canon rumors FORUM

Gear Talk => Lenses => Topic started by: neuroanatomist on March 06, 2018, 12:36:36 PM

Title: Canon updates the 15-45, 18-150 and 55-200mm for the M50's Dual Sensing IS
Post by: neuroanatomist on March 06, 2018, 12:36:36 PM
Canon has incorporated Dual-Sensing IS into the new EOS M50. As I suggested in another thread, this feature will require firmware updates for lens support:

It's dual-sensing IS, probably means the camera's gyro sensors (i.e., electronic level) help support lens IS.  That may require lens firmware updates.

While I was correct about the lens firmware updates being needed, I was partially incorrect about the nature of Dual-Sensing IS.  Rather than using the gyro sensors in the camera, it uses data directly from the camera's CMOS image sensor to provide additional information about the amount of camera shake, and that information is used to enhance the effectiveness of the lens-based optical image stabilization.

Canon has released lens firmware updates for some of the EF-M lenses to support Dual-Sensing IS when used with the EOS M50 (and presumably, future M bodies that will ahve dual-sensing IS):

EF-M 15-45mm f/3.5-6.3 IS STM (https://www.usa.canon.com/internet/portal/us/home/support/details/lenses/ef/ef-m/ef-m-15-45mm-is-stm/ef-m-15-45mm-f3-5-6-3-is-stm?subtab=downloads-firmware)

EF-M 18-150mm f/3.5-6.3 IS STM (https://www.usa.canon.com/internet/portal/us/home/support/details/lenses/ef/ef-m/ef-m-18-150mm-f3-5-6-3-is-stm/ef-m-18-150mm-f3-5-6-3-is-stm?subtab=downloads-firmware)

EF-M 55-200mm f/4.5-6.3 IS STM (https://www.usa.canon.com/internet/portal/us/home/support/details/lenses/ef/ef-m/ef-m-55-200mm-f-4-5-6-3-is-stm/ef-m-55-200mm-f4-5-6-3-is-stm?subtab=downloads-firmware)

Hopefully, updates for the EF-M 11-22mm, EF-M 18-55mm, and EF-M 28mm Macro will be forthcoming.  If so, they can be found starting from the Support Pages for the EF-M lenses (https://www.usa.canon.com/internet/portal/us/home/support/product-finder/support-lenses?cm_sp=CSO-_-PFListing-_-EFM_Series_Lenses_Listing#lenses-eos-lenses-efm).
Title: Canon updates the 15-45, 18-150 and 55-200mm for the M50's Dual Sensing IS
Post by: canonnews on March 06, 2018, 12:53:05 PM

Canon has released updates for the three EF-M lenses to support dual sensing IS – which is a combination of both in camera body and lens based shake detection which is used by the lens to determine the amount of stabilization required.


Right now, only the EOS-M50 supports dual sensing IS.


The firmware can be found on the lens pages at Canon USA under “firmware”;



Thanks Neuroanatomist


 


Title: Re: Canon updates the 15-45, 18-150 and 55-200mm for the M50's Dual Sensing IS
Post by: Dominion003 on March 06, 2018, 04:15:59 PM
So the Dual Sensing IS will only work exclusively with EF-M lens only?  Was hoping my Sigma 17-50mm f/2.8 EX DC OS HSM would be able to to take advantage of the Dual Sensing IS.
Title: Re: Canon updates the 15-45, 18-150 and 55-200mm for the M50's Dual Sensing IS
Post by: neuroanatomist on March 06, 2018, 04:22:53 PM
So the Dual Sensing IS will only work exclusively with EF-M lens only? 

Correct, unless Canon updates firmware for other lenses (EF/EF-S) which could be mounted via the adapter.  Regardless, any such update for your lens would have to come from Sigma, and for that they would have to reverse engineer the necessary information processing (in other words, don't hold your breath).
Title: Re: Canon updates the 15-45, 18-150 and 55-200mm for the M50's Dual Sensing IS
Post by: kphoto99 on March 06, 2018, 06:37:16 PM
If there are more lenses EF/EFs being updated then this feature will show up in the DSLR cameras. But if no other lens gets this firmware update then it will be limited to EOS-M bodies.
The first EF lens that should get this update is the nifty-fifty or the 40mm.
Title: Re: Canon updates the 15-45, 18-150 and 55-200mm for the M50's Dual Sensing IS
Post by: neuroanatomist on March 06, 2018, 06:51:07 PM
If there are more lenses EF/EFs being updated then this feature will show up in the DSLR cameras. But if no other lens gets this firmware update then it will be limited to EOS-M bodies.
The first EF lens that should get this update is the nifty-fifty or the 40mm.

I do not believe that will happen.  Dual-sensing IS uses data from the image sensor, and in a dSLR, that is only exposed during the actual image capture (too late for IS to be of benefit, and I really don't see them implementing this just for live view). So, this is a feature that will be restricted to mirrorless bodies.  They could still update EF/EF-S lens firmware for it, but honestly I doubt they will do so.



Title: Re: Canon updates the 15-45, 18-150 and 55-200mm for the M50's Dual Sensing IS
Post by: Woody on March 06, 2018, 11:58:04 PM
Rather than using the gyro sensors in the camera, it uses data directly from the camera's CMOS image sensor to provide additional information about the amount of camera shake, and that information is used to enhance the effectiveness of the lens-based optical image stabilization.

Sounds like something that can be propagated to other EOS-M cameras.

But that is unlikely to happen...
Title: Re: Canon updates the 15-45, 18-150 and 55-200mm for the M50's Dual Sensing IS
Post by: AvTvM on March 07, 2018, 05:16:04 AM
I do not believe that will happen.  Dual-sensing IS uses data from the image sensor, and in a dSLR, that is only exposed during the actual image capture (too late for IS to be of benefit, and I really don't see them implementing this just for live view). So, this is a feature that will be restricted to mirrorless bodies.  They could still update EF/EF-S lens firmware for it, but honestly I doubt they will do so.

agree 100%   

Yet another *unique systemic advantage* of mirrorless cameras over all those antiquated mirrorslappers  :P and mirrorflickers   ::)... and (potentially) helpful *with every single capture* !  8) 
Title: Re: Canon updates the 15-45, 18-150 and 55-200mm for the M50's Dual Sensing IS
Post by: 3kramd5 on March 07, 2018, 11:14:07 AM
I do not believe that will happen.  Dual-sensing IS uses data from the image sensor, and in a dSLR, that is only exposed during the actual image capture (too late for IS to be of benefit, and I really don't see them implementing this just for live view). So, this is a feature that will be restricted to mirrorless bodies.  They could still update EF/EF-S lens firmware for it, but honestly I doubt they will do so.

agree 100%   

Yet another *unique systemic advantage* of mirrorless cameras over all those antiquated mirrorslappers  :P and mirrorflickers   ::)... and (potentially) helpful *with every single capture* !  8)

Did you really need to invent another term for SLR? You’ve been using mirrorslapper for quite some time now, but mirrorflicker? Really?

What are shutters? Curtainsliders?


Also, it’s not a systematic advantage of mirrorless cameras. It’s entirely possible to implement it in a camera with a mirror even if a manufacturer elects not to. Canon for example put DPAF in SLRs. Even though it only functions when the mirror is up, it advantages those reflex cameras.
Title: Re: Canon updates the 15-45, 18-150 and 55-200mm for the M50's Dual Sensing IS
Post by: neuroanatomist on March 07, 2018, 11:18:10 AM
Did you really need to invent another term for SLR? You’ve been using mirrorslapper for quite some time now, but mirrorflicker? Really?

Perhaps we should start referring to MILCs as mirror-challenged cameras, as a politically correct way to acknowledge their evident disability.   :P
Title: Re: Canon updates the 15-45, 18-150 and 55-200mm for the M50's Dual Sensing IS
Post by: 3kramd5 on March 07, 2018, 11:28:04 AM
Did you really need to invent another term for SLR? You’ve been using mirrorslapper for quite some time now, but mirrorflicker? Really?

Perhaps we should start referring to MILCs as mirror-challenged cameras, as a politically correct way to acknowledge their evident disability.   :P

The ones with in body image stabilizers would quite naturally be “sensor wigglers.” And lenses with the ability to change focus: “optics pushers.”
Title: Re: Canon updates the 15-45, 18-150 and 55-200mm for the M50's Dual Sensing IS
Post by: C-A430 on March 07, 2018, 12:10:05 PM
If there are more lenses EF/EFs being updated then this feature will show up in the DSLR cameras. But if no other lens gets this firmware update then it will be limited to EOS-M bodies.
The first EF lens that should get this update is the nifty-fifty or the 40mm.

Nifty-fifty and 40/2.8 have no IS. There is nothing firmware update can do about that. This isn't IBIS replacement, but optical IS booster. It wont give stabilization to lens that does not have it.
Title: Re: Canon updates the 15-45, 18-150 and 55-200mm for the M50's Dual Sensing IS
Post by: kphoto99 on March 07, 2018, 08:16:18 PM
If there are more lenses EF/EFs being updated then this feature will show up in the DSLR cameras. But if no other lens gets this firmware update then it will be limited to EOS-M bodies.
The first EF lens that should get this update is the nifty-fifty or the 40mm.

Nifty-fifty and 40/2.8 have no IS. There is nothing firmware update can do about that. This isn't IBIS replacement, but optical IS booster. It wont give stabilization to lens that does not have it.

You are so right. Now I can't think of any EF(s) lens that is a likely candidate, possible the 18-135 STM/USM variants.
Title: Re: Canon updates the 15-45, 18-150 and 55-200mm for the M50's Dual Sensing IS
Post by: AvTvM on March 08, 2018, 04:39:20 AM
The ones with in body image stabilizers would quite naturally be “sensor wigglers.” And lenses with the ability to change focus: “optics pushers.”

*mirrorslappers* are (D)SLRs with a massive, solid, honest, down-to-earth, 19th century mechanic, wood-chopper axe and miners hammer type mirror SLAP ... BA-WHAMM, THUD! [first and foremost some Nikon models, Canon does not even manage to get this "really right") ... you can see the photog's hand shaking almost like the re-coil of a large-calibre handgun ... laying waste to any image capture at speeds slower than 1/125s ... and those shots ring out ... clearly audible all the way to the very last benches in church at a wedding ... or at concerts ... preferably during the most delicate pianissimo stretches of music ... when - seemingly inevitable - some trigger-happy dumbass photog manages to fire off an entire buffer-filling 11fps salvo   :P

*mirrorflickers* are sorry little mirrorswinging Rebel-class pieces of plastic and other junk, that only manage to disturb bystanders in a 3 metre radius and produce just enough vibration to ever so sneakily ruin half of the shots taken ... of course only to be noticed after the event ... during closer review of shots on a real monitor ...  ::)

optical lenses in general I'd just call "photon grinders"  ... weak lenses should be denominated with a warning sticker like on cigarette packs ... "Kills Photons!"  :P  ;D
Title: Re: Canon updates the 15-45, 18-150 and 55-200mm for the M50's Dual Sensing IS
Post by: Jester74 on March 08, 2018, 08:18:02 AM
Did you really need to invent another term for SLR? You’ve been using mirrorslapper for quite some time now, but mirrorflicker? Really?

Perhaps we should start referring to MILCs as mirror-challenged cameras, as a politically correct way to acknowledge their evident disability.   :P

ILM-CCs? Haha, that's a good one!

And how do (should) we call those folks who lack any photograhical knowledge and still post like hell?
FWLAPKASPLHs?

 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

No, that's not PC, maybe knowledge-challenged folks who still post like hell?

K-CFWSPLH?

 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D