September 23, 2014, 12:32:51 PM

Author Topic: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced  (Read 18120 times)

neuroanatomist

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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #60 on: August 23, 2013, 11:07:03 PM »
The term was 'L quality' initially.

It's all semantics.

I've been worn down.

There's the dead horse, now, where'd I put that stick?   ;)

It appeared to me that your point was that since 'L quality' can't be specifically defined by inclusionary and exclusionary criteria, it shouldn't be considered at all.  You then concluded the only differentiating factor was the red ring (which I hope was hyperbole).  I pointed out a few things left off your list, not focused exclusively on build (for example, is there a non-L lens with a ground/polished aspherical element?).

But it can be semantics, I suppose. Most things are, in the end.  Why is Sigma's 35/1.4 an Art lens - can't I shoot basketball from under the net with it?   Canon says L is for Luxury.   There are some cars that are called 'luxury cars' and many that aren't called that.  What distinguishes them?  My Subaru has power everything, heated wiper blades,  and even heated seats to warm my butt on a cold winter day - those features are found in 'luxury cars', does that make my station wagon a luxury car? 
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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #60 on: August 23, 2013, 11:07:03 PM »

jdramirez

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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #61 on: August 23, 2013, 11:18:33 PM »
Wow... I started a fire storm.  I suppose designations are entirely subjective, but sometimes you just know.

Tom Brady's wife is a Super model... what makes her super... who knows, but I'd love to put my finger ON it.
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

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jdramirez

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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #62 on: August 23, 2013, 11:38:10 PM »

2. 'L Quality' doesn't have any meaning. 


2.  Disagree - pick up a 17-55 and a 24-105, or a 50/1.4 and a 50/1.2L, and 'L build quality' is obvious.



Yeah, but pick up any of the fast USM primes and say a 200 f2.8 or 135 f2.8 and the difference isn't so apparent.

The L's are properly designed as tools for a given job, so it's not to be unexpected that they have individual characteristics, some are state of the art and have everything that could be reasonably expected from a lens by a working professional.  Others are robust precision tools with the money spent where it matters rather on redundant features like say AF on a TSE or IS on a fisheye...

My gripe is not about the general greatness of L lenses and the expectation that the red ring rightfully inspires, it's just that as a parameter of comparison, it's not the greatness, it's the general bit that bothers me.

To decry a budget lens ('gateway' was spot on) as being or not being 'L quality' just isn't all that useful.

It's blind submission to marketing speak. 

I've came up with two things for my list...

1. Red Ring
2. EF mount

Dang, there are other lenses with EF mounts that aren't L's.

Sheeeeeet (to quote Clay Davis)

1. Red Ring.

I'm aware I'm being a boring pedantic pr1ck here.  I just don't know what L quality means.  Well I do.  But really, literally, we don't.  Canon doesn't.  As their EOS Works statement belies. 

It shouldn't be so easy a thing to say, if it isn't so easy to define.

And it shouldn't really be applied to a lens like the 55-250 STM in any terms.  It's just not helpful at all to anybody.

There are a ton of aspects to a lens that aren't simply covered in an MTF chart.

1. Build quality (metal v. plastic)
2. Weather sealing
3.  Aperture variable v. constant regarding zooms.
4.  Max aperture
5.  Sharpness @ center and at edges
6.  Color replication/saturation
7.  Contrast
8.  Chromatic abberation
9.  aperture design (round v. hexagonal)
10. vignetting
11. barrel distortion
12. full time manual focus
13. auto focus speed
14. bokeh rendering

Every lens is a sacrifice.  We are dealing with the properties of bending and capturing light.  And while "L Quality" may be a vague term, you can often say that many of the 14 should be an improvement over the non-L counter part. 

There are too many smart people in these threads and photographers in general who would be swayed by branding and advertising.
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

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Zv

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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #63 on: August 24, 2013, 12:09:27 AM »
The term was 'L quality' initially.

It's all semantics.

I've been worn down.

There's the dead horse, now, where'd I put that stick?   ;)

It appeared to me that your point was that since 'L quality' can't be specifically defined by inclusionary and exclusionary criteria, it shouldn't be considered at all.  You then concluded the only differentiating factor was the red ring (which I hope was hyperbole).  I pointed out a few things left off your list, not focused exclusively on build (for example, is there a non-L lens with a ground/polished aspherical element?).

But it can be semantics, I suppose. Most things are, in the end.  Why is Sigma's 35/1.4 an Art lens - can't I shoot basketball from under the net with it?   Canon says L is for Luxury.   There are some cars that are called 'luxury cars' and many that aren't called that.  What distinguishes them?  My Subaru has power everything, heated wiper blades,  and even heated seats to warm my butt on a cold winter day - those features are found in 'luxury cars', does that make my station wagon a luxury car? 

This should be one of the 10 CR Commandments (see that thread). Thou shalt NOT use a Sigma 35 1.4 Art lens for Sports! Blasphemy!

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WoodyWindy

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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #64 on: August 25, 2013, 07:12:32 AM »
Let's see...

Roughly two pages of commentary on the new lens, its characteristics, and how they compare to other lenses (including "L" lenses).

Three pages (at posting time) of "So, define 'L'?" flame war.

Sad.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2013, 08:55:02 AM by WoodyWindy »

YZF197

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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #65 on: August 29, 2013, 12:59:17 AM »
i use everything from tamron 2.8 zooms to "muh L lenses!". right now i'm borrowing a 70-200 2.8 (1995 version, no IS) for football season as last year i shot with the awesome 200 2.8 L (old version, early 90's). L lenses should stand for in a 'L'eague of their own.  that 200 2.8 'L' had the worst chrom abs in high contrast of any lens i've ever shot with but i didn't buy it for high contrast high light situations, i bought it because i needed a job to be done and only the 'L' version was up to the task. canon doesn't make a 200 f/4 consumer lens, and i was fed up with 70-300 4-5.6 crap tier lenses.

'L' lenses either go full retard with awesome features OR get you focal lengths and aperture combos that plebs can't get with regular EF/EF-s lenses. the red ring is just to show you're serious - take that as you may. i've seen plenty of red ringers acting like it was babby's first photo shoot or a freshman art student. it's a tool for a specialty job, kinda like a jackhammer or a grinder. you don't send a hammer and a screwdriver to do a jackhammer's job or a nail file to do a grinder's job. just like you don't send a gripped 5D mk III to do a cell phone's job.

paul13walnut5

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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #66 on: August 29, 2013, 04:24:58 AM »
Disapointed to hear about your negative experience with the 200mm f2.8 (metal sliding hood = mk1, clip on plastic hood mk2, identical in everyother regard) i had this lens for a few years and absolutely loved it.
No chroma issues I can remember (unlike say, my 100mm f2.0 in bright light wide open)

Maybe you got a bad copy, was the lens filtered?

P.s. What do you mean by 'full retard'?

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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #66 on: August 29, 2013, 04:24:58 AM »

jdramirez

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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #67 on: August 29, 2013, 07:17:04 AM »
Disapointed to hear about your negative experience with the 200mm f2.8 (metal sliding hood = mk1, clip on plastic hood mk2, identical in everyother regard) i had this lens for a few years and absolutely loved it.
No chroma issues I can remember (unlike say, my 100mm f2.0 in bright light wide open)

Maybe you got a bad copy, was the lens filtered?

P.s. What do you mean by 'full retard'?

I heard somewhere you NEVER go full retard. 
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100L->85mm f/1.8 USM-> 8mm ->100L & 85L

paul13walnut5

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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #68 on: August 29, 2013, 09:20:50 AM »
I'm hoping it's an unfortunate translation by the likes of babel fish.  Thats the only reason I've not reported it.

Horrible word.  Much like we in the UK have banished the term 'spastic' maybe the term 'retard' should be replaced.

Disapointed to hear about your negative experience with the 200mm f2.8 (metal sliding hood = mk1, clip on plastic hood mk2, identical in everyother regard) i had this lens for a few years and absolutely loved it.
No chroma issues I can remember (unlike say, my 100mm f2.0 in bright light wide open)

Maybe you got a bad copy, was the lens filtered?

P.s. What do you mean by 'full retard'?

I heard somewhere you NEVER go full retard. 

I might however report you jdramirez.

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jdramirez

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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #70 on: August 29, 2013, 07:59:40 PM »
I'm hoping it's an unfortunate translation by the likes of babel fish.  Thats the only reason I've not reported it.

Horrible word.  Much like we in the UK have banished the term 'spastic' maybe the term 'retard' should be replaced.

Disapointed to hear about your negative experience with the 200mm f2.8 (metal sliding hood = mk1, clip on plastic hood mk2, identical in everyother regard) i had this lens for a few years and absolutely loved it.
No chroma issues I can remember (unlike say, my 100mm f2.0 in bright light wide open)

Maybe you got a bad copy, was the lens filtered?

P.s. What do you mean by 'full retard'?

I heard somewhere you NEVER go full retard. 

I might however report you jdramirez.

 tropic  thunder...  good movie.   and feel free to report me.   if people are going to be offended by words out of context,  then there are bigger issues for them than the censor ship of the English language.
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100L->85mm f/1.8 USM-> 8mm ->100L & 85L

Zv

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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #71 on: August 29, 2013, 09:55:48 PM »
I'm hoping it's an unfortunate translation by the likes of babel fish.  Thats the only reason I've not reported it.

Horrible word.  Much like we in the UK have banished the term 'spastic' maybe the term 'retard' should be replaced.

Disapointed to hear about your negative experience with the 200mm f2.8 (metal sliding hood = mk1, clip on plastic hood mk2, identical in everyother regard) i had this lens for a few years and absolutely loved it.
No chroma issues I can remember (unlike say, my 100mm f2.0 in bright light wide open)

Maybe you got a bad copy, was the lens filtered?

P.s. What do you mean by 'full retard'?

I heard somewhere you NEVER go full retard. 

I might however report you jdramirez.

 tropic  thunder...  good movie.   and feel free to report me.   if people are going to be offended by words out of context,  then there are bigger issues for them than the censor ship of the English language.

Seriously? Tropic Thunder! Watch it before reporting anyone!
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jdramirez

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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #72 on: August 29, 2013, 10:41:39 PM »
I'm hoping it's an unfortunate translation by the likes of babel fish.  Thats the only reason I've not reported it.

Horrible word.  Much like we in the UK have banished the term 'spastic' maybe the term 'retard' should be replaced.

Disapointed to hear about your negative experience with the 200mm f2.8 (metal sliding hood = mk1, clip on plastic hood mk2, identical in everyother regard) i had this lens for a few years and absolutely loved it.
No chroma issues I can remember (unlike say, my 100mm f2.0 in bright light wide open)

Maybe you got a bad copy, was the lens filtered?

P.s. What do you mean by 'full retard'?

I heard somewhere you NEVER go full retard. 

I might however report you jdramirez.

 tropic  thunder...  good movie.   and feel free to report me.   if people are going to be offended by words out of context,  then there are bigger issues for them than the censor ship of the English language.

Seriously? Tropic Thunder! Watch it before reporting anyone!

I wonder if I have it on my computer... I have a hankering to watch it now.

Nope. :(
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100L->85mm f/1.8 USM-> 8mm ->100L & 85L

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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #72 on: August 29, 2013, 10:41:39 PM »

paul13walnut5

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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #73 on: August 30, 2013, 06:29:00 AM »
if people are going to be offended by words out of context,  then there are bigger issues for them than the censor ship of the English language.

It's an offensive word in the wrong context, I sought context, you merely repeated the word, without context.

It's not censorship.  It's keeping things civil. Words like 'nigger' and 'poof' appear in the dictionary also.  That doesn't make them fair game to be used without a thought for the consequences.

9VIII

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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #74 on: September 30, 2013, 11:19:52 AM »
So, the lens is out now, and so far reviews look pretty darn good.
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Re: Canon EF-S 55-250 f/4-5.6 IS STM Announced
« Reply #74 on: September 30, 2013, 11:19:52 AM »