Patent: Canon RF 24mm f/1.4L and Canon RF 35mm f/1.4L

EOS 4 Life · Aug 5, 2021

It does make sense to make 1.2L and 1.8 lenses before 1.4L.

FrenchFry · Aug 5, 2021

Canon Rumors Guy said:
Continue reading...

Are we still expecting an event in 2021 where more lenses are announced at one time than ever before? If so, would these lenses potentially be part of that announcement?
Or do you expect the major lens announcements will all be pushed to 2022 at this point?
Do you have any news about telephoto announcements (300mm, 400 DO, 500mm, 200-500mm)?
Thanks!

CanonGrunt · Aug 5, 2021

A 22 f/1.4 would be interesting…

Hector1970 · Aug 5, 2021

The R range could do with small F2 primes to go with the small camera.
24 and 35 1.4 would make sense to me but 22mm seems an odd focal length.
20mm or 16mm I'd have thought would be more useful.

slclick · Aug 5, 2021

Keep 'em coming. Before you know it (save earthquakes, pestilence and politics) RF will be close to matching EF in variety.

timmy · Aug 5, 2021

FrenchFry said:
Are we still expecting an event in 2021 where more lenses are announced at one time than ever before? If so, would these lenses potentially be part of that announcement?
Or do you expect the major lens announcements will all be pushed to 2022 at this point?
Do you have any news about telephoto announcements (300mm, 400 DO, 500mm, 200-500mm)?
Thanks!

Will purchase the 200-500f4 in a heartbeat

SwissFrank · Aug 5, 2021

Sorry to shout, but guys, these patents are almost never about the example lenses shown in the patent, but about the higher-level design. There is NO indication in this patent that these particular lenses might possibly be manufactured.

This patent is over a specific set of lens group constraints that gives a result of minimizing the size of the focus group (to need a small motor and have low battery drainage and fast focus speed, one presumes) while satisfactorily correcting aberrations.

The lenses described are merely things one could do with this set of constraints. The patent doesn't cover just these specific designs, but ALL designs that meet these constraints.

If anything, I'd expect Canon to NOT tip its hand by showing an exact formula it is actually going to construct. It doesn't need to. There's no up-side. Has it ever done so before?

The constraints mentioned are things such as: first group is immovable and has positive refractive power, second group negative and moves for focus, ratio of focal lengths of the various groups meeting certain mathematical constraints, and so on.

Juangrande · Aug 5, 2021

Canon Rumors Guy said:
Continue reading...

I just want that RF 35mm f1.2 in my hands ASAP! Don’t care about f1.4.

jam05 · Aug 5, 2021

SwissFrank said:
Sorry to shout, but guys, these patents are almost never about the example lenses shown in the patent, but about the higher-level design. There is NO indication in this patent that these particular lenses might possibly be manufactured.

This patent is over a specific set of lens group constraints that gives a result of minimizing the size of the focus group (to need a small motor and have low battery drainage and fast focus speed, one presumes) while satisfactorily correcting aberrations.

The lenses described are merely things one could do with this set of constraints. The patent doesn't cover just these specific designs, but ALL designs that meet these constraints.

If anything, I'd expect Canon to NOT tip its hand by showing an exact formula it is actually going to construct. It doesn't need to. There's no up-side. Has it ever done so before?

The constraints mentioned are things such as: first group is immovable and has positive refractive power, second group negative and moves for focus, ratio of focal lengths of the various groups meeting certain mathematical constraints, and so on.

jam05 · Aug 5, 2021

First one doesn't get a patent for "constraints". An application is exactly just that, an application. Second, if one owns a patent who cares if their hand is tipped? That's why patents exist. Patent infringement is costly, especially if you lose. Ask Apple how it went with ProRes. Sure, I'll tip my hand if I hold a patent. Pay them royalties.

InchMetric · Aug 6, 2021

Juangrande said:
I just want that RF 35mm f1.2 in my hands ASAP! Don’t care about f1.4.

I spent the day with my RF50 1.2 (indoor kid birthday activities) and was constantly backing up. I suspect a 35 will replace the 50, and the 85 can take up the portrait distance slack.

Dj 7th · Aug 6, 2021

This might sound odd, but I still want to put it out there in case Canon is spying on the forum. Why can't Canon make 25mm and 15mm just like the Zeiss Milvus? If you look at the EF prime line up, let's start from 200mm, 135mm, 100mm, 85mm, 50mm, 35mm. I just feel that 25mm and 15mm are the logical sequence and not 24mm and 14mm. This might just be my OCD kicking in, but I have contemplated buying Zeiss just to keep the numbers logical.

Right now I have the following Prime RF Lenses, 100 Macro, 85mm f/1.2, 50mm f/1.2. I am waiting for the RF 35mm f/1.2 (I have that covered for now with Tamron 35 f/1.4) and I will like to see 25mm f/1.4 and 15mm f/2.8 or even f/4 to complete the cycle.

xwxw · Aug 6, 2021

Dj 7th said:
This might sound odd, but I still want to put it out there in case Canon is spying on the forum. Why can't Canon make 25mm and 15mm just like the Zeiss Milvus? If you look at the EF prime line up, let's start from 200mm, 135mm, 100mm, 85mm, 50mm, 35mm. I just feel that 25mm and 15mm are the logical sequence and not 24mm and 14mm. This might just be my OCD kicking in, but I have contemplated buying Zeiss just to keep the numbers logical.

Right now I have the following Prime RF Lenses, 100 Macro, 85mm f/1.2, 50mm f/1.2. I am waiting for the RF 35mm f/1.2 (I have that covered for now with Tamron 35 f/1.4) and I will like to see 25mm f/1.4 and 15mm f/2.8 or even f/4 to complete the cycle.

If you really want to be OCD then the next should be 15mm and there should never be a 25mm.

135, 85, 50, 35, 15, see the pattern?

Maybe one day, after AI has taken over photography, Canon can develop a new line of products, like vintage cars, just to satisfy us OCDer by strictly following these schemes. Oh and they should be exactly at those focal lengthens and no rounding shenanigans would be allowed.

Dj 7th · Aug 6, 2021

xwxw said:
If you really want to be OCD then the next should be 15mm and ther should never be an 25mm.

135, 85, 50, 35, 15, see the pattern?

You are right. Now you are making me do calculations.

sanj · Aug 6, 2021

I wait for 24mm 1.2.

Jaeger · Aug 6, 2021

Looks bigger than the Sony GM 24mm f1.4 boooo! It seems Sony is now making the better, smaller lenses. The whole mount argument was just a gimmick!

SwissFrank · Aug 6, 2021

jam05 said:
First one doesn't get a patent for "constraints". An application is exactly just that, an application. Second, if one owns a patent who cares if their hand is tipped? That's why patents exist. Patent infringement is costly, especially if you lose. Ask Apple how it went with ProRes. Sure, I'll tip my hand if I hold a patent. Pay them royalties.

I majored in Comp Sci and Japanese in the late 80s and have lived in Japan since the day of my last final, where I worked 100% in Japanese, down to writing the Japanese release notes for software packages my department produced. That was 30 years ago. I'm reading this patent now. I know all the technical terms. I just don't see why you're claiming it's not for "constraints" when it is exactly that. I've given a translation of the first several constraints in the lens formula they're patenting, on the off-chance you don't read Japanese. If you didn't even understand my translation, just ask me to explain it to you, rather than calling me a liar.

jam05 said:
Second, if one owns a patent who cares if their hand is tipped? That's why patents exist. Patent infringement is costly, especially if you lose. Ask Apple how it went with ProRes. Sure, I'll tip my hand if I hold a patent. Pay them royalties.

A given optical spec can be achieved with a huge number of different formulae. Compare the EF 50/1.2 and RF 50/1.2 for instance. The EF is just a fancy Double Gauss, while the RF is... something else without a name (but surely with a patent). Yes, the fact that Canon patents a lens formula that allows a super-sharp 50/1.2 does prevent other makers from using that same formula. But it doesn't prevent them from developing a competing 50/1.2 with a different formula.

I'll meet you halfway: many firms don't mind tipping their hand, and even issue a product roadmap. But if Canon wanted to surprise the market with a 50/1.2 that is ten times sharper than its predecessor, or with an f/2 zoom, say, there's no reason that, when patenting the general formula, they would show as an example that implements that formula to produce the exact lens they want to be a surprise.

SwissFrank · Aug 6, 2021

Dj 7th said:
This might sound odd, but I still want to put it out there in case Canon is spying on the forum. Why can't Canon make 25mm and 15mm just like the Zeiss Milvus? If you look at the EF prime line up, let's start from 200mm, 135mm, 100mm, 85mm, 50mm, 35mm. I just feel that 25mm and 15mm are the logical sequence and not 24mm and 14mm. This might just be my OCD kicking in, but I have contemplated buying Zeiss just to keep the numbers logical.

What would make sense is a lens lineup where each lens had double or half the area. This requires a step of sqrt(2) between focal lengths. Now focal lengths are invariably a few percent from nominal anyway, so instead of a a 141.2135mm lens we could just call it a 140.

12mm
17mm
25mm
35mm
50mm
70mm
100mm
140mm
200mm
280mm
400mm
560mm

for me the real surprise is that no-one seems to make a 70mm. I have the Leica 75/1.4, but otherwise it seems like 85mm and 90mm are more common.

Ziz · Aug 6, 2021

Was really hoping for a 35mm 1.4L USM with weather sealing the size of the old EF50mm 1.4 (or smaller) - when traveling, size really matters. This would be the most important lens in my bag.

Japan Patent JP2021-113905

Canon RF 35mm f/1.4L USM

Canon RF 24mm f/1.4L USM

Canon RF 22mm f/1.4L USM

EOS R

Wildlife enthusiast!

C70

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EOS 3

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from EOS 1N to R

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R5, C70

R5, C70

Switched from Nikon. Still zooming the wrong way.

EOS R5

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EOS R5

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from EOS 1N to R

from EOS 1N to R

Zissou

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