Next EOS not a 1Ds4 or 5D3.... could be a 1D Mark 5? [CR2]

[Canon Rumors]

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<strong>What’s coming?

</strong><a href="http://www.canonrumors.com/2011/10/rumored-1d-mark-v-for-october-spec-list-cr1/">Last weeks mention of a 1D Mark V spec list</a> was for the most part dismissed by yours truly. The spec list just seemed too detailed. However, my mind could be changing with new information that has trickled in over the last couple of weeks.</p>
<p>It’s looking more and more like a camera will be announced by Canon in 2011, however it may not be available until the new year.</p>
<p><strong>What I do know

</strong></p>
<ul>
<li><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-weight: normal;">The next EOS camera will NOT be a 5D Mark III.</span></li>
<li><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-weight: normal;">The next EOS camera will probably not be a 1Ds Mark IV. Probably is the key word here, it could change.</span></li>
<li><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-weight: normal;">The next EOS camera will not be an APS-C camera.</span></li>
</ul>
<p><strong>What’s left?

</strong><a href="http://www.canonrumors.com/2011/09/a-new-entry-level-full-frame-camera-cr1/">A new model camera</a> introduced to the lineup, or a replacement of a <a href="http://www.canonrumors.com/2011/08/stoke-the-1d-mark-v-fire/">current camera</a>. I’m currently leaning towards a replacement of the 1D Mark IV.</p>
<p>Line amalgamation of the 1D and 1Ds? Maybe not in the literal sense we’ve been told. However, they could definitely take on the same form factor. By making the Mark V a full frame camera. That would lower production costs, tooling and everything else that comes with sharing parts across camera models.</p>
<p><strong>A Loose 1D Mark V spec list based on multiple pieces of information

</strong></p>
<ul>
<li><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-weight: normal;">Full Frame</span></li>
<li>16-20mp Range</li>
<li>Native ISO 51,200</li>
<li>Dual DIGIC V</li>
<li>Frame Rate Unknown</li>
<li>EOS Video Features Unknown.</li>
</ul>
<p>October 18 coincides with previous mentions of an announcement the third week of October. The rumor last week from DCI also mentions October 18, as does the CPS invite in The Netherlands.</p>
<p>If this is coming in 10 days, I expect to see a lot more info coming my way.</p>
<p>I was told <a href="http://www.canonrumors.com/2011/03/5d3-1d5-and-1ds4-timeline-cr1/">as long as 6 months ago</a>, that the next EOS camera would be a 1D Mark V.</p>
<p><strong>Lenses?

</strong>I’m told more and more that Canon will be staggering announcements for the foreseeable future. You’ll see a body, and then a lens a while later, and so on.</p>
<p>I have nothing definitive to report on that topic.</p>
<p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;">c</span>r</strong></p>

 

[Justin]

This makes so little sense that I feel compelled to not even enumerate why.

 

[niccyboy]

I really doubt from a marketing perspective they would release a FF 1 series pro camera with equal or lower MP than the predecessors. Or one that doesn't equal or better the 3 year old D3x.

I know that there are so many arguments disputing the relevance of megapixel counts. But from a sales and branding perspective, being in line or ahead of your previous line and competitors and the continuation of a progression in increasing MP (that the average consumer watches) is important.

It isn't just the pros that look at 1d releases and pro camera releases... many rebel and 7d level consumers/prosumers follow these cameras, just as we all look at ferraris yet drive bmws/fords etc.

 

[gene_can_sing]

Here's a really strange thought. Why not just release the camera that everyone wants (5D3)? Then everyone will go out and millions of them. Release the camera that only a few people want (1D), you will sell very few of them and just piss off your customer base.

God forbid Canon does something that their customer base really want.

 

[thepancakeman]

I really doubt from a marketing perspective they would release a FF 1 series pro camera with equal or lower MP than the predecessors. Or one that doesn't equal or better the 3 year old D3x.

I know that there are so many arguments disputing the relevance of megapixel counts. But from a sales and branding perspective, being in line or ahead of your previous line and competitors and the continuation of a progression in increasing MP (that the average consumer watches) is important.

It isn't just the pros that look at 1d releases and pro camera releases... many rebel and 7d level consumers/prosumers follow these cameras, just as we all look at ferraris yet drive bmws/fords etc.

I guess I tend to disagree on what the average consumer is watching. I think the consumers that can afford a 1x are going to be saavy enough to understand MPs are not the defining factor, and those that can't afford it simply look at "what brand are the pros are shooting?" or else ignore the top end altogether.

Personally I tend to doubt the MP would be that low as well, but I'm also willing to say it's not out of the question if the rest of the performance is over the top.

 

[hambergler]

This makes so little sense that I feel compelled to not even enumerate why.

Why not?

I look it as a D3s Killer or D4s competitor with those specs it certainly could be.

5D and 1Ds = high MPixel cameras

this is low light monster with high high FPS and awesome autofocus

I would rather have this than a 5d Mark III though I would probably end up getting both

Currently the D3s > 1D Mark IV for everything the camera is meant to be IMO.

This camera is not meant to compete with the D3X so I don't know why anyone would draw that comparison unless it was confirmed they were merging the 1Ds and 1D lines


I think any current 1D Mark IV owners which is who this camera is geared toward would love the specs.

APS-H -> Full frame

12800 ISO -> 51200 ISO assuming you don't have to push would be insane

Add video features and that is a dream camera for me

 

[mjbehnke]

I have a very stupid question? If Canon is going to reduce the pro line to a 1Ds and a 5D, and possibly eliminate the Aps-h sensor, could this new 1D Mark V be a mirror-less camera?

Only reason I ask is, the 1D has always been a great high frame rate camera. Making it FF and going mirror-less would make it a pretty high speed fps camera.

Just my thoughts.

 

[AG]

As stupid as it sounds it could also be the mythical 6D video DSLR.

Thats not a 5D3 or 1D series.
Its still EOS
Its something a lot of 5D2 video shooters are hoping for.
It could "possibly" be Full Frame
It would not have to be huge MP sticking around the 18-24bracket.

/walks off and grabs flame suit.

 

[Leopard Lupus]

From my personal thoughts: Canon is long overdue for the release of camera body that appeals to the higher-end consumer (yes, I am classifying the 5D mk ll as a consumer body) but at the same time I can understand the need to update the smaller margin of professional line bodies. However, with a new affordable body ( 5D mk lll or not) would Canon really toss the upcoming holiday season out the window for a less desired, expensive pro body?

 

[te4o]

Hey, there is a lot more light out there than the current EOS are catching... I hope this one will improve precisely on this issue.
Weren't there rumours about shaking up the Canon lineup some months ago - there we go. The problem is we mere mortals will have to wait until the Canon shake-quake is over to find out what we can afford and what is reasonable.

BTW when does this contest finish so that I can read the really important stuff here?

 

[wtlloyd]

Two full-frame 1 series bodies, 1.3 crop sensor is gone, maybe to be revived down the road as a pro-sumer sensor. Why not?

1DV gets full frame, 20 megapixels, 10 frames/sec, for around $5k. Clean enough you can crop down if you want, something I personally found wanting in the 1Ds3. There will always be demand for this price point, it hits a comfort zone that's well established. Not every working photog or agency can afford to pay for one or more flagship bodies.

1DsV full frame, of course, around 4 or 5 frames/sec, mid-30's plus megapixels, sees introduction of some new trend setting tech. Bumps up to $9K or $10K. Maybe $12K if it's a serious MF challenger (in terms of file size)
We can assume the earthquake interrupted the staging of new models. If production was so compromised on components of existing models (have ya tried to buy a new 1DIV lately?) that restarting wasn't realistic, then the 1DV suggested in the thread doesn't seem so outta left field to me....

 

[niccyboy]

I really doubt from a marketing perspective they would release a FF 1 series pro camera with equal or lower MP than the predecessors. Or one that doesn't equal or better the 3 year old D3x.

I know that there are so many arguments disputing the relevance of megapixel counts. But from a sales and branding perspective, being in line or ahead of your previous line and competitors and the continuation of a progression in increasing MP (that the average consumer watches) is important.

It isn't just the pros that look at 1d releases and pro camera releases... many rebel and 7d level consumers/prosumers follow these cameras, just as we all look at ferraris yet drive bmws/fords etc.

I guess I tend to disagree on what the average consumer is watching. I think the consumers that can afford a 1x are going to be saavy enough to understand MPs are not the defining factor, and those that can't afford it simply look at "what brand are the pros are shooting?" or else ignore the top end altogether.

Personally I tend to doubt the MP would be that low as well, but I'm also willing to say it's not out of the question if the rest of the performance is over the top.

I understand what you are saying. I'm not talking about the consumers that will actually purchase it. i know a lot of my clients, and their representatives... art directors, creative directors, designers, stylists, journalists etc... they all have the consumer level cameras, and a lot of them talk to me about the gear and specs.

The consumers I am talking about are the XX & XXD consumers. They can't necessarily afford the Xds but they know what they are, and often basic specs.... they don't however know that MP isn't the be all and end all. But to them... the MP number increasing from model to model is logically an improvement.

Now the reason I mention these people is, the flagship range still represents canon's image and i think it does make a difference when it comes to whether they buy the 7dmk2 or the d7xxx... That's what i mean about the marketing perspective, I'm not talking about actual consumers buying it, they would be idiots not to actually know what they were purchasing.

HOWEVER.. if this does has some monster frame rate that or some other HUGE improvement on other features from the previous 1d models then it could obviously be plausible.

Or as someone else mentioned it could be the mythical entry level full frame or dedicated video FF dslr.

It does seem foolish not to refresh any of the pro line cameras, 1 and 5 are both due... but if they haven't released it, surely it's for a reason now... I think, pre-christmas 5dmk3 release would be a smart move... ( i don't think many people would get a 1 series for xmas, if so, i need friends like them haha)

Edited to fix my typos.

 

[Henry]

Have to admit that just about any pro level camera that Canon comes out with - I'm going to buy . Unless of course it's not full frame! So a 1D Mark V at a competitive price will make everyone happy ($3,000) - OK maybe a dream. Let's face it, we all want the new 5D MK 3 to beat the Nikon D800 in specs (36 MP) and in price! Just look at the new Sony 24 MP (not full frame), 12 fps, articulated LCD, *** $1,500 & 16-50 f/2.8 for about $650 (it's no L lens but then again $$$).

This all raises the bar for Canon - they're not idiots or we all wouldn't be using Canon equipment.

Here's what's important to me: 24+ MP, 19 + point cross type focus, outstanding metering options, auto ISO that's user selectable, be able to connect to computer to set programmable functions of the camera, user selectable control on all limits (tv, av, ISO, HDR), *** (this is optional - but Sony has it!), Radio control everything - flash ETTL, wifi (damn iPhone has it), 8 + fps, sky high native ISO 51,200 (awesome), in camera HDR (?), definitely more bracketing options, dual slots (CF & SD), Dual DIGIC V, full Video features, articulating LCD, sigh - call me a dreamer!

This camera will exist - it's just a matter of who puts it out first. Hopefully it's Canon and hopefully it's the next one announced and hopefully under $4,000.00 8)

Excuse the smiley faces!!

 

[macfly]

Well I guess in 8 days time I'll know if I'm returning to Nikon. If they can manage 36mp and Canon languishes in the weeds with 2004 mp levels, that'll be the end of our 24 year relationship.

 

[Canon 14-24]

I recall back, people were wishing for a 60d, but instead got a split in the line up with a new 7d first (with a couple folks balking at the initial price above their range) and then months later received a 60d that some felt underwhelmed too.

Could it be Canon possibly pulling a similar move with a new FF model with superior AF and then later release the 5d3 or are we going to get a curve ball with a non dslr or mirrorless model at this upcoming potential announcement?

 

[Dave]

First I don't believe in such a low MP rate. Okay... I think extremeley hight MP are completeley nonsense, from a marketing perspective you can't ignore the fact that the competitors are much further at this point.

5D or 1D...
I wouldn't wonder if they'll launch/announce both at the same time. But I'm quite sure that there will be at least one EOS announcement in 2011.

The big question is imo: What are the issues that distinguish a new 5D from a new 1D.
The 5D HAS to be "worse" in some perspective.

 

[rbr]

That camera, if this rumor is true, would have to be at least 26mp or it would be a step down for all the many the wildlife photographers who use and love the 1D MarkIV. Suddenly their 500, 600, and 800mm lenses will gather less pixels or they they are going to have to get 30% closer to their subjects. A lot of folks ain't gonna be happy. They better keep making the 1D4 also if this is true.

 

[Orion]

Well I guess in 8 days time I'll know if I'm returning to Nikon. If they can manage 36mp and Canon languishes in the weeds with 2004 mp levels, that'll be the end of our 24 year relationship.

with respect, I don't see how not comming with at least 36mp would make you switch back? Unless you need an image that is that large for billboards, etc . . . ? and after 24 years

 

[recon photography]

i dont know where this information came from, but i find it hard to believe. The new pro model full-frame or 1.3 crop will be more likely to have 32mp than 16mp

 

[Ivar]

I think this is the key item for the next 1D - keep the density.

More supportive arguments against low MP count:
* As Sony has already demonstrated, it is possible to move 24MP@12fps
* on print, the ISO will be no worse on higher MP camera using the same technology and sensor size
* premature replacement of the 1D series (it is only 2 years old) needs compelling reasons, not another supposedly 2 years product for pro-s

That camera, if this rumor is true, would have to be at least 26mp or it would be a step down for all the many the wildlife photographers who use and love the 1D MarkIV. Suddenly their 500, 600, and 800mm lenses will gather less pixels or they they are going to have to get 30% closer to their subjects. A lot of folks ain't gonna be happy. They better keep making the 1D4 also if this is true.