August 20, 2017, 03:25:00 PM

Author Topic: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9  (Read 17078 times)

Hflm

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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #60 on: April 20, 2017, 10:35:56 AM »
Presumably their story is that the stacked sensor allows readouts fast enough to avoid artifacts from full electric shutter.
It better should. MY present A7rii is hardly usable in churches during weddings because of banding.

I'll have to check that out. Other than one time to hear if it's really silent, I've never used it due to one of sony's  design choices to drop precision by a bit in that mode.
If ISO is higher (like in chruches), it doesn't matter whether it is 12bit or 14bit, as one will hardly see a difference. But banding is the bigger issue to me at least.

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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #60 on: April 20, 2017, 10:35:56 AM »

PureClassA

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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #61 on: April 20, 2017, 12:14:53 PM »
I was really expecting to see this camera hit with something that looked more like the phoroshopped rumor designs (more akin to a 1DX) with a bigger body designed to balance out against bigger glass, just as you said.  I really find it disappointing they decided somewhere along the line to try to offer a full featured "Pro" competitive camera, but still seemingly shove it all inside a compact body.

And in fairness that's an embarrassing kludge. They should have made the body bigger.

+1000.  My point from the beginning.  I'm just trying to give an F letter grade on the body decision a kind D- grading based on the extender.

The 'have cake and eat it too' line is the A7 line -- small but loaded with tech.  But the A9 specs and pricing seem aimed at people that will only put f/1.4 primes and f/2.8 zooms on it.  Give them a body to wield that big glass appropriately!

- A
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neuroanatomist

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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #62 on: April 20, 2017, 12:21:24 PM »
But the A9 specs and pricing seem aimed at people that will only put f/1.4 primes and f/2.8 zooms on it.  Give them a body to wield that big glass appropriately!

Except that Sony has stated repeatedly* that the main advantage of MILCs is the smaller size and lighter weight. 



*Note that stating something repeatedly doesn't make it true.
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ahsanford

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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #63 on: April 20, 2017, 12:26:05 PM »
But the A9 specs and pricing seem aimed at people that will only put f/1.4 primes and f/2.8 zooms on it.  Give them a body to wield that big glass appropriately!
Except that Sony has stated repeatedly* that the main advantage of MILCs is the smaller size and lighter weight. 

...and now they've released a sports/wildlife rig that has the grip smaller than 77D that will be asked to wield heavy glass all day.  I await the smaller and lighter lenses for such demanding applications.   ::)

- A

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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #64 on: April 20, 2017, 12:35:11 PM »
...and now they've released a sports/wildlife rig that has the grip smaller than 77D that will be asked to wield heavy glass all day.  I await the smaller and lighter lenses for such demanding applications.

Sony has this all thought out, they're poised to take over the market as soon as POTUS signs the executive order that no one can have hands larger than his.   ;)
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3kramd5

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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #65 on: April 20, 2017, 12:37:31 PM »
I gotta say, the no blackout high frame rate shooting with continuous AF looks slick.

https://youtu.be/_ZXFI-eIXk8

But the A9 specs and pricing seem aimed at people that will only put f/1.4 primes and f/2.8 zooms on it.  Give them a body to wield that big glass appropriately!

Except that Sony has stated repeatedly* that the main advantage of MILCs is the smaller size and lighter weight. 


They have? I'm not saying you're wrong, and I haven't paid much attention to their campaigns, but usually it's Sony evangelists who make that incorrect case. Smaller form factor is an option, but it's not the main advantage (and in many cases it's not an advantage at all.

That sounds like something a marketing department farted out without conferring with engineering.

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neuroanatomist

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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #66 on: April 20, 2017, 12:47:51 PM »
Except that Sony has stated repeatedly* that the main advantage of MILCs is the smaller size and lighter weight. 

They have? I'm not saying you're wrong, and I haven't paid much attention to their campaigns, but usually it's Sony evangelists who make that incorrect case. Smaller form factor is an option, but it's not the main advantage (and in many cases it's not an advantage at all.

That sounds like something a marketing department farted out without conferring with engineering.

For example, in an Amateur Photographer interview with Kimio Maki (Sony's Senior General Manager of the Digital Imaging Business Group):

Quote
AP: Can you summarise the benefit of choosing an Alpha 7-series camera over a DSLR in a single sentence? 
KM: Size. It’s all about size – it’s smaller and lighter. That’s the main reason of choosing our products.

AP: There are still some who prefer the feel of a DSLR and in their hands opposed to a Sony Alpha 7-series camera. What would you say to these photographers?
KM: If you don’t mind the feel of a camera that’s bigger and heavier please carry on. If you want to take a lighter and smaller camera, the Sony Alpha 7-series might be preferred. As long as the quality is the same, smaller and lighter is better I think. That is our policy.
(full transcript of interview)
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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #66 on: April 20, 2017, 12:47:51 PM »

3kramd5

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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #67 on: April 20, 2017, 01:10:48 PM »
 :o

Carry on? Like don't buy our S____?

Again, this is a crazy allegiance to form factor. It's like they don't care to let consumers know about their technological achievements.
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ahsanford

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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #68 on: April 20, 2017, 01:16:22 PM »
KM: If you don’t mind the feel of a camera that’s bigger and heavier please carry on. If you want to take a lighter and smaller camera, the Sony Alpha 7-series might be preferred. As long as the quality is the same, smaller and lighter is better I think. That is our policy.

And that's the key phrase.  A9 is a new platform 'level'/trimline.  An A9 is not an A7 like a 1DX is not a 5D.

Announcing the A9 line was a chance to shape that product line's identity differently.  Imagine an alternate narrative to this rig:

  • "We made it bigger and tougher for the demands of professional photographers."

  • "Fast full-frame lenses need to be larger and heavier than slower lenses, so we gave you a more solid grip to hold the camera."

  • "We change the control layout to give professionals more dedicated knobs/switches/buttons to make real-time changes more intuitive and faster to perform.  This lets you maximize your time looking through the viewfinder to not miss that decisive moment."

You get the idea.  The A9 could have been a different animal with a different marketing story that would have resonated better with professionals.  Instead, Sony stuck to its guns and put an A7 on steroids.  I think that was a bad call.

- A
« Last Edit: April 20, 2017, 01:33:42 PM by ahsanford »

neuroanatomist

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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #69 on: April 20, 2017, 01:17:40 PM »
Sony: "World, if you want bigger, heavier cameras then buy from someone else."

World: "Ok, we will."

 ;)
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Jopa

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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #70 on: April 20, 2017, 03:01:34 PM »

You get the idea.  The A9 could have been a different animal with a different marketing story that would have resonated better with professionals.  Instead, Sony stuck to its guns and put an A7 on steroids.  I think that was a bad call.

- A

That's why I thought the A9 would look much more logical in an A99 style body (even keeping E-mount). So now the A99II looks more suitable for large lenses than the "sports" A9.
I hope when Canon is ready for a pro mirroless they won't put it into an M-style body ;)

Sator

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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #71 on: April 20, 2017, 03:46:44 PM »
More exactly, this 24MP stacked sensor would have made more sense in A mount because they already have decent long telephoto primes for A mount. It would also balance between ergonomically with large telephoto lenses. You would have gotten 20fps shooting with the mechanical shutter and all the advantages that confers. The a9 seems a bit of a waste of an interesting sensor.

Dylan777

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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #72 on: April 20, 2017, 05:40:03 PM »
But the A9 specs and pricing seem aimed at people that will only put f/1.4 primes and f/2.8 zooms on it.  Give them a body to wield that big glass appropriately!
Except that Sony has stated repeatedly* that the main advantage of MILCs is the smaller size and lighter weight. 

...and now they've released a sports/wildlife rig that has the grip smaller than 77D that will be asked to wield heavy glass all day.  I await the smaller and lighter lenses for such demanding applications.   ::)

- A

You forgot to add front and back side  ;)

I said before, going to say again. The option going small is there for a7/a9 + FE28, FE35f2.8, FE55, Batis and latest FE85f1.8. You do not need to add heavy f1.4 and 2.8 zoom on it.

Lack of weather sealed and big lenses could spell trouble for A9.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2017, 05:43:18 PM by Dylan777 »

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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #72 on: April 20, 2017, 05:40:03 PM »

ahsanford

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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #73 on: April 20, 2017, 06:41:09 PM »
More exactly, this 24MP stacked sensor would have made more sense in A mount because they already have decent long telephoto primes for A mount. It would also balance between ergonomically with large telephoto lenses. You would have gotten 20fps shooting with the mechanical shutter and all the advantages that confers. The a9 seems a bit of a waste of an interesting sensor.

1) Nothing is stopping you from putting your A-mount glass on an A9.  You can adapt it.

2) A-mount would not attract Canon and Nikon folks like E-mount does, as again, you can adapt your EF glass or FX glass on it.

3) Sony has never delivered more than a... 12 fps mechanical shutter, is that right?  There is no 20 fps mechanical shutter ready to go.

4) Eventually a 20 fps setup like this could hit the A-mount someday (with an electronic shutter), but why they'd lead with that instead of E-mount is beyond me.  Again:  Trying A-mount is a full blown conversion, where E-mount is far less painful to try out.

- A

3kramd5

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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #74 on: April 20, 2017, 08:30:00 PM »
Plus with a mechanical shutter they have OSPDAF interruption.
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Re: Off Brand: Sony Announces the A9
« Reply #74 on: April 20, 2017, 08:30:00 PM »