Phottix Odin: Inaccuate high-ISO metering problem

[V8Beast]

Update: AdamJ and chriswatters were spot on.

Keeping the aperture and shutter values the same as before in Av mode, I turned the flashes to 1/128 power in manual mode, and like Adam and Chris suspected, the image was still overexposed at ISO 800. Now that my pea brain realized what was going on, I turned off one of the lights, and doubled the distance of the remaining light from the subject. This allowed the Odins to achieve the correct exposure to ISO 3200.

More boring tests:

Keeping the Odins in TTL mode and the camera in Av mode, but stopping the aperture down and/or decreasing the ISO, resulted in very accurate flash metering. In other words, shooting in real world conditions instead of some bogus set of test conditions that would never be encountered in the field, allows the Odins to function as they should. Man, I'm such an idiot

The really dumb thing is that I never shoot wide open, and in the rare instance that I'm at ISO 800 or higher - factors that contributed to this pseudo problem -  it's because I'm in a dark environment that actually warrants it, not just for the sake of testing.   

So I've concluded that the Odins work great, as long as the user isn't an idiot

[risc32]

Glad to hear there isn't a bug, and that you figured it out. My first real outing last saturday at a wedding shoot went well. At first it didn't fire and i was thinking about going to plan b. the wedding party was very ready to get to the reception, but i did another once over the settings and noticed that i must have bumped a slider on the receiver while mounting it on a light stand. i either knocked it to the wrong group, or channel, can't recall, but once corrected it worked perfectly. all formals after the ceremony done and in my car in about 20mins. yeah, i'm not to pleased with the lack of time. that and the fact i had two photographer friends of the bride/groom there as guests over my shoulder at times, but that's another story...

[V8Beast]

Just finished my first real gig with the Odins, and let's just say these suckers get the job done.











It's sooooo liberating not having to deal with the stupid line of sight nonsense anymore, and it allows positioning and angling the flashes in ways that just aren't possible otherwise. Why didn't I buy these things sooner ? Being able to control power output right from the camera saves  ton of time as well. Thank goodness I didn't have to get gouged by Canon for a set of 600EXs

[risc32]

couldn't agree more. nice shots, you have a good handle on all that chrome and your shots always have a certain look to them that i think is just awesome. Plus i see you in the center of that wheel.

[wickidwombat]

glad they are working out for you, pics look fantastic as usual!
580 exii plus the odin still work out cheaper than the 600 and
the odins will also work with studio strobes

[V8Beast]

Thanks for the kind words, fellas.

wombat, how well do the Odins interface with studio lights? I like the idea of controlling the power from the transmitter instead of having to walk over to the lights every time I want to adjust the power. That's one of the main reasons I picked them up, since I'm going to have to get some monolights sooner or later.

The Speedlites work great for run-and-gun shots like the ones posted above, but when attempting to light up the entire car (first shot), I had to turn the ISO up more than I wanted to for the desired results. For certain occaisions, I'd like a broader beam of light than what the Speedlites offer. With large subjects, there isn't much margin for error in this regard with the Speedlites.     

[wickidwombat]

Thanks for the kind words, fellas.

wombat, how well do the Odins interface with studio lights? I like the idea of controlling the power from the transmitter instead of having to walk over to the lights every time I want to adjust the power. That's one of the main reasons I picked them up, since I'm going to have to get some monolights sooner or later.

The Speedlites work great for run-and-gun shots like the ones posted above, but when attempting to light up the entire car (first shot), I had to turn the ISO up more than I wanted to for the desired results. For certain occaisions, I'd like a broader beam of light than what the Speedlites offer. With large subjects, there isn't much margin for error in this regard with the Speedlites.   

the odins dont control the studio light power they are pure manual
at least I dont think they do since they plug into the lights via a 3.5mm cable
I dont think there will be any smarts going down the line

i'll typically mix them and set it all in manual like use speedlights for accent lights like a hair light with a snoot or background lights when I am using the elinchroms as main lights. I've always just adjusted the studio lights on the flash head as I assumed the odin wont control the power and since the power settings are very different between speedlights and elinchrom studio lights speedlights have 1/3rd stop increments as a function of a fraction of their full power where as elinchrom studio lights have 1/10th stop increments from their minimum output up to their maximum output

I know elinchrom have the high end skyports with power control from the transmitter which works really well and an elinchrom reciever can be used with speedlights but again in this case the speedlights are dumb and only the elinchrom light recieve the benefit of the radio controlled power adjustment

[lucuias]

Odin is a superb ETTL wireless solution from portrait to wedding and events,it does had flaws when it 1st release,my 5Dmark III having overexposure issues when the flash head flip 180degree.But was fixed via firmware.
Nevertheless,I still had a couple of times miss connect issue between odin receiver and flash hot shoe.

Below were some of the shot using Phottix odin

[V8Beast]

the odins dont control the studio light power they are pure manual
at least I dont think they do since they plug into the lights via a 3.5mm cable
I dont think there will be any smarts going down the line

Good to know. Some control of the studio lights is still better than no control I doubt the 600EX would do much when it comes to controlling studio lights, either

[jonathan7007]

Re: Odin units and studio units
There are lots of situations where I might want lug the Norman gear to the shoot -- and then mix in a speedlite or two. For instance the speedlight at or near the camera could be the "fill-in" at a power setting below that of the key lights. (I know the Odin controller does not allow a "pass-through" speedlite on top)

I read that if any of the speedlites ar set for ETTL there is a preflash. If the studio power packs are triggered by optical slaves that would be a problem. But perhaps the users here are suggesting buying a Strato or another Odin receiver for the power packs...

My studio units are older Norman packs like the 2000D and an 808.

This was the only thing making me hold back for more research on the Phottix set. I *do* wish there was a pass-through fitting, as I don't think my current bracket for events will allow the Odin controller to fit under the top shoe that can move relative to the camera for horiz-to-vert shift. Might have to go back to the older side mount style...

jonathan7007

[lucuias]

Hi jonathan7007,
I have a solution for using Phottix odin while at the same time using another flash on body without using bracket .I did this myself for my wedding work.
1st ,get yourself a Nissin SC-01 Universal TTL cord http://www.nissindigital.com/SC-01.html
2nd, attach Nissin SC-01 Universal TTL cord on your body while phottix odin transmitter on the cord external hot shoe.
3rd, attach your flash light on phottix odin receiver.then attach it on the Nissin SC-01 universal TTL cord top shoue.
4th,keep the switch on Nissin SC-01 Universal TTL cord on EXT(external).





I hope this helps.I had been shooting a lot of wedding and event using this setup.It is always great to have on body flash as fill light while another off flash as key light/rim light.







However,lately the Nissin SC-01 giving me connectivity issue between the cord and my camera hot shoe.

[jonathan7007]

Ronnie,
I love multiple light candids like those examples in your posts. Thank you for your experimentation and, especially, for sharing the rig. It sounds like the key element of the Nissan cord is a switch for external use. I will research this gear.Side brackets with posts as handles or mounting of flash heads used to be in lots of camera store bins as used. Sometimes at yard sales! That would work to hold the Odin controller.

Do you mix any Strato receivers into the Odin setup?

Is there a preflash that would cause any issue with old-style "generic" optical triggers placed on a studio-style power pack?

I used to do a lot of this with pure optical triggers for editorial work. Had a kit of spring clamps, threaded clamps, magic-arms, hand-driven lag screws with 1/4-20 tops, a real do-everything little case. Lots of duct-tape, of course. I plan to be doing this for events, weddings, this year. I already do this (multiple speedlites) for vacation rental/RE shooting.

At this point I am planning on using 550's instead of a jump to 600's. I do have one 580ex, a bunch of Vivitar 285s that I will swap for used 550's.

Again thanks for posting

jonathan7007

[lucuias]

Ronnie,
I love multiple light candids like those examples in your posts. Thank you for your experimentation and, especially, for sharing the rig. It sounds like the key element of the Nissan cord is a switch for external use. I will research this gear.Side brackets with posts as handles or mounting of flash heads used to be in lots of camera store bins as used. Sometimes at yard sales! That would work to hold the Odin controller.

Do you mix any Strato receivers into the Odin setup?

Is there a preflash that would cause any issue with old-style "generic" optical triggers placed on a studio-style power pack?

I used to do a lot of this with pure optical triggers for editorial work. Had a kit of spring clamps, threaded clamps, magic-arms, hand-driven lag screws with 1/4-20 tops, a real do-everything little case. Lots of duct-tape, of course. I plan to be doing this for events, weddings, this year. I already do this (multiple speedlites) for vacation rental/RE shooting.

At this point I am planning on using 550's instead of a jump to 600's. I do have one 580ex, a bunch of Vivitar 285s that I will swap for used 550's.

Again thanks for posting

jonathan7007

Hi Jonathan,

I just slip the Odin controller in vest pocket.No I do not mix with Strato on my wedding work but I did once on Portrait shoot with my friend's Strato,it works just fine.
After owns odin,I didn't use pure optical triggers.Thus,no comment on that.

Here are another shot with this setup and it works just great

[jonathan7007]

Love it! That key-light-to-the-side look (with appropriate fill) is EXACTLY why I want that kind of rig. Now I see why the Odin controller was "loose" on its wire in the shot you posted earlier. Now all I need is a low-cost two-legged light stand to hold the high-key light at events! B&H carry those? Aaaah, shipping to Hawaii is too high...

I used to do this stuff with just optical and quick math (square and square root) reflexes. Too old now for those quick reflexes. <grin>.

jonathan7007

[V8Beast]

More love for the Odins. Strongly back-lit subjects always threw the infrared Canon flash triggering off, but with the Odins, shooting straight into the sun is no problem.



This is far from a great shot, but I love the convenience of being able to adjust the backlight and fill in groups independently, right at the camera, without having to manually re-adjust the flashes. It's a great way to make an otherwise boring shot not quite as boring