November 23, 2017, 08:34:35 AM

Author Topic: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING P3, DEER P6)  (Read 22503 times)

hbr

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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #45 on: August 17, 2017, 10:32:57 PM »
Thanks for sharing those photos with us, Tom. Great shots. Sorry you are having problems with your 24-70 f/2.8. Fortunately mine works perfectly. May have to do an AFMA? I am loving my 6D2 but still in the process of getting familiar with what it can do. I notice you were using very slow shutter speeds. Were you using a tripod?

Brian

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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #45 on: August 17, 2017, 10:32:57 PM »

Talys

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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #46 on: August 18, 2017, 12:37:14 AM »
Great wedding shots!  Nice variation on the types of photos; they came out great.

tomscott

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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #47 on: August 18, 2017, 03:43:24 AM »
Thanks for sharing those photos with us, Tom. Great shots. Sorry you are having problems with your 24-70 f/2.8. Fortunately mine works perfectly. May have to do an AFMA? I am loving my 6D2 but still in the process of getting familiar with what it can do. I notice you were using very slow shutter speeds. Were you using a tripod?

Brian

Have you shot anything critical with it yet? Seemed fine in my test shots and then wasn't amazing at the wedding, just adequate. It seems sharp enough with still subjects just doesn't keep up with moving subjects in AI servo. I know the newer lenses MKII are a lot faster with the newer AF systems, my 70-200 was spot on.

No tripod just handheld.

I had the camera on auto ISO all day with it ensuring minimum shutter speed matched focal length. On the indoor shots on the stairs I was using a 16-35mm hence the slow shutter speed which was an error on my part and should have been higher but thankfully I have a steady hand and the subjects were static. They all came out really well, helps with it being a wide angle but have now compensated the auto ISO an extra stop so 24 for example would shoot minimum 1/60th. It did mean the ISO was nice and low it could have really got carried away in there and although I dont mind 3200-12800 for those types of images, sort of showcase shots it wouldnt have been suitable.

Its also a lot darker in there than the images make it look, it was a very overcast and stormy day with very little light coming through the clouds. There was a large window above the stairs which is where the light came from to illuminate the scene. I also only had 10 minutes with them before they had to be announced so all was go!

For inside the marquay I was using flash so the slow shutter speed wasn't really an issue as the flash would freeze the action.

Anyway in hindsight you are correct should have been shooting higher and usually would but thought I would see how I got on and will make changes in the future.

It is nice that its one less thing to think about, although it needs to work properly. I think it would be a lot better if you could set max and min shutter speeds per lens rather than per focal length as it works great if your subject is still or if your lens has IS.

The auto ISO can go crazy too I have it set up to 25,600 and in a church 24mm at 2.8 at 1/60th could easily hit 4000/6400 so worth keeping an eye on. I didnt find the ISO to be an issue at all very pleased with all the images in terms of IQ and noise. Wouldn't have issue printing large.

Hope that answers your question.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2017, 03:49:42 AM by tomscott »
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tomscott

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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot
« Reply #48 on: August 18, 2017, 03:52:51 AM »
Ok guys managed to get these uploaded to Flickr to share with you guys

Nice!

Thanks for the effort Tom.
Ok guys managed to get these uploaded to Flickr to share with you guys.

Experience was extremely positive, I don't think its playing overly well with my 24-70 F2.8 L MKI in terms of AF but all my other lenses I had no issue with at all 70-200mm F2.8 MKII and 16-35mm F2.8 MKII.

All i can say is wow... the 6DMKII handled flawlessly and the tilt screen came in handy in so many shots! The high ISO is incredible and the low light AF... put it this way both blow the doors off a 5DMKIII I don't think the AF missed once on the dance floor.
[... snip...]

Thank you so much for sharing these. This helps with some upcoming decisions.  :)

[EDIT: And great work!]

Beautiful work!  And I'm terribly impressed with the camera.
Interesting, thanks for sharing your experiences. Definitely insightful to hear from a former 5D3 owner.
 
Great wedding shots!  Nice variation on the types of photos; they came out great.

Thank you all. Hope that some of my experience with the camera can help you make a more rounded decision.

Cheers

Tom
6D MKII, 5D MKIII STOLEN, 7D MKII 70D 17-55mm F2.8 16-35mm F2.8 II L 24-70mm F2.8 L 24-105mm F4 L 70-200mm F2.8 II L 100-400mm F4.5-5.6 II L 2x II 1.4X III 580EX

hbr

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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #49 on: August 18, 2017, 05:12:40 AM »
Thanks for sharing those photos with us, Tom. Great shots. Sorry you are having problems with your 24-70 f/2.8. Fortunately mine works perfectly. May have to do an AFMA? I am loving my 6D2 but still in the process of getting familiar with what it can do. I notice you were using very slow shutter speeds. Were you using a tripod?

Brian

Have you shot anything critical with it yet? Seemed fine in my test shots and then wasn't amazing at the wedding, just adequate. It seems sharp enough with still subjects just doesn't keep up with moving subjects in AI servo. I know the newer lenses MKII are a lot faster with the newer AF systems, my 70-200 was spot on.

No tripod just handheld.

I had the camera on auto ISO all day with it ensuring minimum shutter speed matched focal length. On the indoor shots on the stairs I was using a 16-35mm hence the slow shutter speed which was an error on my part and should have been higher but thankfully I have a steady hand and the subjects were static. They all came out really well, helps with it being a wide angle but have now compensated the auto ISO an extra stop so 24 for example would shoot minimum 1/60th. It did mean the ISO was nice and low it could have really got carried away in there and although I dont mind 3200-12800 for those types of images, sort of showcase shots it wouldnt have been suitable.

Its also a lot darker in there than the images make it look, it was a very overcast and stormy day with very little light coming through the clouds. There was a large window above the stairs which is where the light came from to illuminate the scene. I also only had 10 minutes with them before they had to be announced so all was go!

For inside the marquay I was using flash so the slow shutter speed wasn't really an issue as the flash would freeze the action.

Anyway in hindsight you are correct should have been shooting higher and usually would but thought I would see how I got on and will make changes in the future.

It is nice that its one less thing to think about, although it needs to work properly. I think it would be a lot better if you could set max and min shutter speeds per lens rather than per focal length as it works great if your subject is still or if your lens has IS.

The auto ISO can go crazy too I have it set up to 25,600 and in a church 24mm at 2.8 at 1/60th could easily hit 4000/6400 so worth keeping an eye on. I didnt find the ISO to be an issue at all very pleased with all the images in terms of IQ and noise. Wouldn't have issue printing large.

Hope that answers your question.

Thanks for replying Tom. The reason I asked about the slow shutter speeds is that I, being an old man, can no longer hold the camera steady at those low speeds. About the best speed handheld I can do without IS is around 1/125 to 1/250. I am impressed!
I have only taken landscapes with my 24-70 and I am trying to find a model to try the camera out with people, therefore no closeups as you have taken.
Anyway, great pictures and thank you again for sharing them with us.

Brian

PS Yes I have noticed that the camera does a great job of brightening up dark scenes and I would not hesitate to take indoor shots without a flash.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2017, 05:14:53 AM by hbr »

tomscott

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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #50 on: August 18, 2017, 06:10:41 AM »

Thanks for replying Tom. The reason I asked about the slow shutter speeds is that I, being an old man, can no longer hold the camera steady at those low speeds. About the best speed handheld I can do without IS is around 1/125 to 1/250. I am impressed!
I have only taken landscapes with my 24-70 and I am trying to find a model to try the camera out with people, therefore no closeups as you have taken.
Anyway, great pictures and thank you again for sharing them with us.

Brian

PS Yes I have noticed that the camera does a great job of brightening up dark scenes and I would not hesitate to take indoor shots without a flash.

I see! TBH unless its the version II it might be worth having a play with the 24-105 MKI and MKII or the 24-70 F4 for landscape work with them being a lighter more compact and most importantly having IS. One of the reasons I haven't bought the MKII version of the 24-70 my copy is very sharp seems to be one of the better and  last off the line. Although the MKII is sharper and lighter I dont see the benefit without IS especially for the cost again double. Really hoping they will bring an IS varient out as it would help.

Of corse even the most experienced gets a little anxious when photographing these situations and your heart is going etc it certainly would help when working quickly to steady the camera. Its also difficult moving between my lenses with and without IS as you can get a way with a lot more with an IS lens and when working quickly its another thing to think about.

People can be more difficult to shoot than first thought. An example I like to tell people is like photographing sheep. You would think they are easy to photograph because they are slow etc but the way they gring the grass in their teeth basically vibrates the whole head so you have to shoot at 1/640+ to get the head sharp. People although they seem to be still they are always moving - a blink, smile, shift of the eye or even a heartbeat can blur an image. In fact the first image she blinked and the lashes are not tack but the rest of that area is.

I shoot a lot of motorsport too and getting decent pans at 1/15th and 1/30th takes a lot of practice and is much harder with a FF sensor than it is with crop. I think ive honed some skill from there. Like you say I would much prefer to be up in that high range as you get much more keepers and dont have to worry all day that the images are critically sharp. Again depends on situation a lot of these wedding venues are very dark and adding flash without multiple large difusers can add strange lighting artifacts in the background and I like to work quickly without big set ups like that. The 6DMKII handled it extremely well. Its by no means perfect and the MKIV will give you better results but for nearly 50% less it offers a hell of a lot for the money, probably far more than I need except for those 1-2% of situations.
 
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Jack Douglas

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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #51 on: August 18, 2017, 08:08:13 AM »
What's that I hear?  I think it's the trolls grinding their teeth.  They really don't like to hear this kind of talk, like really, there now is another Canon camera that is a pleasure to use and gives capable photographers more than adequate quality and no doubt will .... sell well!

Jack
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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #51 on: August 18, 2017, 08:08:13 AM »

tomscott

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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #52 on: August 18, 2017, 09:17:54 AM »
What's that I hear?  I think it's the trolls grinding their teeth.  They really don't like to hear this kind of talk, like really, there now is another Canon camera that is a pleasure to use and gives capable photographers more than adequate quality and no doubt will .... sell well!

Jack

The review threads are still trolling and nobody is posting images. Literally arguing about situations they might find themselves... in their sleep. lol Nothing real world.

Its painful to read.

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7DmkI

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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #53 on: August 18, 2017, 10:18:51 AM »
Hi Tom.

Thank you very much for sharing your experience with the 6Dii.

I am an amateur and am happy with my 7Di; but technology changes and I wish to upgrade, preferably to full frame.  5Div is a bit too much $$ for me (although I’ve got approval from my CFO at home  ;) ); next natural move would be a used 5Diii or 6Dii which are about the same price.

I prefer to have a more current model like the 6Dii but after reading all these “REVIEW”s, they discouraged me to go for the 6Dii and leaning towards back to a used 5Diii.  Your hands on experience gave me a whole new look at 6Dii (and a lot of people like me, too, I believe) and helps a lot in my decision. 

One thing we got to remember – 6D series is considered as the lower end model of  FF, it can’t and shouldn’t be comparing with 5Div  (which is $$$$$ more) on feature and performance. The price difference is there for a reason.  6Dii price will probably go down after this introductory stage and it will become more attractive and by then, I will grab one!

Thanks once again.



tomscott

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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #54 on: August 18, 2017, 11:06:57 AM »
Hi Tom.

Thank you very much for sharing your experience with the 6Dii.

I am an amateur and am happy with my 7Di; but technology changes and I wish to upgrade, preferably to full frame.  5Div is a bit too much $$ for me (although I’ve got approval from my CFO at home  ;) ); next natural move would be a used 5Diii or 6Dii which are about the same price.

I prefer to have a more current model like the 6Dii but after reading all these “REVIEW”s, they discouraged me to go for the 6Dii and leaning towards back to a used 5Diii.  Your hands on experience gave me a whole new look at 6Dii (and a lot of people like me, too, I believe) and helps a lot in my decision. 

One thing we got to remember – 6D series is considered as the lower end model of  FF, it can’t and shouldn’t be comparing with 5Div  (which is $$$$$ more) on feature and performance. The price difference is there for a reason.  6Dii price will probably go down after this introductory stage and it will become more attractive and by then, I will grab one!

Thanks once again.

Glad to be some help and agree with all you have said.

Really in my mind the 5DMKIII has a couple of benefits: you can buy used which will save you some money, it does have a more accurate AF system and it has two card slots. Otherwise the 6DMKII is superior in every way.

If IQ is your main concern then the issues with the 5DMKIII have been solved here and it makes it a much more useable camera for so many applications.

The 5DMKIII feels its age the 6DMKII has all the nice new features like the tilt screen, bluetooth, wifi viewfinder II etc which really makes the difference on day to day shooting. The twin card slot is a bit of a marketing thing too, for a pro it is very useful and SD cards are more vulnerable than CF cards. If you stick a 128gb card in you will get roughly 2200 shots which means you can leave it in there and off load when you are ready. If the card is in the camera and not being messed around with the likelihood of a failure is really slim. Ive been shooting 15 years professionally and only had one card that had a problem. It didnt even fail, the lock switch on the SD card failed so when you put it into the camera or reader it wouldnt read, with a bit of playing I sorted it and downloaded all the images got intouch with lexar and they replaced it for me.

It is very nice to have two cards for that one time it "might" happen but its extremely rare if you look after your cards.

Saying that the 5DMKIII is solid. Absolutely solid mine had more than 300,000 clicks on it and had been dropped in a river, soaked multiple times at race meets, had barely any paint left and was missing the mode dial top and still worked like a champ they are made to be abused and keep going. Although soaking it is not really advised it was fine, the electronics probably would have corroded over time. Just have to bare that in mind when buying pre-owned which is why I dont unless I know who its come from.

The 6DMKII is an entry level camera. On the other side of the coin we have got to a point where these cameras are so good that you can do things that only pro cameras could do a few years ago and there is no reason why you shouldnt. Reason I bought the 6DMKII is because it was cheaper buying new than a 5 yr old MKIII and I wanted the newer features as ive been used to them with the other cameras i carry 7DMKII and 70D.

I also had an original 7D and if im honest I really didnt get on with it. The 18mp sensor I thought was so noisy, a 6DMKII will be a huge upgrade in terms of IQ. Keeping the 7D would be great for other applications too.

The main thing is have a go with one! Take some images have a play and see if you like it!

I have been between minds for months and have been doing all my shooting recently with my 7DMKII and 70D and haven't had any problems at all infact probably shot some of my best images recently.


All shot with 7DMKII apologies these all have FB compression.

Shot this a few weeks ago for the same company Globus for their Alpha Solway Chemical Suits



Just been on a 3000 mile roadtrip through Europe for Porsche post magazine.




 











Weddings with a crop camera  :o

Lara & Hugo de Chassiron-79 by Tom Scott, on Flickr

Lara & Hugo de Chassiron-92 by Tom Scott, on Flickr

Lara & Hugo de Chassiron-95 by Tom Scott, on Flickr

Lara & Hugo de Chassiron-327 by Tom Scott, on Flickr

Lara & Hugo de Chassiron-335 by Tom Scott, on Flickr

Love my Canon gear and will continue to use it and not worry about people think I should be using XYZ.

If you continue to produce high quality imagery and clients are happy... why worry.

Cheers

Tom
« Last Edit: August 18, 2017, 11:11:56 AM by tomscott »
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Jack Douglas

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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #55 on: August 18, 2017, 01:23:10 PM »
Now I was accused, but I'd say Tom is the Canon fanboy! ;)  I accept being a Canonfanman (CFM) cause I love my Canon gear. ;D  Wish I had shots like this to show.  :)

Jack
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stevelee

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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #56 on: August 18, 2017, 02:38:31 PM »
Wow. Great shots.

I got my first SLR, a Canon FT-QL, in 1969. Both of my DSLRs have been Canons. My next one will likely be a 6D2. My most recent smaller cameras have been S95, S120, and now G7X II, which I use when I travel. If someone wants to call me a Canon fanboy/man/geezer, I won't argue with them.

My first Rebel was not that great in terms of noise in low light, and my EF 75-300mm III is not the sharpest lens around, but I don't regret getting either one, especially for the money. The Xsi took some good photos, but more importantly got me into using a DSLR.

My two best lenses are EF models, so will still work fine with the 6D2. I don't have the time, money, or interest to start running out buying other brands to try. If other folks want to do that, or if they just like other brands better, that's fine with me. If they take good pictures, so much the better. I can find way too many other things to entertain me than to spend time going on fan boards for other brands to bash them.

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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #57 on: August 18, 2017, 05:26:44 PM »
tomscott, your OP and follow-ups add up to the best real-world review I've ever read.  Like you took us along while you were working.  And the shots you've shared are excellent, showing consistent professionalism and a wide range of camera skills.

And you've brought the discussion level for the forum way back up. 

Thank you!

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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #57 on: August 18, 2017, 05:26:44 PM »

Frodo

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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #58 on: August 18, 2017, 11:32:03 PM »
Thanks Tom, for the real world review.

When I shoot events on my 6D, its not the IQ including DR that holds my images back. It images being unsharp through motion blur or missed focus (even with the centre AF point. I've always got the shoots I wanted, but I would have to take several to give me a couple spot.

You say you used auto-ISO a lot and that it uses 1/focal length as slowest speed. While I have steady hands, this is simply not enough for a 20+ MP camera.  Some auto-ISO systems allow you to specify a multiple of the 1/focal length speed. I think the 5D mkiii has this. Does the 6D mkii?  This is a simple, but critical feature.

I was pleased to read your positive comments about focusing. The AF point spread is rather limited. I would like to use lateral AF points on servo focus. The 6D simply can't do this. Can the 6D mkii?

Finally, what is the shutter noise like? I typically use silent mode and the 6D is quiter than my M3.

Thanks, Bob
If gear matters: 5DsR, 6D, M3, Samyang 14/2.8, EF 24-105/4, EF 35/2.0IS, EF 50/2.5 macro, EF 85/1.8, EF 200/2.8II, EF 400/5.6, EF-M 11-22/4-5.6, EF-M 18-55/3.5-5.6, EF-M 55-200/4.5-6.3, Ext 1.4x, Lifesize conv, Ext tube EF25, 430EXII, 270EX, Yongnuo 603C

tomscott

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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #59 on: August 21, 2017, 05:04:01 AM »
images being unsharp through motion blur or missed focus (even with the centre AF point. I've always got the shoots I wanted, but I would have to take several to give me a couple spot.

You say you used auto-ISO a lot and that it uses 1/focal length as slowest speed. While I have steady hands, this is simply not enough for a 20+ MP camera.  Some auto-ISO systems allow you to specify a multiple of the 1/focal length speed. I think the 5D mkiii has this. Does the 6D mkii?  This is a simple, but critical feature.

I was pleased to read your positive comments about focusing. The AF point spread is rather limited. I would like to use lateral AF points on servo focus. The 6D simply can't do this. Can the 6D mkii?

Finally, what is the shutter noise like? I typically use silent mode and the 6D is quiter than my M3.

Thanks, Bob

I have to disagree with you on 1/focal length not being fast enough for 20+mp cameras. Ive been doing this for years with cameras of this resolution but it depends on your subject, like you say if you are shooting subjects that move (events) then obviously you have to shoot faster. As far as I know the 5DMKIII didnt have the auto iso focal length feature, just standard auto ISO all you could do was set a minimum shutter speed and the ISO would match depending on light levels if you are shooting in AV.

What you can do with the auto iso is set the shutter speed to match the focal length but like I said with short teles or wide angles it doesnt work because they can be so wide 1/30th isnt oging to stop motion unless you want motion in your images. What you can do is bias the system either faster or slower which I assume is done in stops and can be +/- 3. I have mine set to bias +1 which means at roughly 24 it will shoot at 1/60th. It depends if your in critical situations and the light is fairly even I would shoot in manual and set the shutterspeed as desired and then the auto ISO works in a normal fashion that it will match to get an even exposure.

Auto ISO isnt always great as it tends to push a lot more than you probably would if you were shooting manually. In these situations there isnt time to set all so quickly so I like auto iso because it usually gets it right and with these new cameras im pretty happy with the ISO up to 12,800.

Usually once the light dies down I shoot in manual anyway as light is pretty consistent and I stick the flash on which freezes motion. When the clouds are moving and sun comes out etc this is where it is useful.

The point spread isnt really limited tbh its almost the same as the 5DMKIII and covers the same area as the 6D but with 45 points which is the difference. Shooting with 9 or 11 points with focus recompose leaves too much error IMO especially with large DOF lenses even f2.8 gives you like 2-3cm the focal plan changing to the degree in which you have to focus recompose is more than enough to miss focus. The points are a little tighter than a 5DMKIII which at first glance was a bit annoying but in practice makes no difference, the 5DMKIIIs is very tight compared to the same focus system in the 7DMKII which covers almost the whole frame making life a lot easier. Problem with FF at the moment. You can use any of the points on AF servo and you get the same groupings as the 5DMKIII.

The shutter isnt what I call quiet but its about the same as all other Canon silent shutter modes.

Hope that helps

Cheers

Tom
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Re: First 6DMKII photoshoot (WEDDING IMAGES P3)
« Reply #59 on: August 21, 2017, 05:04:01 AM »