November 23, 2014, 12:42:24 PM

Author Topic: New User looking for advice..  (Read 1724 times)

brettfer

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New User looking for advice..
« on: April 19, 2014, 04:17:46 AM »
Hi lads & ladies,

Well I'm after a camera. This will be my first DSLR and I'm a longtime Ferrari fanatic. I collect Ferrari memorabilia and diecast models. I also attend Ferrari events and F1 when the finances allow. Budget? I didn't really want to go over $2000 (with lense/s), but if more is the better option overall than save more $ I will. Been trolling plenty of forums and websites for info and these are the few I've considered.

Canon 5D,6D,7D,70D

I would need to use macro lense (models) and video is an option but not entirely necessary. I may branch into my own website and sell Ferrari stuff so detail is a "thing" I guess.But currently I'm an enthusiast and its just a hobby.

Cheers

Brett

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New User looking for advice..
« on: April 19, 2014, 04:17:46 AM »

wickidwombat

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Re: New User looking for advice..
« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2014, 01:10:39 PM »
canon 70D

Canon 15-85 IS
Tamron 150-600

then down the track look at maybe the sigma 35 f1.4 or 50 f1.4

here are some ferrari shots from shanghai F1 a week ago with the tamron on the 5Dmk3

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Drizzt321

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Re: New User looking for advice..
« Reply #2 on: April 29, 2014, 01:36:24 PM »
Yea, the 70D will be quite good for you to start with, if you can afford a bit more to step up to it. And the new Tamron 150-600 will be pretty great as a fairly good telephoto zoom. You'll also end up needing a good tripod, most likely, and you don't want to skimp on that.

If you can manage, buy the 70D, Tamron 150-600, good tripod (budget $500-1000, and definitely get Arca-Swiss compatible). Macro, I think the go-to in Canon land is the 100L f/2.8 IS. It'll really bust your budget, but you can always get it later. Or switch and go Macro first, and then get the Tamron later on.

Realistically, you'll have to go over $2K for a fairly good body (meaning one with acceptable AF for the racing photography) plus telephoto lens, plus good tripod since you _will_ need one. Theoretically with enough light you can hand-hold the Tamron with enough light, but while it's not a monster like the 800mm, it still weighs a too much for most people to handhold for very long.

And trust me, don't try to spend $50 for a tripod, it'll suck. You'll end up buying another one for $150 thinking you'll be set. Then you'll go for $300, and it's better, but then you'll just end up spending more money to get something that's quite good. Ah, here's the link, Thom's tripod article. Look at Maxim #2.
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lintoni

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Re: New User looking for advice..
« Reply #3 on: April 29, 2014, 02:51:08 PM »
The EF 100 f2.8 Macro (not the L version) is an excellent lens.  For taking pictures of models, in a controlled environment with a tripod, the image stabilisation will not be necessary, so you can save a bit of money there.
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jdramirez

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Re: New User looking for advice..
« Reply #4 on: April 29, 2014, 05:36:19 PM »
I'd also throw the 60 d into the mix.  You can get one for 600 ish.  At a distance, the auto focus should be equally as good as the 70 d.  If you were closer to the subject and depth of field could switch away from your subject quickly, then the ,70d would be preferable. 

I'd also suggest some good peripheral lighting and maybe a 180mm macro combined with a teleconvertor.

It is just other options.  Just make sure there is sufficient light.
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100L-> 85mm f/1.8 USM-> 8mm -> 85mm f/1.2L mkii

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Re: New User looking for advice..
« Reply #5 on: April 29, 2014, 06:18:01 PM »
I'd suggest buying a refurbished FF Canon 6D along with a 24-70 F/4 zoom.  You will appreciate the better response to red colors, and the 24-70 f/4 is a macro zoom lens that will let you focus closely.
 
A 70D refurb is only slightly less than a 6D refurb, but FF makes a big difference.  Its going to run you a little over $2,000 for the combo.

traingineer

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Re: New User looking for advice..
« Reply #6 on: April 29, 2014, 07:57:13 PM »
I'd suggest buying a refurbished FF Canon 6D along with a 24-70 F/4 zoom.  You will appreciate the better response to red colors, and the 24-70 f/4 is a macro zoom lens that will let you focus closely.
 
A 70D refurb is only slightly less than a 6D refurb, but FF makes a big difference.  Its going to run you a little over $2,000 for the combo.

+1
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Re: New User looking for advice..
« Reply #6 on: April 29, 2014, 07:57:13 PM »

Skirball

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Re: New User looking for advice..
« Reply #7 on: April 29, 2014, 08:07:51 PM »
Guess I'll be the oddball and tell you to just get a Rebel (unless you're going to get a cheap 60D).  If you insist on spending money put it towards lenses.  Any modern SLR will produce quality images in a tabletop setting, car races have less to do with fancy AF systems and more with panning technique, and car shows are going to benefit from large aperture glass more than the modest performance bump of the 70D - unless you go 6D, but a 6D with a single lens doesn't do you much good.

tolusina

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Re: New User looking for advice..
« Reply #8 on: April 29, 2014, 08:34:34 PM »
I know, there are only Canons on your list, I just cannot help but thinking those exotic red cars, well, a red camera..........




That's a Pentax K-50, specs are none too shabby, lots of lenses available both current and vintage. Pentax K-3 is highly regarded.
 
But, if full frame is desired, Canon is the only, really.
Sony models are only supported short term, limited native lens choices.
Nikon, maybe they'll recover their film era greatness, not yet. For me, I prefer the handling of Nikons, but there are too many deal killers starting with the fuzz that lines the mirror box.
Canons deliver. Period.
From your list, I choose 6D, that's my bias.
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candc

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Re: New User looking for advice..
« Reply #9 on: April 29, 2014, 08:37:08 PM »
the 70d is good for macro with the flip screen an dual pixel focus. the ef-s 60 goes really well on it as a macro and portrait lens, its nice and small, reasonable price. if you are looking to do video  the 70d is best. its a really good all around camera. it feels modern in use. we are lucky nowadays in that there are a lot of good choices out there and you don't need to spend a ton of money to get good results.

wickidwombat

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Re: New User looking for advice..
« Reply #10 on: April 29, 2014, 10:59:43 PM »
why buy a macro lens just buy some tubes everyone seems to be focusing on macro and really it more close up than macro so tubes will be plenty, to photograph actual racing he is going to need a long lens that performs...
and really a 60D or 6D af for tracking race cars? F1 cars? ummmm No.

For the OP stated uses the best would be to
A) accept $2000 isnt enough and it will over run
B) get a 70D the AF will be better than going for anything with a crappy 9 pt AF
C) look for a used 15-85 IS to save some bucks (I got one for my parents for $400) new they are about $800 i think
D) get a tamron 150-600
and E) get some AF tubes for close up work with the 15-85

probably grab a $100 50 f1.8 mk2 for now for some wide apperture fun

get a tripod later the 150-600 can be handheld easily enough.
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jdramirez

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Re: New User looking for advice..
« Reply #11 on: April 29, 2014, 11:23:41 PM »
why buy a macro lens just buy some tubes everyone seems to be focusing on macro and really it more close up than macro so tubes will be plenty, to photograph actual racing he is going to need a long lens that performs...
and really a 60D or 6D af for tracking race cars? F1 cars? ummmm No.

For the OP stated uses the best would be to
A) accept $2000 isnt enough and it will over run
B) get a 70D the AF will be better than going for anything with a crappy 9 pt AF
C) look for a used 15-85 IS to save some bucks (I got one for my parents for $400) new they are about $800 i think
D) get a tamron 150-600
and E) get some AF tubes for close up work with the 15-85

probably grab a $100 50 f1.8 mk2 for now for some wide apperture fun

get a tripod later the 150-600 can be handheld easily enough.

Formula 1 cars go up to 200 miles per hour... or at least I think they do in my video games.  But the question is how far will the photographer be from the subject?  My guess is that he would be in the stands... so lets say 20 meters is as close as he'll ever get to the vehicles in motion.

Per a dof calculator (@ f/5.6):

Subject distance    65 ft
 
Depth of field
Near limit    61 ft
Far limit    69.5 ft
Total    8.5 ft

So we aren't talking about shallow depth of fields with a speedy adjustment by the lens to keep focus.  I think the 60D, 7D, or even a 50D could keep pace with a car going 200 mph when you are that far away.  Heck... my old Canon XS can probably do an adequate job... though I don't recall if the XS has an AI servo mode...

Also... when you are that type of distance... the perceived added reach of a crop sensor along with a 1.4x teleconvertor will get you close to the action...

I know we as a group will praise full frame... and it is nice... very nice... super nice... I don't want to undersell it... but crop isn't that bad.  In good light, I contend it is difficult to tell the difference.  @ higher isos... ok... crop is noticeably worse... but the races will take place outdoors... sunny... cloudy... depends on the desired shutter speed.  1/6000 will limit the blur only to the tires, but at 1/200, presuming he is panning, will blur the background as a result of the camera movement... So f/2.8 isn't that necessary.

I think the 100 non L is a good option for the macro work... but the fact of the matter is that there is more than one way to skin a cat... which is a stupid saying... I think a more apropos phrase is there is more than one way to get a woman into bed. 

And most of the options discussed will be adequate for the tasks listed.
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100L-> 85mm f/1.8 USM-> 8mm -> 85mm f/1.2L mkii

wickidwombat

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Re: New User looking for advice..
« Reply #12 on: April 29, 2014, 11:34:39 PM »
why buy a macro lens just buy some tubes everyone seems to be focusing on macro and really it more close up than macro so tubes will be plenty, to photograph actual racing he is going to need a long lens that performs...
and really a 60D or 6D af for tracking race cars? F1 cars? ummmm No.

For the OP stated uses the best would be to
A) accept $2000 isnt enough and it will over run
B) get a 70D the AF will be better than going for anything with a crappy 9 pt AF
C) look for a used 15-85 IS to save some bucks (I got one for my parents for $400) new they are about $800 i think
D) get a tamron 150-600
and E) get some AF tubes for close up work with the 15-85

probably grab a $100 50 f1.8 mk2 for now for some wide apperture fun

get a tripod later the 150-600 can be handheld easily enough.

Formula 1 cars go up to 200 miles per hour... or at least I think they do in my video games.  But the question is how far will the photographer be from the subject?  My guess is that he would be in the stands... so lets say 20 meters is as close as he'll ever get to the vehicles in motion.

Per a dof calculator (@ f/5.6):

Subject distance    65 ft
 
Depth of field
Near limit    61 ft
Far limit    69.5 ft
Total    8.5 ft

So we aren't talking about shallow depth of fields with a speedy adjustment by the lens to keep focus.  I think the 60D, 7D, or even a 50D could keep pace with a car going 200 mph when you are that far away.  Heck... my old Canon XS can probably do an adequate job... though I don't recall if the XS has an AI servo mode...

Also... when you are that type of distance... the perceived added reach of a crop sensor along with a 1.4x teleconvertor will get you close to the action...

I know we as a group will praise full frame... and it is nice... very nice... super nice... I don't want to undersell it... but crop isn't that bad.  In good light, I contend it is difficult to tell the difference.  @ higher isos... ok... crop is noticeably worse... but the races will take place outdoors... sunny... cloudy... depends on the desired shutter speed.  1/6000 will limit the blur only to the tires, but at 1/200, presuming he is panning, will blur the background as a result of the camera movement... So f/2.8 isn't that necessary.

I think the 100 non L is a good option for the macro work... but the fact of the matter is that there is more than one way to skin a cat... which is a stupid saying... I think a more apropos phrase is there is more than one way to get a woman into bed. 

And most of the options discussed will be adequate for the tasks listed.
i was in the stands shooting full frame plus the tamron for the back straight i wished i had a 70D
I know the crappy 9 point af would not have had a chance to get even close to the shots the 5d3 delivered

the 70D might go close

shooting in cloudy, sunny and rain over the 3 days

VC off auto iso zone AF and panning
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Re: New User looking for advice..
« Reply #12 on: April 29, 2014, 11:34:39 PM »

tolusina

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Re: New User looking for advice..
« Reply #13 on: April 30, 2014, 12:12:35 AM »
Um, has anyone else noticed that the OP has a total of one CR post, the one that started this thread 10 days ago?
Lots of replies, no response from the OP........................
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Menace

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Re: New User looking for advice..
« Reply #14 on: April 30, 2014, 01:47:25 AM »

Been trolling plenty of forums and websites for info and these are the few I've considered.


 ;)
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Re: New User looking for advice..
« Reply #14 on: April 30, 2014, 01:47:25 AM »