December 22, 2014, 05:54:10 PM

Author Topic: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]  (Read 33808 times)

AvTvM

  • 1D X
  • *******
  • Posts: 1187
    • View Profile
Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #240 on: November 27, 2013, 11:58:24 AM »
Canon are not in business to keep you guys happy, they are in business to keep their shareholders happy. Start thinking like that.

Actually it is exactly the other way round. At least for companies that want to be successful.  ;)

IF Canon wants to stay in business with me, they better think about what I want and how they keep ME happy. Otherwise I won't continue to buy from them. And the same goes for all their other customers too .. each single one of them. If they don't make 'em happy, they won 't have anything to make their shareholders happy down the line.

CUSTOMERS always come FIRST.  8)

http://imgc.allpostersimages.com/images/P-473-488-90/60/6004/IADB100Z/posters/david-sipress-i-have-just-one-more-question-will-it-make-me-happy-new-yorker-cartoon.jpg

canon rumors FORUM

Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #240 on: November 27, 2013, 11:58:24 AM »

Random Orbits

  • 1D X
  • *******
  • Posts: 1407
    • View Profile
Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #241 on: November 27, 2013, 12:44:14 PM »

CUSTOMERS always come FIRST.  8)


That's right:  CUSTOMERS come first.  Customer does not.

neuroanatomist

  • CR GEEK
  • ************
  • Posts: 15238
    • View Profile
Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #242 on: November 27, 2013, 12:48:04 PM »
Canon are not in business to keep you guys happy, they are in business to keep their shareholders happy. Start thinking like that.

Actually it is exactly the other way round. At least for companies that want to be successful.  ;)

IF Canon wants to stay in business with me, they better think about what I want and how they keep ME happy. Otherwise I won't continue to buy from them. And the same goes for all their other customers too .. each single one of them. If they don't make 'em happy, they won 't have anything to make their shareholders happy down the line.

CUSTOMERS always come FIRST.

Not exactly.  CustomerS come first.  In aggregate.  Canon needs to keep a majority of the user base 'happy', or at least buying - that is one way to deliver value to shareholders.  They've clearly demonstrated the ability to do that.  If your particular wants/needs coincide with those of the majority, well and good. If not, as is clearly the case for you, then Canon doesn't really give a CRAP about YOU.
EOS 1D X, EOS M, and lots of lenses
______________________________
Flickr | TDP Profile/Gear List

privatebydesign

  • Canon EF 300mm f/2.8L IS II
  • ********
  • Posts: 2852
  • Ermintrude says "moo"
    • View Profile
Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #243 on: November 27, 2013, 12:57:30 PM »
Canon are not in business to keep you guys happy, they are in business to keep their shareholders happy. Start thinking like that.

Actually it is exactly the other way round. At least for companies that want to be successful.  ;)

IF Canon wants to stay in business with me, they better think about what I want and how they keep ME happy. Otherwise I won't continue to buy from them. And the same goes for all their other customers too .. each single one of them. If they don't make 'em happy, they won 't have anything to make their shareholders happy down the line.

CUSTOMERS always come FIRST.  8)

http://imgc.allpostersimages.com/images/P-473-488-90/60/6004/IADB100Z/posters/david-sipress-i-have-just-one-more-question-will-it-make-me-happy-new-yorker-cartoon.jpg

Oh you are so wrong, Canon don't care one jot about you or me as individuals, nor particularly for cameras in general, they only care about us as incidental individual contributors to market forces. If we, collectively, are not spending money on P&S's and entry level DSLR's, the cash cows from which all else is derived, then what are they to do, lament the good old days before cameras in phones and the film days when you needed a decent sized "sensor" to get any kind of image quality? Do the Sony thing of throwing any and everything out there with no consistency or system integrity at a huge loss? Go the Nikon route of trying to convince people they want something they clearly don't, stuff from which the consumer has clearly moved on. No, to protect their shareholders they are maneuvering their profit income to different product streams. We, the declining stills orientated market, are fortunate that the ideas they are moving towards are somewhat complimentary to our own "needs" for still based equipment, so far.

The customer only comes first if the company can sell the stuff they make and give their shareholders a reasonable return. If they can't they will try to find other customers, not different shareholders.

AvTvM

  • 1D X
  • *******
  • Posts: 1187
    • View Profile
Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #244 on: November 27, 2013, 01:33:26 PM »
We, the declining stills orientated market, are fortunate that the ideas they are moving towards are somewhat complimentary to our own "needs" for still based equipment, so far.

The customer only comes first if the company can sell the stuff they make and give their shareholders a reasonable return. If they can't they will try to find other customers, not different shareholders.

hehehe! Quite funny. Next suggestion will probably be to kneel down and beg to Canon "please, please give me a new stills-oriented camera."  ::)

no way!

In reality it is way easier for (almost all of) Canon's customers to turn around and find another supplier of excellent image capturing gear than it is for Canon to find "new customers" willing to pay inflated prices for fairly un-innovative products.

AmbientLight

  • Canon 7D MK II
  • *****
  • Posts: 493
    • View Profile
Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #245 on: November 27, 2013, 02:08:30 PM »
We, the declining stills orientated market, are fortunate that the ideas they are moving towards are somewhat complimentary to our own "needs" for still based equipment, so far.

The customer only comes first if the company can sell the stuff they make and give their shareholders a reasonable return. If they can't they will try to find other customers, not different shareholders.

hehehe! Quite funny. Next suggestion will probably be to kneel down and beg to Canon "please, please give me a new stills-oriented camera."  ::)

no way!

In reality it is way easier for (almost all of) Canon's customers to turn around and find another supplier of excellent image capturing gear than it is for Canon to find "new customers" willing to pay inflated prices for fairly un-innovative products.

Say, do you exist in some sort of distorted reality field?

Sony is not doing well financially, but at least they are fighting for corporate survival, Nikon is facing decline for years, while Canon is far more successful than any other camera or lens vendor.  :o

Looks like you may want to morph yourself into a different customer, then.  :o

neuroanatomist

  • CR GEEK
  • ************
  • Posts: 15238
    • View Profile
Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #246 on: November 27, 2013, 03:22:57 PM »
In reality it is way easier for (almost all of) Canon's customers to turn around and find another supplier of excellent image capturing gear than it is for Canon to find "new customers" willing to pay inflated prices for fairly un-innovative products.

...and yet, people keep buying Canon products...and you keep whining and complaining.  I think you're clever enough to figure out which of the two of you is succeeding, and who is failing.
EOS 1D X, EOS M, and lots of lenses
______________________________
Flickr | TDP Profile/Gear List

canon rumors FORUM

Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #246 on: November 27, 2013, 03:22:57 PM »

RLPhoto

  • Canon EF 300mm f/2.8L IS II
  • ********
  • Posts: 3545
  • Gear doesn't matter, Just a Matter of Convenience.
    • View Profile
    • My Portfolio
Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #247 on: November 27, 2013, 03:53:58 PM »
We, the declining stills orientated market, are fortunate that the ideas they are moving towards are somewhat complimentary to our own "needs" for still based equipment, so far.

The customer only comes first if the company can sell the stuff they make and give their shareholders a reasonable return. If they can't they will try to find other customers, not different shareholders.

hehehe! Quite funny. Next suggestion will probably be to kneel down and beg to Canon "please, please give me a new stills-oriented camera."  ::)

no way!

In reality it is way easier for (almost all of) Canon's customers to turn around and find another supplier of excellent image capturing gear than it is for Canon to find "new customers" willing to pay inflated prices for fairly un-innovative products.

It's probably time better spent taking photos than complain about how supposedly another brand takes better photos.

9VIII

  • 5D Mark III
  • ******
  • Posts: 681
    • View Profile
Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #248 on: November 27, 2013, 06:29:16 PM »
The video's title--A Tradition of Innovation

What an innovation THE 700D ;D ;D

Yes! Very innovative, Canon! From its very innovative start 71 years ago as unlicensed copycat maker of german camera designs ... all the way to 2013 with their greatest innovative triumph ever ...  the Canon Digital Kiss ... all in white!  ;D

Canon does not need a long, boring video showing off their "tradition of innovation". One picture tells the story: 
(c) Tom Fishburne  (c) http://tomfishburne.com/2012/10/cannibalize.html

While the 700D deserves everything it gets, don't forget everything Canon has done with glass in the last few years. Had I been shopping for a high end camera in 2009 I very well may have gone for the NIkon D700, Nikon glass was very competitive at the time. But that's not when I entered the market, from what I can see Canon has very little competition right now, their recent lenses mop the floor with the competition (at least on the long end, we'll see what happens with the short end next year).



We, the declining stills orientated market, are fortunate that the ideas they are moving towards are somewhat complimentary to our own "needs" for still based equipment, so far.

The customer only comes first if the company can sell the stuff they make and give their shareholders a reasonable return. If they can't they will try to find other customers, not different shareholders.

hehehe! Quite funny. Next suggestion will probably be to kneel down and beg to Canon "please, please give me a new stills-oriented camera."  ::)

no way!

In reality it is way easier for (almost all of) Canon's customers to turn around and find another supplier of excellent image capturing gear than it is for Canon to find "new customers" willing to pay inflated prices for fairly un-innovative products.

If you're looking for a nice walk-around camera, sure, switching to a different company might be easy. If you want anything more specific out of your camera the number of options falls quickly, pretty much right down to 2. Compact system manufacturers simply don't have the lenses, and as I pointed out above, the nearest competitor has some catching up to do. I'm confident Canon's lens line-up can carry them for quite a while when it comes to the high end market. The real problem is cell phones.
-100% RAW-

jrista

  • Canon EF 400mm f/2.8L IS II
  • *********
  • Posts: 4817
  • EOL
    • View Profile
    • Nature Photography
Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #249 on: November 27, 2013, 07:17:01 PM »
We, the declining stills orientated market, are fortunate that the ideas they are moving towards are somewhat complimentary to our own "needs" for still based equipment, so far.

The customer only comes first if the company can sell the stuff they make and give their shareholders a reasonable return. If they can't they will try to find other customers, not different shareholders.

hehehe! Quite funny. Next suggestion will probably be to kneel down and beg to Canon "please, please give me a new stills-oriented camera."  ::)

no way!

In reality it is way easier for (almost all of) Canon's customers to turn around and find another supplier of excellent image capturing gear than it is for Canon to find "new customers" willing to pay inflated prices for fairly un-innovative products.

AvTvM has just become a megatroll, people. He lost the battle in the last couple of threads, officially bailed out on Canon as he moved to his wonderful new Sony and the A7r. It's his time, now, to leave these shores in search of new lands.

As with all trolls, don't touch it...don't feed it...don't SPEAK to it...and it will go away. Of course, megatrolls have an even greater appetite for touching and feeding and chitchat, so I understand it's that much harder to resist. BUT, if you want the troll to slither away to new feeding grounds, stand your ground!!   :P  ::)


eml58

  • 1D X
  • *******
  • Posts: 1540
  • 1Dx
    • View Profile
Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #250 on: November 27, 2013, 07:30:59 PM »
Not exactly.  CustomerS come first.  In aggregate.  Canon needs to keep a majority of the user base 'happy', or at least buying - that is one way to deliver value to shareholders.  They've clearly demonstrated the ability to do that.  If your particular wants/needs coincide with those of the majority, well and good. If not, as is clearly the case for you, then Canon doesn't really give a CRAP about YOU.

Yes, it's a Sad truth, must be horrible for some to wake up with the realisation that one of the largest Corporates on the Planet just doesn't know who you are. Canon like many other Companies that sell a Product, sell to the Mass Market, it's very much a case of "You can't keep all of the People Happy all of the time, but we can keep most of the People Happy most of the Time".

Except AvTvM
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

jrista

  • Canon EF 400mm f/2.8L IS II
  • *********
  • Posts: 4817
  • EOL
    • View Profile
    • Nature Photography
Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #251 on: November 27, 2013, 07:48:49 PM »
Not exactly.  CustomerS come first.  In aggregate.  Canon needs to keep a majority of the user base 'happy', or at least buying - that is one way to deliver value to shareholders.  They've clearly demonstrated the ability to do that.  If your particular wants/needs coincide with those of the majority, well and good. If not, as is clearly the case for you, then Canon doesn't really give a CRAP about YOU.

Yes, it's a Sad truth, must be horrible for some to wake up with the realisation that one of the largest Corporates on the Planet just doesn't know who you are. Canon like many other Companies that sell a Product, sell to the Mass Market, it's very much a case of "You can't keep all of the People Happy all of the time, but we can keep most of the People Happy most of the Time".

That's good business, though. Any business that tries to cater to each specific individual is doomed to fail. It isn't even something any company should ever strive to do (which is probably why so many governments are bloated and financially strapped these days, as that's exactly what they try to do, and are epically failing at it.) Good business is finding a sweet spot and exploiting it as long as you can. There isn't going to be some sudden, overnight, rapid shift to mirrorless, so Canon has plenty of time to figure out their plans for moving into the market and exploiting it the same way.

It's a harsh word, exploit, and we customers and consumers certainly don't like to be exploited. But if you think about it...look at what the likes of Canon and Nikon over the last 15 years have done for the photographic art. Look at how much image quality has skyrocketed, and how accessible that kind of image quality is now. I mean, while in the film days a camera might not have been as expensive initially, you had the perpetual cost of buying film, developing it, and getting photographic prints made. That ongoing cost kept high quality photography out of the hands of your average joe. Today is an entirely different world...thanks to companies like Canon and Nikon.

While I don't necessarily have EXACTLY the camera I PERSONALLY want with all the specific features I need at the price point I can afford...the equipment Canon does offer gives me more than enough capability to produce good photographic art. If I didn't know better, I might actually feel sad for the person who is on a never-ending quest to find that 100% perfect camera, and is willing to dump brand after brand, kit after kit, in order to find it. And, once they have finally found it, will just have to give it up again once the next big competitor on the market develops something else new, and trounces their wonderfully new found "perfect" camera. I find such an endeavor to be naive and wasteful, and a very explicit choice, so I don't feel sad for such people.

Except AvTvM

Good thing he ain't a majority, then, eh? ;)

Roo

  • Canon 70D
  • ****
  • Posts: 277
    • View Profile
Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #252 on: November 28, 2013, 02:51:45 AM »

IF Canon wants to stay in business with me, they better think about what I want and how they keep ME happy.

If Canon was a car company and only listened to you I'm sure this is what we would be inflicted with...



Thank god they know how to make cameras to suit the majority and run a business successfully.  ;D
5Diii, 60D,GoPro Hero 4, Canon 24-105L, Canon 70-200 2.8L is II, Samyang 14 2.8, Tamron 17-50 2.8 vcd, Tamron 90 macro, Tamron 150-600

canon rumors FORUM

Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #252 on: November 28, 2013, 02:51:45 AM »

AmbientLight

  • Canon 7D MK II
  • *****
  • Posts: 493
    • View Profile
Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #253 on: November 28, 2013, 03:51:03 AM »

IF Canon wants to stay in business with me, they better think about what I want and how they keep ME happy.

If Canon was a car company and only listened to you I'm sure this is what we would be inflicted with...



Thank god they know how to make cameras to suit the majority and run a business successfully.  ;D

 ;D ;D ;D

Oh, great. Is this a beer can holder on the outside of the driver's door or am I imagining things?

Eldar

  • 1D X
  • *******
  • Posts: 1767
    • View Profile
    • Flickr
Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #254 on: November 28, 2013, 04:05:41 AM »
All businesses that succeed over time have a healthy balance between shareholders, employees and customers. Canon would not have been able to build the position they have without that. They have to make money to make the shareholders happy, they need to provide interesting and challenging workplaces to attract the best talent and they need to deliver products and services that tick the right motivation amongst the customer base.
There is always a danger that a company can fall asleep and be too complacent with what they have. DEC, Kodak, NCR, Nokia ... there are lots of examples of companies with a leading position being leap jumped by new technology and more aggressive competitors. Canon need to solve their sensor challenges, to keep us still photographers happy, which I’m sure they will. But apart from that, within this segment, I don’t see them having serious problems.
I am currently sitting in front of a 130x90cm2 print of a landscape, shot with the 5DIII and the 24-70 f2.8L II, and wonder; What more do I need?
5DIII, 1DX, 7DII, 8-15/4L, 16-35 f4L IS, 24-70/2.8L II, 70-200/2.8L IS II, 200-400/4L IS 1.4x, Zeiss 15/2.8, 17/4L TS-E, 24/3.5L TS-E II, Zeiss 35/1.4, Zeiss Otus 55/1.4, Zeiss Otus 85/1.4, 100/2.8L IS Macro, Zeiss 135/2, 600/4L IS II

canon rumors FORUM

Re: New EOS-1 in 2014 [CR1]
« Reply #254 on: November 28, 2013, 04:05:41 AM »