More features and specifications for the Canon EOS R3 have emerged

SwissFrank

from EOS 1N to R
Dec 9, 2018
608
343
an ultrafast pair of exposures with a few stops difference could make shots possible that aren't, with current technology
The way described in a Canon patent maybe 18 months ago is:

Every receptor cell has TWO charge buckets and the sensor can instantly change between charge being distributed in one bucket or the other.

This can be alternated EXTREMELY rapidly, for instance 1 nanosec in bucket 1, 999 in bucket 2, repeating over and over.

So say you take a 1/1000 sec photo, and there's even motion blur in the photo. You'd get 1000 slices of exposure in each bucket, with bucket 1 being 10 stops underexposed. As long as subject movement was slow enough, the result would look continuous in both exposures. Now, if the object moved well over 1000 pixels in the resulting picture, then the underexpose would show the motion as a little disconnected. But that's a fast object to move so far in 1/1000 sec! In the normal case of something moving only a few pixels or a few hundred, and further not so focused that it only illuminates a single pixel while not illuminating neighbors at all, it'd look very smooth.

Besides this capability of nearly doubling dynamic range, you also can use the sensor for global shutter: when finished with a (normal DR) shot in bucket 1, just switch to bucket 2 which you never bother to read. Then take your time to read out bucket 1 and you get the effect of global shutter.

Under normal shooting, of course, you'd think each charge bucket was about half the normal size and thus limited in headroom for bright objects. But in this case it alternates 50/50 between bucket 1 and 2, so can store about the same charge across two buckets the the standard design could in 1.

There's one more trick in the patent I forget.

Anyway, I'm about half-convinced we'll see this special new sensor in a camera slotted above the R5 within a year or two, and if so it will be actually quite revolutionary.
 

StoicalEtcher

EOS RP
CR Pro
Jan 3, 2018
407
349
Yorkshire
Canon has never been the one to "target" specific users. Sony does that. I HATE that. Canon makes cameras that appeal to all users. For example, the 1Dx cameras appealed to wedding photographers AND sports photographers, etc. I've always loved that about canon. With cameras like the R5 available, there is no way a sub-36ish mp camera will appeal to wedding photographers, unless it has some insane low light abilities or something. If they do target this specific genre of photographer, they will be breaking from what they've always done. It will be extremely disappointing and they will have lost a permeant canon mirrorless convert.
I've highlighted part of your response - because that is effectively what I am suggesting: I don't think Canon would be saying the R3 is the camera for wedding photographers, given the way they are setting it up in their press releases.

Now, that doesn't mean it wouldn't perhaps be a great camera for all sorts of uses - not just sport/wildlife/news PJs - and even perhaps for those wedding 'togs that prefer lower mp over higher too. But if the R5 does what some need, then Canon doesn't have to say the R3 is a replacement for it, rather a different tool for those with different needs/desires.

Cheers.
 

Toglife_Anthony

Hit the G.A.S. & pump the brakes at the same time!
Apr 2, 2020
58
75
Why, if someone has a Canon camera and they buy another one, is this necessarily 'brand loyalty' ? I use Canon as my working cameras and I wanted a (jacket) pocketable APS-c compact. I have no brand loyalty at all, and I looked at the Ricoh GRIII and Fujica X100V, but the best one for me was the Canon G1XIII. Brand loyalty had nothing to do with it, it's a case of Canon coming up with the best camera.
You dug too deep. Obviously some people buy cameras on a case-by-case basis and will go with whatever brand. My comment was in general, and generally once people buy into a brand, they'll stick with that brand. This goes beyond cameras.
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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The EVF seems very very protruding compared to the 1DXmkIII.
I'm not a pro nor user of such a body, but could be an issue to store it intoa bag no?

How many pros using this type of body have you ever seen storing such a camera in a bag? If traveling via air they use hard cases. Otherwise, the ones I know tend to carry them on their person or throw them, unbagged, on the passenger seat or in the trunks of their cars.
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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Long form video is very popular. Set the camera for an interview or wildlife scene etc and let it run, then edit out the good bits. Indeed in interviews getting the camera and gear handling out of the equation is very important, nothing breaks the flow of things quite like somebody saying cut I have to reset the camera!

On the other hand, when shooting such long form video, where focus is set and remains unchanged, far less capable cameras can do just as well of a job.
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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*Most* of the things I've needed to record over the pandemic (which got me into videography) have been longer than 30 minutes.
Interviews
Weddings (like a documentary recording)
Church Services/Sermon recordings
Conference presentations

I realize there are lots of things that don't need long-form recording capability, but there are lots of things that do, and I've found cameras with artificial record time limits are more trouble than they're worth in those situations.

It was enough of an issue that I went and bought a used C300.

And C300 bodies, or even older and less capable dedicated video cameras, work well in those situations where high performance AF and other advanced features are not required.
 
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Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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I would really love that! In that case it could also be 45 to 50Mp. A R3 that is a superset of R5 (don't mind the video) would interest me a lot!

DiG!C X isn't a single chip like previous iterations, it's an architecture. So increased data throughput wouldn't be described as "Dual DiG!C X".
 
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Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
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The record limit being removed is not for scenes would be my guess. A lot of professionals do long format recording for interviews, shows, and corporate events. An unlimited record limit would prove invaluable for those professionals. That said, these professionals are probably doing external recording to a monitor like the Ninja V+ anyways.

Or they're using their older, cheaper, and less capable cameras for the stationary shots and using the higher end cameras with greater capabilities for the shots that actually need that capability.
 
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Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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If they do come out with a global shutter in a R... body, I'm guessing that they will put a ND filter in it to protect the sensor when the lens is removed (as well as having the ND function).

It has a mechanical shutter. When closed, a mechanical shutter completely covers the sensor.
 
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Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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Honestly a good bet, and would even make sense to help boost the value of the R1 if it does end up being in the $7500 range, which nowadays is significantly more expensive than the C200 or C70, both of which have ND filters. The ND filters on the cinema cameras serve the same function, and due to the different sensor tech needed for global shutter, I doubt a global shutter sensor would even function with a mechanical shutter.

Why would a global sensor not function with a mechanical shutter? When mechanical shutters are used, readout isn't started until after the mechanical shutter is closed.
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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Since Canon hasn't dangled any R3 MP carrots, my guess is much lower MP's than what most people had anticipated for this camera. Looks like the envisioned higher MP body is a ways off, yet. This may very well validate some of the opinions out there that the R3 was actually intended to be the R1 but after Sony's A1 release, Canon decided to rethink its high end offerings and release dates. Still, the R3 looks to be a body that will be well received by sports and action photographers. Bird photographers may just have to wait awhile longer for some other Canon surprise high MP or APSC offering. Is there a soon to be R7 just around the corner?? After all, no one expected this R3 body when Canon made the sudden and surprising announcement. Maybe Private by Design is right and we shouldn't get so hung up on MP. However, since the pixel peepers may now be let down a bit, it may behoove Canon to put it all out there, play their cards and show us their R3 hand. No bluff, no tease, just show us what you've got. Lay their cards on the table for everyone to see. Then, being able to make an informed decision, we'll either buy it or not.

They'll certainly announce the full specs before you're able to buy it.
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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I know the R3 isn't supposed to be a high MP camera, but I really do hope it has at least 24 MP. I'd feel let down at only 20.

There's no real practical difference between 20 and 24 MP. It's only a 3.4% difference in linear resolution.

EDIT: I must have been half asleep when I did the math. It's actually 9.5%, but that's still fairly inconsequential. Instead of a display size of, say, 36x24, you can enlarge to 39x26 and get the same number of pixels per inch.
 
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Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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I don't know why the mechanical shutter is such a power hog in the R5 - as a consequence I'm not using it much in the field, but I do hope they optimize the power in the R3, in addition to the stacked voltage advantage

It's not just the shutter. It's also the energy needed to refocus the lens between each frame.
 
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Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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Hi David, here is what I see at this canon europe link

JPEG: 2 compression options RAW: RAW, C-RAW 14 bit (14-bit with Mechanical shutter and Electronic 1st Curtain, 13-bit A/D conversion with H+ mode, 12-bit A/D conversion with Electronic shutter, Canon original RAW 3rd edition) HEIF: 10bit HEIF is available in HDR shooting with [HDR PQ] set to [Enable] Complies with Exif 2.31 and Design rule for Camera File system 2.0 Complies with Digital Print Order Format [DPOF] Version 1.1

parsed out,
H mode, MS or EFCS : 14bit depth
H+ mode, MS or EFCS : 13bit depth -- makes sense, to shoot faster need faster sensor readout, so drop 1 bit of resolution and tradeoff with a slightly lower SNR
ES : 12bit depth -- same as above, need to read faster
As an aside .. I see posters here asking for ES options for 10, 20, 30 fps .. but the readout still has to be done in the same amount of time to prevent rolling shutter effects, so ES will stay at 12bit ... I think.

I can't wrap my head around the power requirements between these modes though. if it was the electronics pathway from sensor to card that was power hungry, ES should have also degraded at lower than 50% batt levels, but it doesn't. I mean I get performance degradation at low batt levels, but 50% ;)

Again, the primary power issue is the energy needed to refocus the lens between each shot.
 
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Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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The EOS-1R is still two years away so I feel like I'll have to buy the R3 even though I have two R5's.

It'll be the EOS R1. They dropped the dash between EOS and the number when they went from film to digital models. They reversed the numbers/letter in the model names between the EF and RF mount, just like they reversed the letter/number order between the FD and EF mount.
 

rick1

EOS M6 Mark II
Sep 8, 2016
65
36
Sorry, that doesn’t make any sense to me. Every company has a target user in mind when they develop a product. Otherwise they would just make 1 product in total right? Segmentation within a product lineup is of course something that Canon employs. But please correct me if I have mis understood what you are getting at?
For example, sony released an updated A9ii with new features that ONLY targeted sports photographers. Canon has never done that. Whenever they release a new mainstream camera they add features that a wide variety of people will benefit from. Their 1Dx cameras were only 30% less megapixels than their 5DmIV which made them beneficial to other photographers besides sports photographers. With the current technology, and with the R5 being 45mp, to keep the same pace, the R3 would need to be 32mp at least.