Here is the Canon Cinema EOS C70

PureClassA

Canon since age 5. The A1
CR Pro
Aug 15, 2014
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Mandeville, LA
Shields-Photography.com
I really want the R6 but two things are really stopping me from pulling the trigger.

1)No dual slot recording.

2)Micro HDMI

Why put in two slots, if you cant even use them?!
Is this coming in a firmware update or what?!
Well they work for stills. Just not video. But I imagine dual recording in those modes produces a lot of heat and may have something to do with that. And yeah I hate the Micro port. Hate it. But I’ll live with it. Not a deal breaker
 
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telemaque

Before Sunset
CR Pro
Nov 30, 2019
121
77
VIDEOS Camera Bodies for serious amateurs:

I was very happy reading the Canon R6 specs and really thought I would buy it.
I am looking at it with a pure Video approach. I do not need a new body for Photography.

Before making a decision on buying this new body I wanted to see the feedback from some bloggers I do trust.
For example this Austrian guy from Cine5D.

Well here is his experience on the R6:

Quite sad, when you know he is a very honest person testing cameras with seriousness...
Impossible to consider buying a body that is not reliable on the field...
Ridiculous to be obliged to wait so long between different video sessions.

Even more sad, watching afterwards his review of the Sony A7S iii, showing a camera that is apparently close to perfect for a documentary film maker like him.

So this information on the C70 is not really exciting me, especially at that price level.

For me, the current conclusion is sad (with a pure video approach only):
  • at acceptable price levels for amateurs ie 2000 to 3000 Euros, Canon is offering bodies less interesting than other brands Lumix, Sony and Fuji.
  • at professional price level ie 4000 to 6000 Euros the competition on mirroless is even bigger with new Lumix and continuous Sony progress on their recent launched bodies (S1H, A7S iii).
  • at industry price level, ie above 6000 up to 12000 Euros, maybe Canon finds his way and seems to receive good feedback from professionals.
This seems to confirm my very old posts saying, me with my 2000-3000 Euros budget, I am not the commercial target of Canon.
I said this summer if R6 was in the field as good as what we read on paper, I would be the most happy customer and would buy it.

Sadly this happy end will not arrive.

Again, I wish to remind Canon leaders, that there are a bunch a customers interested in videos with my budget around 2000-3000 Euros and it is incredible to see that Canon is not able to produce an equivallent of the Lumix GH5, with maybe an APS-C sensor, but with the equivallent video options offered by Lumix ?!

The review of Cine5D on the Canon R6 is a shame for Canon.
How come, can Canon launch a body clearly oriented into videos that can not work on permanent basis during a full day of shooting?

Let's see what the new Cine Line will show ?!
Saying I have strong hopes would be a lie...
 

SecureGSM

2 x 5D IV
Feb 26, 2017
2,360
1,231
VIDEOS Camera Bodies for serious amateurs:

I was very happy reading the Canon R6 specs and really thought I would buy it.
I am looking at it with a pure Video approach. I do not need a new body for Photography.

Before making a decision on buying this new body I wanted to see the feedback from some bloggers I do trust.
For example this Austrian guy from Cine5D.

Well here is his experience on the R6:

Quite sad, when you know he is a very honest person testing cameras with seriousness...
Impossible to consider buying a body that is not reliable on the field...
Ridiculous to be obliged to wait so long between different video sessions.

Even more sad, watching afterwards his review of the Sony A7S iii, showing a camera that is apparently close to perfect for a documentary film maker like him.

So this information on the C70 is not really exciting me, especially at that price level.

For me, the current conclusion is sad (with a pure video approach only):
  • at acceptable price levels for amateurs ie 2000 to 3000 Euros, Canon is offering bodies less interesting than other brands Lumix, Sony and Fuji.
  • at professional price level ie 4000 to 6000 Euros the competition on mirroless is even bigger with new Lumix and continuous Sony progress on their recent launched bodies (S1H, A7S iii).
  • at industry price level, ie above 6000 up to 12000 Euros, maybe Canon finds his way and seems to receive good feedback from professionals.
This seems to confirm my very old posts saying, me with my 2000-3000 Euros budget, I am not the commercial target of Canon.
I said this summer if R6 was in the field as good as what we read on paper, I would be the most happy customer and would buy it.

Sadly this happy end will not arrive.

Again, I wish to remind Canon leaders, that there are a bunch a customers interested in videos with my budget around 2000-3000 Euros and it is incredible to see that Canon is not able to produce an equivallent of the Lumix GH5, with maybe an APS-C sensor, but with the equivallent video options offered by Lumix ?!

The review of Cine5D on the Canon R6 is a shame for Canon.
How come, can Canon launch a body clearly oriented into videos that can not work on permanent basis during a full day of shooting?

Let's see what the new Cine Line will show ?!
Saying I have strong hopes would be a lie...
++++ How come, can Canon launch a body clearly oriented into videos that can not work on permanent basis during a full day of shooting?

A.M.: no, it is not. It is a photography centric body with some video functionality included.
 
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Aug 19, 2016
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My hunch about the price. It won't be more than $5499.
Why?
Canon C300 price: $10999
Canon C200 price: $ 5499
Canon C100 price: $ 2699
As the numbers come down, the price decreases. That has been the logic so far.

Now okay, C100 is only a HD camera. So C70, with a 4K spec (hopefully) will be more than that. But it can't be more than the price of C200, that would make no sense. Because C200 gives us CinemaRawLite. If this camera only gives us 422 10 bit internal, there's no justification that it's price can go beyond the C200 price. That would make no sense and would make this camera a dud at launch. So I would expect a price which is lower than C200.
 

telemaque

Before Sunset
CR Pro
Nov 30, 2019
121
77
++++ How come, can Canon launch a body clearly oriented into videos that can not work on permanent basis during a full day of shooting?

A.M.: no, it is not. It is a still first body with some video functionality included.

I hear your remark but I disagree with it.
If you are not targetting Videos as a main target, why should you produce a Mirrorless camera?

What improvement do you get from Mirrorless cameras versus DSLR for stills?
I don't think you get much of improvements? Maybe I am wrong, I would be happy reading those reasons.
In my opinion main reason why the 1D line is still a DSLR, because its target is professional stills mostly.

If the target would be mainly Stills, they would have launched a new Canon 5D ... with improved videos features.
If you see differently, please let me know why. Interested to understand your thoughts.

Sony and Lumix invested on Mirrorless cameras mostly for video reasons.
Only way to be able to have the possibility to check the focus during recording a video, having a mirrorless camera.
 

SecureGSM

2 x 5D IV
Feb 26, 2017
2,360
1,231
I hear your remark but I disagree with it.
If you are not targetting Videos as a main target, why should you produce a Mirrorless camera?

What improvement do you get from Mirrorless cameras versus DSLR for stills?
I don't think you get much of improvements? Maybe I am wrong, I would be happy reading those reasons.
In my opinion main reason why the 1D line is still a DSLR, because its target is professional stills mostly.

If the target would be mainly Stills, they would have launched a new Canon 5D ... with improved videos features.
If you see differently, please let me know why. Interested to understand your thoughts.

Sony and Lumix invested on Mirrorless cameras mostly for video reasons.
Only way to be able to have the possibility to check the focus during recording a video, having a mirrorless camera.
++++ If the target would be mainly Stills, they would have launched a new Canon 5D

A.M.: R5 was positioned as a 5 series camera.

++++ What improvement do you get from Mirrorless cameras versus DSLR for stills?

A.M. in a few words: almost every single metric of the R5 is a massive Improvement over the DSLR 5D line Except: lesser battery life and lack of OVF.
 

SteveC

R5
CR Pro
Sep 3, 2019
2,577
2,473
What improvement do you get from Mirrorless cameras versus DSLR for stills?
I don't think you get much of improvements? Maybe I am wrong, I would be happy reading those reasons.
In my opinion main reason why the 1D line is still a DSLR, because its target is professional stills mostly.

Try: 1) being able to see what you'll get in the viewfinder 2) autofocus points everywhere 3) All sorts of autofocus options not possible (or much more difficult) with a mirror.

I'm sure others could come up with a much longer list.

To say that mirrorless is only beneficial to video is simply ignorant.

Therefore it is entirely possible to create a mirrorless camera aimed at stills shooters, and Canon has been doing so for a couple of years. They did reasonably well with the R and RP, and superbly with the R5 and R6.
 

telemaque

Before Sunset
CR Pro
Nov 30, 2019
121
77
++++ What improvement do you get from Mirrorless cameras versus DSLR for stills?

A.M. in a few words: almost every single metric of the R5 is a massive Improvement over the DSLR 5D line Except: lesser battery life and lack of OVF.

I don't want to bother you. I wish to understand simply.

If you would name 2 or 3 major improvements what would you list?

From your comments, I see maybe I have misunderstood the value of the R5 on the stills side.
Thanks for your feedback.
 

telemaque

Before Sunset
CR Pro
Nov 30, 2019
121
77
Try: 1) being able to see what you'll get in the viewfinder 2) autofocus points everywhere 3) All sorts of autofocus options not possible (or much more difficult) with a mirror.

I'm sure others could come up with a much longer list.

To say that mirrorless is only beneficial to video is simply ignorant.

Therefore it is entirely possible to create a mirrorless camera aimed at stills shooters, and Canon has been doing so for a couple of years. They did reasonably well with the R and RP, and superbly with the R5 and R6.

I am trying to understand and I appreciate your feedback.

I might be ignorant and have no problem recognizing it.
 

SecureGSM

2 x 5D IV
Feb 26, 2017
2,360
1,231
I don't want to bother you. I wish to understand simply.

If you would name 2 or 3 major improvements what would you list?

From your comments, I see maybe I have misunderstood the value of the R5 on the stills side.
Thanks for your feedback.
1. AF improvements across the board :
- no need to AFMA your lenses anymore.
- ratio of in focus vs missed focus shots is much higher for R5
2. IBIS
3. much wider AF spread covering entire frame
4. better continues AF , tracking abilities, eyeAF
5. Much higher FPS
6. A Silent shutter mode
7. WYSIWYG viewfinder. exposure simulation
8. blackout free shooting.
9. oh.. An ability to Auto focus at F22!!.
10. An ability to confidently AF in low light settings

and so on and so forth
 
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Feb 9, 2020
6
7
My hunch about the price. It won't be more than $5499.
Why?
Canon C300 price: $10999
Canon C200 price: $ 5499
Canon C100 price: $ 2699
As the numbers come down, the price decreases. That has been the logic so far.

Now okay, C100 is only a HD camera. So C70, with a 4K spec (hopefully) will be more than that. But it can't be more than the price of C200, that would make no sense. Because C200 gives us CinemaRawLite. If this camera only gives us 422 10 bit internal, there's no justification that it's price can go beyond the C200 price. That would make no sense and would make this camera a dud at launch. So I would expect a price which is lower than C200.

If the rumored specs based on an earlier post are true...


...I'd say this camera could have more attractive specs than the C200. I know it does for me. It doesn't have internal RAW but it does have the same new dual gain sensor as the C300 Mark III and based on what I've read it sounds like it's fantastic for low light and a higher dynamic range than the C200's sensor. The biggest weakness that the C200 had was it's 8 bit 4:2:0 then jumps to RAW with no middle ground. 10 bit 4:2:2 is a broadcast standard and I see myself needing that more often than RAW for the majority of the work that I do.

I know exactly why this doesn't have internal RAW because it would hurt the C300 Mark III's sales. It makes perfect sense to me. Plus I wouldn't be surprised if this new camera could do RAW externally. I can totally see a Ninja V getting a firmware update down the road that would be able to do this because Atomos always seems to cater towards Canon. I'm just speculating of course but it wouldn't surprise me. I'd rather record RAW externally anyway because you can get so much more for your money with SSD's than expensive CFast cards.
 
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telemaque

Before Sunset
CR Pro
Nov 30, 2019
121
77
Why? I don't remember Canon itself positioning R6 as a video camera.

Honestly, I also understood R6 to be a Video camera... It is only the answers on my post today that made me realize it was not.
Thanks to the members of CR for clarifying what R5 and R6 were really offering to the photographers.

I suppose we all only hear and remember what we want to hear and remember...
So this confusion comes mostly from my own expectations.

However, having Canon pushing all over the place the R5 is a monster that can shoot 8K video internally and R6 being its little brother...
did not help stupid people like me to understand it is a photo/still centric camera.

In real life, I am a commercial director and was a marketing director in the chemical industry.
The least I can say is that the marketing message was not appropriate.
It is not a serious problem for me, just the feeling that I have really missed the point...

I think Canon should better adjust their marketing message.
This bizarre R5 marketing message has created a huge hope in the video makers community and now is creating a huge disappointment.

Reading other posts from CR members I understand these R5 and R6 bodies are a big satisfaction on the photographic/still side...
So why promoting 8K video feature for the R5? Especially if this feature is dramatically limited because of overheating issues?

This is not the first time Canon is criticized on products that are in fact very good products but surprisingly marketed...
 
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telemaque

Before Sunset
CR Pro
Nov 30, 2019
121
77
So sonys option at $3k is a steal. Its a cine camera 1st. Then xlr k3m gives you x l r inputs 4 channels. Plus polarpro Mattebox with ND filters gets you 95% there.

With proper Rig you can't go wrong. Add about another $1500-$2000.

Still less than $6k though. And still FF. If you own EF glass A7siii should be an option for video.. if you own RF glass then A7siii is Not for you unless u sell your glass.

Thanks for your different posts. Looking myself for a video camera, I read them with great interest.
I have some EF lenses and was impressed by the different reviews of the Sony A7S iii.

Have you experienced Sony with EF lenses?
Were you happy with the results?
Any adaptor to highlight or MC11 is good enough?

Thanks for your feedback.
 

Tony Bennett

EOS M50
Mar 8, 2017
49
61
Same here mate. Just took the decision to return my R5 and get an a7siii.
Im quite amazed though how Sony played canon. They won the war.
And I’m even convinced that when the a7iv comes out it’ll be a more capable hybrid than the R5.

Time to invest in some good FE glass now.
Glad you're gone. I ditched two A7III's and Sony's not as good glass to remain a Canon user.
 

Tony Bennett

EOS M50
Mar 8, 2017
49
61
I feel for canon R5 users tbh. The way canon hyped this camera up It was best thing since sliced bread. 2x stats not disclosed during all the hype. #1 DR canon knows how to test dr and when its amazing they surely tell ppl and brag. The c300iii did 16+ and it was marketed everywhere. The other one is R5 and the codecs. No pro line h264 was telling to me. I never thought sony would fo it. Truth is h265 is not backed by cpus yet. Power to edit not there. U need proxies.

As for R5 and ninja to get 4k prores kinda a workaround. With Sony a7siii you use ninja to get 16bit raw linear = 12bit log raw. If it good enough for Arri its good enough for me. Sony using pro fx9 codec is bc of R5 specs. Who says competition ain't good.

If I owned R5 I'd be on them for h264 pro codec!!
Another Sony troll.
 

Tony Bennett

EOS M50
Mar 8, 2017
49
61
He just joined Saturday and he feels sorry for R5 users. His words, not mine. Another is StevenSteven. He just joined in June and is openly dissing the R5 then says in a more recent post he returned his to buy his beloved Sony. He's a liar. He never had the R5. These trolls come on here and try to spit venom then leave never to be heard from again.