The Best of Photokina 2016, and a Few Things That Make You Go Hmmmm

Canon Rumors Guy

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We didn’t head to Photokina this year for a host of reasons, but we definitely paid attention to what was going on. It looks like it has been a great show with a lot of great announcements.</p>
<p>I figured I’d rank the best things we saw at Photokina, and a few things we’ll have to wait and see on. Keep in mind, beyond the EOS 5D Mark IV, we haven’t actually had our hands on any of the gear announced in Cologne.</p>
<p>You can see all the Photokina items for preorder <a href="https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/buy/items/ci/32624/ipp/60/N/3614572237/view/GRID/bi/2466/kbid/3296">over at B&H Photo</a>.</p>
<p><strong>Top Announcements at Photokina</strong></p>
<p><strong>Fujifilm GFX 50S</strong></p>
<p>I’m so happy that the rumors of Fujifilm medium format system has turned out to be true. What excites me more is that it’s likely to come in at under $10,000 USD including a prime lens.</p>
<p>I think the sub $10,000 medium format segment is potentially bigger than some people thing and that they’re going to sell a lot of cameras. What’s most important is that Fuji must get the lenses for the system out to the market as quickly as possible, when people don’t have lens options, they tend to look elsewhere. Fuji can make great lenses, so I’m not worried about the quality of the optics.</p>
<p>The Leica S has always been my favorite “medium format” body, but I’m staying away from the system until we see a 50mp or higher sensor (I’d love to see 80mp). The lenses are absolutely stellar, as are the ergonomics of the camera, but I just can’t justify the cost for the resolution.</p>
<p>I think the GFX 50S will pass the Pentax 645 system in popularity fairly quickly.</p>
<p>Well done Fujifilm, there’s a chance you’re going to take my money.</p>
<p><strong>Canon EOS  5D Mark IV</strong></p>
<p>I count this as a Photokina announcement, and I was so impressed they were able to get it to the masses so quickly. This is obviously the only product on this list I’ve had the chance to play with, and I think it’s a great step forward for the 5D line.</p>
<p>When you release a replacement for the most popular full frame camera in the world, you’re going to get a ton of criticism along with praise. Most of the criticism has come from the videographer world, while I respect their opinions. The majority of buyers for the EOS 5D Mark IV will be using the camera for still photography, just like the previous iterations. We did some unscientific market research at Lens Rentals Canada, and more that 95% of the people that rented the 5D Mark III, did so for still photography.</p>
<p>This camera is going to be a workhorse for professionals the world over for many years to come.</p>
<p>Well done Canon, you already took my money.</p>
<p><strong>Sigma 85mm f/1.4 DG Art</strong></p>
<p>It’s finally here! It seems the entire photography community has been waiting for the 85mm f/1.4 Art and the excitement for the announcement has been over the top.</p>
<p>Sigma is promising that this lens will equal the Zeiss Otus 85mm f/1.4 in optical performance, and give you the benefit of autofocus for a fraction of the cost. If Sigma gets anywhere near this claim, they’re going to have themselves a massive success.</p>
<p>We’re hoping for a new Canon EF 85mm f/1.2L III some time in 2017, because it may be hard to resist this Sigma offering.</p>
<p><strong>Canon EF 16-35mm f/2.8L III</strong></p>
<p>I had this preordered a week before it was announced, it’s by far the most anticipated product in my world. If this lens carries on the performance of Canon lenses released in the last couple of years, it’s going to become the best wide angle zoom in the world.</p>
<p>I’m hoping for better optical performance than the brilliant EF 16-35mm f/4L IS, with the added bonus of an extra stop of light for event photography.</p>
<p>I’ve found the EF 11-24mm f/4L to be too wide and too big for most of my uses, even though it is an amazing piece of glass.</p>
<p>I have a feeling a lot credit cards will be getting abused once this lens starts shipping.</p>
<p><strong>The Top Wait and See Announcements at Photokina</strong></p>
<p><strong>Sigma 500mm f/4 OS Sport</strong></p>
<p>The knock on Sigma has always been consistent autofocus performance. If there was a focal length where consistency is paramount, 500mm would be it. We’re hoping Sigma has improved in this area and that the brand new $6000 supertelephoto turns out to be a steal, considering the brilliant Canon equivalent is about 50% more expensive.</p>
<p>Tamron seems to have focused on AF accuracy over AF speed, and I’ve found their latest primes to be about as consistent as you can expect from a third party manufacturer. The slightly slower speed of the AF hasn’t bothered me for my shooting style.</p>
<p><strong>Canon EOS M5</strong></p>
<p>I had some initial excitement for this camera. It looks to be a lot better from a ergonomic standpoint as well as technologically. The 24.2mp sensor is a great APS-C sensor and DPAF is a remarkable technology.</p>
<p>My problem is they still haven’t addressed the lens issues with the EOS M system. This is a $1000 camera body, and as such, there should be some higher end fast primes available for it. I will never use an 18-150mm f/3.5-6.3 IS STM, no matter how great it is.</p>
<p>I look forward to using the camera with an open mind and I hope we see new lenses announced in the first half of 2017 to compliment it.</p>
<p>You can sound off in the forum with your favorite products of 2016, I’m sure I have overlooked something!</p>
<p><a href="https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/buy/items/ci/32624/ipp/60/N/3614572237/view/GRID/bi/2466/kbid/3296">Preorder all of the items announced at Photokina</a></p>
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Dylan777

EOS-1D X Mark III
Nov 17, 2011
5,514
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"Well done Fujifilm, there’s a chance you’re going to take my money."

I might join that list too Craig, plus native 110mm f2 :)
 

neuroanatomist

I post too Much on Here!!
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Jul 21, 2010
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Canon Rumors said:
I think the sub $10,000 medium format segment is potentially bigger than some people thing and that they’re going to sell a lot of cameras.

The Leica S has always been my favorite “medium format” body

I'd hope it would be bigger. Given that Leica previously extimated the entire global medium format market at ~6,000 units per year, it's a pretty small pie to be sliced up.
 

Aaron D

Hey!
Jul 21, 2016
273
265
Kansas City
www.aarondougherty.com
Yep, some fast primes would be great for the M5. They don't have to be as stylish as the present series, either, just small and sharp.

And I hope Canon reads this: the perfect M FOUR would have a built-in viewfinder withOUT a penta-lump on top. Put it to the side for better pocket-fittability....
 

j-nord

Derp
Feb 16, 2016
467
4
Colorado
Fujifilm GFX 50S - medium format is well outside my affordability range and also impractical for most of my shooting so I don't pay much attention to it.

Canon EOS 5D Mark IV - great step forward but not quite the super all round stills camera that has me pulling the trigger.

Sigma 85mm f/1.4 DG Art - great to see though not of particular use to me. Love to play with one at some point.

Canon EF 16-35mm f/2.8L III - want, want, want, waiting to see coma tests!!!!!!

Sigma 500mm f/4 OS Sport - exactly the kind of super tele prime competition I want to see more of! Interested to see how it performs although I think a 500 f5.6 OS Sport would have been more my cup of tea (doubt they'd bother since they have the two 150-600 lenses)

Canon EOS M5 - nothing to see here but I guess its a 1/2 step in the right direction.


Next up 6DII - will Canon have any surprising specs or will it be exactly what we are expecting?
 

tmroper

EOS 90D
Sep 22, 2016
177
66
I think the Panasonic GH5 is a huge announcement. 10-bit 4K video internally at 4:2:2 in a camera that small and inexpensive is something that no one has done since the Blackmagic pocket, and many have been wanting. It sets a new bar.
 

unfocused

EOS-1D X Mark III
Jul 20, 2010
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Canon Rumors said:
We're hoping Sigma has improved in this area and that the brand new $6000 supertelephoto turns out to be a steal, considering the brilliant Canon equivalent is twice the price.

Except that it isn't twice the price. $6,0000 vs. $9,000 ($8,400 CPW street price and $7,200 refurbished price). If the sigma actually sells for closer to half the price of the Canon ($4,500 street price or on special) then it could be a winner, but $6,000 is too close in price to the Canon.
 

weixing

EOS RP
Jul 20, 2010
619
19
Aaron D said:
Yep, some fast primes would be great for the M5. They don't have to be as stylish as the present series, either, just small and sharp.

And I hope Canon reads this: the perfect M FOUR would have a built-in viewfinder withOUT a penta-lump on top. Put it to the side for better pocket-fittability....
Hi,
After looking at the size of the Olympus ED 25mm F1.2 Pro (and this is for m4/3), I think if a fast mirrorless lens is going to be as big as an EF lens, I might well get an EF lens with an adapter... at least I can also use it on my DSLR.

Have a nice day.
 

asl

EOS M50
Aug 23, 2016
34
1
tmroper said:
I think the Panasonic GH5 is a huge announcement. 10-bit 4K video internally at 4:2:2 in a camera that small and inexpensive is something that no one has done since the Blackmagic pocket, and many have been wanting. It sets a new bar.

Yes, this seems impressive. I am not totally convinced to buy in to mft (yet..) but it is tempting. As video is important to my use.
 

jebrady03

EOS RP
Feb 2, 2011
529
22
42
Sarasota, FL
Canon Rumors said:
Sigma 85mm f/1.4 DG Art
It’s finally here! It seems the entire photography community has been waiting for the 85mm f/1.4 Art and the excitement for the announcement has been over the top.
Sigma is promising that this lens will equal the Zeiss Otus 85mm f/1.4 in optical performance, and give you the benefit of autofocus for a fraction of the cost. If Sigma gets anywhere near this claim, they’re going to have themselves a massive success.
We’re hoping for a new Canon EF 85mm f/1.2L III some time in 2017, because it may be hard to resist this Sigma offering.

The question is, will the AF be barely better than the Zeiss Otus? I had the 50 Art tuned to my 5D Mark III and since the 5D Mark IV arrived, I haven't touched the lens because I don't want to go through the long, drawn out process of tuning the damn thing again. I too am hoping for an 85L III in the very near future. Even an 85mm f/1.4L would be fine with me. And I don't need 85/1.8 or 135/2 focusing speed, but as long as the AF speed isn't DEAD LAST in their current lineup (65 macro withstanding), I'll happily purchase it immediately.

If they can master the AF and if the busy-bokeh-bug doesn't hit the Sigma and it renders nicely (as well as the 85L II or Otus), then I won't even bother with waiting for Canon.
 

midluk

EOS RP
Aug 27, 2015
321
0
Canon Rumors said:
Canon EOS M5
I had some initial excitement for this camera. It looks to be a lot better from a ergonomic standpoint as well as technologically. The 24.2mp sensor is a great APS-C sensor and DPAF is a remarkable technology.
My problem is they still haven’t addressed the lens issues with the EOS M system. This is a $1000 camera body, and as such, there should be some higher end fast primes available for it. I will never use an 18-150mm f/3.5-6.3 IS STM, no matter how great it is.
I look forward to using the camera with an open mind and I hope we see new lenses announced in the first half of 2017 to compliment it.

I had a look at the M5 in cologne. Canon made the mistake to put the cameras where some flickering light was visible. The flicker in the EVF really turned me off.
And I didn't manage to comfortably use any of the wheels (definitely not the weel around the shutter button) to adjust any settings from the normal holding position of my right hand.

I was definitely considering an M5 as a smaller second camera before, but cologne has deGASed me in this regard.
 

AvTvM

EOS R6
Nov 4, 2011
3,165
0
i do not understand the continuos wish for "some faster EF-M primes".
My impression is it comes mainly from people who have not really thought about size and cost of such lenses. Just look at Fuji and their XF lenses. Those f/1.4 and f/1.2 clunkers are nearly as big as FF lenses and rather expensive to really expensive. I don't think many people in their right mind would be willing to shell out a grand or more a piece for big fat EF-M *CROP ONLY* f/1.4 fast primes.

I'll much rather continue to ask Canon for a kick ass FF-sensored MILC system, fully competitive with Sony A7/R II series. Once there is an FF sensor inside that camera, we can use excellent, affordable and compact f/1.8 lenses to get the same photographic functionality than from a bigger, much more expensive crop f/1.2 lens on APS-C sensor. I would love to see that FF MILC come with a native 24/2.0 STM pancake, a 50/1.8 STM IS and a 85/2.4 IS STM prime. And if others want f/1.4 or f/0.95 lenses instead and are willing to pay through the nose for them and carry aroud OTUS-sized clunkers ... fine with me. Canon should sell these too, then. :)

PS: Pending reviews and results of a personal hands-on, I am very inclined to buy an EOS M5 with 18-150. Once price has come down. :) Not willing to spend a ton on crop-sensor cameras or lenses. Only other EF-M lens I'd definitely buy is a compact, moderately fast, moderately priced EF-M 80 or 85mm/2.4 IS STM.
 

Tom W

EOS R5
Sep 5, 2012
305
276
I share the sentiment that the EF-M lens lineup is a little short. I really don't think it would be difficult to make the modest changes necessary to 3 or 4 full frame lenses to adapt them to the EOS-M lineup. 35/2 IS, 50/1.4 or 1.8STM, 85/1.8 - these would all be welcome partners to the EF-M 22 mm lens. Something a little wider than 22 mm would also be welcome, as 22 works out to a field of view of a 35 mm on a full frame body. Something in the 15 mm range would be welcome.

A moderately fast zoom would be welcome also - say, a 15-45 f/4 IS.
 

Canon Rumors Guy

EOS-1D X Mark III
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Jul 20, 2010
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unfocused said:
Canon Rumors said:
We're hoping Sigma has improved in this area and that the brand new $6000 supertelephoto turns out to be a steal, considering the brilliant Canon equivalent is twice the price.

Except that it isn't twice the price. $6,0000 vs. $9,000 ($8,400 CPW street price and $7,200 refurbished price). If the sigma actually sells for closer to half the price of the Canon ($4,500 street price or on special) then it could be a winner, but $6,000 is too close in price to the Canon.

Sometimes I think in Canadian pricing, I have corrected the issue.
 

gregorywood

Always in learning mode
AvTvM said:
i do not understand the continuos wish for "some faster EF-M primes".
My impression is it comes mainly from people who have not really thought about size and cost of such lenses. Just look at Fuji and their XF lenses. Those f/1.4 and f/1.2 clunkers are nearly as big as FF lenses and rather expensive to really expensive. I don't think many people in their right mind would be willing to shell out a grand or more a piece for big fat EF-M *CROP ONLY* f/1.4 fast primes.

I'll much rather continue to ask Canon for a kick ass FF-sensored MILC system, fully competitive with Sony A7/R II series. Once there is an FF sensor inside that camera, we can use excellent, affordable and compact f/1.8 lenses to get the same photographic functionality than from a bigger, much more expensive crop f/1.2 lens on APS-C sensor. I would love to see that FF MILC come with a native 24/2.0 STM pancake, a 50/1.8 STM IS and a 85/2.4 IS STM prime. And if others want f/1.4 or f/0.95 lenses instead and are willing to pay through the nose for them and carry aroud OTUS-sized clunkers ... fine with me. Canon should sell these too, then. :)

PS: Pending reviews and results of a personal hands-on, I am very inclined to buy an EOS M5 with 18-150. Once price has come down. :) Not willing to spend a ton on crop-sensor cameras or lenses. Only other EF-M lens I'd definitely buy is a compact, moderately fast, moderately priced EF-M 80 or 85mm/2.4 IS STM.

I'll second this sentiment. I like the idea of the M5 and what it could be. The issue is the native glass is not that great and if I bolt on L glass with an adapter, it just gives me a slightly smaller body and slightly less weight over my DSLR package with the same glass. I'd like better native M glass, or a full frame M with an EF mount.
 

Canon Rumors Guy

EOS-1D X Mark III
CR Pro
Jul 20, 2010
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www.canonrumors.com
neuroanatomist said:
Canon Rumors said:
I think the sub $10,000 medium format segment is potentially bigger than some people thing and that they’re going to sell a lot of cameras.

The Leica S has always been my favorite “medium format” body

I'd hope it would be bigger. Given that Leica previously extimated the entire global medium format market at ~6,000 units per year, it's a pretty small pie to be sliced up.

That number is extremely low. Phase One on their own moves about 5000 backs a year I've been told. Throw in Leica, Hasselblad and the best selling medium format camera the 645 and that numbers rises significantly. Price is everything on this one for Fuji.
 

Don Haines

Beware of cats with laser eyes!
Jun 4, 2012
8,265
1,938
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gregorywood said:
AvTvM said:
i do not understand the continuos wish for "some faster EF-M primes".
My impression is it comes mainly from people who have not really thought about size and cost of such lenses. Just look at Fuji and their XF lenses. Those f/1.4 and f/1.2 clunkers are nearly as big as FF lenses and rather expensive to really expensive. I don't think many people in their right mind would be willing to shell out a grand or more a piece for big fat EF-M *CROP ONLY* f/1.4 fast primes.

I'll much rather continue to ask Canon for a kick ass FF-sensored MILC system, fully competitive with Sony A7/R II series. Once there is an FF sensor inside that camera, we can use excellent, affordable and compact f/1.8 lenses to get the same photographic functionality than from a bigger, much more expensive crop f/1.2 lens on APS-C sensor. I would love to see that FF MILC come with a native 24/2.0 STM pancake, a 50/1.8 STM IS and a 85/2.4 IS STM prime. And if others want f/1.4 or f/0.95 lenses instead and are willing to pay through the nose for them and carry aroud OTUS-sized clunkers ... fine with me. Canon should sell these too, then. :)

PS: Pending reviews and results of a personal hands-on, I am very inclined to buy an EOS M5 with 18-150. Once price has come down. :) Not willing to spend a ton on crop-sensor cameras or lenses. Only other EF-M lens I'd definitely buy is a compact, moderately fast, moderately priced EF-M 80 or 85mm/2.4 IS STM.

I'll second this sentiment. I like the idea of the M5 and what it could be. The issue is the native glass is not that great and if I bolt on L glass with an adapter, it just gives me a slightly smaller body and slightly less weight over my DSLR package with the same glass. I'd like better native M glass, or a full frame M with an EF mount.
Me three!
Has anyone else noticed that there are now 2 M zooms slower than the magic F5.6 number? It's almost like Canon wants to make tiny lenses to go with their tiny camera....