What’s next from Canon?

[geffy]

It can also be a lens issue, specifically if the AF motor doesn't move exactly the amount the camera tells it to, particularly in high speed shooting modes when the camera might not do a "confirmation" AF reading after the lens has moved. It can also be a loose lens/camera interface that allows the lens to move slightly in relation to the sensor after AF has been locked.

i think you have to call these something different, out of focus is a different issue, a lens is designed to focus at a set back distance for its type, a broken or mis-performing lens is not this issue this issue is about the mirror whether other problems can be solved by the same solution does not make them the same problem as it may not appear on two different cameras where as a lens fault would and it would not affect resale as its a natural phenomenon of SLR cameras

 

[YuengLinger]

Somebody forwarded me some chatter today that Canon is considering replacing the regular EOS bodies with the R mount system. This would now be the second time that Canon screws me over with a new mount.
If true I'd like to sell my gear and save up for a Leica...

Leica has long been out there tempting photographers...But what exactly about the Rf mount system would prompt you to sell your lenses? You could keep using the 5D II until it just doesn't work anymore. When it's time to replace it, even if there isn't another Ef mount body on the planet that would suit you, say, oh, maybe in the year 2035 or so, you could still use your current EF lenses with an adapter on the Rf mount. By which time you might have been tempted by some of the amazing Rf glass.

Now this is crazy talk, but a bartender I know has told me that none of this matters. She says civilization can only last another 12 years. I'll be taking my family to a cave I know high in the mountains in the temperate zone, bringing a portable solar-panel system, spare SD cards and batteries, and, when night falls, sitting and chimping my photos of the final days.

 

[jeffa4444]

I have used the 5DS for a number of years now mainly for portraits in the studio with a mixture of strobes, daylight and LEDs. The images are generally well detailed and great for cropping. The down sides are low light noise and file sizes. Going to 80mp is only going to increase file size and I have enough resolution so unless the low light performance vastly improves then I will be slow to change.
the EOS R is also in my arsenal along with the RF 24-105mm f4L IS USM and the 24-240mm F4.5 - 6.3 IS USM lens. Its a good camera but not a great camera although Im impressed with the RF 24-105mm. The Holy Trinity in RF mount would set me back £ 7,257
then I would need to add the 85mm adding a further £ 2,799 bringing the total to £ 10,056. On top of this the cost of the new R body which knowing Canon will be over £ 3K at launch and its easy to see why for the serious amateur this is a hugely expensive upgrade. For that reason I opted to buy the EF 85mm f1.4L IS USM and carry on using my existing EF holy trinity and for now the 5DS.

 

[YuengLinger]

i think you have to call these something different, out of focus is a different issue, a lens is designed to focus at a set back distance for its type, a broken or mis-performing lens is not this issue this issue is about the mirror whether other problems can be solved by the same solution does not make them the same problem as it may not appear on two different cameras where as a lens fault would and it would not affect resale as its a natural phenomenon of SLR cameras

adiuy geitta aayiigo scnbw slis sj kjhieab

 

[Ozarker]

I thought it already had a price cut of $200? Maybe I'm just gullible.

You are right! Unfortunately, the next lens I want hasn't been produced yet.

 

[criscokkat]

But the jump from a 30MP 5D Mark IV (or even 24MP 5D Mark III) to an 80+ MP EOS Rs is a LOT bigger than the jump from a 24MP 5D Mark III to a 30 MP 5D Mark IV. Why do you keep conflating people coming from a 30MP 5D Mark IV with people coming from a 50MP 5Ds/5Ds R?

Why do you keep conflating that this is the upgrade for the 5DMIV not the 5DS/R?

This upcoming camera has always been portrayed as the replacement for the high megapixel camera, not the general purpose pro camera. The 5DMV and the equivelant RII will more than likely come outjust before christmas next year, or in spring of 2021. I personally think it does show the interest in the R system (& mirrorless systems as a whole) as people are doing mental gymnastics trying to justify buying this when it comes out early next year instead of simply waiting for the RII, which will most likely be released at the same time and on the same rough release interval as a (possibly final) 5DMV.

 

[Punio]

A lot of thoughts about an EOS R Mark 2. I highly doubt Canon have the EOS R on anything less than a 4 year refresh period. That means 2022.

What I am also curious about is the naming system. Canon have labelled their bodies quite sensibly in terms of 1 being the top tier, the 5 next and then the 7, and then the bigger the number the further down the range.

How are they naming the EOS R system? Where does the R fit? We all assume it will be:

1R
5R and 5RS
R and Ra
RP
Rc (asp-c)

Doesn't seem as intuitive.

 

[YuengLinger]

A lot of thoughts about an EOS R Mark 2. I highly doubt Canon have the EOS R on anything less than a 4 year refresh period. That means 2022.

What I am also curious about is the naming system. Canon have labelled their bodies quite sensibly in terms of 1 being the top tier, the 5 next and then the 7, and then the bigger the number the further down the range.

How are they naming the EOS R system? Where does the R fit? We all assume it will be:

1R
5R and 5RS
R and Ra
RP
Rc (asp-c)

Doesn't seem as intuitive.

Naming seems reasonable, but what has that to do with Canon's schedule for releasing a pro type of FF mirrorless? What I'm waiting for is a 5D type body with a much better EVF than the current R. I don't believe Canon has ever marketed the R as a pro style body. It has a better sensor and AF than the 6DII, but otherwise performs more at the 6DII level than a 5DIV.

A high-resolution mirrorless meant more for landscape and product photography would not need an EVF upgrade, though customers might be a little disappointed if it is exactly the same as the current R. And does such a camera need IBIS?

Call me pessimistic, or cyincal, but I think Canon is waiting for a fully working IBIS and an EVF they don't have to license from some other company. (Does anybody know who makes the newest EVF shared by Leica, Sony, and Panasonic?)

 

[Punio]

Naming seems reasonable, but what has that to do with Canon's schedule for releasing a pro type of FF mirrorless?

My point I was making was that because of the ambiguity in the EOS R naming, its hard to be definitive about what is coming next from Canon. Is it a 5D equivalent next or was the R actually the 5D equivalent? Canon said the there is still a Pro body to come soon but in their interview with ImageResource they referred to the 1D as their understanding of Pro body.

If the EOS R was called the 5R we could have a 'better' guess at the schedule.

 

[criscokkat]

A lot of thoughts about an EOS R Mark 2. I highly doubt Canon have the EOS R on anything less than a 4 year refresh period. That means 2022.

What I am also curious about is the naming system. Canon have labelled their bodies quite sensibly in terms of 1 being the top tier, the 5 next and then the 7, and then the bigger the number the further down the range.

How are they naming the EOS R system? Where does the R fit? We all assume it will be:

1R
5R and 5RS
R and Ra
RP
Rc (asp-c)

Doesn't seem as intuitive.

I don't think it'll be a full 4 years for the RII. I think it will the end of next year/early 2021 at the latest. I think the original long term plan was for the R to come out in 2020 as the mirrorless version of the 5dmV. The RF lenses and cameras were obviously under development for years, I think Sony forced their hand in pushing the boundaries of mirrorless tech and they needed to release something sooner, hence the R with a recycled sensor. I see no reason why we won't see one last release of the 5d series accompanied by an RII that comes along with that. The M6II has shown that the sensor itself was what was holding the speed back. I can't imagine they'd wait an extra 2 years just because the R is only 2 years old. It'll probably then be back to the 'regular schedule' with the next round coming 4 years after that most likely.

 

[YuengLinger]

I don't think it'll be a full 4 years for the RII. I think it will the end of next year/early 2021 at the latest. I think the original long term plan was for the R to come out in 2020 as the mirrorless version of the 5dmV. The RF lenses and cameras were obviously under development for years, I think Sony forced their hand in pushing the boundaries of mirrorless tech and they needed to release something sooner, hence the R with a recycled sensor. I see no reason why we won't see one last release of the 5d series accompanied by an RII that comes along with that. The M6II has shown that the sensor itself was what was holding the speed back. I can't imagine they'd wait an extra 2 years just because the R is only 2 years old. It'll probably then be back to the 'regular schedule' with the next round coming 4 years after that most likely.

I agree with much of what you are saying, but in this case, names do mean something. Clearly the R is not a mirrorless version of the 5D series, so an RII couldn't be either. It just wouldn't make sense to have the same series, in one generation, gain an extra card-slot, better weather sealing, and a higher burst rate--in addition to a top-notch, action-oriented EVF. Such a camera must have a new name.

I don't expect an EOS 5R (or whatever) until 2021, because Canon is reportedly going to release another 5D and 1D body, plus the high-res R. Just seems not enough oxygen in one year for much more than that in FF, and, as mentioned above, I don't think Canon has the goods yet when it comes to the EVF or the IBIS.

As for an RII, which would be an upgrade to the EOS R, the full four years seems pretty likely.

 

[Joules]

It just wouldn't make sense to have the same series, in one generation, gain an extra card-slot, better weather sealing, and a higher burst rate--in addition to a top-notch, action-oriented EVF. Such a camera must have a new name.

I don’t know...

The 90D got a Joystick, improved wheather sealing, an upgrade in FPS AND shutter life time, Spot AF and so on. It gobbled up a good number of features from the 7D series and presumably even killed it, yet the name stayed the same.

I also wouldn't be surprised if the R and RP just suffer from the terrible naming schemes the M series had initially. Not that it is great now, but M100, M50, M6, M5 make at least follow the 'lower is better' scheme, in contrast to the M, M2, M3 stuff. I at least hope they'll go to numbers at some point, making a spiritual successor to the R rather than a literal R II.

 

[unfocused]

People need to wrap their heads around the idea that Canon's mirrorless system does not have to follow the DSLR market segmentation. In fact they haven't so far, so why would future releases?

Canon currently has seven full frame cameras introduced at seven different price points and with seven different feature sets. (1D, 5D, 5Dr, Ra, R, 6D and RP). There are two additional mirrorless models rumored: A high resolution model and an action-oriented model. I don't expect that either of these two will exactly mirror the available DSLRs, although the high resolution model may be the only true "replacement" for a DSLR on the list.

Canon has said they intend to offer models both above and below the current mirrorless offerings, although it is hard to imagine a mirrorless model below the RP, but who knows?

It is possible that a second generation R may arrive sooner than the usual refresh rate, in part because the line is new so it would't be surprising to see Canon update models more quickly for the first generation or two. It's also possible that Canon leaves the R in the lineup and offers an upgraded version with two card slots and some other improvements. A big unknown is whether or not Canon views the single card slot as a hindrance to sales. Just because people on the internet endlessly obsess over single card slots doesn't mean buyers care that much.

In short, people need to quit worrying about 5D and 1D equivalency when they discuss the R series, as I doubt Canon will ever make mirrorless bodies that are true equivalents to their DSLRs.

 

[Michael Clark]

Here's what's even more interesting. I just went on to see if I could earn the one lonely point for the 5D Mark II that it had previously said it would earn... upon sign-up it said it would give me 6 points, and it did. I added my 400mm F5.6L (for 8 points) and those two products alone were good enough for the lowest-tier free CPS membership (which just gets you expedited repair service, but hey, it's free).

View attachment 187557

What country are you in?

On the "My Products" list I'm also still getting 6 points. I assumed it was because that's what the value was when I originally registered it back in 2011.

 

[mb66energy]

You'd still need to debeyer. The colors of the filters in the Bayer mask are far from the colors we use in our RGB reproduction systems. Particularly in the "red" channel, most Bayer masks are centered on about 590nm (which is a slightly orange version of yellow) rather than 640nm, which is what we use for "Red" in RGB additive (screens that emit light) trichromatic color reproduction systems. The "blue" filters in a Bayer mask are usually centered around 455nm, instead of 480nm "Blue", and the "green" filters are centered at around 540nm, rather than 525nm "Green".

View attachment 187553

Maybe I haven't understood debayering correctly: For me it was giving e.g. 10 Megapixel (2.5 Red, 5 Green, 2.5 Blue, millions) sensor the 10 full color Megapixels in the image by extrapolating the color signal of all pixels to their neigbours to give them some cull color information.
Some color adjustment is surely necessary, but I think this is much easier than calculating full color image pixels from single color detector pixels.

 

[mb66energy]

The problem with making a 100mm f/2 macro is that it's really difficult (and expensive, and heavy) to do flat field correction required for macro lenses out past an around f/2.8 sized entrance pupil. The EF 100mm f/2 leaves a lot of field curvature uncorrected (which is often desirable in a portrait lens, as it gives smoother out of focus areas), but field curvature is a death sentence for a macro lens (which doesn't worry about out of focus areas as much since it's specifically designed to image flat 2D objects at close distances).

If I look at the Zeiss planar which has a very good reputation, it has macro at f/2 so this is possible. The EF f/2 100mm is an "old" lens introduced 10/1991. If I look at the design of the EF-M 32 there should be some progress in (1) new glass types, (2) new aspherical lens possibilities, (3) new methods of optics calculation. You are right, it is not easy, but I think it would be possible @ 1200-1400 EUR on RF mount - maybe to much for some hypotheticel target group.

 

[Travel_Photographer]

What country are you in?

On the "My Products" list I'm also still getting 6 points. I assumed it was because that's what the value was when I originally registered it back in 2011.

I'm in the U.S.A. and using the Canon USA site.

The points values don't make a lot of sense. There must be some other method they're using to calculate points. For example, I got a full 8 points for my old Canon EF-S 10-22mm that I bought with my Rebel XTi! Yet as you correctly stated, neither my 16-35L or 24-70L (both original versions) qualified for a single point. I also got 8 points for my original 70-200 F4L IS, but the F2.8 version doesn't get a single point. I have no idea what methods they're using to assign points.

 

[Kit.]

I agree with much of what you are saying, but in this case, names do mean something. Clearly the R is not a mirrorless version of the 5D series, so an RII couldn't be either. It just wouldn't make sense to have the same series, in one generation, gain an extra card-slot, better weather sealing, and a higher burst rate--in addition to a top-notch, action-oriented EVF. Such a camera must have a new name.

Dunno what you are talking about. My 5D2 has a single card slot and less than 4fps burst rate.

 

[SecureGSM]

Dunno what you are talking about. My 5D2 has a single card slot and less than 4fps burst rate.

You cannot be serious.

 

[Michael Clark]

Pretty much any man who brings his tablet into the, ahem, "library" has way more than seven minutes to watch a video. Sometimes as much as 20 minutes here...

(Please note this post is in no way a comment on where this thread has come to!)

I'm a quick worker in the, ahem, library and rarely spend more than 5 minutes there.
Beyond that, I can read the text transcript of most videos in about 1/3 the time it takes to watch a video. Why waste time when I can be learning three times as much in the same number of minutes?