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Author Topic: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question  (Read 10610 times)

revup67

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I recently acquired the 16-35mm L IS USM Canon lens.  Prior I had been buying highly rated / reviewed 72mm filters.  I've used several of the filter review sites prior to acquiring any UV or Polarizer filters (especially lenstip.com which was very thorough) however I am curious if anyone has (1) any experience with Zykkor or other ND faders from ND2 to ND400 or do you believe carrying individual ND filters is a better way to go?  I've been told the Zykkor's use Hoya glass.  I do have the Hoya ND400 HMC 72mm and the Hoya HMC ND 8 and am fond of these two but I am also keeping in mind and trying to minimize the carrying load if it makes sense.  Thanks in advance.
Thanks
Rev
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Axilrod

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Re: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question
« Reply #1 on: January 28, 2012, 06:28:35 PM »
I recently acquired the 16-35mm L IS USM Canon lens.  Prior I had been buying highly rated / reviewed 72mm filters.  I've used several of the filter review sites prior to acquiring any UV or Polarizer filters (especially lenstip.com which was very thorough) however I am curious if anyone has (1) any experience with Zykkor or other ND faders from ND2 to ND400 or do you believe carrying individual ND filters is a better way to go?  I've been told the Zykkor's use Hoya glass.  I do have the Hoya ND400 HMC 72mm and the Hoya HMC ND 8 and am fond of these two but I am also keeping in mind and trying to minimize the carrying load if it makes sense.  Thanks in advance.

There is no such thing as a 16-35mm IS.  There is a 16-35mm f/2.8L (version 1) that takes 77mm filters, and a 16-35mm f/2.8L II that takes 82mm filters.  So I'm confused.

As for Fader ND filters, I have a Genus 72mm that I use with all my large aperture primes, it's nice to have the adjustability and being able to shoot wide open in broad daylight.

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Axilrod

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Re: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question
« Reply #2 on: January 28, 2012, 06:29:52 PM »
Actually I just noticed it says 16-35mm f/2.8L II in your sig, so you need an 82mm. 
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/676826-REG/Genus_GL_GNDF_82_82mm_ND_Neutral_Density.html
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neuroanatomist

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Re: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question
« Reply #3 on: January 28, 2012, 10:21:03 PM »
As long as you plan on sticking with an APS-C body, an 82mm variable ND would work.  The IQ takes a slight hit relative to a high-quality standard ND, but a good quality vari-ND will be fine.

However, if you plan to go FF, you might want a couple of standard ND filters instead.  Personally, I find that a 3-stop and a 10-stop meet my needs; I have 72mm and 77mm 3-stop and 77mm and 82mm 10-stop filters, all B+W. The 10-stop adds some warmth, which can be corrected by adjusting the WB in post.

The reason I suggest avoiding the vari-ND if you go FF is uneven polarization.  At angles of view wider than 24mm (on FF; wider than 15mm on APS-C), a polarizing filter cannot evenly polarize the entire field - skies are banded dark/light, for example. A vari-ND is a CPL stacked on a linear polarizer - that uneven polarization translates to a 'Maltese cross' artifact, worse at wider angles and greater polarization (darker setting on the vari-ND). 
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revup67

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Re: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question
« Reply #4 on: January 28, 2012, 11:06:52 PM »
Axilrod - I apologize you were correct in your assumption it is a Mkii and of course there is no IS (what was I thinking) - thanks for the link on the ND but Neuro is correct, going FF soon and purposely got this lens for that reason

Neuro - you are correct and clairvoyant.  My plan to acquire this lens was to wait for the 5D Mkiii.  So it appears sticking with a straight ND is the way to go.  I was just informed Hoya does not make an ND400 in the US for an 82mm size so seeking out substitutes at the moment but not a Filter holder type such as Cokin, prefer a screw on.  Open for recommendations for a 9 or 10 stop screw on for 82mm ND.

Question: (perhaps absurd), the glass on the 16-35 mkii does not go edge to edge.  can you use a step down ring from 82 to 72 on an APS-C and/or FF camera?  I have a 72mm ND400 at present.   I suspect the answer is "no" and there is a reason - thanks in advance
Thanks
Rev
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wickidwombat

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Re: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question
« Reply #5 on: January 29, 2012, 02:21:02 AM »
i got the lightcraft workshop variable ND 82mm it flares out to 86mm and comes with an 86mm centerpinch lens cap and doesnt vigentte on full frame
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Re: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question
« Reply #6 on: January 29, 2012, 04:54:05 AM »
I recently acquired the 16-35mm L IS USM Canon lens.  Prior I had been buying highly rated / reviewed 72mm filters.  I've used several of the filter review sites prior to acquiring any UV or Polarizer filters (especially lenstip.com which was very thorough) however I am curious if anyone has (1) any experience with Zykkor or other ND faders from ND2 to ND400 or do you believe carrying individual ND filters is a better way to go?  I've been told the Zykkor's use Hoya glass.  I do have the Hoya ND400 HMC 72mm and the Hoya HMC ND 8 and am fond of these two but I am also keeping in mind and trying to minimize the carrying load if it makes sense.  Thanks in advance.

Are you quite sure that the 8-16mm Fisheye that you mention in your signature is made by Canon and not by Sigma?
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Re: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question
« Reply #6 on: January 29, 2012, 04:54:05 AM »

briansquibb

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Re: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question
« Reply #7 on: January 29, 2012, 07:01:35 AM »

Are you quite sure that the 8-16mm Fisheye that you mention in your signature is made by Canon and not by Sigma?

The Canon fisheye is 8-15

http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/Canon-EF-8-15mm-f-4-L-USM-Fisheye-Lens-Review.aspx

neuroanatomist

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Re: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question
« Reply #8 on: January 29, 2012, 09:21:55 AM »
Neuro - you are correct and clairvoyant.  My plan to acquire this lens was to wait for the 5D Mkiii.  So it appears sticking with a straight ND is the way to go.  I was just informed Hoya does not make an ND400 in the US for an 82mm size so seeking out substitutes at the moment but not a Filter holder type such as Cokin, prefer a screw on.  Open for recommendations for a 9 or 10 stop screw on for 82mm ND.

Question: (perhaps absurd), the glass on the 16-35 mkii does not go edge to edge.  can you use a step down ring from 82 to 72 on an APS-C and/or FF camera?  I have a 72mm ND400 at present.   I suspect the answer is "no" and there is a reason - thanks in advance

Schneider Optics (parent company of B+W filters) makes an 82mm screw-in 10-stop ND filter, that's the one I have.  The only US distributor, AFAIK, is 2filter.com (link); they're in NH, mine arrived the day after I placed the order.

A step-down adapter and smaller-than-82mm filter will mechanically vignette. Anything thicker than an 82mm F-Pro mount will vignette.  Note that to complete the weather/dust sealing on the 16-35L II, a filter is required.  Personally, I use a B+W XS-Pro MRC UV. 
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shermanstank

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Re: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question
« Reply #9 on: January 29, 2012, 11:40:07 AM »
I personally use a LEE filter holder (Foundation Kit)  that can hold 4x6 Graduated ND filters or 4x4 ND  filters.  I certainly love the flexibility/control  of moving the filter/s up or down to balance the scene.

I have a bunch of 4x6 LEE and SINGH-RAY Graduated ND filters.  and this decision was made easy  after stumbling upon an excellent landscape photographer---   PATRICK SMITH     http://www.flickr.com/photos/patrick-smith-photography

Amongst all of the filters, my personal favorite is the LEE BIG STOPPER.

Cheers!

Sherwin
« Last Edit: January 29, 2012, 11:44:45 AM by shermanstank »

Axilrod

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Re: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question
« Reply #10 on: January 29, 2012, 05:25:47 PM »
I recently acquired the 16-35mm L IS USM Canon lens.  Prior I had been buying highly rated / reviewed 72mm filters.  I've used several of the filter review sites prior to acquiring any UV or Polarizer filters (especially lenstip.com which was very thorough) however I am curious if anyone has (1) any experience with Zykkor or other ND faders from ND2 to ND400 or do you believe carrying individual ND filters is a better way to go?  I've been told the Zykkor's use Hoya glass.  I do have the Hoya ND400 HMC 72mm and the Hoya HMC ND 8 and am fond of these two but I am also keeping in mind and trying to minimize the carrying load if it makes sense.  Thanks in advance.

Are you quite sure that the 8-16mm Fisheye that you mention in your signature is made by Canon and not by Sigma?

I think you meant is it made by Sigma and not Canon, it says "Canon 8-16mm," there is a Sigma 8-16mm, but the Canon is an 8-15mm.
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revup67

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Re: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question
« Reply #11 on: January 29, 2012, 06:37:28 PM »
Michael and Axil - thanks for the heads up.  My signature should indicate Canon 8-15 Fisheye, not 8-16 (now fixed).  Sloppy typing.  I had the signature correct then added one more lens and the signature word wrap stated I had too many lines.  In truncating the sig the typo appeared.  thanks for your watchful eyes.

Some excellent tips on here about the ND's to choose but for certain won't fall back on the 72's.  For a moment there was a smidget of a glimmer of hope which was thankfully debunked by Neuro.

I've got a holder with a few graduated Cokins and there certainly is a big benefit to sliding up and down just those panes can be a bit flimsy and chip easily.  The B&W screw on is one to consider for sure.  I am also considering the Hoya ND64 and Hoya ND8 screw on and possible stacking though am concerned about the stacking aspect and if it will degrade the photo in any way shape or form.  Of course it does allow for the benefit of separation of the two vs. one screw on.

Wickid - that lightcraft workshop variable ND 82mm looks like one fine product - it's just shy of the 9 or 10 stops I was seeking at 8 stops.  What's most appealing though is the lack of degradation on the image

Rev
« Last Edit: January 29, 2012, 11:42:01 PM by revup67 »
Thanks
Rev
Canon EOS 5D MK3 + EOS 7D » Canon50mm 1.4 » Canon 100mm IS USM L Macro » Canon 24-105 L USM IS » Canon 70-300 IS USM L» Canon MP-E65 » Canon 8-15mm Fisheye »Canon 16-35 Mkii USM L » Canon 200mm 2.8 L USM II » Canon 400mm 5.6 L » Canon 580EXII & MT 24EX Flash

canonuser78

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Re: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question
« Reply #12 on: May 07, 2013, 05:11:17 AM »
i got the lightcraft workshop variable ND 82mm it flares out to 86mm and comes with an 86mm centerpinch lens cap and doesnt vigentte on full frame

Hello there,
no vignette on full frame for this kind of filter , sounds great , but how about the uneven polarization at 82mm (16-36 USM II) ? I asked because I have found something cheaper with similar sizes as lightcraft 82/86 front thread diameter :

FOTGA Slim Fader Variable ND Filter Adjustable ND2 to ND400 82mm , review here.

My concerns are related to this line :
The Fader ND filter is suggested to use with wide and standard lens to obtain the best performance. Image quality may drop when focal length above 200mm. It may not be suitable for wide angle lens <24mm,35mm film format equivalent .

Anyone tried ?
thanks,
« Last Edit: May 07, 2013, 05:14:48 AM by canonuser78 »

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Re: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question
« Reply #12 on: May 07, 2013, 05:11:17 AM »

Vossie

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Re: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question
« Reply #13 on: May 07, 2013, 06:37:56 AM »
I use LEE filters for ND's and grads. Works well on the 16-35, except if you also use the LEE CPL (which has to be in front of the other filters; you get serious vignetting from ~20 mm and wider).

Pro's of LEE filters
  • excellent optical quality (such as no color casting on dark ND's
  • very big offering of graduated filters
  • works on (almost) all of your lenses, just buy extra adapter rings
  • creative possibilities are endless (especially when combining grads with other filters

Con's are:
  • expensive (especially the pro-glass filters
  • difficult to find shops with stocks (I buy from Omnifoto.nl, who usually has quite good stock)
  • systems takes a fair bit of volume in your pack (I use the LowePro S&F filter case to carry them) and somewhat cumbersome to use.
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Re: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question
« Reply #14 on: May 07, 2013, 06:56:25 AM »
Schneider Optics (parent company of B+W filters) makes an 82mm screw-in 10-stop ND filter, that's the one I have.
I recently researched the color cast with 10x nd filters (see http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=12884.25) and ended up with a Heliopan that also has a warm, but slightly different color cast than the b+w. I chose the much more reasonably priced uncoated version because a 10 stop filter is designed to stop light. Correcting wb doesn't really remove the color cast completely, but it is "good" enough, for better results you have to use ps.

The catch in any case is: For really good results you need a "hot mirror" nd filter that stops infrared, because the color cast is not the only problem but ir also lowers contrast in hot conditions. Since you cannot stack filters for uwa lenses, the only choice is a combined ir-nd which is for example available from Tiffen, but for a much higher price.

Btw: you can also build a vari-nd filter from two polarizers (cpl + non-cpl) which is exactly is what a composite nd filter really is, just in the home-made version you can still use the polarizers alone and you have the option to adjust the rear cpl for a polarizer effect which is not possible with a ready-made vari nd. I wouldn't use any vari-nd for uwa though.

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Re: Canon 16-35mm L IS USM - Need ND Filters, recommendations ? Question
« Reply #14 on: May 07, 2013, 06:56:25 AM »