What’s next for the Canon EOS R5 and Canon EOS R6?

EVGA 2080Ti FTW3 seems to be able to handle it. Just encoded a 3 minute 4K30P video using H265 with 'medium' compression in Handbrake in 1:40 seconds.

Most likely I'm not doing it right.
ok, stand corrected. Thanks for trying it.

so now you have a gpu which is as large? as the r5 with 2? fans and a tdp of around 280w which can do real-time 30p and by your timings do almost 60p (but not 120p nor 8k) No idea on the quality of your 30p vs r5.

pretty impressive what the r5 is doing in such a tiny space.

doesnt detract away from what people are saying about the overheating, just gives insight into the challenges and trade offs.
 
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Bert63

What’s in da box?
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Dec 3, 2017
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ok, stand corrected. Thanks for trying it.

so now you have a gpu which is as large? as the r5 with 2? fans and a tdp of around 280w which can do real-time 30p and by your timings do almost 60p (but not 120p nor 8k) No idea on the quality of your 30p vs r5.

pretty impressive what the r5 is doing in such a tiny space.

doesnt detract away from what people are saying about the overheating, just gives insight into the challenges and trade offs.

Downloading a test 4k120p now.

Yeah. No. Not even close and this time my three fans spun up right from the beginning.
 

Juangrande

EOS 90D
Mar 6, 2017
182
236
Even if a firmware update allows a higher heat threshold before shutting off, I'm not turning it on (and hopefully it's an option users can toggle). Not worth it to reduce the life of the electronics. The normal 4k mode out of the R5 looks pretty dang good, and I can work around the other limitations, including for hour-long wedding ceremonies.
Four hour long ceremonies! You must be shooting a lot of catholic weddings lol.
Only thing I want on the R5 is 1080p 120fps, Clog3, and dual slot video recording. Other than that they can leave it alone, and simply make an RF C100 for everybody that does video and is complaining.

It's also sort of sad that video has hijacked the R5 dialogue. The first "professional" mirrorless camera from Canon and for all purposes it's what every Canon photographer has dreamed of. This is coming from an 80%video/20% photo guy, too.
 

BeenThere

EOS R
CR Pro
Sep 4, 2012
1,243
670
Eastern Shore
With B&H closed today and my grip already on the way, how would I know if I got in on the first shipment?
If your order status is “processed ” or “shipped” I think you will be in the first group. B&H were still working right up to 5pm Yesterday. My order changed to shipped around 4:50pm. They will email FEDX tracking no. When shipped. Good luck!
 

Dantana

EOS RP
Jan 29, 2013
322
169
Los Angeles, CA
www.flickr.com
It is not a defect, it was a design decisions. The camera has firmware that both detects, warns and then deals with the situation. It is a defect when they don't know about the issue, ship the product, and then have to create an emergency fix to make it usable beyond spec. None of this is happening, just a lot of noise around people that want more than what was promised. I don't think Canon ever said you should shoot a full length motion picture with this camera. Look at the size, cost, and weight of a camera that could deliver what some people are requesting. I know it is not something that I want.
Yes

The funny thing is, you could shoot a full length motion picture with this camera at 8K and not have an issue, if it was a traditionally shot, narrative film. I've never been on the set of a narrative production where the camera was rolling for more than a few minutes at a time, followed by talking, and adjusting, and more adjusting and...

Everyone's needs are different. If you need to shoot at one of the max res heat generating settings for longer than a few minutes at a time, then this isn't the camera for you. Maybe you thought it would be when you first saw the specs, but now it turns out it's not. Oh well.

Oh, and when I say "you" I don't mean Danglin. I'm referring to those who are complaining.
 
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Bert63

What’s in da box?
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Dec 3, 2017
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If your order status is “processed ” or “shipped” I think you will be in the first group. B&H were still working right up to 5pm Yesterday. My order changed to shipped around 4:50pm. They will email FEDX tracking no. When shipped. Good luck!


Naw. I'm toast. Still sitting backordered along with my pathetic little battery haha.. Funny that the grip made the cut and the battery didn't. Odd. I don't hold out any hope but will give it over the weekend before I cancel.
 
Its flawed, lol why else would people even entertain the fact that there maybe a recall or firmware updates to address issues. A company actually developed a "fan" to attach to the bloody thing... A blinking external fan!!! People are posting about mount adapters that can provide cooling... Its a joke, and people like you who dont hold a company to the fire for delivering a severely hampered product is why they can continually disappoint, because of you. When there are changes to the product and updates, it wont be because of you, it will be because of all the people you complain about. You are welcome.
Well I think there are 2 approaches - yes, provide balanced feedback to Canon direct or better still, don’t buy it. I think the latter hurts them more.

the issue I think that many people have here is that a lot of the YT comes from people who, to use your earlier analogy have jumped to doing video reviews to differentiate themselves, then found lots of others have also, and now seem to have found that they get more people watching their videos if they create over the top headlines to seek viewers.

based on your work it’s not suitable for you and validly so. But we’re not going to sway Canon on here. The YT crowd - alas yes. The main review sites which also appear to be going with the hyperboles also have heavy influence. For me, the ones that provide a balanced viewpoint are the ones I watch, the rest no thanks. I suggest contacting Canon and telling them why you won’t upgrade would be worthwhile.
 

cdcooker

I'm New Here
Jun 28, 2013
13
3
Canon have plenty of time to test out the overheat problem before the official launch. There is no excuse on this. Even a minor overheat issue will be blown out of proportion in this internet-every-joe--is-a-camera-reviewer-era, not to mention this is not a minor issue.
 

Juangrande

EOS 90D
Mar 6, 2017
182
236
They thought the 8k gimmick would gloss over the cracks, also they are relying on all their loyalist customers to defend them no matter what problems the product has, also they are aware that many people are trapped behind thousands of dollars of great EF glass already owned. They also thought they had the best looking girl at the dance, but then Sony and the A7sIII walked through door.
Except the Sony girl at the dance can’t shoot stills and has herpes.
 
Canon have plenty of time to test out the overheat problem before the official launch. There is no excuse on this. Even a minor overheat issue will be blown out of proportion in this internet-every-joe--is-a-camera-reviewer-era, not to mention this is not a minor issue.
They did test it hence why they had the timings and an option in one of the menus around overheat.

but agreed they have misjudged the response.
 

Danglin52

Wildlife Shooter
Aug 8, 2018
317
335
Look, I like Canon, and actually have an R5 out for delivery as I write this. I can tell you, if I learn that this camera cannot be trusted to perform I will return it. And I’m sure that I am not alone in this thinking. So if it was a design decision it will have an impact on purchase decisions. If Canon wants my $4000 this camera will have to work and not get in the way of my process. It’s that simple... the ball is in their court.

I totally agree with you about the camera performing to spec with the limitations sited by Canon and embedded with in the software, I think you will be happy. If you are buying it with the intent of recording more than 20 min of 8K or 4k HQ, you might as well cancel the order now.
 

rbielefeld

EOS 90D
Apr 22, 2015
173
399
Well reasoned. I agree there will not be a problem for most users and use cases. The marketing should perhaps have been more cautious.

Not sure Canon, busy making great cameras, was prepared for the negative whiny world of youtube parasite do nothing reviewers and their dim-witted followers who eat up their conflict laden drivel. I am continually surprised at how low some of these reviewers will stoop, how large their egos, how gullible their audience is, and how they and their followers do almost everything on irrational emotion instead of thinking. It is truly sad that some of the most careless, abrasive, immature and just gross personalities are listened to by so many.

Canon probably thought the use case for high frame rate and high bit rate 4K modes and 8K would never be thought by anyone to be used for long form shooting. Enter a bunch of griping brand elitists and amateurs with unrealistic expectations and now there is an alleged fatal flaw in the product. Consumers have become dumb and spoiled, and the voice of un-reason is pandered to in the modern world, rather than ignored or refuted. It really is the most complex problem businesses face- how to please an increasingly whiny user base.
Yep, you have hit it pretty much on the head. Canon was basically up front with the limitations of these cameras as they are written in the manual. So, as a consumer, determine if the tool will meet your needs and if so buy it, if not get something else or wait until what you need becomes available. Most importantly, don't go by what others say about a product like these cameras. Get one in your hands and give it a go. Then make a truly informed decision based on the way you approach photography. For me this camera is going to be perfect I think. I shoot mostly action type stills with short clips of video to back them up at times. I can't wait to get my R5, which will be here tomorrow. Then I will determine if it meets my needs, but not before then. I think it will without any issues.

I do wish those who say Canon has made a big mistake with these cameras would at least wait until photographers have them in their hands and in-depth reviews are done by the masses before a judgment is made. My hypothesis is that for the price point these cameras will be very competent if not stellar performers within their limitations.
 

Danglin52

Wildlife Shooter
Aug 8, 2018
317
335
Yes

The funny thing is, you could shoot a full length motion picture with this camera at 8K and not have an issue, if it was a traditionally shot, narrative film. I've never been on the set of a narrative production where the camera was rolling for more than a few minutes at a time, followed by talking, and adjusting, and more adjusting and...

Everyone's needs are different. If you need to shoot at one of the max res heat generating settings for longer than a few minutes at a time, then this isn't the camera for you. Maybe you thought it would be when you first saw the specs, but now it turns out it's not. Oh well.

Oh, and when I say "you" I don't mean Danglin. I'm referring to those who are complaining.

I realize I wasn't the you and agree with the movie thing. Many people don't realize that most movies scenes are shot in short clips and then assembled in post (yes, 1918 took a different approach). I think it is more you tubers making an issue because then can't shoot themselves sitting at their desk sharing their opinions with the world. I think most of them would see themselves and 8k and realize that is shows every little flaw and they will be dialing back the resolution. As a stills shooter, I don't shoot a lot of video even when I would like to capture some action because I want high quality stills. One thing I will test if I can flip to 8k video for a few minutes to capture unique behavior and then pull out some stills if I see something I like. The 8k is a feature that appeals to subset and the noise is making us miss the advantage of what appears to be either class leading or at least matching Olympus IBIS on a full frame sensor. Pretty amazing! If someone need 8k, their option is either living with the limitations of the R5 or spending thousands of dollars more to buy one of the professional solutions - that is not going to get you a great stills experience. Once again, this is a hybrid which makes comprises on both ends.
 
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Downloading a test 4k120p now.

Yeah. No. Not even close and this time my three fans spun up right from the beginning.
Thank you.

i don’t use the gpu, and I use staxripper. I get maybe 3 to 5 FPS encode speed across 16 cores - ha ha.

whatever is doing or assisting with the x265 and perhaps the associated buffering / writing to CFexpress is generating the additional heat. But depending on how that’s implemented and based on what I’ve read about differences on h265 across Nvidia gpu generations I’m not sure they have much latitude to change much on the encoding approach outside of frame rates, bits per frame etc. I’m sure they have some, but enough to lower the heat but maintain the quality and frame rates ? if they have well why didn’t they do it before. Doesn’t make sense.

the more I read the comments here, the more I think they should have pushed the higher modes over HDMI (bar raw which they perhaps can’t do). There’s obviously good reasons why they didn’t want to disable internal on these modes....
 
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Max TT

Canon 60D / Canon 6D
Feb 9, 2020
114
135
All fair comments and probably quite indicative of one of the challenges any wedding photographer will face.

Alas it means right now, the r5/r6 isn’t suitable for you.

But may I ask what are you comparing the r5/6 to? What are you using today for your stills/video? Would it be fair to say that the r5 lowest 4K mode (which apparently doesn’t overheat) is comparable to whatever (guessing here) Canon body you are currently using?
Yes you are quite right, the base video modes on the R5 are better than what I currently use. It will be an improvement for sure. But its a $3800 improvement that brings with it some serious concerns. I haved owned only APSC 60d, 80d, 90d... I sold both 80d and 90d, and now I rent for past 8 months 5DMIII or IV for jobs.

Been saving to move into mirrorless so far $5700 set aside. Should have $7100 by September. I was looking at combination of either the R6 + RP or the R5 + RP. Currently the R6 is totally out of the question because it cant even do 4k30p without overheating and thats a no go for the makeup tutorial clients I currently have.

People say well just shoot 1080, but yall dont realize how normal people (clients) think... 4k is a selling point, even though they cant tell the difference. Anyways, look let me let you all enjoy your new product, I'll find a way to deal with my disappointment. Actually thinking about the A7sIII + A7R II combo, or the Nikon Z6/Atomos + Z5 combo, there are options, all still within budget. So I will be fine.
 
Yes you are quite right, the base video modes on the R5 are better than what I currently use. It will be an improvement for sure. But its a $3800 improvement that brings with it some serious concerns. I haved owned only APSC 60d, 80d, 90d... I sold both 80d and 90d, and now I rent for past 8 months 5DMIII or IV for jobs.

Been saving to move into mirrorless so far $5700 set aside. Should have $7100 by September. I was looking at combination of either the R6 + RP or the R5 + RP. Currently the R6 is totally out of the question because it cant even do 4k30p without overheating and thats a no go for the makeup tutorial clients I currently have.

People say well just shoot 1080, but yall dont realize how normal people (clients) think... 4k is a selling point, even though they cant tell the difference. Anyways, look let me let you all enjoy your new product, I'll find a way to deal with my disappointment. Actually thinking about the A7sIII + A7R II combo, or the Nikon Z6/Atomos + Z5 combo, there are options, all still within budget. So I will be fine.

thank you and yes I understand your concerns. I would still flag them to Canon

Using an atomos with the canons solves the problem i thought ?

Sony can’t do internal I thought for their higher bit rate modes either ?

so if you are factoring in an atomos then your r5/r6 is still viable perhaps? Not that I’m spending your money!
 

Nelu

1-DX Mark III, EOS R5, EOS R
CR Pro
Well reasoned. I agree there will not be a problem for most users and use cases. The marketing should perhaps have been more cautious.

Not sure Canon, busy making great cameras, was prepared for the negative whiny world of youtube parasite do nothing reviewers and their dim-witted followers who eat up their conflict laden drivel. I am continually surprised at how low some of these reviewers will stoop, how large their egos, how gullible their audience is, and how they and their followers do almost everything on irrational emotion instead of thinking. It is truly sad that some of the most careless, abrasive, immature and just gross personalities are listened to by so many.

Canon probably thought the use case for high frame rate and high bit rate 4K modes and 8K would never be thought by anyone to be used for long form shooting. Enter a bunch of griping brand elitists and amateurs with unrealistic expectations and now there is an alleged fatal flaw in the product. Consumers have become dumb and spoiled, and the voice of un-reason is pandered to in the modern world, rather than ignored or refuted. It really is the most complex problem businesses face- how to please an increasingly whiny user base.
I'd double-like your comment if I only could!
We live in a world full of entitled ,whining little people.
 
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privatebydesign

I post too Much on Here!!
CR Pro
Jan 29, 2011
10,533
5,810
Yes

The funny thing is, you could shoot a full length motion picture with this camera at 8K and not have an issue, if it was a traditionally shot, narrative film. I've never been on the set of a narrative production where the camera was rolling for more than a few minutes at a time, followed by talking, and adjusting, and more adjusting and...
I agree with you about the movie thing. People don't realize that most movies scenes are shot in short clips and then assembled in post
But you both miss the point that the temperature control starts the second the camera is turned on not when the record button is pushed, and in a production environment that can easily be 15/20minutes before 'action'. I think we are all in agreement though, nobody should be looking at the R5 to shoot their next big production or long form video, that is not what it was designed to do.