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Author Topic: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?  (Read 32584 times)

J.R.

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #105 on: June 28, 2013, 01:37:24 PM »

Obviously Canon did not intend the AF system to be the 6D's main selling point.

Of course ... if anything, it moved on some of the 6D's aspirants to the 5D3 only for the AF.

IMO the major grumble that people have against the 6D's AF is that it was not improved substantially over the 5D2. Some here claim that there is radical improvement while other feel they are calling a spade a spade.

On a personal note, my 6D ran into trouble with the AF sensor that Canon has replaced earlier this week. I got the camera back today and it is loads better. That said, having both cameras, I think I will keep the 6D primarily for WA stuff and keep using the 5D3 for everything that is action packed.
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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #105 on: June 28, 2013, 01:37:24 PM »

pensive tomato

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #106 on: June 28, 2013, 02:05:44 PM »

Obviously Canon did not intend the AF system to be the 6D's main selling point.

Of course ... if anything, it moved on some of the 6D's aspirants to the 5D3 only for the AF.

IMO the major grumble that people have against the 6D's AF is that it was not improved substantially over the 5D2. Some here claim that there is radical improvement while other feel they are calling a spade a spade.

On a personal note, my 6D ran into trouble with the AF sensor that Canon has replaced earlier this week. I got the camera back today and it is loads better. That said, having both cameras, I think I will keep the 6D primarily for WA stuff and keep using the 5D3 for everything that is action packed.

Fair enough, I agree that with the exception of the center point, Canon did as little in the AF department with the 6D as it could get away with. The 6D was not designed for action shooting. I do feel that as a camera though, the 6D is an improvement overall compared to the 5D2, but it's clearly not the intended upgrade path for most 5D2 users. Again, the camera has a 6 on its name. I think that's well deserved and at a price point of $1800 or lower, it's a very good value in the current US market.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2013, 02:11:51 PM by pensive tomato »
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J.R.

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #107 on: June 28, 2013, 02:12:15 PM »
The 6D was not designed for action shooting. I do feel that as a camera, the 6D is an improvement overall compared to the 5D2, but it's clearly not the intended upgrade path for most 5D2 users.

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Wildfire

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #108 on: June 28, 2013, 02:50:39 PM »
The 6D was not designed for action shooting. I do feel that as a camera though, the 6D is an improvement overall compared to the 5D2, but it's clearly not the intended upgrade path for most 5D2 users.

I think you nailed it.

For anyone who was happy with what the 5D2 had to offer, the 6D takes that and improves on it in every way with very minor but still worthwhile upgrades. For anyone who wants something substantially more than what the 5D2 had to offer, the 5D3 is what they need.

TWI by Dustin Abbott

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #109 on: June 28, 2013, 05:57:24 PM »
A friend of mine has the 6D. The battery drains overnight even with the power off. He sent it to Canon and they upgraded the firmware and then said that they could not reproduce the problem.

It worked properly for a couple of weeks, but now it's doing it again. He can't leave the battery in the camera without it draining in a day or two, even with the power switch shut off.

Has anyone else heard of this problem?

PS... too late to return it.

GPS on?

otherwise no.. never heard of that problem.

GPS and wireless is off. Even the main power switch is off, so it shouldn't matter what the GPS and wireless are doing.

Which lens do you have attached?  I've had my 6D since December and only saw this problem twice, recently after purchasing a Tamron 24-70 2.8 (power was switched off).  Both times I had the Tamron lens attached and found the battery completely drained in the morning.  I have never seen this with any other lens attached (Canon 24-105, 70  - 200)

Thanks for the tip! 
He does use the Tamron 24-70 2.8 IS. I asked him to try different lenses, as well as leaving it with no lens attached. He is away for another week or so, but I'll pass on your experience. The lens may well be the problem!

I don't know if someone else has answered this question, but I encountered the same issue.  Tamron did a free update to the circuit board that solved the problem. 
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CarlTN

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #110 on: June 29, 2013, 12:20:52 AM »

Obviously Canon did not intend the AF system to be the 6D's main selling point.

Of course ... if anything, it moved on some of the 6D's aspirants to the 5D3 only for the AF.

IMO the major grumble that people have against the 6D's AF is that it was not improved substantially over the 5D2. Some here claim that there is radical improvement while other feel they are calling a spade a spade.

On a personal note, my 6D ran into trouble with the AF sensor that Canon has replaced earlier this week. I got the camera back today and it is loads better. That said, having both cameras, I think I will keep the 6D primarily for WA stuff and keep using the 5D3 for everything that is action packed.

Thanks for weighing in.  I do feel there is something to the phenomenon yours had.  It seems to me that this could contribute to the negative experience so many have had with the 6D's autofocus (that of the outer points not working accurately).  This is however not what happened with the experience Neuro had, as he described it.  The camera was not at fault in his case.

For anyone who expected a significant upgrade to the 5D2's autofocus on a body which sells for 25 to 30% LESS than the 5D2 sold for during most of its life (not counting closeout prices after production neared its end, the average street price for the 5D2, new units, was in the $2400 to $2500 range...not even accounting for inflation)...all I can say is, your expectations were absurd.  Canon gave you the autofocus gem you wanted, and charges a relatively fair price for it, with the 5D3.

What the 6D is, is a significant overall improvement over the 5D2 (especially for stills shooting), like it or not...and for 30% LESS money.  So, why in hell is ANYONE complaining about the 6D?  There's no valid reason...and again, mine servo tracks just fine, quite quick and responsive.  I don't care what problems you had with servo tracking with the 5D2.  The 6D I own, in my hands, can keep up with action just fine.  Its outer points are very accurate, even in low light...they seem to lock focus about as quickly as the center point much of the time. 

I've yet to try a flashgun on it, but I'm not convinced it would give anything other than decent...if not quite good results...slower sync speed or not.

It's time to end this ridiculous thread.

CarlTN

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #111 on: June 29, 2013, 12:39:00 AM »
The fact is, you did not know a basic aspect of the 6D's autofocus, thus you misused it...and based on that, you found FALSELY that it was somehow the camera's fault that you did not get all the shots in focus in your little test.  When in reality, it was your own lack of knowledge that very likely caused most of the problem.  You assumed the 6D's autofocus worked like the 5D3's or 1DX's, regarding selecting a single point in servo mode, and assuming the point would transition to other points.  Since there was no transition, once the target moved off your selected AF point, there was nothing for the system to focus on...and thus your subject moved out of the plane of focus.  The focus certainly did lose lock, but it was your fault that it did.

All this really proves, is that most of the time, regarding the 6D's supposed lack of AF ability, or lack of making itself seem "impressive", it's really a lack of an impressive photographer using the camera.

When did I assume that?  From what I can tell, I'm not the one making ass-umptions here.  For someone who 'didn't make a false statement' you just made another one.  Or if you prefer, an incorrect assumption based on ignorance of the facts.

Re-read what I stated...and what you stated...

When I tried servo tracking with an outer point on the 6D, it would frequently start out in focus then drift successively to backfocusing as the kid ran closer.  The 1D X and 5DIII had no problem in that scenario.  That may be technique, though - I suspect if I'd used just the center point, the 6D would have fared better.  But that would mean cropping away a lot of the final images, since for composition purposes I prefer to leave the subject 'room to run' within the frame.  With the center point on the 6D, the handoff to the outer points sometimes 'missed' and the outer point would lock onto a pipe on the wall or something - the high density of the 5DIII/1D X AF sensor makes those handoffs seamless.

“When I tried starting the servo tracking with an outer point on the 6D, it would frequently start out in focus then drift successively to backfocusing as the kid ran closer.”

Well, I can see why you had a problem here, because the 6D is not designed to specify a single point, then transition to other points in servo mode.  You have to leave it on that one point, and keep the subject on it as you pan.  You have to leave all points active, in order to track subjects that move across the frame, as you did in that situation.  This is also how the 5D2’s AF worked, is it not? 

The 5D3 and 1DX are the only bodies where you could do the action you are describing.  There is no “handoff” from point to point here, that the 6D can do.  You can only select single points at a time, or else leave them all active.  You should have just left them all active for this situation…which I will admit will still leave you with a lower hit rate than the 5D3 or 1DX.  The reason being, the top and especially the bottom points, absolutely love to grab foreground details on the ground and focus on them, rather than on the subject in the center vertical third of the frame.  If there was a way to select all but the top and bottom points, then the AF system of the 6D would be even closer to the performance of the higher density, higher AF-point sensor…in servo mode...in my opinion.  So that is definitely a case where Canon have "hobbled" the AF, and they should not have.

Did I include enough context for you?  I stated, "When I tried servo tracking with an outer point on the 6D, it would frequently start out in focus then drift successively to backfocusing as the kid ran closer," and subsequently, "With the center point on the 6D, the handoff to the outer points sometimes 'missed' and the outer point would lock onto a pipe on the wall or something."

You added a couple of extra words to my statement, "When I tried starting the servo tracking with an outer point on the 6D, it would frequently start out in focus then drift successively to backfocusing as the kid ran closer.” The point I was making was that servo tracking with a 6D outer point could not keep up with a kid running towards me, even with a fast-focusing lens like the 70-200 II.

I then went on to state that, "With the center point on the 6D, the handoff to the outer points sometimes 'missed'," and in that case, I was in automatic AF point selection mode, where the 6D should hand off the focus from the center point to the outer points...and again, it often failed to do so. 

So, you apparently put my statement about poor tracking with an outer point and my seperate statement about poor handing off from the center point to the outer points together, and came to the conclusion that I was expecting servo tracking from an outer point to hand off to a center point.  Of course, I could also have been in 11-pt auto select, started with the center point over my subject, then recomposed so an outer point was over the subject...and in that case, the focus should have been handed off from the outer point (back to) the center point with continuous if the subject moved through the frame.  That was a technique I used with my 5DII...it even worked - about a third of the time.

So to summarize, I was using the 6D's AF system within it's design parameters, and using it correctly.  It just wasn't holding up it's end of the bargain.  But because I stated that it was failing to track a moving kid, you assumed (and have regurgitated several times) that I was trying to use it incorrectly due to ignorance of it's proper function, instead of accepting that the 6D just couldn't track the kid.  Staunch defense in the face of facts.  Nice.  I'd accuse you of being a FLAO (fanboi with loss of all objectivity), except you did basically call two of the 6D's AF points crap (apologies, to be precise you stated, "...the top and especially the bottom points, absolutely love to grab foreground details on the ground and focus on them, rather than on the subject in the center vertical third of the frame.").

I didn't make a false statement, again you are quoting me out of context.  You never mentioned that you had tried the 6D yourself (or at least I did not see where you did...before I made the above observation.  If you had said so in your preceding post, then my statement would have been false.)

Ignorance of the facts at the time you make a statement does not make your statement true.  If you stated that I had blue eyes, that would be false too, regardless of whether or not I had previously stated my eye color.  You made an assumption (several, actually) and you were wrong, but you won't admit it.  But you go right ahead and crusade for the 6D...after all, it's a forum where you can express your opinion....even if that opinion is based on ignorance of certain facts and false assumptions about other facts. 

Better yet, let's see some of those small birds and running kids tracked with your 6D...grab your 6D and go take some pictures, and show us those!

How about you show yours first, since I'm such a liar, you would just cut them to pieces and claim I didn't shoot them or something. 

Get over yourself, you know full well that you SAID YOU SELECTED A SIDE AUTOFOCUS POINT AND THEN EXPECTED IT TO HAND OFF TO OTHER POINTS.  An impossibility with the 6D, but a reality with the 5D3 and 1DX.

  "When I tried servo tracking with an outer point on the 6D, it would frequently start out in focus then drift successively to backfocusing as the kid ran closer."

How can you "try" a single outer AF point without selecting it?  You can't.  What you said was intentionally misleading, if you are now claiming you did not select that point.  If you had all AF points active, then that's what you're doing...you're not "trying" an outer AF point.

Case closed on that, you lost.

How about this?  Rather than me posting pictures of minors who are my relatives on the internet...why don't you give me your phone number and we can discuss this on the phone, Dr. bigshot.  I am open to an autofocus shootout with anyone who ever happens to travel into my area.  You could...unless of course you're afraid to travel in the South.  I have no doubt you can travel anywhere you wish on a whim, Dr. bigshot.

Btw, I've been to Boston quite a few times.  I have cousins who grew up there.  Both my uncle and one of his sons attended MIT, and the son taught there for a number of years.  The daughter got married on the Harvard campus in the chapel.  I attended the wedding...a few months before 9/11/01.  I'm grateful the wedding wasn't in september, or my family and I might have been on one of those airplanes!

Your part of the country has its strengths and its weaknesses...so come down off your high horse Dr. bigshot, and act your age.  There's no need for this constant petty snideness you're happy to hurl at me...calling me a liar.  At least I know how to use a "crude" autofocus system.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2013, 02:42:29 AM by CarlTN »

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #111 on: June 29, 2013, 12:39:00 AM »

J.R.

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #112 on: June 29, 2013, 02:42:09 AM »
careful now!
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CarlTN

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #113 on: June 29, 2013, 02:51:49 AM »
if people buy the 6d for video it's their own fault considering the well-known moire problem since the 20mp sensor isn't built to downsample like the 22mp version.


I was certainly well aware of the moire before buying, and I did not buy the 6D for video other than non-pro footage.  I've yet to see moire with mine, but I don't shoot people and their clothing, as much as I do nature and things not man-made. 

I'm not aware of anyone who has bought the 6D with the purpose of attempting serious video with it.  I suppose those people exist, but I've never heard of it, or read anyone on here buying it for that.

CarlTN

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #114 on: June 29, 2013, 02:54:13 AM »
I haven't read through this thread yet, but so far I am loving my 6D to bits.

A bit about me - I'm no pro photographer and have only been shooting for 14 months. I have stepped up from a 600D, so jumping to full frame was certainly different, but didn't take much to get use to. I shoot landscapes, cityscapes, and recently trying to shoot people.

For landscapes the 6D is perfect.

For people however, there are things I wish it had but happy to compromise. Everyone talks about the 11 point AF system and I agree, could be better. I am finding I have to focus then recompose the shot most of the time, makes shooting a touch slow. But that aside the quality of the shots 5000 ISO + is un-matched from what I have experienced so far.

:)

Glad you're enjoying it.  It's entirely possible that the AF sensor is not working properly, as has been the case with others on here, such as RT.

CarlTN

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #115 on: June 29, 2013, 02:55:37 AM »
I can understand your persepective, of course.  I would just like to see the terrible moire you experienced with it, yourself.  I know it exists, I just was curious.

Here is a capture from a 6D video... Nothing like that ever happened to me with the 5DMKIII or the 1DX. And I can assure you that on video this is much worse than it looks in this picture because those lines and circles are moving! So, in my opinion, ad far as video is concerned, the 6D is just a 5DMKII with very much improved high ISO performances, a better central AF point, but a much worse ergonomic and a much cheaper body. So, all in all, as a second body I still prefer by far my old 5DMKII with the ML firmware.

P.S.= sorry for the creepy faces...

Thanks for sharing that.  I can see how that would get annoying.

J.R.

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #116 on: June 29, 2013, 03:13:51 AM »

why in hell is ANYONE complaining about the 6D?  There's no valid reason


The reasons for complaining appear to be valid to a number of people here including myself.

The 6D may suit your requirements perfectly but that alone is not reason enough for everybody to agree with you. Different people have different wants / needs from their equipment and I don't see why a discussion as to why someone does not like a 6D cannot be undertaken. After all, nobody is being negatively affected by this discussion.

The way I look at it, everyone is entitled to their freely express their opinions in an open forum. You must however realize at that at various points of time you simply have to agree to disagree and move on.
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CarlTN

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #117 on: June 29, 2013, 03:28:45 AM »

why in hell is ANYONE complaining about the 6D?  There's no valid reason


The reasons for complaining appear to be valid to a number of people here including myself.

The 6D may suit your requirements perfectly but that alone is not reason enough for everybody to agree with you. Different people have different wants / needs from their equipment and I don't see why a discussion as to why someone does not like a 6D cannot be undertaken. After all, nobody is being negatively affected by this discussion.

The way I look at it, everyone is entitled to their freely express their opinions in an open forum. You must however realize at that at various points of time you simply have to agree to disagree and move on.

True.  But I do feel there is an unfair bias going on, by people who have spent very little time with the 6D, and were in a hurry to dislike it.  Can you imagine what would happen if I started a thread and asked what people don't like about the 5D3, or the 7D?  It would be dominated by people who do like the camera, and they would aggressively attempt to negate any criticisms of it.

Here, we basically have just me and a couple of other people who like the 6D, yet the thread is dominated by 5D3 lovers who dislike the 6D, and think of those who use it as unsophisticated people who are not serious photographers.  And it's just not true.  I consider myself serious, whether I make a lot of money from it or not.  My status as not a big time, world class professional photographer who gets paid $10 million a month, has little to nothing to do with the ability of my current camera.  It has everything to do with various other choices I've made, along with the fact that there are entirely too many professional photographers since digital took over...and there's only so much money to go around.  The general public puts very little monetary value on photography.  They think it, as with music, should either be free, or almost free.

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #117 on: June 29, 2013, 03:28:45 AM »

G-V

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #118 on: June 29, 2013, 03:33:24 AM »
Recently got my 6D after using the 50D for 4 years, and the single biggest con that I've noticed is the AF assist lamp is placed much lower on the body... So low, in fact, that I sometimes accidentally cover it with my finger.

Video moire is also a con, but I guess it's justified by the low price of this otherwise fantastic full-frame DSLR.
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CarlTN

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #119 on: June 29, 2013, 03:40:47 AM »
Recently got my 6D after using the 50D for 4 years, and the single biggest con that I've noticed is the AF assist lamp is placed much lower on the body... So low, in fact, that I sometimes accidentally cover it with my finger.

Video moire is also a con, but I guess it's justified by the low price of this otherwise fantastic full-frame DSLR.

Good points.  I rarely use the AF assist lamp, interesting that you noticed it was a bit low...I didn't realize it. 

The moire might be the main intentional hobbling of the camera, but also due to the math of the sensor pixel dimensions, as has been stated various places.

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Re: What do you NOT like about the Canon 6D?
« Reply #119 on: June 29, 2013, 03:40:47 AM »