

Strikes me as the epitome of arrogance.

 

[distant.star]

.
What possesses someone to hand down a slate of commandments for how other people should behave?

Strikes me as the epitome of arrogance.

I would love to see you say that in a court of law to a judge.

That's nice.

 

[JohnDizzo15]

.
What possesses someone to hand down a slate of commandments for how other people should behave?

Strikes me as the epitome of arrogance.

Not sure what would possess someone to do such a thing either. I agree that it would strike many as the epitome of arrogance. So I ask, are you referring to my opening post?

If so, you have misinterpreted what I have said to be commandments as those were merely things that I personally felt people "should" bear in mind when participating in such conversations. Also mixed in there were my feelings about certain types of behavior and how I perceive them. Commandments would have required different language be present in order to meet the definition.

I was in no way issuing a slate of commandments, rules, or an edict of any kind. Just providing my point of view and some suggestions.

Thou shalt not.....

 

[tolusina]

.
What possesses someone to hand down a slate of commandments for how other people should behave?

Strikes me as the epitome of arrogance.

That's a Q and A with all manner of deep, philosophical, political and religious implications, discussion of which is inappropriate to a photo gear head forum.
Were it not inappropriate, I'd also ponder what makes people accept such commandments.

(.... pulling on hip waders, running away..............)

 

[Larry]

.
What possesses someone to hand down a slate of commandments for how other people should behave?

Strikes me as the epitome of arrogance.

Long standing tradition.

See: Religions/kings/emperors/etc, ...anyone with power/authority over others.

(But I agree that OP was "suggestion", not commandment)

 

[Canon1]

CR Forum Etiquette

It really seems like there is a lot of hostility here among forum members. I really can't believe some of the stuff people say to each other here. Good debate is productive, but some of this stuff is...

Before this, I've never seen a group of people who all share the same passion as one another be so brutal to one another.

There are even many posters here with thousands of posts who used to be wonderful sources of information who now resort to the same childish behavior.

I challenge everyone to grow up a little, and recognize that there are tons of people here, beginners and pros alike, who all share this common passion of photography. Think of the discussions we could have if we left the bull s#%t behind.

I hope the admins don't sensor this post. My intent here is not to slam CR or further inflame members, but to encourage people to try to be civil and productive. This is a great community and resource.

Happy shooting,