December 18, 2017, 12:31:18 AM

Author Topic: Tilt Shift Lens advice  (Read 3970 times)

CanonFanBoy

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Tilt Shift Lens advice
« on: October 23, 2017, 06:39:42 PM »
I have a question or three for those of you who use tilt shift lenses. I see the new crop of TS lenses coming out and just wonder what I would need to use.

I have two possible uses: 1. Architechture and 2. Miniaturization

1. Am I correct to assume that none of the new TS lenses are really wide enough for architecture? 50/90/135mm  I really don't have a clue about any of this. I guess it would depend on the shot framing and whether or not the shots will be in tight areas like a downtown city. What focal length would you use for this?

2. For miniaturization would you use the 135mm?

I'm also wondering what other possible uses these types of lenses have. I wouldn't be into macro, but maybe there is something else?

These lenses might be the next great thing in TS lenses. I hope so. Just thinking that a wider focal length would be better for architecture.

Hope this is posted in the right place. I think these questions are about technique. It is also about the lenses, so I guess it could be posted either place.

Thanks!
5D Mark III, Canon A-1, Voigtlander Vito, Tamron SP 15-30 f/2.8 Di VC, 24-70 F/2.8L II, 70-200 f/2.8L IS II, 35 f/1.4L II, 135 f/2L, Helios 58 f/2 (x3), Canon FD 50 f/1.8, 600EX-RT (x7), Streaklight 360ws. Jumping ship to SoNikon any day now.

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Tilt Shift Lens advice
« on: October 23, 2017, 06:39:42 PM »

neuroanatomist

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Re: Tilt Shift Lens advice
« Reply #1 on: October 23, 2017, 07:35:25 PM »
Most of my architectural shots are at 17mm or 24mm.  When I shoot tighter, they're generally not shots that would benefit significantly from lens movements. 

Can't address the 'fake miniature' shots as I don't go there.
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privatebydesign

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Re: Tilt Shift Lens advice
« Reply #2 on: October 23, 2017, 08:00:25 PM »
Are you sure you won't feel "defeated" if you get one?

For architecture the 24 rules. The new lenses are built to replace the 45 and 90 with the 135 being an oddity. For interior real estate and the fact that you can make it a 24 with the TC 1.4 the 17 was my obvious choice and I use it extensively.

I am getting the new TS-E50 for product work as I shoot a wide range of sized objects and the 90 is too long, I am also assuming the 50 will take the 1.4 and 2x TC's so with two lenses and two TC's I end up with six good focal lengths.

Miniature look is a bit passe now it is so easily done in post but the longer the focal length the better.
Too often we lose sight of the fact that photography is about capturing light, if we have the ability to take control of that light then we grow exponentially as photographers. More often than not the image is not about lens speed, sensor size, DR, MP's or AF, it is about the light.

Valvebounce

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Re: Tilt Shift Lens advice
« Reply #3 on: October 23, 2017, 09:04:09 PM »
Hi PBD.
I fear you may have confused CanonFanBoy with CanonGuy!  :)

Cheers, Graham.

Are you sure you won't feel "defeated" if you get one?

For architecture the 24 rules. The new lenses are built to replace the 45 and 90 with the 135 being an oddity. For interior real estate and the fact that you can make it a 24 with the TC 1.4 the 17 was my obvious choice and I use it extensively.

I am getting the new TS-E50 for product work as I shoot a wide range of sized objects and the 90 is too long, I am also assuming the 50 will take the 1.4 and 2x TC's so with two lenses and two TC's I end up with six good focal lengths.

Miniature look is a bit passe now it is so easily done in post but the longer the focal length the better.
7DII+Grip, 1DsIII, 7D+Grip, 40D+Grip, EF 24-105 f4L EF-S 17-85, EF-S 10-22, EF 70-200 f2.8 L IS II, EF 1.4xIII, 2xIII, EF 100-400 f/4.5-5.6l IS II, Σ17-70 f2.8-4 C, EF 50mm f1.8, YN600EX-RT, YN-E3-RT, Filters, Remotes, Macro tubes, Tripods, heads etc!

1DsIII, 20D, 24-105, 17-85, Nifty 50 pre owned

privatebydesign

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Re: Tilt Shift Lens advice
« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2017, 09:09:09 PM »
Darn, you are correct Graham and offer my apologies!

That will teach me to look at this silly forum when I am tired  ::)

Hi PBD.
I fear you may have confused CanonFanBoy with CanonGuy!  :)

Cheers, Graham.

Are you sure you won't feel "defeated" if you get one?

For architecture the 24 rules. The new lenses are built to replace the 45 and 90 with the 135 being an oddity. For interior real estate and the fact that you can make it a 24 with the TC 1.4 the 17 was my obvious choice and I use it extensively.

I am getting the new TS-E50 for product work as I shoot a wide range of sized objects and the 90 is too long, I am also assuming the 50 will take the 1.4 and 2x TC's so with two lenses and two TC's I end up with six good focal lengths.

Miniature look is a bit passe now it is so easily done in post but the longer the focal length the better.
Too often we lose sight of the fact that photography is about capturing light, if we have the ability to take control of that light then we grow exponentially as photographers. More often than not the image is not about lens speed, sensor size, DR, MP's or AF, it is about the light.

CanonFanBoy

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Re: Tilt Shift Lens advice
« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2017, 10:21:59 PM »
Most of my architectural shots are at 17mm or 24mm.  When I shoot tighter, they're generally not shots that would benefit significantly from lens movements. 

Can't address the 'fake miniature' shots as I don't go there.

Yes, the fake miniature shots are a novelty. It might be fun occasionally. It sure isn't worth $2k. I've thought and looked on line a little more and I see some portraits (mostly full length) that look very nice. They are taken with TS lenses. Looks like fun. Really like the idea of having multiple focus points in the shot.

Since I enjoy portraits the most, the 50 might be a good choice for that. I just wonder whether the 135mm would be anything special. I have the 135 f/2L, but that is a different animal of the same focal length.

Neuro, I guess I need to read more about this because I really don't have a clue. Thanks for answering. I knew you used TS lenses. Glad to have your input. :)
5D Mark III, Canon A-1, Voigtlander Vito, Tamron SP 15-30 f/2.8 Di VC, 24-70 F/2.8L II, 70-200 f/2.8L IS II, 35 f/1.4L II, 135 f/2L, Helios 58 f/2 (x3), Canon FD 50 f/1.8, 600EX-RT (x7), Streaklight 360ws. Jumping ship to SoNikon any day now.

Zeidora

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Re: Tilt Shift Lens advice
« Reply #6 on: October 24, 2017, 12:34:15 AM »
Agree on architecture 17/24.

My other camera is a 4x5" and I have used T/S movements with 150, 180 macro, and 210 (divide FL by 3 to get 35 FF equivalent) for botanical work, rarely even with a 360 which is more of a pain because it is a tele design. You can isolate point of view/perspective from focal plane, and get nicer OOF areas while all parts that you are interested are still tack sharp. On complicated shots, it takes me 30-45 minutes to do the set-up. So nothing for snap shots.

The longer TS lenses for SLR do not offer the same flexibility as a front (and rear) standard of a view camera. Accordingly, if I really care that much, I rather get the 4x5 out than get a suboptimal solution with SLR-T/S lenses for close-ups.  The downside, of course, is sheet film. For landscape/architecture, the SLR T/S are sufficient, IMHO.

Hope that helps.
5D2 full spectrum, 5DsR, a bunch of Zeiss (some other) primes, for documentary natural history, macro, and micro.

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Re: Tilt Shift Lens advice
« Reply #6 on: October 24, 2017, 12:34:15 AM »

Valvebounce

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Re: Tilt Shift Lens advice
« Reply #7 on: October 24, 2017, 03:29:26 AM »
Hi CanonFanBoy.
My experience of TS lenses runs to about a couple of hours during a landscape and TS tutorial day, (Thank you CPS) we concentrated on straightening the tall conifers (architectural) and increasing the depth of focus of landscapes, getting a branch positioned 18" in front of the tripod through to the far end of a large forest glade all in acceptably sharp focus.
I forgot to say, I want one but can't justify the cost, for a hobby with how much time I wouldn't use it having it sit in a bag would be a waste which is, I suspect, the main reason for the ones you see on eBay!  :)

Cheers, Graham.

I have a question or three for those of you who use tilt shift lenses. I see the new crop of TS lenses coming out and just wonder what I would need to use.

I have two possible uses: 1. Architechture and 2. Miniaturization

I'm also wondering what other possible uses these types of lenses have. I wouldn't be into macro, but maybe there is something else?

These lenses might be the next great thing in TS lenses. I hope so. Just thinking that a wider focal length would be better for architecture.

Hope this is posted in the right place. I think these questions are about technique. It is also about the lenses, so I guess it could be posted either place.

Thanks!
« Last Edit: October 24, 2017, 03:38:30 AM by Valvebounce »
7DII+Grip, 1DsIII, 7D+Grip, 40D+Grip, EF 24-105 f4L EF-S 17-85, EF-S 10-22, EF 70-200 f2.8 L IS II, EF 1.4xIII, 2xIII, EF 100-400 f/4.5-5.6l IS II, Σ17-70 f2.8-4 C, EF 50mm f1.8, YN600EX-RT, YN-E3-RT, Filters, Remotes, Macro tubes, Tripods, heads etc!

1DsIII, 20D, 24-105, 17-85, Nifty 50 pre owned

LDS

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Re: Tilt Shift Lens advice
« Reply #8 on: October 24, 2017, 04:14:43 AM »
I'm also wondering what other possible uses these types of lenses have. I wouldn't be into macro, but maybe there is something else?

The shift movement is also useful to shoot reflective surfaces without showing the camera reflected into. You can also stitch two images shoot at opposite shift to create a "panorama" image.

The tilt movement is useful whenever you need to move the focal plane - it works for some landscapes, and still-life/product shots (i.e. I use them for train models). Miniaturization is an extreme effect of that, but it can also used creatively to focus very selectively.

Just a note: these lenses work best when on a tripod and a head that allows precise movements. While they can be used shifted handheld (with less precision), IMHO using tilt handheld is far more difficult.

bluenoser1993

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Re: Tilt Shift Lens advice
« Reply #9 on: October 24, 2017, 08:02:54 AM »
I would agree fully with Valvebounce and add that all the TS seen on eBay is an indication of how difficult they can be to sell, at least in a small market part of Canada from my experience.  I loved the whole idea of TS and luckily got a used 17mm for a great price.  After 3 years of no shots except test shots, and one attempt with the mountain scenery too far away, I realized it was wasting space in my bag.  I couldn't sell it without resorting to a silly price, but in the end managed a trade for a like new 24-70 2.8 II which I'm hoping will work well for my son's volleyball.  Keep that in mind before you jump in.

Hi CanonFanBoy.
My experience of TS lenses runs to about a couple of hours during a landscape and TS tutorial day, (Thank you CPS) we concentrated on straightening the tall conifers (architectural) and increasing the depth of focus of landscapes, getting a branch positioned 18" in front of the tripod through to the far end of a large forest glade all in acceptably sharp focus.
I forgot to say, I want one but can't justify the cost, for a hobby with how much time I wouldn't use it having it sit in a bag would be a waste which is, I suspect, the main reason for the ones you see on eBay!  :)

Cheers, Graham.

I have a question or three for those of you who use tilt shift lenses. I see the new crop of TS lenses coming out and just wonder what I would need to use.

I have two possible uses: 1. Architechture and 2. Miniaturization

I'm also wondering what other possible uses these types of lenses have. I wouldn't be into macro, but maybe there is something else?

These lenses might be the next great thing in TS lenses. I hope so. Just thinking that a wider focal length would be better for architecture.

Hope this is posted in the right place. I think these questions are about technique. It is also about the lenses, so I guess it could be posted either place.

Thanks!
5Ds, EF 24-70 f/2.8 II, EF 35 f/2 IS, EF 135L f/2, EF 100-400L II, 1.4xTC III

privatebydesign

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Re: Tilt Shift Lens advice
« Reply #10 on: October 24, 2017, 08:18:29 AM »
As an aside, shift is easily replicated in post or by using a wider lens and cropping.

Tilt is the killer feature that is not easily replicated, I can't understand a landscape shooter not using a tilt lens, the first time I saw pin sharp images from foreground to background shot at optimal apertures of f5.6 and f8 I knew it was the only way to shoot landscapes. Having said that focus stacking can, in many situations, replicate the focus control you get with tilt.
Too often we lose sight of the fact that photography is about capturing light, if we have the ability to take control of that light then we grow exponentially as photographers. More often than not the image is not about lens speed, sensor size, DR, MP's or AF, it is about the light.

neuroanatomist

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Re: Tilt Shift Lens advice
« Reply #11 on: October 24, 2017, 08:28:46 AM »
As an aside, shift is easily replicated in post or by using a wider lens and cropping.

To 'replicate in post' with keystone correction also results in significant cropping, so either way you need a wider lens. 
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privatebydesign

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Re: Tilt Shift Lens advice
« Reply #12 on: October 24, 2017, 08:48:47 AM »
As an aside, shift is easily replicated in post or by using a wider lens and cropping.

To 'replicate in post' with keystone correction also results in significant cropping, so either way you need a wider lens.

Well it depends on how much of an angle you pointed up to take the picture in the first place and what you envision as the final image, often it is just two triangles out of the top two corners where the subject is behind the plane of the bottom corners anyway, so nothing of consequence is lost. And yes shift exists for a reason and nothing done in post to emulate it will have quite the same IQ, I was just pointing out that shift is not 'magical', whereas I believe tilt is.
Too often we lose sight of the fact that photography is about capturing light, if we have the ability to take control of that light then we grow exponentially as photographers. More often than not the image is not about lens speed, sensor size, DR, MP's or AF, it is about the light.

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Re: Tilt Shift Lens advice
« Reply #12 on: October 24, 2017, 08:48:47 AM »

LDS

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Re: Tilt Shift Lens advice
« Reply #13 on: October 24, 2017, 08:51:59 AM »
As an aside, shift is easily replicated in post

Not always - the image will look "compressed" along the axe when you need a strong correction. It may be noticeable or not, may depend on how much the viewer already knows about the subject. The image can be stretched trying to solve the problem, but that will also introduce other issues like a loss of resolution. Of course the need to interpolate to re-create missing pixels will decrease quality as well.

Cropping may mean you may need an higher mpx camera, if your image will be shown large enough.

But for occasional use, both techniques may avoid to buy a dedicated expensive lens.

IMHO TS lens are lenses one should buy when he or she really feels the need, not because they look interesting gadgets with more knobs. But if you're into the kind of photography they're designed for, they allow shots which are impossible or take a lot of time to be replicated in post.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2017, 09:01:58 AM by LDS »

CanonFanBoy

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Re: Tilt Shift Lens advice
« Reply #14 on: October 24, 2017, 09:05:10 PM »
You are all a big help. Thanks!
5D Mark III, Canon A-1, Voigtlander Vito, Tamron SP 15-30 f/2.8 Di VC, 24-70 F/2.8L II, 70-200 f/2.8L IS II, 35 f/1.4L II, 135 f/2L, Helios 58 f/2 (x3), Canon FD 50 f/1.8, 600EX-RT (x7), Streaklight 360ws. Jumping ship to SoNikon any day now.

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Re: Tilt Shift Lens advice
« Reply #14 on: October 24, 2017, 09:05:10 PM »