December 10, 2017, 11:05:48 PM

Author Topic: Companies that process RAW files  (Read 18739 times)

Valvebounce

  • Canon EF 400mm f/2.8L IS II
  • *********
  • Posts: 3459
  • Doing my best to get all of this to work together.
Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #15 on: October 02, 2016, 05:21:56 AM »
Hi aa angus.
I run a business, (cars, not photography) one of my priorities is to help the economy which is supporting me in various ways, one way I see to do that would be to employ local help if I needed it, same country if local is not available, then overseas as a last resort.
I passionately hate the race to the bottom caused by cheap, cheaper than that and the quality that follows. And yes I do have to buy parts sourced from abroad, typically China these days, but it better be up to quality or you get it back.
I wish you the best but if I found you were outsourcing abroad I wouldn't use you, cheaper or not unless you were the last resort.

Cheers, Graham.

lol none of you seem to understand, I'm trying to spend LESS time editing, not ramp things up.
One day some of you may run businesses. Of those few who do, some of your businesses will be successful. Now, unfortunately, one of the drawbacks of owning a successful business is that there is a lot of work to do. When the amount of work is too great for one person, it's time to start outsourcing some of the load. I don't expect you simpletons to understand this concept, so don't hurt your brains trying xx

We're "simpletons", yet you're the one seeking advice from strangers on a camera rumours forum to help your "successful" business.  Good one, hero.  All the best with your 'churn and burn' process.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2016, 05:26:08 AM by Valvebounce »
7DII+Grip, 1DsIII, 7D+Grip, 40D+Grip, EF 24-105 f4L EF-S 17-85, EF-S 10-22, EF 70-200 f2.8 L IS II, EF 1.4xIII, 2xIII, EF 100-400 f/4.5-5.6l IS II, Σ17-70 f2.8-4 C, EF 50mm f1.8, YN600EX-RT, YN-E3-RT, Filters, Remotes, Macro tubes, Tripods, heads etc!

1DsIII, 20D, 24-105, 17-85, Nifty 50 pre owned

canon rumors FORUM

Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #15 on: October 02, 2016, 05:21:56 AM »

rfdesigner

  • EOS 5DS R
  • ******
  • Posts: 870
Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #16 on: October 02, 2016, 07:42:57 AM »
Hello,

I am a Melbourne (Australia) based wedding photographer.
I shoot between 30-60 weddings per year. I shoot between 1500-3000 images per wedding.

Do any of you have experience paying overseas companies to process you raw files? Are there any companies who are priced reasonable who you would recommend?

I would really appreciate any help or advice here, as I'm currently drowning in Lightroom.

Thanks very much!

processing is only one activity you could outsource/employ someone else.

Decide what you think is "core" and what isn't, core stuff should be done under your controll.  Outsource for the stuff that is handle turning and just gets in your way and/or the areas you really aren't so good at (no one's perfect)

Processing...   how much can you automate?..  is it worth investing in a mega-processing machine.  I like the idea of getting in a grad, they could help as an assistant/2nd camera during a shoot and you get them to do the bulk of the basic processing leaving the stuff you really care about and you keep control so they learn what you want and things get better over time.

FYI I ran a small bussiness in another field for a time.

lol none of you seem to understand, I'm trying to spend LESS time editing, not ramp things up.
One day some of you may run businesses. Of those few who do, some of your businesses will be successful. Now, unfortunately, one of the drawbacks of owning a successful business is that there is a lot of work to do. When the amount of work is too great for one person, it's time to start outsourcing some of the load. I don't expect you simpletons to understand this concept, so don't hurt your brains trying xx

nice!  ::)
6D, 30D, 383L+, 28f1.8, 50STM, 100f2.0, 5.5"f8 scope, 12"f5 scope.

Alex_M

  • EOS 6D Mark II
  • *****
  • Posts: 345
Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #17 on: October 02, 2016, 09:00:56 AM »
That was not a nice thing to say, aa_angus.

let me go ahead and apologise on your behalf. I am also living in Melbounre for 20 years now and feel obliged to assure the forum that Melbournians are in general very polite and nice people... Not sure what just happened here..  :(

Mikehit

  • Canon EF 300mm f/2.8L IS II
  • ********
  • Posts: 2183
Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #18 on: October 02, 2016, 09:17:10 AM »
Very common problem - OP asks a question, some questions and comments are posed such that the OP takes it as a personal slight about their methods which they believe to be as good as they can be, so gets irritated and posts (shall we say) intemperate responses.

If people only ever directly answered the question, no more and no less, fora would be pretty boring places to be IMO.

Given it is their livelihood I would think the OP would take time and think 'I wonder why they said that...' and ask for more details so see if the workload is as efficient as it could be.

old-pr-pix

  • EOS 80D
  • ****
  • Posts: 298
Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #19 on: October 02, 2016, 09:33:20 AM »
In an effort to salvage something from this thread...  I have no direct experience photographically using off-shore support; but, I can relate experiences attempting to use outsourced engineering design (CAD/CAM) support between US and India.  For engineering there are definite standards and right vs. wrong solutions -- I find it difficult imagine how one would establish quality/style standards for something as subjective as photo PP.  Don't underestimate the difficulties of communicating via email -- language and time zones can make real-time communications questionable.  The "sales" contact may be fine, but the person actually assigned to work on your account may not be so easy to communicate with -  and may change daily.  Once settled-in with a workable supplier watch out they don't further sub-contract to an even lower cost (less reliable, less controllable, etc.) source without your knowledge.  Suddenly you may get a batch of "crap" and wonder what happened.  Or an important project simply gets "lost" in all the exchanges. Of course, they always expect to be paid - even if you are totally dissatisfied with their output.  That brings other stresses to resolve.

IMO - as suggested above - hiring a local "assistant" makes the most sense.  Someone you can coach daily and guide into matching your style and quality expectations.  They may also serve as a workable "second shooter."  That can give you a path to grow your business further.  Eventually perhaps reaching a point where you can select which events you want to cover and delegate the others to reliable assistants.

Best of luck whatever you decide to do.
Two systems:  Canon & Olympus

Orangutan

  • EOS-1D X Mark II
  • *******
  • Posts: 1898
Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #20 on: October 02, 2016, 10:00:15 AM »
none of you seem to understand, I'm trying to spend LESS time editing

No, we get that.  But editing is a significant part of what shows in your portfolio, the basis on which you've been hired. 

Quote
one of the drawbacks of owning a successful business is that there is a lot of work to do.
How much time do you spend processing 3,000-6,000 wedding photos now?  How much time do other photographers spend on comparable work?  If it's less than what you're spending, then maybe you need to improve your workflow before you outsource a good portion of the basis on which you're hired.

TAW

  • EOS Rebel SL2
  • ***
  • Posts: 96
Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #21 on: October 02, 2016, 10:03:56 AM »
I would like to second pwp's suggestion of inquiring locally and working with a student.  I run a business (nothing to do with photography) and we bring on an intern every few years.  It has been an extremely rewarding experience for us and them...  Here is how I approach interns:

1) Try to give them flexible work so they can vary their hours based on school, homework, finals...
2) School comes first - this is as much about giving them experience to move from being a student into the working world.  Getting that first experience can be really challenging and when a student does find it, it can really set them apart.
3) Pay them fairly.  Some can be so excited about working and getting experience, they are willing to work for free which I think is crazy.  Hopefully that helps them learn to treat people fairly as the grow.
4) If they do something really good and you really make bank, share...  Offer to pay some of their tuition...
5) Make sure to give them honest feedback (including investing a little time) so they can really develop and grow. 

I wish you the best in your business!
tom



It's not the the snake bite that kills you, it chasing after the snake.

canon rumors FORUM

Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #21 on: October 02, 2016, 10:03:56 AM »

Orangutan

  • EOS-1D X Mark II
  • *******
  • Posts: 1898
Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #22 on: October 02, 2016, 10:06:49 AM »
I would like to second pwp's suggestion of inquiring locally and working with a student.  I run a business (nothing to do with photography) and we bring on an intern every few years.  It has been an extremely rewarding experience for us and them...  Here is how I approach interns:

1) Try to give them flexible work so they can vary their hours based on school, homework, finals...
2) School comes first - this is as much about giving them experience to move from being a student into the working world.  Getting that first experience can be really challenging and when a student does find it, it can really set them apart.
3) Pay them fairly.  Some can be so excited about working and getting experience, they are willing to work for free which I think is crazy.  Hopefully that helps them learn to treat people fairly as the grow.
4) If they do something really good and you really make bank, share...  Offer to pay some of their tuition...
5) Make sure to give them honest feedback (including investing a little time) so they can really develop and grow. 

I wish you the best in your business!
tom

+100

We need more employers like you in the world.

Lurker

  • EOS Rebel T7i
  • ****
  • Posts: 113
Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #23 on: October 02, 2016, 11:07:28 AM »
I can't answer your question, I have no experience in the area.  I'm at the other end of the spectrum.  An amature that gets out a few times a year and shoots hundreds of images at most.  Then life takes over and leaves little or no time for post processing.  Your questions raise several for me.

Do you do any culling of images?  Are you putting all 1500-3000 images into Lightroom?  How many images do you actually show to the client?  Have you tried other workflow software like Breeze Systems Downloader Pro and BreezeBrowser, Photo Mechanic or FastRawViewer?  Some videos advocate culling 90-95% of your images before putting anything into LR.  Some suggest rejecting all images and saving only the ones you like.  Lots of good tutorials on YouTube, or the software sites, from working pros. 

One big complaint about LR is how slow it is at ingesting images.  All the above software render images very fast and support culling images very quickly.  I believe all support XMP data too which is then imported into LR.

I recently added FastRawViewer to my workflow.  It was about $15, the other 2 options run about $150.  As a pro the $150 might not bother you but it was too much for me.

Orangutan

  • EOS-1D X Mark II
  • *******
  • Posts: 1898
Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #24 on: October 02, 2016, 11:24:54 AM »
One big complaint about LR is how slow it is at ingesting images. 

This is a myth: Lightroom imports images pretty quickly so long as you make two processing selections: (1) choose "add" rather than "move" so the images are imported in-place rather than moved to LR's catalog folder; (2) set "build previews"  to "minimal."  On my old/slow computer I can import 800+ photos in about 3 minutes for the first cull.  You then generate larger previews before processing.

Jack Douglas

  • Canon EF 400mm f/2.8L IS II
  • *********
  • Posts: 4643
  • http://www.gohaidagwaii.ca/blog/eagle-photography-
Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #25 on: October 02, 2016, 12:18:19 PM »
My wee bit of insight unrelated to the OP question.  Anyone posting should consider that there will be comments from left field and have a thick enough skin to receive some (borderline) insulting comments. That in no way implies that I condone impolite comments. 

And, just a little effort should be put into framing a question so that it provokes the appropriate responses otherwise it's "ask a stupid question and get a stupid answer".

I applaud those who provide insightful input in spite of the negative aspects associated with a post because it then ends up still providing valuable information that one can glean.  I don't have a lot of spare time to burn and use CR as a learning tool, seldom frequenting other sites and I have learned a lot even from threads that go off track.  Actually the odd borderline comment can be quite humorous, come to think of it.

It sure would be nice if there was filter automation that would remove the clueless commentary from a thread. ;)

Jack
1DX2   11-24 F4   24-70 F4   70-200 F2.8 II   300 F2.8 II   1.4X III   2X III   400 DO F4 II 

http://yourshot.nationalgeographic.com/profile/647784/

takesome1

  • EOS 5DS R
  • ******
  • Posts: 1152
Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #26 on: October 02, 2016, 12:33:15 PM »
comment removed by mod

romanr74

  • EOS 7D Mark II
  • *****
  • Posts: 531
  • I see, thus I am
Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #27 on: October 02, 2016, 01:07:10 PM »
i'm honestly a bit puzzled by that question. i would believe that in wedding photography post is at least as important for the final result as the shooting itself is. to me the outsourcing of post thus sounds like a no-go. am i being naive here? is this a common thing?
« Last Edit: October 02, 2016, 01:14:25 PM by romanr74 »
EOS 5D Mark III; EF 15mm f/2.8 Fisheye; TS-E 17 f/4.0L; EF 85mm f/1.2L II; Macro EF 100 f/2.8L IS; EF 11-24 f/4.0L, EF 16-35 f/2.8L II, EF 16-35 f/4.0L IS, EF 24-70 f/2.8L II, EF 70-200 f/2.8L IS II

canon rumors FORUM

Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #27 on: October 02, 2016, 01:07:10 PM »

privatebydesign

  • Canon EF 600mm f/4L IS II
  • **********
  • Posts: 6588
  • Would you take advice from a cartoons stuffed toy?
Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #28 on: October 02, 2016, 01:56:07 PM »
Jesus Christ guys! How many pro wedding photographers did their own processing back in the film days? Virtually none. How many drew this kind of bullS___ for it? Not one single one of them.

There are many pro photographers that outsource processing, if your gift/skill/strength is in other areas of your business you'd be a fool to not outsource it. And it can be surprisingly reasonably priced.

Outsourced processing companies can provide quick and consistent end product to your requirements and style while you are shooting another wedding, how many of you with your smart arsed comments can be in two places at once? Just talk through with the company what you want and maybe send them an image or three with your style and bang, you are done.

Now I don't shoot the volume needed to make outsourcing a requirement, but if I shot 3 weddings a week I'd absolutely look into it, there are many working pros of all levels, from the $1,000 to over $10,000 a shoot, outsourcing their processing. Again, if it's not an efficient use of your time you would be a bad business person to not outsource, and don't forget, taking on even a part time processor of your own has many far reaching implications and costs for a business that might or might not gel with a particular shooters business model.

Here are some interesting links, unfortunately I can''t give a personal recommendation as I haven't used any of them myself, but it should help.

http://www.mylavalu.com/
https://www.fotofafa.com/
http://theimagesalon.com/#welcome
http://www.photographersedit.com/
http://shootdotedit.com/

There is even an Au based one!

http://rdfl.com.au/


And some reasons why.

https://fstoppers.com/originals/wedding-photographers-get-your-life-back-outsourcing-your-editing-142235

http://jasminestar.com/editing-post-processing/

« Last Edit: October 02, 2016, 02:03:47 PM by privatebydesign »
Too often we lose sight of the fact that photography is about capturing light, if we have the ability to take control of that light then we grow exponentially as photographers. More often than not the image is not about lens speed, sensor size, DR, MP's or AF, it is about the light.

Orangutan

  • EOS-1D X Mark II
  • *******
  • Posts: 1898
Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #29 on: October 02, 2016, 02:09:58 PM »
The OP asked a fairly straightforward question about outsourcing Raw processing.

Often a seemingly straightforward question carries implicit questions or presumptions.  In this case, the telling quote is:


Quote
I would really appreciate any help or advice here, as I'm currently drowning in Lightroom.

The underlying problem is that the OP is having trouble keeping up with PP using LR, and is proposing one possible solution.  There are many photographers who do that much work using LR, a product largely designed for precisely that purpose, so what could be going on with OP?  I can think of several possibilities: (1) the OP wants more free time, and wants to do almost zero LR.  (2) OP likes shooting, but not PP. (3) OP has a slow computer.  (4) OP has weak LR skills, and would spend a lot less time if he leveled-up his LR skills.

Given the above quote, OP left the door open for us to interpret the underlying problem and propose solutions.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2016, 02:54:34 PM by Orangutan »

canon rumors FORUM

Re: Companies that process RAW files
« Reply #29 on: October 02, 2016, 02:09:58 PM »