Here is everything that you need to know about tomorrow’s big day from Canon

FrenchFry

Wildlife enthusiast!
Jun 14, 2020
463
583
"The EOS R3 is is The first EOS to feature an entirely new stacked BSI CMOS sensor" So likely its performance is different - better We all hope.
I'm hoping the BSI helps let in more light and result in better low light performance. Even if minimal, I'll take it!
 
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SteveC

R5
CR Pro
Sep 3, 2019
2,568
2,473
I wonder how many affluent dreamers will buy the R3 in the mistaken belief that it will magically transform them into better photographers...
Naah, I already figured out the R5 didn't make me a better photographer, so why would this camera?
 
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aceflibble

EOS RP
May 8, 2015
355
192
They could publish the reviews today, but then they would have to pay a lot of money to Canon.
That's not how the industry works. That's not how any industry works.
If you've signed an actual NDA, which is a legally binding contract stating you will not talk about [subject] until a ccertain point (or simply ever), then yes, breaking that contract may mean you are subject to a lawsuit, whether you broke the terms of the NDA or not is very quick and simple to prove, and you'll be paying a huge fine and/or getting some time behind bars, depending on the exact nature of the subject at hand.
... But that requires the manufacturer to spend a lot of time and money drawing up legally sound contracts, getting copies posted off and signed, everyone filing everything correctly, and nobody can be bothered. It also opens up the possibility of leaks as if you send someone a contract saying "you will not talk about the R3 until 11am on the 14th", and then that person simply does not agree to sign that contract... well, you've just told them the R3 is coming and what kind of time frame it should be arriving. You've leaked yourself.

What actually happens, in this and every other industry you can name, is manufacturers strike non-binding embargos with outlets and influencers. An embargo doesn't require anything to be signed like an NDA does. If someone breaks the embargo you can't level any kind of charges against them, but outlets won't break the embargo because they know if they do you'll never cooperate with them again. The threat of financial penalty is not there; nobody would have to pay Canon a single penny if they set an R3 or 100-400 hands-on video live a half day early, for example. But Canon would never send that channel a review unit ever again. They'd never invite them to press events again. They'd never give them any support reviewing any further products. If you break an embargo, that's it, you're blacklisted by that company. Other companies will also notice that you broke embargo and they will stop working with you, too. And if a channel, site or magazine can't get review units sent to them, they are pretty much out of business; very few people can afford to buy every product they want or need to review, and even when they can afford it, the nature of coverage now is so focused on being the first to publish that waiting for a retail unit to be delivered often means your review will not get enough traffic to make any money.

This is also why those outlets and channels which always have a ''review'' ready to go within minutes of announcement must always be taken with the largest barrel of salt you can fathom. They're never under contract to suck up to the manufacturer—nobody is ever "paid off", and as a side note, accusing someone of being paid off or secretly under contract is in fact illegal, yes, even 'just' in a youtube comment, so nobody should ever do that—but they are under pressure to not rock the boat much. Manufacturers will blacklist you for breaking embargo, for giving one product a negative review, or simply because you told a bad joke in the bar after a press event one time, so every outlet and channel does have incentive to play nice and go easy on everything. It's just not a direct financial penalty incentive. That's why you so rarely hear anyone say any part of a new product is actually "bad", just "average" at worst. It's the old 7-10 scale: nothing is allowed to be given less than a 7/10 or you'll never get work again.


So, no, nobody would have to pay any money to Canon. But if they break the embargo with a company of that size they'll struggle to produce work again, and cease earning money.

(I've signed more NDAs in my lifetime than I care to remember and I've also been blacklisted by a fair few companies, so believe me when I say the pressure manufacturers put on outlets is very, very real.)
 
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FrenchFry

Wildlife enthusiast!
Jun 14, 2020
463
583
I am new to this discussion and currently shoot with 1DX IIIs with the latest versions of 400 and 600 lenses. What is the expectation of compatibility through an adapter for these lenses.
The latest version of the lenses (released this year) already have an RF mount. If you are referring to the 2018 versions, the general consensus seems to be that the lenses work very well on the R5, but autofocus may not be as fast as on a body with integrated grip, which has a larger battery. The hope is that the R3 will address this, but we don't know yet.
 
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Finn

EOS M6 Mark II
Mar 6, 2021
83
60
I'm just glad to see Canon finally offering a Canon BSI sensor. Could make mkII's of the R5 and R6 worthy upgrades or trade ups. I'm amazed at how well canon's FSI 45MP sensor in the R5 does, especially when paired with Canon's DPP software. Pretty impressive for how many and how small the photodiodes have to be for 45MP.

I'm more interested in how the R3 video performs. We pretty much now its going to be a faster, higher MP, slightly smaller 1DXM3 and will perform very well in the sports arena.
 
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FrenchFry

Wildlife enthusiast!
Jun 14, 2020
463
583
If you actually new anything about lens design telephoto lenses have little to no effect of barrel distance of rear element. The design of the 600III is already redesigned to have most of the internal elements shifted rearward to lighten the lens dramatically (less elements).
Modifying the rear lens element to sit closer does nothing for super telephotos like it does for medium and short focal lenthgs when it comes to benefits.

if you’re mearly upset that they permanently attached the adapter and you refuse to spend the money cause they “cheaped out” you should actually try and understand why they did that.
I think a lot of people are excited to see a refresh to the 500mm F4, 300mm F2.8, and 200-400mm F4, which were released in 2011, 2011, and 2013, respectively.
8-10 years is a really, really long time in the tech world to not see advancements or improvements in a new model. One can reasonably assume (and the rumors support) that the new versions of these lenses will see some pretty dramatic upgrades given the length of time elapsed between the old and new models.
These improvements may have little or even nothing to do with the new RF mount. For example, the EF 600mm F4 that came out in 1999 was about 11.8 lbs, the EF 600mm F4 II that came out in 2011 was about 8.7lbs, and the EF 600mm F4 III that came out in 2018 was about 6.7lbs. These dramatic weight reductions are much appreciated improvements for anyone who has spent time carrying these lenses. These improvements are not related to any new mounts, but they are a huge deal for the end user.

As a result, a refresh to the 500mm F4, 300mm F2.8, and 200-400mm F4 could bring great improvements to the size and weight of these lenses, even if those improvements are not a direct consequence of the new RF mount. I would also think it would be possible to improve the focusing speed of these lenses with the latest nano USM technology, as well as make improvements to micro-contrast and colors with the newest lens coatings. Who knows, maybe the new lenses would even be sharper. Again, not because of the new RF mount, but because of the release occurring 10+ years after the previous model.
 
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Aug 7, 2018
395
342
I always thought that 4K with low noise at night is a good addition to a camera, but then I see videos like this that remind me that you can buy things like a DJI Pocket 2 for 400 Euros or so and the quality is amazing. Of course you can't mount your lenses on it, but for people like me who see video just as a bonus. something like those cheap walkaround video camera take away the need to buy a large camera that can do video:

Of course the noise in the sky and on the street could be lower and the sound needs improvement, but I wonder how much better an R3 would look. And can you handhold it that easy while walking?
 
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SUNDOG04

EOS 90D
CR Pro
Mar 1, 2015
131
94
People will be disappointed initially, as always. In time, it will be proven to be pretty darn good, as always.
 
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RayValdez360

Soon to be the greatest.
Jun 6, 2012
779
544
40
Philadelphia
If it is like past announcements, the first reviews probably won't tell us much -- just run through the features and a few first impressions. It will be a couple weeks, I think, before we get any in-depth reviews.
Some people had it a few weeks or months. This is like the slowest roll out ever. I just hope they dont sugar coat anything. If it isn't worth it tell us. ASAP
 

koenkooi

EOS 5D Mark IV
CR Pro
Feb 25, 2015
2,118
2,147
how about shorter minimum focus distance?! ;)
Honest question: with or without massive focus breathing? I really like the 1.2m MFD on the 100-500, but at MFD on the long end it's more like a 290mm, AlanF measured it a while back.
 

reef58

EOS RP
CR Pro
Apr 16, 2016
442
445
North Carolina
youtu.be
That's not how the industry works. That's not how any industry works.
If you've signed an actual NDA, which is a legally binding contract stating you will not talk about [subject] until a ccertain point (or simply ever), then yes, breaking that contract may mean you are subject to a lawsuit, whether you broke the terms of the NDA or not is very quick and simple to prove, and you'll be paying a huge fine and/or getting some time behind bars, depending on the exact nature of the subject at hand.
... But that requires the manufacturer to spend a lot of time and money drawing up legally sound contracts, getting copies posted off and signed, everyone filing everything correctly, and nobody can be bothered. It also opens up the possibility of leaks as if you send someone a contract saying "you will not talk about the R3 until 11am on the 14th", and then that person simply does not agree to sign that contract... well, you've just told them the R3 is coming and what kind of time frame it should be arriving. You've leaked yourself.

What actually happens, in this and every other industry you can name, is manufacturers strike non-binding embargos with outlets and influencers. An embargo doesn't require anything to be signed like an NDA does. If someone breaks the embargo you can't level any kind of charges against them, but outlets won't break the embargo because they know if they do you'll never cooperate with them again. The threat of financial penalty is not there; nobody would have to pay Canon a single penny if they set an R3 or 100-400 hands-on video live a half day early, for example. But Canon would never send that channel a review unit ever again. They'd never invite them to press events again. They'd never give them any support reviewing any further products. If you break an embargo, that's it, you're blacklisted by that company. Other companies will also notice that you broke embargo and they will stop working with you, too. And if a channel, site or magazine can't get review units sent to them, they are pretty much out of business; very few people can afford to buy every product they want or need to review, and even when they can afford it, the nature of coverage now is so focused on being the first to publish that waiting for a retail unit to be delivered often means your review will not get enough traffic to make any money.

This is also why those outlets and channels which always have a ''review'' ready to go within minutes of announcement must always be taken with the largest barrel of salt you can fathom. They're never under contract to suck up to the manufacturer—nobody is ever "paid off", and as a side note, accusing someone of being paid off or secretly under contract is in fact illegal, yes, even 'just' in a youtube comment, so nobody should ever do that—but they are under pressure to not rock the boat much. Manufacturers will blacklist you for breaking embargo, for giving one product a negative review, or simply because you told a bad joke in the bar after a press event one time, so every outlet and channel does have incentive to play nice and go easy on everything. It's just not a direct financial penalty incentive. That's why you so rarely hear anyone say any part of a new product is actually "bad", just "average" at worst. It's the old 7-10 scale: nothing is allowed to be given less than a 7/10 or you'll never get work again.


So, no, nobody would have to pay any money to Canon. But if they break the embargo with a company of that size they'll struggle to produce work again, and cease earning money.

(I've signed more NDAs in my lifetime than I care to remember and I've also been blacklisted by a fair few companies, so believe me when I say the pressure manufacturers put on outlets is very, very real.)
Time behind bars for a breach of contract. That is pretty rough. I guess it may depend on the jurisdiction of governing law, but I don't expect any country under which these NDA's were contracted would give jail time, but who knows?
 

FrenchFry

Wildlife enthusiast!
Jun 14, 2020
463
583
how about shorter minimum focus distance?! ;)
Yes! With corresponding higher max reproduction ratio!!!!

RF 100-500 has a minimum focus distance of 90cm and max magnification of 0.33x, compared to 370cm and 0.15x on the EF 500mm F4.
EF 100-400 II has a minimum focus distance of 98cm and max magnification of 0.31x, compared to 250cm and 0.17x on the EF 400mm F2.8 III.

It would be so nice to be able to use the new big whites for photos of large insects (and similarly-sized items like flowers) like we can use the excellent 100-4/500 zooms for these subjects for ideal subject isolation.
 
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FrenchFry

Wildlife enthusiast!
Jun 14, 2020
463
583
Honest question: with or without massive focus breathing? I really like the 1.2m MFD on the 100-500, but at MFD on the long end it's more like a 290mm, AlanF measured it a while back.
Obviously without focus breathing is preferred, but as long as the max reproduction ratio increases, getting the close focus capabilities improved on big whites would great.