There Will Be a New EOS M Camera Coming in 2016 [CR2]

ahsanford

Particular Member
Aug 16, 2012
8,617
1,642
tron said:
+1 Good point. To rephrase it in a mathematical way:

(don't mess it up) and let it take EF lenses without adapter.

don't ( mess it up and let it take EF lenses without adapter).

;D

I'm personally torn on this, as is this forum to some degree (see my poll from some time ago).

Advantages of a new mount (adaptor needed to use EF glass):

Z-sony-a7r-ii-top-L.JPG


[list type=decimal]

[*]A new mount allows you to make a very small form factor rig if you choose slower/shorter lenses (35mm f/2, 50 f/2, etc.)
[*]You could adapt older lenses, non-Canon lenses, etc.
[/list]

Advantages of sticking with EF (no adaptor needed):

sigma-sd-quattro-vue-dessus-900px.jpg


[list type=decimal]

[*]You do not need to invest/stockpile lenses in a new mount -- you just need EF.
[*]You can never leave home without an adaptor if it does not exist. The nightmare of leaving for a shoot with a mirrorless-only lens attached to the camera along with a bag of EF glass -- that you cannot use without that adapter -- cannot happen if it's a full EF mount.
[*]Canon will put a proper 5D3-sized grip on it and not hedge on grip size to keep it small for the small percentage of people who want a tiny rig. And that bigger/chunker grip might fit your same FF SLR batteries. :D
[/list]

There are many other reasons for both camps but I'm foggy this morning and cannot recall them all. It's not an easy decision at all. Again, just look at how Sony is struggling to balance the needs of the 'keep it small' camp and the 'do everything my SLR can' camp.

- A
 

Ebrahim Saadawi

EOS 90D
Aug 29, 2014
154
0
An SL1 or Rebel body with the 5D sensor is an idea. Not probably going to happen. But an idea nonetheless.

It would give FF image quality to the masses and those who have zero need for the greatest AF, metal grade body, too many buttons, dual cards, large buffer, etc. Those who just want a small cheap FF canon. Price at 80D point and no other product gets hurt in the line. Will it happen? No.

Neither a FF eos m mirrorless is coming.

To get expectations right: FF in Canon ecosystem is going to stay at DSLRs starting from the cheapest 6D MKII (then the current 6D will remain as a super super cheap FF option). And on thr mirrorless side. Canon is going to keep updating and refining the EOS m APS-C line. It will be segmented as we can see with the m10, so its segmentation and this CR rumor makea it pretty obvious Canon's next mirrorless is the next farther segmentarion of the eos m line, but starting a higher end segment, as they see people are clamouring for more advanced eos m.
 

asl

EOS M50
Aug 23, 2016
34
1
Etienne said:
asl said:
Would like DR like 80d or better.. and 4K and if possible DPAF, but is seems unlikely ?
The main reason i would buy one is that the 11-22mm lens looks impressive, always want one for portable/hiking/landscape setup and also have it be compatible with bigger lenses.
But never found the M cameras to be so tempting. I find 4K nice to have on my phone (can get some ok freeze frames from it also), so buying a camera without it seems backwards to day.
I have the M3 and the 11-22 (sold my original M). The 11-22 is a brilliant little lens, and with IS the handheld video is almost like it's on a tripod. It is tiny even with the 11-22 on it, and the 22mm f/2 fits anywhere for when the light goes low. The M3 system has it's faults, but I bought the whole system including both lenses, removable viewfinder, and EF-M to EF adapter cost me less than $1000. The adapter with the 35mm f/2 IS works brilliantly on the EOS-M3 for both photos and videos. I also like the M3 with the 100mm f/2.8L IS ... the tilt touchscreen really helps getting awkward macro shots quickly, and the 1.6x crop gives even better macro performance... nearly equivalent to cropping a macro shot from the 5DS system
4K and touchscreen DPAF would make an M5 irresistible for me.

I see lot of people like the 11-22 lens that is encouraging a bit.
I did actually consider buying it just to have it at one point, even I do not have an M. Now I all most wish I did, as it has gone up in price a bit here.
I also have have the 100mm IS L and tilt screen is something I miss a lot of times and not just for pure macro.
As 80d was released with out 4K I am really hoping for good M at this point, or else it could be years until a new Canon camera with 4K and the features I am looking for is released. (one with out the 5d price tag, 5d is also in my opinion "missing" tilt screen). If no 4K it would be necessary to look at other options than Canon when it comes to to filming 4K it seems (might be stating the obvious but..).
 

Sporgon

5% of gear used 95% of the time
CR Pro
asl said:
I see lot of people like the 11-22 lens that is encouraging a bit.

The 11-22 EF-M is so good because it is at it best pretty well wide open, so the f/4 mark, like it's big brother, the FF 16-35 IS. A very wide lens wants to be at its best here, but especially on a high resolution crop, because you can still get ample dof (f/4 at 11 mil crop gives about from 2.5 m to infinity - not based on dof tables), which results in not only a faster shutter speed for less shake and a sharper image, but also no resolution sapping diffraction.
 

ahsanford

Particular Member
Aug 16, 2012
8,617
1,642
Sporgon said:
The 11-22 EF-M is so good because it is at it best pretty well wide open, so the f/4 mark, like it's big brother, the FF 16-35 IS. A very wide lens wants to be at its best here, but especially on a high resolution crop, because you can still get ample dof (f/4 at 11 mil crop gives about from 2.5 m to infinity - not based on dof tables), which results in not only a faster shutter speed for less shake and a sharper image, but also no resolution sapping diffraction.

That's lovely in principal, but I often find there is something in the foreground and in the background in my UWA shooting. ;D

I hear you, though. I rarely complain about today's lenses which seem biased towards more wide-open use. It's more like 'f/4 and be there!' these days.

- A
 

AvTvM

EOS R6
Nov 4, 2011
3,165
0
f/4 is a very slow stop. any lens should be f*cking sharp at that aperture. on crop diffraction window goes to f/5.6 to max. f/8 - so there's not much of a useful f-stop range to start with.
 

d

EOS RP
Mar 8, 2015
417
0
AvTvM said:
f/4 is a very slow stop. any lens should be f*cking sharp at that aperture. on crop diffraction window goes to f/5.6 to max. f/8 - so there's not much of a useful f-stop range to start with.

...yet I've seen really nice images taken with this lens stopped down well beyond f/8. Some photographers are evidently poorly informed about the limited usefulness of their little WA-zoom M lens. Go figure!
 

AvTvM

EOS R6
Nov 4, 2011
3,165
0
d said:
AvTvM said:
f/4 is a very slow stop. any lens should be f*cking sharp at that aperture. on crop diffraction window goes to f/5.6 to max. f/8 - so there's not much of a useful f-stop range to start with.

...yet I've seen really nice images taken with this lens stopped down well beyond f/8. Some photographers are evidently poorly informed about the limited usefulness of their little WA-zoom M lens. Go figure!
i got the 11-22 and like it. of course i also take lits of images with it at f/8 and even f/11 and they turn out well. however, people not aware of diffraction's toll on sharpness at f/8 or f/11 on an APS-C sensor have little clue of the laws of optics ...
 

ahsanford

Particular Member
Aug 16, 2012
8,617
1,642
AvTvM said:
i got the 11-22 and like it. of course i also take lits of images with it at f/8 and even f/11 and they turn out well. however, people not aware of diffraction's toll on sharpness at f/8 or f/11 on an APS-C sensor have little clue of the laws of optics ...

Or we're fully aware of diffraction but would accept diffraction softness due to the odd technical reason. I was shooting Fallingwater five years ago on my old T1i and the light was very difficult. Even with ISO 100, I couldn't slow the shutter down enough to blur the waterfall due to bright sunlight, as I foolishly didn't have an ND filter on me.

So I stopped down to f/22 and got the composition I wanted. Was it tack sharp? No. But taking a razor sharp shot at f/5.6 or so would have looked far worse for that particular composition.

- A
 

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rrcphoto

EOS R6
Jun 20, 2013
2,505
147
ahsanford said:
AvTvM said:
i got the 11-22 and like it. of course i also take lits of images with it at f/8 and even f/11 and they turn out well. however, people not aware of diffraction's toll on sharpness at f/8 or f/11 on an APS-C sensor have little clue of the laws of optics ...

Or we're fully aware of diffraction but would accept diffraction softness due to the odd technical reason. I was shooting Fallingwater five years ago on my old T1i and the light was very difficult. Even with ISO 100, I couldn't slow the shutter down enough to blur the waterfall due to bright sunlight, as I foolishly didn't have an ND filter on me.

nice picture. now load that cr2 into DPP4 and run it through DLO, which will has diffraction correction, and corrects the CA I see in that picture.

and see if you like it more.
 

Sharlin

EOS R
CR Pro
Dec 26, 2015
1,371
1,314
Turku, Finland
Hellish said:
If this camera gets DPAF + 4k binned not cropped it will be a killer.

Like there's a snowball's chance in hell that the M series will get 4K before Canon's enthusiast/prosumer DSLR lines... Especially as the M series is already known for its, um, "less-than-optimal" battery life. Also: how to make the tiny body not red hot when recording 4K... If there's something Canon does not want is repeating Sony's folly with the A6300.
 

ahsanford

Particular Member
Aug 16, 2012
8,617
1,642
Sharlin said:
Hellish said:
If this camera gets DPAF + 4k binned not cropped it will be a killer.

Like there's a snowball's chance in hell that the M series will get 4K before Canon's enthusiast/prosumer DSLR lines... Especially as the M series is already known for its, um, "less-than-optimal" battery life. Also: how to make the tiny body not red hot when recording 4K... If there's something Canon does not want is repeating Sony's folly with the A6300.

I didn't want to be a naysayer to the idea myself, but I find it rather amusing that a mirrorless rig would get a premium feature like 4K before it gets, say, an integral viewfinder. Canon does not sprint after just learning how to crawl.

- A
 

pokerz

EOS 90D
Aug 19, 2016
167
0
Sharlin said:
Hellish said:
If this camera gets DPAF + 4k binned not cropped it will be a killer.

Like there's a snowball's chance in hell that the M series will get 4K before Canon's enthusiast/prosumer DSLR lines... Especially as the M series is already known for its, um, "less-than-optimal" battery life. Also: how to make the tiny body not red hot when recording 4K... If there's something Canon does not want is repeating Sony's folly with the A6300.
Just simply release 4k (2x crop with line skipping and pixel binning) to its Mirrroless, never overheat for 30mins record time, sounds good?