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Messages - PerfectSavage

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31
EOS Bodies / Re: 46.1mp Canon DSLR Previewed at PhotoPlus 2012? [CR1]
« on: September 22, 2012, 11:18:37 PM »
Has to be FF sensor with pixel size of about 4.3 microns so very close to current 7D. Perhaps a FF 7D2 after all?

NO, there will never ever be a FF 7D2... 7D is and always will be an APS-C series...stop the madness.

32
EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: Canon Announces the Canon EOS 6D DSLR
« on: September 20, 2012, 08:13:20 AM »
In fact, Canon's global Japan site places the 6D BEHIND the 7D in it's pecking order...check it out...1D series, 5D, 7D and THEN 6D....then 60D.   http://web.canon.jp/imaging/eosd-e.html

This probably means that you will get less cps points (US) or only cps silver (Europe) for the 6d as its not "professional". But this is mostly marketing and doesn't necessarily mean the 6d is worse than 7d/5d2.

I'm not familiar with CPS specifics, but I agree, there is no "better/worse"...I think it's just organized by intended market, build quality...the 6D is only a partial alloy body, mostly aluminum and exterior is plastic and rubber like the 60D but a bit more ergonomic by the hands-ons I've read.  Canon calls it an "enthusiast" camera and the 7D a "prosumer" (even though clearly it's a pro APS-C camera, build is better than 5D2).

33
EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: Canon Announces the Canon EOS 6D DSLR
« on: September 20, 2012, 08:01:51 AM »


The 6D will sell...a LOT.  It's just like when the 7D was launched to give those moving up from a Rebel to the x0D series another option in 2009... "7D or 50D?? Hmmm...if I buy the 50D will I wish I'd bought the 7D in six months?"

The 6D Will sell a lot????? HAHAHAHA............ At the same Price you can have something very very very BETTER: Nikon D600! I always loved Canon.... In the 2012 a product like that with that features and with that price is VERY VERY RIDICULOUS. See what the D600 have more for the same price!



You can't compare what happen with 7D: it's ridicolous!!.....

How old are you?  15?  Event shooters with multiple Canon bodies don't even look at Nikon and vice versa.  What is so "very very very BETTER" about the D600 grasshopper? It is still a Nikon after all, no? 

...and it's exactly like the 7D launch, 60D launch and even 1Dc launch... in that it's another option to choose from... having more choices is always "very very very BETTER".

34
EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: Canon Announces the Canon EOS 6D DSLR
« on: September 18, 2012, 10:00:32 AM »
This is ridiculous what Canon has done. I have been looking to update my 7D and was really disappointed at the price of the 5DIII. When I saw rumors of the 6D I thought my prayers would be answered and I would get a full frame 7D! This camera is ridiculous. It is a full frame 60D. Maybe this could be a backup camera or something but that is it. I doubt a ton of people want a full frame 60D and are willing to pay $2100 for it.
I am so pissed at Canon right now for crippling this so much (and why include wifi & gps?). They could have priced this for $1800 without those or have put in a worthwhile focus system instead. And not even a dual SD card slot????? Ridiculous Canon. Also, i'm pissed at Canon's new extreme pricing, and for making almost no improvements in the last 4 years in video. Even their recent lenses were disappointing, not in performance, but in usability. Who wants a f/2.8 24mm & 28mm prime and why put IS in that and not in the 24-70 f/2.8? Its obvious Canon knew no one would buy the 24 & 28mm lenses if the 24-70 had IS at f/2.8, even if it was $2,500.

The 6D is not a worthy upgrade for 7D users for sure so now the decision is to save up for the 5DIII or switch to Nikon where the D800 & D600, while not perfect, have alot to offer. I could easily get away with the D600 as a main camera and be very happy where the Canon 6D would even be disappointing as a backup. My only full frame capable lens is the 70-200 f/2.8 II and that is probably easy to sell.

No one other than those with the whims expressed on these message boards ever claimed it was an upgrade, let alone "replacement" for a 7D.  The 7D2 will be the upgrade to the 7D and it will not be FF, it will probably be a new APS-C sensor with better ISO/IQ like the 6D's sensor is a new FF one and also have some improved AF around speed/sports etc.  In fact, Canon's global Japan site places the 6D BEHIND the 7D in it's pecking order...check it out...1D series, 5D, 7D and THEN 6D....then 60D.   http://web.canon.jp/imaging/eosd-e.html

The 6D is an "enthusiast" camera as Canon has clearly stated repeatedly in every announcement and marketing piece globally...a FF 60D basically with much better ISO/IQ.  Haven't had my hands on one obviously but the specs look like the build quality is inferior to the 7D/5D as well, no real mention of weather sealing levels and it is not a 100% magnesium alloy body, mostly aluminum to decrease weight.  It's not a pro camera, never intended to be one.  Everyone seemed to want a "FF 7D" well, they have one already, it came out this past spring and it's called the 5D Mark III.
 
The 6D is an enthusiast camera to provide an option for those looking to move up from the x0D series or even Rebel that want a FF option but don't want to spend $4K nor need all the pro capabilities.  It is an EXCELLENT option to the 7D for those shooting landscape, portraiture etc that don't have kids or photography sports and action.  It is also a great option as a B or C cam for event photographers etc. that want to park a portrait prime on it.  Why pay for a 5D3 for a B/C cam when you can buy a great piece of glass (or even two lenses) with the difference?  For event photographers shooting a 1D series or 5D II/III as primary body, they would prefer the 6D and the new 24-70 L II (or other new glass) to a 5D III and no new glass as their B or C camera option, I assure you.

The 6D will sell...a LOT.  It's just like when the 7D was launched to give those moving up from a Rebel to the x0D series another option in 2009... "7D or 50D?? Hmmm...if I buy the 50D will I wish I'd bought the 7D in six months?"  Now those looking to move up from an x0D have another option other than a $4K camera in the 5D3 or even a choice of whether a 6D is better for their uses than a 7D...and those multi-body shooters have a much easier path to that second, third or fifth body they've been needing but have done without due to budget.

The 5D3 will be closer to $3K by end of year...watch.  My guess is the LIST price (forget the recent Adorama mistake or one-off drama on eBay) of the 5D3 will be $2,999 by the holidays...maybe cheaper if they drop the 6D down to $1,999 etc.

35
Clearly this was either a grey-market camera (which Adorama is famous for but always clearly states) or a mistake.  The price on Adorama's eBay store is back to regular price. 

Who cares anyway?  If you bought the camera on day one, or even at ABOVE list price from someone who had an early model then you clearly did your own cost-benefit analysis and deemed it WORTH IT.  To some it wasn't worth it and they didn't buy it, to others it was worth twice the price and they bought two.  What happens afterward is none of your business, it's a free market...and a camera is a depreciable asset...just like a TV, PC or a car for that matter.

Moreover, the list price hasn't officially changed so this is a moot topic really isn't it?

36
the 60D images are on the original CR link at the top of this thread... it's a bad link on Canon's site, it says "6D" but the page it directs to is "60D", the Canon Australia (canon.au) links are 6D images and video, CR's link is to the old 60D samples page.

nope, above link points to the correct 6D site.

Quote
Canon has posted a bunch of images and videos made with the new Canon EOS 6D. As suspected, their results are terrific.


Have at it pixel peepers!


http://web.canon.jp/imaging/eosd/samples/eos6d/

Well, that's really odd.  Perhaps it's a geography-based thing with the URL based on geo/IP... I'm in NYC and have clicked on both the CR link as well as the link directly on Canon's site with all EOS model sample pages... the one for 6D takes me directly to the 60D page every time, not a 6D page... I only see 6D images on the Canon Australia site link I referenced...  Any idea why that's happening?  I'd love to download high res. and the Australia site only has mid-res. images from what I can see.

For me, this link (in NYC at least) - http://web.canon.jp/imaging/eosd/samples/eos6d/ - links to the 60D samples page - http://web.canon.jp/imaging/eosd/samples/eos60d/    ...and even on Canon's EOS image samples page, it still directs me to 60D... You're 100% sure this link on the line above this takes you to a 6D page?  Any idea why it doesn't work for me?

37
Australia has stills and video up here from the 6D:  http://www.canon.com.au/About-Canon/News-Events/News-Press-Releases/IMR-EOS-6D/Sample-Images


only small sample images?.. pretty useless if you ask me.

yup, but an order of magnitude more useful than 60D images :)  and the video at least shows pretty decent DR; I'm sure larger ones will be up soon on the USA site or other Canon site.

??

it´s the same images as in the link from the first post... only that you can´t downlaod the full resolution images from your link.

i don´t see any 60D images....

the 60D images are on the original CR link at the top of this thread... it's a bad link on Canon's site, it says "6D" but the page it directs to is "60D", the Canon Australia (canon.au) links are 6D images and video, CR's link is to the old 60D samples page.

38
Australia has stills and video up here from the 6D:  http://www.canon.com.au/About-Canon/News-Events/News-Press-Releases/IMR-EOS-6D/Sample-Images


only small sample images?.. pretty useless if you ask me.

yup, but an order of magnitude more useful than 60D images :)  and the video at least shows pretty decent DR; I'm sure larger ones will be up soon on the USA site or other Canon site.

6D video sample :  http://www.canon.com.au/About-Canon/News-Events/News-Press-Releases/IMR-EOS-6D/Videos

39

Your link directs to 60D images and video from 2010, not 6D.  Canon Australia has stills and video up here from the 6D:  http://www.canon.com.au/About-Canon/News-Events/News-Press-Releases/IMR-EOS-6D/Sample-Images

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<p><strong>From Canon<br />

</strong>Canon has posted a bunch of images and videos made with the new Canon EOS 6D. As suspected, their results are terrific.</p>
<p>Have at it pixel peepers!</p>
<p><strong><a href=\"http://web.canon.jp/imaging/eosd/samples/eos6d/\" target=\"_blank\">http://web.canon.jp/imaging/eosd/samples/eos6d/</a></strong></p>
<p><strong><span style=\"color: #ff0000;\">c</span>r</strong></p>
<p><strong> </strong></p>


40
EOS Bodies / Re: Is the 5D3 SOFT compared to the 5D2?
« on: May 24, 2012, 12:05:05 PM »
While I have been taking a break from my work as a food photographer, so I have not done any studio shots on a tripod with Zeiss glass on the 5d3 yet... I can say definitely say that I am getting super sharp images from this camera handheld.

I shot almost exclusively prime lenses on the 5d2 until buying the 5d3 kit and I'm getting tack sharp photos with the 5d3 and 24-105 handheld.  Whether or not this is just the improved AF system giving me more and better keepers remains to be seen, but I am extremely happy either way.

I'll be working on a food project in the next two months, so I'll see how it performs there, but I honestly can't imagine a noticeable difference, other than what I feel is much better color rendition in the 5d3, especially for vibrant colored food.

I also did a reshoot with the 5d3 of a scene for a feature film I shot on the 5d2.  Video sharpness looks identical out of the camera to me as I was not shooting a scene that would have a lot of aliasing.  Any perceived extra sharpness in the 5d2 was most likely aliasing on fine details like brick and grass.  I am quite glad this is gone as the aliasing and moire can really kill the filmic look.  With the ability to slightly sharpen in post, the 5d3 definitely edges out the 5d2 in sharpness (but not amazingly so).  The high ISO video quality is absolutely astonishing though.  Yes, the video can start to get waxy looking, but I can push the ISO so much higher now.  I would have to use Neat Video on footage on the 5d2 above ISO 800 which would make the footage very waxy anyway and add a ridiculous amount of time to the render.

There are two tricks you can use to get rid of this waxy look of noise reduced high-ISO video... 1. Light your scene better and use a lower ISO!  2. Add film grain in post.  My last stage of video processing is adding real 35mm film grain scans by Gorilla Grain over top of the video.  While it may seem counterproductive to reintroduce noise, I think that ISO noise is ugly and film grain is not.  Of course your taste may vary... but even at only 50% opacity, this film grain will "dither" your video and effectively cover over that waxy look.

Thanks for the response.  One question since you mention the video and there are references to the changes in profiles, etc. (potentially).  Since combining footage from both, did you use the same profile(s) when shooting video on the 5D3 as the 5D2?  Any noticeable differences, especially in post if color grading etc.?  I've been wondering how they might work together, i.e. an A/B cam scenario, with respect to the profiles (custom, CineStyle, etc) as I don't plan to sell either of my 5D2s given the price drop.

41
EOS Bodies / Re: Is the 5D3 SOFT compared to the 5D2?
« on: May 24, 2012, 12:00:33 PM »
All of these responses are very helpful (and educational).  Thanks a lot.

42
EOS Bodies / Is the 5D3 SOFT compared to the 5D2?
« on: May 23, 2012, 01:28:15 PM »
I've own both the 5D2 and 7D and have used them for several years (bought the 7D a month after it was out and the 5D2 maybe six months after it was out) and on occasion rented a 1Ds3 for certain shoots as well.  A couple weekends ago I got my hands on a 5D3 and as I didn't have a subject to test in studio, nor did I want to pixel peep at tests 100 others out there have already done, I walked an early Saturday morning in SoHo in NYC for a few hours to shoot street and test the touted DR improvements in areas of dark shadow and contrast cast by the low morning sun through the low rise buildings, fire escapes etc.  I shot with both the 17-40 f/4L and 70-200 f/4 IS, choosing those over faster primes to allow me a range of focal lengths and eliminate my penchant for shooting shallow DoF and force me to shoot no larger than f/4 to best gauge sharpness, etc.  So, in short, I liked it...a lot.  It handled very well, just like the 7D and I was pleased overall with the results (RAW in LR3).  So as I prepared to buy one this week I started looking at more comparisons out there  (5D2 vs 5D3) and then saw a clip on the video performance by Philip Bloom touting the ability to sharpen video content in PremierePro but saying that "...out of camera video is far less sharp and contrast-y than the 5D2 was (at same settings.)"  Coupled with some of the muddiness issues in the shadows (if in camera NR not turned off), JPEG issues, and looking at 100% crops in the latest tests I've seen, I'm starting to wonder, is the 5D3's sensor somehow a little "soft" compared to the 5D2.  As many of you now have your 5D3 with shipments sent out the past few weeks, I'm curious what you've seen overall given I only shot with it a few hours.  In terms of PURE IMAGE QUALITY (not features, no doubt the 5D3 is a completely new camera feature wise over the 5D2), is the 5D3 sensor producing the same quality of images out of camera as the 5D2's sensor does?  I'm wondering if I should be buying as many 5D2's as I can find as a short-term investment vs. a 5D3 (will probably outperform FaceBook's stock) :)))

43
EOS Bodies / Re: For those interested in 7D2
« on: May 16, 2012, 08:46:43 AM »
The 7D has a better build quality and sealings than the 5DII and equal to the 5D3 and 1Dx.

Ummm...no.  The 7D has better build quality and sealings than the 5DII and equal to the 5DIII - that part is true.  The 1D X is a substantial step up in both build quality and weather sealing.  The ranking is 1-series >> 7D = 5DIII > 5DII = 50D/60D.

Hard to say exactly given the production 1Dx isn't even out yet, no?  What is going to be different in the 1Dx from the 5D3 sealing-wise?...because my 5D3 is exactly the same as my 7D in terms of housing (from what I can see/touch at least)

44
EOS Bodies / Re: For those interested in 7D2
« on: May 11, 2012, 11:31:15 AM »
It seems that in most of these thread's about new body's everyone will be happy if the price goes up 1000 dollars over current 7D body's pricing.  I personally am a hobby shooter with about 4 weddings lined up as the 2nd shooter this summer.   The thought of spending close to or more than 2g's for a camera is my max budget.   That being said I wanted to know what people do for money that makes a 2500 dollar pro-sumer body a good deal?

you can pick up a 5D mark II for less than 2gs ....

I don't think anyone considers the prices a "good deal", other than the 5D2 right now, I think it's more "market value/ market price".  If the market doesn't sustain a price, it will drop...that you can count on.  If I were you, shooting as a hobby and B/C camera for hire at weddings and I was on a tight budget, I'd look hard at the 60D, unless you're shooting weddings outdoors in potential wet conditions.  The 60D is a GREAT camera, a baby 7D.

45
EOS Bodies / Re: For those interested in 7D2
« on: May 11, 2012, 11:24:22 AM »
Aren't "Its just for fun" and "I am a business person in an unrelated field" pretty much the same?  At least, I don't see much of a distinction.

Echoing the sentiments above, value is in the eye of the beholder.  That said, even though photography is only a hobby for me, I am passionate enough about it that I could see spending $2k-$2.5k for a 7DII.  What I'll be looking for are improved low light focus ability, less noise at higher ISO, improved DR (not expecting this after 5DIII), 10 fps (not really needed) and while the focus system is already very good, I expect some sort of improvement there in number of points, etc.  I don't really need more MP, but also wouldn't mind a small bump up to 22-24 MP range.  But the noise, DR, colors, and low light focusing ability are really where I would like to see improvements.

Totally agree with the above.  Another thing is these subjective terms thrown around like "prosumer" relative to the 7D.  The 7D is a PRO camera, the 60D (50D etc) is a PROSUMER camera.  The 7D has a better build quality and sealings than the 5DII and equal to the 5D3 and 1Dx.  You don't have to be a FF body to be considered a PRO camera.  A guy named Drake Doremus shot an entire feature length movie (shot 100%) on the 7D and it won rave reviews at Sundance and was sold to Paramount distribution for $4 million USD, the film was Like Crazy.  If you can't afford $2Kish for a camera then my advice is "don't buy it",  the 60D is a great camera almost the same as the 7D minus the magnesium alloy housing and a few other specs.  Can't afford the 60D?  The Txi series are great cameras too.  Whoever mentioned the 5DII and 7D are nearly "the same" has clearly never shot with either of them, they are vastly different cameras in every respect other than the Canon name on the front and black color and that they both use EF mount lenses.  I bought my first 7D about two months after they were out and the body was $1,699 or $1,799 then, I forget which.  So I would assume, IF THEY EVEN INTRODUCE a 7D2 (which I think they will), that the price would be somewhere over $2K but not by much - I'd guess $2299 body, I can't see $2500+ unless they plan to keep the 5D3 at $3500 USD.  I'm expecting the 5D3 to drop to around $3100 when the FF studio camera comes out closer to $4K (whether that be a 3D or other aptly named body)  Personally right now, I think the 5D2 is the best value out there, while you can still get them.  I am trying to decide between a lens and picking up a 5D2 right now since it is such a great value.  When they're gone, I think the price for new 5D2s people are holding onto will go up with the 5D3 at $3500.  It's basic supply and demand.  The question is how many 5D2s are out there, they sold a lot of them last fall when they dropped the price.

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